Ok so most of you may know I am actually DRUGFILMS. It seems I have bred alot of hatred with my movies submitted by DRUGFILMS. I don't care. I make games - that's it. Also I noticed games don't fare well on NG in general. Out of the top 50 - there are only like 10 games. Rememeber games is what NG was all about when it started...sigh..the good old days.

Anyways I also am kind of reluctant to submit stuff to NG because people really don't know shit about how long it takes to make (much less finish) a flash movie/game. Yeah I might have spent 50+ hours on it - (in some cases 150+) and people put it down. That really makes the artist feel bad. They thought they were being creative and doing something good - and then some stupid shit who doesn't know any better gives it a zero and a stupid review.

Well guess what. That will not stop me (or any flasher worth their salt)- you have to get used to it. Get used to people hating your shit - and even you. I will bet 90% of that hatred comes from JEALOUSY.

I know alot of Flash artist get turned off when they get bad reviews- but don't let that stop you. Just remember alot of Artists were persecuted and even jailed in the old days for their work/beliefs. You always have to stand strong for what you believe in. I am writing this cause maybe there will be one Flash artist who gave up - and reads this- and realizes it's not really about what someone thinks of your work - it's what YOU think of your work. And do not let any shitbrain tell you otherwise. Feel good about yourself, your flash movies, and your artistic abilities - and keep making stuff- don't stop for anyone.

If you really believe you are Flash material- don't let anyone or anything stop you. I love you NG. Peace.

You're right - it does really suck when you put so much time into a piece of work, and have it put down. Don't let the assholes get you down!

uh ok......

Anyways I also am kind of reluctant to submit stuff to NG because people really don't know shit about how long it takes to make (much less finish) a flash movie/game.

You're right but your case is strange. People always hate your games and they're all great. Every movie of yours is underated. Maybe they're just not smart enough to figure out how to play cokehead or any other game of yours.

Anyways I also am kind of reluctant to submit stuff to NG because people really don't know shit about how long it takes to make (much less finish) a flash movie/game. Yeah I might have spent 50+ hours on it - (in some cases 150+) and people put it down. That really makes the artist feel bad. They thought they were being creative and doing something good - and then some stupid shit who doesn't know any better gives it a zero and a stupid review.

Well guess what. That will not stop me (or any flasher worth their salt)- you have to get used to it. Get used to people hating your shit - and even you. I will bet 90% of that hatred comes from JEALOUSY.

If you really believe you are Flash material- don't let anyone or anything stop you. I love you NG. Peace.

I totally agree with you. NG has been helpful pushing me to do better work. I like to see what people think. Not everyone is going to like what I do but hey there is 18,000 movies/games to pick from...there is something for everyone!

Well said Pete! Check this page which shows some facts about a famous artist, Claude Monet:

http://www.muggleart.camelogic.com/Monet.htm

His work was harshly critizied, but he stayed true to his dreams.

shut up faggot i dun care how much effort u put into it people can vote what they like as long as its there opinion its not effort its quality and when u make sdhit bout drugs think to urself does everyone like drugs?

wow I am actually making sense to some people. Tahanks for your support. It is strange but I felt like this for a long time - it's good to get it off your chest. Keep on Flashing! I know I make crazy/non-normal shit but that is just me...so to each his own. It doesn't bother me if people don't like my stuff- it bothers me more when I get a 0- that is usually totally uncalled for. A ZERO is for something that took no time at all - or like a 1 frame animation hahaha. I believe if you spent time on a flash it deserves at least a 1 . I believe ZERO's come from ZERO"s and from jealousy. maybe they are jealous that you took your time to voice you beliefs or actually do something period. It's hard to finish a flash - and maybe that is why they hate the artist/flash because they themselves have never finished anything in their lives. Again thanks for the support peeps.

Humans in general are stupid, self-serving, ignorant ass holes and there's nothing anyone can do about it. Didn't you know that by now?

Wow thanks Wade I am reading that and it is good to read something relevent. Education and hard work is the key to everything. Thanks Wade.

Well I liked those games,don't sweat it.
Also I come here for games mainly

I think that the message that you brought up is very important.
And I totally agree. I´m proud to say that some of the NG members still know what NG is all about. It is not to get high votingpower as some out there belives. If one puts his soul and heart to a movie and spends many hours trying to make it perfect his/hers own way, then I belive that that movie deserves fair votes and grades.
Keep submitting Flash. Amen.

Thank you, Tom Fulp, for NG and for the portal. Thank you very much.
-Pikka

Thats sum weird shit!

Regardless of what you say i still hate cokehead 2 it shames number one's name it is very boring and not very fun, if you made it fun by testing it on mutliple friends or people you know it might be better.
I was apauled

Dude I really didn't care about CH2 tell the truth I justr wanted to finish something that may have never got finished. Here is the real scoop. It was meant to be more of a "mouse coordination" game. I know it's hard. Also I put Osama GWBush supposedly dies in the first one - so I needed someone better. Originally Osama was gonna shoot up herion/opium but I thought coke is close enough. and I don't care if everyone in the world think it is crap - it has it's ood qualities. Sorry I let you down - but you know - you just gotta keep it moving. Peace

Amen Pete!

I'm glad you made this post!
I feel 100% the same way as you do.
And I definetly agree the games don't get nearly the respect they deserve. Half the movies in the top 50 are pathetic, they're not even real animation (flash tweening), and yet a game which takes hours of coding (and even more time testing and working out every last bug) plus art and animation for the game, takes a huge f#ckin backseat to the movies. Stuff like Synj Vs. Horrid deserves it spot (it's true animation) but when it comes to stuff like Super Console Wars, i think movies get way too much respect.

I think this may be because 90 percent of the little 13 year old shits who make up this otherwise proud website's userbase are shitty-ass gamers, and cry like little bitches if they die once, or can't beat a boss. Hell there's this one little faggot who has given me a ZERO on EVERY one of my submissions...

Game creators need more respect (hell even Alien Hominid isn't too high up on the Top 50 anymore) and NG needs to filter out the riffraff...

At 1/31/03 01:07 PM, skyline_gtr_racer wrote: shut up faggot i dun care how much effort u put into it people can vote what they like as long as its there opinion its not effort its quality and when u make sdhit bout drugs think to urself does everyone like drugs?

And here is the case in point. Little idiots who start any argument with 'shut up faggot' and a mass of bad spelling. The idiots who don't understand the, as stated above, definition of a vote of 0 on Newgrounds. 0 or 5 are the numbers they know. >_<

Life's full of them. Ignore them, and praise the sensible, intelligent people. :)

Sessnet it gets even worse than that.I once submited a flash game. called kiling spree which I wasted 12 hours on.Everyone was giving it good scores and it had about a 2.06 as a score.Then suddenly a litle fucker whose name is Jim Yang said the movie is stolen.Suddenly everyone was following that guy and lying and never said where they saw it.U could tell this was before the server upgrade.It got blammed which realy suks since I put 12+ hours on that damn game.

that is horrible evilshadow - don't let them get you down. Fuck them. I know it sucked about what happened. Resubmit - see what happens. Who cares just keep making stuff because if you stop you will end up like the losers who gave you 0's. You are better than that and you know it!

Also Riftmaster thanks for the support and let me tell you I think Geek Fighter is the best fighting game on NG yet - (this coming from me who made Bloody rage). Now bloody rage wasn't all that but I did spend like 200+ hours at least on it. However Geek Fighter is pure, and so much more fun picking shit up and hitting people. Did you ever play Poi-Poi? Your games are the shit - and thanks for the support flash brethren.

I think there is a factor called "talent" you forgot to mention. Usually, a flash with countless hours put into it will most certainly stay, even have a nice score,but it's talent that makes movies go to the top 50. For Flash, you need either ( or both) artistic and programming skills, a movie with a lot of work put into it, but with little skills will, unfortunatly, not get as much a good score as the author expected.

I don't think games are underated on NG, more people make good movies than good games, that's my opinion. And the top 50 is getting pretty competitive now, more than in the good old days, when street life toped the chart forever. (where is that submision now anyway?) I don't know enough about Flash programming, but my guess is that it's much more complicated to do a kick ass game than a kick ass movie.

Could we please move on with that " games/assassin started Ng thing? This website has evolved into something waaaay cooler than good'ol shotgun man, teletubies funland and club a seal. These where classics, agreed, but that doesn't make them better than today's portal.

You are right though, people should not get discouraged when their movies get blammed, in my opinion, this simply means the author has to improve, that's all. How good do you think Synj and Tom where when they first played around with Flash? I do hope your post has given confidence back to many Flash artists who put hard work into a Flash with a 1.56 score.

... Go Monet!

poxpower you are right - but talent is something you also need to cultivate. Also i believe RiftMaster is more right because it does take a HELLA of a lot more coding and flash knowledge to make a semi-decent /complex game. I believe that the Top50 are good - but I also believe Street Life is better than 1/2 of the top 50 - even though it had almost no complexity of coding. But somehow tweened animations make it to the top50. I think Riftmaster was right because I guess 90% of the userbase of NG must not know what it takes to make game. Do you think gamemakers waste their time for nothing? NO. because they love making games - and they put as much- if not- more effort than just "Tweeners". Now frame-by-frame like Synj is a different story. That is REAL talent and skill - not just tweening. But what I am really saying is that perhaps games should get a +.50 score automatically or something because they often get washed up and and fall way below animations that didn't take as long or not as much TALENT in them. Yeah talent isn't just for artists- talent means you are good at what you do - anything. That also applies for Flash Programming, nose picking, everything. I guess my major qualm is that the top 50 is mainly comprised of animations - and gamemakers who spent alot of time making stuff don't get the respect that "tweeners" much less frame-byframers - than they deserve. About NG being different now than "Shotgun man" days - yeah it's changed but we also can't forget our roots- and that is what NG was about - games - and violence. Now it's more about what a 13 year old likes. maybe they don't think games and violence are as "Special" than movies - and it that case you are right. Games and violence are not so uncommon nowadays - and a good flash movie is. However that doesn't mean that we should forget about the gamemakers - and what NG was all about for it's first 2-3 years - and way before even shotgun man. Peace.

great choice of words Sessnet. I take bad reviews as constructive criticism unless they're just really retarded reviews then I'll just ignore em. reading certain reviews and catching little tips that ppl throw really helps. especially those that are trying to help other flash artists.

-CW

I don't put a lot of faith in scores nowadays... I've noticed that VIEWS are a much better judge. If something is good, people will pass it along to their friends.

If views are indeed any indication, Cokehead 2 is the hottest thing on NG right now. I think it has been slowing down our servers, it's so popular. ;)

-Tom

You make a good point..

One of the things I find hard to believe is that the person with the most Blamm power has not one flash to her name and has only given 50 reviews and has something like 15 000 blam points....
Now I am not a saint but I give review (in alot of cases).Only prob is that sometimes Authors take things too personal and tempt peps to be malicous.
Authors should accept good reviews just the same as bad reviews.

Tom thanks man. It is always good to hear from the "Wizard of OZ". Dude man we need to hook up. By the way don't think I feel bad anyways- it was just something I had to get off my chest- and I usually post self promoting bullshit anyways. I will never give up making stuff and submitting to NG. So what do you think? +.50 for all game submissions? It makes some sense.

thanks for that man maby ill start makeing flash again anyways thanks

I think games are under-rated mainly because artistc talent is much more impressive to a Flash-stranger than programming.

About Ng roots... well it used to be about violence, but now you say it's about what a 13 years-old wants, but isn't that also violence? Maybe I misunderstood or something, so could you clarify that a bit, what is it that, in your opinion, a 13 year-old wants?

It seems you are pissed that most of the users are young teenagers who crave games titties and violence.
It does make for some repetitive top-Charters, I admit.
Can you suggest any kind of system to deal with this problem? Or to give more importance to games, other than boosting it's score, because we know some people will abuse this and others will simply lower their votes on games to balance it out.
Do you think the portal, or the whole website, should be divided into adult/minors section? Or that some priviledges should be granted to mature users. I think we are kind of on that track with the ratings system, but what keeps a 12 year-old from lying about is age anyway?
Maybe Tom could give us some stats or something as to the average age of the NG user so we can have a better picture of what is going on around here.

Let us not forget that the animation/sound/programming of a Flash is only one half of it, there is the question of originality. That's how All your Base and DBZ in a Nutshell managed to live for so long.

I thought my game... "Right Of Way" was good. people kept saying it was too slow... but not on my computer. maybe cuz i have a pentium 4... but.. it did take a good solid week to make. Idoesn seem that movies are liked more than games. :(

I agree with some of your posts, DRUGFILMS, but I don't agree with what you said about tweening and 13 year olds. Tweening takes time too, since you have to make it look good. But bad tweening is just easy to make. About the 13 year olds thing, I think you shouldn't make such an unfair stereotype out of them. I'm a 14 year old so it's easy for me to say this :) Most 13 year olds actually like violence and interactivity. When they submit movies, the movies are usually crappy drawings with crappy animation and crappy blood. Usually with no interactivity, because they don't know programming. Me, I'm a 14 year old, but I signed up when I was 13. I submited Flash movies with decent quality values(even though they got almost no recognition). Well, I'm getting off topic. But about the problem with 13 year olds(again, most of them, since some are fair) is that they like reviewing badly and blamming stuff. They don't care if it's good or bad. They just blam the damn entry.

:? Maybe I misunderstood or something, so could you clarify that a bit, what is it that, in your opinion, a 13 year-old wants?

I don't know exactly what they want - and frankly I don't care. It's what I want I guess. But I do notice that cartoony things get alot more fanfare than adult things. So I guess - me being an adult, can never satisfy the wants of a child. Because I have my own wants- get it? Other than that I don't know if the +.50 for games will really be a good solution - but you have to admit that alot of games are far below what they "deserve" - meaning alot of good flash work is being given a bad score because it doesn't have FF in it or Sonic or whatnot.

You are totally right about the seeing a thing - and not apreciating it for what it is because for a game ALOT is happening that you can't see. Also how many people can appreciate a submission for being optimized, having a decent playback etc...Alot of the technical things will not get due respect and that makes it more frustrating for the person who spent alot of time paying attention to the details that maybe noone will ever see or appreciate.

So in all, I can fairly understand why the majority may vote more for a FF peice or whatnot- versus a well scripted game with complex interactions. That still goes to show that alot of hard work goes unnoticed - and the author who made it may feel like they spent all their hard work on it was in vain to see a FF peice beat it score-wise.

i really don't care much - or ever did - for score - but i will tell you that a good score does make you feel good. A good score makes me feel better than a bad score makes me feel bad. I don't take the score seriously- but because that is what the site *seems* to be about nowadays - I am sure alot of talented artists have had frustrations because of theor hard work being beaten by some tweening and simple graphics.

My main purpose of the post was for artist to not feel bad about bad scores even though that may be the ruling factor on the portal. I have felt like that sometimes- but I don't let it stop me- I just know I have to keep doing my best - and that score doesn't really matter. It matters moer to finish something - and try to finish it good.

Thanks poxpower for your insight.