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Under Judgment Voting

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metalhead676
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:33:29 Reply

wade, how about if you and Tom reward the users who watch teh actual flash for the minutes or whatever and give thema couple of extra points for not being a total dickhead?.

liljim
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:34:21 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:32 PM, Sir_Snark wrote: Hmm..I had an idea, but I am not quite sure you can even do this:
Is there a way, possibly, that the timer would start after the movie is loaded? Like say there is a large submission, but people see like a name that they hate, even though the movie might be good. They could possibly vote 0 on it before the movie is loaded, especially with slow connections, even with a 50 second wait. So if it could be done, this timer starts AFTER the movie is fully loaded, not just after you click "watch this movie". I'm not really sure if there is a way to do this, but just an idea.

That's the way things used to work in the past, but there are complications with that now (and there were when we actually had it running, too).

liljim
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:37:22 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:33 PM, unowned wrote: Denvish claimed that Firewalls and Pop-up blockers can effect it from loading. <>
Could that be a bad thing for my Kerio? I'm going to try voting in IE.

I believe that that was due to the way in which it used to work in the past (see my last post to this thread). It's funny, I've been reading through the Evolutions thread, but seem to have read past all of that stuff. The timer thing has been on my mind since we changed from the old system (where the panel would load on completion of the animation loading up) to swapping to the newer way, then going on to the newer newer way (most recent).

pieoncar
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:37:34 Reply

At 3/23/05 04:26 PM, WadeFulp wrote:
At 3/23/05 04:24 PM, JustLikeFrank wrote: Isnt there a way you can use sessions so that when the movie window is opened a session var is set with the current time, then on the vote page it compares the time the var was set to the current time. That could be used for when people deposit as well, to see if people just vote on 5 movies quickly to get the experience
I believe this is only possible if both windows are coming from the same domain. However, since the content window is coming from a different domain (the .swf file is on another domain), variables like this can't be shared.

Here's how I would go about doing something similar... but I've hardly worked with Flash at all, so I could be dead wrong on a couple integral parts.

First, the "Watch this movie" or "watch this game" part would have to be changed to a Flash movie loaded from uploads.ungrounded.net; when clicked, this movie would connect to UUN through XML sockets and pass the current time along with username and password, etc. loaded by Javascript as shown in this page, but actually pulling the data from cookies by Javascript (tutorials all over the web for that).

UUN will return a time to the XML sockets, and that movie will use a SharedObject to store the time to store how long until voting will be allowed (this would have to be an ID unique to the movie, i.e. based on the movie's ID).

While all this is going on, the flash movie for the voting panel (also loaded from uploads.ungrounded.net) will constantly be looking for the SharedObject, and when it finds that it exists, it will decrement the time until the time hits 0 (or whatever method is convenient); when it's time to allow voting, the SharedObject is deleted.

When the user finally votes, the same variables that were loaded into the first flash movie are again passed to UUN but with an updated time, which is verified against sessions or a table in a database.

AFAIK, the only other change required would be to move the voting database/mechanisms to UUN, or to allow UUN to access a certain table on newgrounds.com.

Just for the sake of argument, did anyone catch if there were any glaring errors in my logic here?

totoum
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:38:29 Reply

i'm on mac and it works for me

Glaiel-Gamer
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:38:46 Reply

you can't alter an swf

liljim
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:40:05 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:37 PM, pieoncar wrote: Stuff.

Believe me man, I really did check into this thoroughly before going over to the method we're using now. I've been researching it for a while. :)

liljim
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:40:24 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:38 PM, totoum wrote: i'm on mac and it works for me

Using what browser?

Glaiel-Gamer
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:44:07 Reply

Ok, it works now.

asdfrasdfg
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:44:27 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:34 PM, liljim wrote:
That's the way things used to work in the past, but there are complications with that now (and there were when we actually had it running, too).

Oh really? I didn't even know that. Well, I still think that this won't fully solve problems, because I remember seeing a movie that was 3 min long and only 99k. So..maybe the time could be increased more because I still think people might even just open something small and even if it is good, they will immeadiatly blam it because they can.

pieoncar
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:45:41 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:40 PM, liljim wrote:
At 3/23/05 05:37 PM, pieoncar wrote: Stuff.
Believe me man, I really did check into this thoroughly before going over to the method we're using now. I've been researching it for a while. :)

Then out of curiosity, what's wrong with the plan I mentioned? You and I both know that the current situation can be easily worked around in any browser (and I'm not dumb enough to say how on the BBS, so nobody ask), whereas using Flash would be all server-authenticated actions, essentially.

Meh, I guess we're all just going by the fact that very few people would ever take the effort to use a workaround though.

liljim
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:48:54 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:42 PM, Pink_beer wrote: Thats good n' all, but not for me. I have a fairly fast connection and when i watch movies i can normally right-click and press "play" and the movie will play. So it only takes me like 10-20 seconds to see the quality of a movie.

Woe-be-tied that you have to wait a WHOLE EXTRA THIRTY SECONDS before getting the vote panel, worse case scenario. Considering that even after the animation has loaded, you still have to WATCH THE MOVIE/PLAY THE GAME, which also should take time.

It might suck that you have to wait just a few more seconds for crappy animations before you're able to vote on them, but that's the whole point to this - there's more at stake than just your 30 seconds or so of viewing. Some of these artists do put shit together just to fuck around, but many of them aren't getting the time back that they've spent on the animation from the people who're voting on them.

How would you feel if you spent months on an animation or game and then some cock comes and votes a 0 on it just because they can't be bothered with waiting for a minute or two for it to load and then watch it through? I'd imagine you'd be pretty torn up about it, given that you're moaning about having to wait thirty seconds more than the max load time for your connection.

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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:50:36 Reply

Wade, I think that you should add a factor to the waiting time, connection speed, putting a thing in the personal profile asking what speed you use, the faster the connection the faster the bar will appear, but then there is the issue of people all saying they have the fastest connection, so maybe instead there could be some sort of auto detect to detect what speed you have if possible.

Also, add a PHP timer to where the bar will appear.

"## seconds until voting bar appears"

papaKLATZ
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:55:07 Reply

I don't know, since this update I can now vote whenever I want, without even opening the movie. Just thought you might know you should fix this.

Zictor
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:55:11 Reply

Its good that this has happened.... I know I used to come here daily and vote randomly on entries to get Experience points... there is the odd day where I spend time going through LOADS of flash, leave a review (i hate the waiting time between reviews!!! that should be sorted out) and vote how I thought it was. But meh, I'm gonna submit more than I have been soon enough... From November till now I've not done much but mess arrround with FX and watch flash movies! =O

New feature Will help too ^_^

totoum
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:56:51 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:40 PM, liljim wrote: Using what browser?

safari, that's apple's browser

SnafuDave
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:57:55 Reply

I just have to say I dislike this idea big time. Just this morning I watched a Flash which were two fat kids dicking off infront of a camera. I watched the full thing and the voting bar still wasn't appearing. I assumed something was broken and didn't vote. The big problem with this is it screws over people with high speed internet such as myself with College T1 speed internet, load times are INSTANT. Plus most people aren't going to know why the bars aren't appearing instantly. And regardless people are still going to vote along the lines of who the author is and what type of Flash it is. Making voting more of a pain in the ass doesn't help ANYBODY. If anything it will just irritate voters of larger movies to blam them even further.

asdfrasdfg
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 17:59:22 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:50 PM, FrOzEn_FoX wrote: Wade, I think that you should add a factor to the waiting time, connection speed, putting a thing in the personal profile asking what speed you use, the faster the connection the faster the bar will appear, but then there is the issue of people all saying they have the fastest connection, so maybe instead there could be some sort of auto detect to detect what speed you have if possible.

Also, add a PHP timer to where the bar will appear.

"## seconds until voting bar appears"

The idea of the ## seconds until voting bar appears doesen't sound like a very good idea to me. I mean, some people might be crazy enough that they just stare at that counter until they can vote 0 on something, just waiting instead of watching the movie. (People, this is Newgrounds, it can happen, it gets like 100,000 visitors in a week.) Now the other thing about auto-detecting speeds sounds like a pretty good idea, so uh, yeah.

papaKLATZ
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 18:00:48 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:57 PM, SnafuDave wrote: Blabbering

Maybe to help out people like this, you should actually have a visible timer of when the panel will appear, and maybe some text that says "The voting panel will appear in: XX seconds. To understand why, click here." and have the word "here" linked to an FAQ about this.

Just a suggestion.

liljim
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 18:01:16 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:45 PM, pieoncar wrote: Then out of curiosity, what's wrong with the plan I mentioned?

I'll contact you about this over e-mail tomorrow, since I would rather keep this thread down to bug reports rather than thrash out the ins and outs of the best way of doing things... Drop me a line just so I have a recap on your address - I do have e-mails from you already stored, but my inbox is a complete mess at the moment.

liljim
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 18:03:19 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:55 PM, Klatzko wrote: I don't know, since this update I can now vote whenever I want, without even opening the movie. Just thought you might know you should fix this.

Are you talking about voting on Under Judgement submissions? If not, you're not paying attention.

liljim
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 18:04:15 Reply

At 3/23/05 05:56 PM, totoum wrote:
At 3/23/05 05:40 PM, liljim wrote: Using what browser?
safari, that's apple's browser

Mac users have reported problems with several browsers, so thanks for the clarification.

Digivolution
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 18:08:12 Reply

This is good news. The only thing that annoys me is that I have broadband. So I would have to wait half a minute then vote, depending on how long the video was. Usually, most flashes are like 15 seconds long if they are just stick men, which are common.

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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 18:15:22 Reply

At 3/23/05 03:21 PM, BlackVivi wrote: Great stuff ^^

Indeed.
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Penis


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Kaabi
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 18:17:28 Reply

Thats pretty nice. Yep, its nice.

AnzRage
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 18:18:03 Reply

yeah i've noticed it i was gonna make a topic asking what the deal was, i sortof knew but i wanted an offical answer. Even so i'm sure they will base the vote on the authors, because everyone else will too even though it's crap.


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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 18:43:01 Reply

I think this is a great idea, because i just submitted a movie yesterday: Majin Vegetto, and as soon as it got submitted the score was at 3.00+ even though it had been on for about 30 seconds:S, but i still got daily 5th place though:P lol


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Carmilla
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 18:58:28 Reply

I think this is an excellent idea.


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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 19:02:15 Reply

I still go with the idea to not give any information while watching under judgement movies, or at least to hide up the list of other movies by the author and the profile. That way they have no way of voting on the flash based on who made it, and are forced to watch the flash unless they feel like throwing out random votes.


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AnzRage
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Response to Under Judgment Voting 2005-03-23 19:10:19 Reply

but i hate when a noob submits a 5 mb uncompressed movie about sticks, you can tell it's crap by their commentary as well. It's a waste of my 50 seconds


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