I'm just getting tired of it. It wont do anyone any good and it doesn't help others who are actually serious about their art work. Everyone makes mistakes, yet lately any topic starter makes a post and it's either, a 5 minute pic, or he didn't post his work in the upload, he just linked it, or its just down right not very good, he gets pounded with repetitive post of bull shit telling him to GTFO or read th rules, or telling him " he sucks ass" ect.

First off its understandable if there was just some jackass that posted a really pointless piece of shit on purpose just to get the forum pissed, but even then your just doing what they wanted you to do. If it's this scenario, don't bother posting in it, you just prove they won

Now on the flip side we get those quick wipe artists. Some are very decent and some art not, yet you treat the decent one with praise and you flame the one thats crap. So then whats the difference? What if someone wanted to try somthing like the one guy but they just quite couldn't pull it off. And some people who are new to the game don't realize the amount of patience you need to make something great. Should you still tear his guts out till theres nuthing left? There's gotta be another way to handle things like this. Other than destroying his dignity. I don't care who they are, nobody deserves shit like that.

Now here's what the worst thing i think that goes on in here. It's when somebody makes an attempt at something and they've gave what they had on it, but it's not good enough. Some guys do give some awesome criticism to help them and you guys are awesome, and then theres just other guys( I'm not name dropping, you figure it out for yourself) who couldn't give a rats ass if he could improve or not. Who the fuck do they think they are? Who says they can't improve? It just kills me to see this kind of stuff, because we might of seen some really good things from them in the future, you never know. It's called constructive criticism people :( It works!

I really doubt this'll do any good, as it's probably been like this for a while, but its just been bugging me recently. However, maybe there's ways to avoid stuff like this even tho theres always going to be people like this out there.

I've noticed that those with a personal art thread get little to no flamming comments on them. Maybe if your looking for some good criticism , make a personal art thread. This would help keep the forum organized too. Everyone seems to have one now a days, so if you haven't made one yet, I suggest you get one.

If you've read this far I hope you'll take this into consideration later on. Everyone's art work sucked ass at one point in time. Your not born gifted, so just treat some of the newer guys with a little more respect or at least give them a chance to improve. Here's your one chance to change, I'm not expecting much from this, but maybe I did somthing.

So please, try being civil!

PLEASEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE !

hello brother.

if you get this joke i give you a cookie

amen!! i totaly just read all of that lol... took for ever but yeah i totally agree

At 10/20/07 12:14 AM, ShirtTurtle wrote: Why not just implement a rule that states "All comments must be friendly or constructive."?
That pretty much gets rid of those "read the rules" comments.

you'd think it'd be that easy, but sometimes theres just so many I don't know if mods could keep track of all the comments made and keep that rule enforced. It's really just up to everyone to grow up, and be respectful. No one can make them change but themselves, I can only suggest what would be nice to have.

At 10/20/07 12:09 AM, narf109 wrote: I'm just getting tired of it. It wont do anyone any good and it doesn't help others who are actually serious about their art work. Everyone makes mistakes, yet lately any topic starter makes a post and it's either, a 5 minute pic, or he didn't post his work in the upload, he just linked it, or its just down right not very good, he gets pounded with repetitive post of bull shit telling him to GTFO or read th rules, or telling him " he sucks ass" ect.

most people dont have anything better to do. (like me) but yea, i think if the artist didnt do something right, one (and only one) person should point out his/her mistake instead of having 10 more posts pointing out the same thing.

First off its understandable if there was just some jackass that posted a really pointless piece of shit on purpose just to get the forum pissed, but even then your just doing what they wanted you to do. If it's this scenario, don't bother posting in it, you just prove they won

good point.

Now on the flip side we get those quick wipe artists. Some are very decent and some art not, yet you treat the decent one with praise and you flame the one thats crap. So then whats the difference? What if someone wanted to try somthing like the one guy but they just quite couldn't pull it off. And some people who are new to the game don't realize the amount of patience you need to make something great. Should you still tear his guts out till theres nuthing left? There's gotta be another way to handle things like this. Other than destroying his dignity. I don't care who they are, nobody deserves shit like that.

i think everyone should stop saying something was done quick. first of all, you dont know how long it actually took (maybe it took a whole hour, you just cant trust people) just post art that looks good with some degree of effort in it.

Now here's what the worst thing i think that goes on in here. It's when somebody makes an attempt at something and they've gave what they had on it, but it's not good enough. Some guys do give some awesome criticism to help them and you guys are awesome, and then theres just other guys( I'm not name dropping, you figure it out for yourself) who couldn't give a rats ass if he could improve or not. Who the fuck do they think they are? Who says they can't improve? It just kills me to see this kind of stuff, because we might of seen some really good things from them in the future, you never know. It's called constructive criticism people :( It works!

i agree. never say someone can't improve. instead tell the guy to keep practicing cuz that's what really improves a drawer/artist.

I really doubt this'll do any good, as it's probably been like this for a while, but its just been bugging me recently. However, maybe there's ways to avoid stuff like this even tho theres always going to be people like this out there.

kool

I've noticed that those with a personal art thread get little to no flamming comments on them. Maybe if your looking for some good criticism , make a personal art thread. This would help keep the forum organized too. Everyone seems to have one now a days, so if you haven't made one yet, I suggest you get one.

yup

If you've read this far I hope you'll take this into consideration later on. Everyone's art work sucked ass at one point in time. Your not born gifted, so just treat some of the newer guys with a little more respect or at least give them a chance to improve. Here's your one chance to change, I'm not expecting much from this, but maybe I did somthing.

i was born autistic. (its good to have a big ego :) )

So please, try being civil!

PLEASEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE !

ey, that's the cat from shrek!

i think everyone should stop saying something was done quick. first of all, you dont know how long it actually took (maybe it took a whole hour, you just cant trust people) just post art that looks good with some degree of effort in it.

yeah good idea, people should that that into consideration, don't tell them u wiped in half a second. Thats as bad as saying its your first flash submission in the portal. Doomed to fail.

and yes it was puss and boots. I mean i figured if you wouldn't listen to me maybe that cute SOB would have an effect. Who could resist that face :)

I'd probably post something to help you out, but I didn't even read the whole post you made.

I just got to lazy.

At 10/20/07 12:32 AM, Bad-Ass wrote: I'd probably post something to help you out, but I didn't even read the whole post you made.

I just got to lazy.

well at least you tried :)

I mostly read every post on the BBS so far but don't post half the time because the topics are shit.

From the rules, verbatim:
- All criticism must be constructive. The art forum is intended to be a POSITIVE environment and negativity is not welcome here.

It's not exactly what you're asking for, but the forum is intended to be receptive to new art and artists.

I'll admit that when something pisses me off, usually an alt, I get sarcastic and cynical very quickly, make some snarky comment and lock the thread. I could be nicer about it, but most of the threads that I lock or delete are breaking multiple rules and flagrantly displaying horrible MS Paint art like it was shit made of gold.

I'd like only one person to post about reading the rules in any one thread and the rest of you just leave the thread alone for a mod to lock or delete it. We don't need to totally destroy a person because they're breaking the rules, but they do need to understand what they did wrong and get it right next time but we don't need to crush them to dust.

...unless they are art thieves, then feel free to unleash unholy Hell upon them. =]

At 10/20/07 12:37 AM, BlackmarketKraig wrote:

...unless they are art thieves, then feel free to unleash unholy Hell upon them. =]

tonight i shall write those words on a small peice of paper, and put thetm under my pillow.

??????

It's the way that the world is I'm afraid.

I'm more than happy to help a person out if I think that they're honestly asking for help and that I can supply them with it.

The fact of the matter is that the world is full of assholes who can't help but point out mistakes (Flamming?)

The world is also full of suck ups who feel the need to kiss ass.

If I go into a thread where a person has not followed the rules, I like to tell them, and show them what the rules are.

If it has already been stated, then I won't bother, but a heap of people will in the hopes that they can either take a cheap bandwagon shot at a 'n00b' or in the stupid hope that a mod will think..........."Wow, seven people have pointed that out, but he pointed it out better with the same exact words and so we'll mod him".

What you're missing is the fact that people like me don't normally bother speaking up about this because you won't see us posting in these circumstances due to the fact that, as I said, we'll steer clear of the situation and stay silent about it, knowing that the mods will get around to it in their own time or it'll die out.

What you're basically doing is shouting at the people who won't actually read this at all. It'll only be read by the people who already know these things.

At 10/20/07 12:37 AM, BlackmarketKraig wrote: From the rules, verbatim:
- All criticism must be constructive. The art forum is intended to be a POSITIVE environment and negativity is not welcome here.

tyeah but it seems impossible to enforce that rule, other than locking a thread when things get nasty. Locking a thread helps but it doesn't fix the problem entirely, and like i said I don't think anything will unfortunately unless people change. Having faith in people isn't something i do often but for once im hoping for it.

most of the threads that I lock or delete are breaking multiple rules and flagrantly displaying horrible MS Paint art like it was shit made of gold.

yeah true most rule breaking is locked, but sometimes flame wars ensue in the good ones and it ends up destroying a generally good topic :( which is disapointing

At 10/20/07 12:41 AM, Raguel wrote: What you're basically doing is shouting at the people who won't actually read this at all. It'll only be read by the people who already know these things.

true true.. so very true -_-;

What you're basically doing is shouting at the people who won't actually read this at all. It'll only be read by the people who already know these things.

I realize this but one can hope right? I know how the worlds like but I just said what needed to be said. Better than bottling it up and snapping at someone who probably didn't deserve it, which is somthing I've done b4 and I'm usually not that kind of a person.

So yeah I understand this is a message that probably wont reach the guys it should, it I guess you could say this is for those people who did get flamed for idiotic reasons, while all us good guys stood by, kept silent and just read the topic spiral into the abyss of hell.

At 10/20/07 12:57 AM, narf109 wrote: I guess you could say this is for those people who did get flamed for idiotic reasons, while all us good guys stood by, kept silent and just read the topic spiral into the abyss of hell.

but what can you really do? backseat mod? bother one to check the thread constantly? argue with flammers?
I'n many of them it seems like posting anything at all will make it worse T_T.

At 10/20/07 01:13 AM, Vortex00 wrote: but what can you really do? backseat mod? bother one to check the thread constantly? argue with flammers?
I'n many of them it seems like posting anything at all will make it worse T_T.

That's pretty much it.

Don't post in a thread like that and don't pay any attention to it.

When you open it, if it's shit and somebody's already pointed out the flaws, then leave it to die.

The main problem is that everybody keeps bumping the damned things to tell them that it shouldn't be there.

If they stopped bumping it, it'd go away.

The person will realize their mistake with one comment if they're not a handicap and the comment maker is not a prick.

If they are actually a trolling wanker, then everybody ignoring them will bore them.

They'll make a post with no reply.

Then they'll reply themselves calling everybody a wanker to no avail.

Then they'll have another go, again with no responses and they'll think "Fuck these art forum cunts, they're a useless pack of shits", and they'll leave.

If people keep responding then they'll keep trolling.

but what can you really do?

Exactly. Your right nothing we can do in the thread itself. So this is what I've done. If you feel like you want to help or want to do something, maybe you can. Maybe you can do something in tribute(in the form of art) to all those people we wished we could of helped without making it worse. Maybe it'll get people to listen in. Might work.

At 10/20/07 12:37 AM, BlackmarketKraig wrote: I'll admit that when something pisses me off, usually an alt, I get sarcastic and cynical very quickly,

Like the rest of us.

make some snarky comment and lock the thread.

Like the rest of all mods.

I could be nicer about it,

You're about the nicest mod I've seen yet. Not ass-licking, it's truth.

I think I won't have much of an opinion here. I'm kind of an asshole, when it comes to lesser art, but I always add decent advice to it.

PS: You mistyped flaming... How's that possible? Such a huge text and the only painful typo is in the title.

I apreciate you trying to clean up the art forum, however I doubt it will ever be like a safe haven of criticism.

At 10/20/07 11:23 AM, ngmastah wrote: I apreciate you trying to clean up the art forum, however I doubt it will ever be like a safe haven of criticism.

It'd help if people would stop to think once in a while if what they're saying is useful once in a while. If it isn't, stop typing and read summat else.

I can't stand reading posts which break rules either, but inevitably a mod's gonna see it and lock it, or it's going to sink to the bottom.

And flaming's for attention whores.

its just a forum who cares... if you want nothing but positive comments goto deviant art... you could poo on the screen and you'd get glowing reviews.. i prefer the harsh sometimes abrasive reality.

It's not our fault these people can't read the damned rules CLEARLY MARKED at the top of the sub-forum. Most of them deserve every single insult thrown at them, so please, shut the hell up and learn how it works before you give us crap about it.

i prefer the harsh sometimes abrasive reality.

yeah but you gotta think that some of the people on here are younger guys, and the second someone tries to be "harsh" they'll retaliate with the only way they know how, they wont second guess trying to bash the guy who tried to bash them. In the end it results in a locked thread and nobody learns nething.

Yeah it's just a forum, but it's also an art forum. I see this place as a way to learn from each other, because that literally was how I developed as an artist. I got great constructive criticism when I first came on here, and unfortunately I don't see other people getting what I managed to get.

I'm not trying to make the forum love each other, I just want people to be civil.

At 10/20/07 12:34 PM, JackFox wrote: It's not our fault these people can't read the damned rules CLEARLY MARKED at the top of the sub-forum. Most of them deserve every single insult thrown at them, so please, shut the hell up and learn how it works before you give us crap about it.

Meh it's not just that tho, even when some guys follow rules they get insulted.

And who honestly does read the rules the second they make an account on newgrounds and post? It like saying you gotta do your homework before you can go play lol. Eventually a person who doesn't read them, is going to get told to read the rules, or his thread is going to be locked, and thats where it should end.

Were human beings were smart enough to know that when someone tells us once, "You gotta read the rules", I pretty sure he's likely to go read them, unless he likes getting his thread locked. That's really all it takes, why should we futher add insult to the doomed thread?

At 10/20/07 12:11 PM, Luis wrote: its just a forum who cares... if you want nothing but positive comments goto deviant art... you could poo on the screen and you'd get glowing reviews.. i prefer the harsh sometimes abrasive reality.

What Luis sed ...

At 10/20/07 12:53 PM, narf109 wrote: why should we futher add insult to the doomed thread?

Lots of people get in the group mood, so they start insulting as well. It's all psychological.
Be honest: Didn't you EVER felt that way? This is Newgrounds, and whether you like it or not, its users and their flaming insults are never going to change.

Lots of people get in the group mood, so they start insulting as well. It's all psychological.
Be honest: Didn't you EVER felt that way? This is Newgrounds, and whether you like it or not, its users and their flaming insults are never going to change.

unfortunately, I'm going to have to agree with you. It's sad that thats how it's going to be. As I said before this thread is just somthing a wanted out there.

Yeah there's been times when I've wanted to insult. And theres times when I've carried out with it. Mistakes on my part.

Hopefully you understand why I made this. Everyones made some good points, glad people read my topic at all. If i didn't change anything that's fine. If i did anything at all thats great. Any other points to be made are welcome. I think I've said everything I needed to say.

I agree with everything you say. Dont slap the shit out of the newbie, just try teaching him/her. I always take time to write constructive reviews on stuffs that the author has put effort in. Art thieves on the other hand bring me joy-joy feelings about lighting them up like xmas trees. But SOMETIMES, a guy just gotta slap the individual back on track to make him/her clear of the obvious. Making circles with ms paint tools or such things just dont pass in our judgment here at the art forum. I just tell the individual the truth, telling him/her to get real and draw on a piece of paper instead, then come back. That way, he/she can compare it to the other shit at ms paint and then ill give props. We all got something hidden inside, but to get it out, you just gotta express it in a real proper way, in a form that suites you the best. Anyways, my point is that flaming shouldnt be over exaggerated. I hate it when people flame to become "one of the guys". Ugh. Uberlame.

In order to understand the individual, you gotta break it down with him/her and take it from the start, doing it step by step and see the results while on the move. Almost like grabbing the arms to make him/her walk. And if the person desires to do it in anime style as an example, which would end up crap by first time, i will break in and make it clear. Even if i would risk gettin my ass bashed by mods or other suckers, i dont give a fuck. MC once rushed me because i was trying to break up a crossfire between him and a criticizer, but hell i was just being honest xP

Yes indeed, we must take the responsibility TO NURTURE OUR ARTISTIC GENERATION! XD
... yeah im serious.