At 9/17/07 08:37 PM, Earfetish wrote:

At 9/17/07 08:27 PM, balto-boy wrote: They were once perfect. satan created sin and flawed the earth forever.

Not if they disobeyed God initially through Satan's temptation. You think God would have the foresight to think they might be tempted.

A simple test. Testing has He does to us now. God has made agreemens with satan before.
" So satan answered the Lord and said, 'Does Job fear God for nothing? Have You not made a hedge, around him, around his household, and around all that he has on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land. But now, stretch out Your hand and touch (take) all that he has, and he will surely curse You to Your face!' And the Lord said to satan, 'Behold, all that he has is in your power; only do not lay a hand on his person (do whatever you want to him, but don't kill him).' So satan went out from the presence of the Lord."
Job 1:9-12

"God works in mysterious ways," - I have no answer
"The only way to salvation is through Christ," - I have no evidence

Absence of proof isn't proof of absence.

I'd thank medical science. Loads of people are sick at birth, and an awful lot die, and prayer doesn't seem to help. If God wanted you to die, he would surely have let you, and if he wanted you to live he would've let that happen too, surely; even from a Christian pov, if death is part of a divine plan then why would God let you screw it up?

ECMO was pretty experimental, then. If God had no purpose for me or my death would had some purpose, then I would've died. The fact that He let me live (and he has saved my life many times after my birth) tells me that I have something to do that requires me to live here to do so. If someone dies, then that means that they have fufilled their purpose or God has nothing else for them to do down here and it's simply time to go.

Well, Balto-Boy, I'd have to concur with you on the fact that giving God a chance is a wise thing. However, I have to add that the atheists have a point in regard to their knowledge. I also have to point out that while you are entitled to your beliefs, there are some of you who just refuse to give God a chance in your lives because you don't like the idea that you're not in control of your own life, and those that did give God a try and walked out, the reason is because it got hard, no?

Deal with it, God didn't say that following him would be easy, he just said it was the right thing. After all, take a look at the French Revolution in the 1790s, it was Godless, and it was humanistic in view. Take a look at what happened to them as a result. They nearly destroyed themselves, and eventually weakened their potential as a Great Power, to be occupied by Nazi Germany in the Second World War.

To conclude, you are entitled to your beliefs, but I am likewise entitled under the American Constitution's first amendment to have the freedom of speech to say that you are the blind leading the blind, and you shall all fall eventually into the abyss, the pit known to us as Hell, the Lake of Fire. If you want to give God a chance, be fully committed, not wishy-washy and ready to quit when it gets too hard. That's a sign of cowardice, and those who do not show faith in God, have no hope of redemption in the end.

At 9/17/07 08:56 PM, balto-boy wrote: Job 1:9-12

The book of Job has nothing to do with my point. It's not about God testing us or proving our faith; God totally has the ability to give Adam and Eve free will whilst still giving them the common sense and foresight not to eat the apple. God could have made every human with free will, but also the want to use that free will for good and not commit immoral acts. The fact that mankind can be tempted by Satan is evidence of a massive flaw in God's handiwork, which it is especially cruel for him to send us to Hell over.

Absence of proof isn't proof of absence.

Absence of answers makes it reasonable to think the unanswerable assumption is incorrect. To use reducio ad absurdum, there's no disproof of fairies / WMDS in Iraq / The Matrix; however those ideas are considered ridiculous, socially, and organised religion isn't.

tells me that I have something to do that requires me to live here to do so.

So now it was nothing to do with your dad praying, or miracles, it was because of a divine plan? ECMO was experimental then, and now it works, so God created you with this disease as one of the lucky ones, and everyone born after you was also a lucky one, and everyone preceding you was unlucky and was going to limbo / purgatory.

If someone dies, then that means that they have fufilled their purpose or God has nothing else for them to do down here and it's simply time to go.

And, unfortunately, for the vast majority of people (including unbaptised babies and Aztecs), that means no kingdom of Heaven. And I suppose the purpose of everyone who was born with your condition before you was to encourage medical scientists to get to work.

These aren't proofs or arguments, these are just explanations, justifications, you ain't gonna convince anyone. You can say 'the only way to salvation is by following Jesus Christ', but that's just a personal conviction, not based on any definable evidence, with opposing evidence in the form of the Qu'ran and the Mayans and the Pagans.

You say 'absence of evidence is not evidence of absence,' I say, 'extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence'. I can't say that you are 100% wrong, but that's only because there is no 100% proof in debate (other than maths), but I can say that, since you have supplied no evidence and rely on faith, it is very probable you are incorrect. So yes, there is no evidence of absence, but that's not gonna shake my atheism. There's no evidence of absence of a lot of things, and organised religion is one of the most unlikely.

At 9/17/07 09:19 PM, Earfetish wrote: The book of Job has nothing to do with my point. It's not about God testing us or proving our faith; God totally has the ability to give Adam and Eve free will whilst still giving them the common sense and foresight not to eat the apple. God could have made every human with free will, but also the want to use that free will for good and not commit immoral acts. The fact that mankind can be tempted by Satan is evidence of a massive flaw in God's handiwork, which it is especially cruel for him to send us to Hell over.

I'm using Job to make some points here: 1. God is testing humankind. The fact the humans exist may very well be a test, some sort of experiment. And before you say something like "Oh, but you just said He cares. Why would He care about a failed experiment?", He does have a reason for caring. Maybe it's the same feeling a child has for a LEGO model they made or something, they made it, so it is part of them.
2. I was also pointing out the possibility that God made a bet with satan about mankind's resistance or what woud happen if it did happen. I don't know everything there is to know. Simply guesses that could very well be wrong. I'm not saying any of those theories are really true.

Absence of answers makes it reasonable to think the unanswerable assumption is incorrect. To use reducio ad absurdum, there's no disproof of fairies / WMDS in Iraq / The Matrix; however those ideas are considered ridiculous, socially, and organised religion isn't.

Because there is evidence of God. You simply said that there's no proof that Christ is the way to salvation (even though He is). There is a tomb, there is a Golgotha hill, Israel isn't some fairytale land.

So now it was nothing to do with your dad praying, or miracles, it was because of a divine plan? ECMO was experimental then, and now it works, so God created you with this disease as one of the lucky ones, and everyone born after you was also a lucky one, and everyone preceding you was unlucky and was going to limbo / purgatory.

And, unfortunately, for the vast majority of people (including unbaptised babies and Aztecs), that means no kingdom of Heaven. And I suppose the purpose of everyone who was born with your condition before you was to encourage medical scientists to get to work.

Until you reach a certain age (which may be different for each individual), then you aren't able to make heart-filled decisions. If a child or baby dies, they're going to Heaven because they never really had a chance and seeing as they couldn't do any evil purposely, they are forgiven by God. This could also lead to the possiblity that if your parents have taught you to do all of the wrong things in life, then you are forgiven by God much more easily.
Plus, you're starting to put words in my mouth. I never said that every ECMO baby had the same purpose as me or that dead babies go to hell. Frankly, I don't appreciate that.

These aren't proofs or arguments, these are just explanations, justifications, you ain't gonna convince anyone. You can say 'the only way to salvation is by following Jesus Christ', but that's just a personal conviction, not based on any definable evidence, with opposing evidence in the form of the Qu'ran and the Mayans and the Pagans.

My reason for this is because God is the master of everything and knows what is right. If you need more proof than that, then your earthly, shameful, sinful self is speaking on your behalf. satan can be a strong deciever. Some have learned to overcome him and some, as in your case, haven't.

You say that I'm not going to shake you of your atheism. Well, you're not going to convince me that God isn't there, because I know He is. Eariler, I clearly stated that you have a choice. I'm am simply telling you what I know because of a conversation leading to this point. You asked for my knowledge, and I gave it to you. Also, you mentioned earlier that life has been going well for you and that you were grateful. Question is, who are you grateful towards?
As a final say, who will you turn to when the Rapture comes? When millions disappear in the blink of an eye? When WWIII occurs? When a sickness sweeps the earth, killing a fourth of the planet? When the antichrist comes to power? Who else will there be to turn to?

Now, here's a challenge for the Atheist Army to deal with.

One verse of the Bible, one that states a challenge to all. Render unto Ceaser that which is Ceaser's and render unto God that which is God's. This verse is Matthew 22:21.

And to add another two to the pile, here's Acts 14:15-16: Ye should turn from these vanities unto the living God,... who in times past suffered all nations to walk their own way. And as a tie-in, here is Daniel 4:17: The Most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever He will.

As a last bombshell, I add Psalm 144:15 to this mix: Happy is the people whose god is the Lord.

To be fair, god doesn't ask a lot of you, just to believe with your heart, soul, and mind. It's not like God's asked you to fight the devil unarmed and alone. In any case, what i do know is that you have not got the right to just dish out on others for their beliefs, just as we have the right to defend ourselves against you.

However, I will not seek a direct war with you. I'll only defend my beliefs and try to explain them to you. If you wish to make an issue of it, then do so, but I will not fight you back, for as it says in the Holy Writ: vengeance is mine, sayeth the Lord.

I want to join :3

Now a "quick" rant.

Some people say that religion has helped the world in many ways, that even if there is no god religion is good. I am completely and utterly against that, religion has brought no good to our lifes.

Thanks to religion there were mass slaughters, punishment, killings, wars, social problems, etc...

If I need to give examples of this, then you sir don`t know much about World history. The only "good" thing that came out from religion, as some people like to state, are the commandments..

Are you kidding me ? Do you seriously believe that without them we would have rape and killings legalized today ?

Everybody knew it was wrong, because humans have morals, religion just took the obvious and made it a rule.

If Religion did make something good, it cannot compensate for all the unjust killings that rise from it. So many great people have died thanks to the inquisition, so many great people deemed as heretics... Religion is the cause of wars that are STILL raging.

All religions are made from human greed, as they are used as tools of human oppression and control. Burn them all.

----------------

Second rant.

How the fuck do theists call us close-minded ?

I`ll tell you something about my past week in college. And for your knowledge, I`m attending an opus-dei university. That`s like punishment for me... but my friends don`t care about me being an atheist. Which I find awesome.

So, I was talking to a girl who is part of a Opus-dei family, she really REALLY believes in everything there is to believe about god, the bible, church, etc...

I told her, do you believe atheists are close minded ?

Yes she told me, because we cannot open our minds to the grace of god.

I grinned in happiness.

I remembered "the atheists guide" which Earfetish linked me too once.

I told her: Why do you believe that ? When I am open to accepting that there is a god if you give me valid evidence of it... not just some bogus information about a dude named Jesus living and making miracles, which cannot be confirmed since the only historians that talk about his existence were, for the lack of a better word, bullshitters ?

I continued:

Do YOU have an open mind about the possibility (and I used possibility here since you cannot say fact or else she might have started crying) that god does not exist ?

NO - she said

God exists, and even if you present me evidence, scientific evidence I will still believe in him.

See ? This is why YOU have a close mind, and me, the lonely atheist are the one with the open one.

God is on my side - she said.

Well folks... the machine of brainwashing worked on her, and there is nothing to do. I just accept that fact that just as if you don`t learn a language after 6 years of age, you will never talk, you will never know the truth about the fakeness of god if you were fed about it since a small age.

Believers will use stupid and sometimes unreal answers to answer your objective questions. And even sometimes, they will go as low as saying:

"Because god wants to test our faith"

Holy shit that makes me laugh...

...And cry, all at the same time.

The idea of god/gods kills more people than war, and destroys more futures than the lack of education.

BUT, believing in god does actually give people a false sense of "tranquility"

Yes, they feel as if they are protected by God. Shame he wont protect you against my car when I run you over xD

Hope I can integrate myself here !!

The two religious people are being deeply unconvincing, some Bible quotes mean nothing to me since the Bible is fake, Golgotha Hill and Israel existing aren't evidence for Christianity just like how 4 Privet Drive exists doesn't prove Harry Potter.

Well, you're not going to convince me that God isn't there, because I know He is.

That's your real evidence; faith, personal conviction, and it's not particularly convincing.

My reason for this is because God is the master of everything and knows what is right. If you need more proof than that, then your earthly, shameful, sinful self is speaking on your behalf. satan can be a strong deciever. Some have learned to overcome him and some, as in your case, haven't.

And that's your understanding of my perspective. It's not, 'actually, you're making a lot more sense than me,' it's 'Satan, the Great Deceiver, invented Paganism and Mayanism.' Like every religious person, you're the expert at making excuses for religion; you don't look at it the way it actually is.

WeissDraconis is coming in this thread and whining about us attacking his beliefs. Stay the fuck away from religious threads and debates if you don't like the heat.

Neosoviet, you're, of course, completely correct in every aspect of your quick rant. People say it's fanatics causing religious conflict, but it's not, it's just religion getting mixed up in everything. Like Celtic versus Rangers football matches in the UK. It's not a bunch of fanatics making excuses, when they're screaming 'fuck you Fenian bastards,' 'fuck you proddie Huns', and then kicking the shit out of each other afterwards to a far more widespread extent than your average football hooligans, and they're not doing it because of political disagreements, they're doing it because of segregation. I really think only thick-headed apologists deny that.

And free speech, too. I love free speech, hate religion, and especially hate the religious affront we have on free speech these days.

hey, responding to that last post that christian guy made... yeah, we arent satanists you dumbass, we are atheists, that means not religious, so even if there were a god or devil(*cough* even though its bullshit) we wouldnt be helping either side, satanist of christian.

For someone who's accusing me of whining, Earfetish, you seem to be doing a lot more of it than me because Balto-Boy and I are providing a counterpoint to your viewpoints. I'm just saying, don't diss us if you can't take us fighting back!

However, if you would like for Balto-Boy and I to stop defending ourselves, maybe you should stop attacking us without a balanced counterpoint.

Next time you go off half-cocked, maybe you should remember that people are more than willing to fight for what they believe. If you don't like that, then that's your problem.

I never said anything to complain, but felt that just point-blank throwing our rights and beliefs in our face does entitle us to defend ourselves.

Don't like it? Then maybe this should be closed, or at least a password offered to the members to authorise a post in this thread. I only say this because you seem to dislike the fact tht Balto-Boy and I are defending our beliefs, and then countering with some of our material. You just have a problem with accepting opposition. Take a look at Nineteen Eighty-Four, and you have an atheistic novel, however, I still find there's all sorts of stuff that Christians can use. If you have a problem with us, and tell us to get effed, all you're doing is handing us weapons to fight back with.

In brief, if you don't like us, at least respect us!!!

At 9/18/07 07:33 AM, WeissDraconis wrote: In brief, if you don't like us, at least respect us!!!

I'm not whining, perhaps you should consider reading some of my posts before saying I'm not providing a balanced viewpoint; I support you guys posting in here really because it spurns conversation, but if you hate atheists shitting on your beliefs then perhaps you should avoid threads where they will.

Posting some Bible quotes isn't ever going to convince an atheist, I can't believe you think that's a good argument. What counterpoint could I possibly make? I don't believe in the Bible, so I dismiss its threats. That's my counterpoint.

At 9/18/07 07:33 AM, WeissDraconis wrote: For someone who's accusing me of whining, Earfetish, you seem to be doing a lot more of it than me because Balto-Boy and I are providing a counterpoint to your viewpoints. I'm just saying, don't diss us if you can't take us fighting back!

However, if you would like for Balto-Boy and I to stop defending ourselves, maybe you should stop attacking us without a balanced counterpoint.

Next time you go off half-cocked, maybe you should remember that people are more than willing to fight for what they believe. If you don't like that, then that's your problem.

I never said anything to complain, but felt that just point-blank throwing our rights and beliefs in our face does entitle us to defend ourselves.

Don't like it? Then maybe this should be closed, or at least a password offered to the members to authorise a post in this thread. I only say this because you seem to dislike the fact tht Balto-Boy and I are defending our beliefs, and then countering with some of our material. You just have a problem with accepting opposition. Take a look at Nineteen Eighty-Four, and you have an atheistic novel, however, I still find there's all sorts of stuff that Christians can use. If you have a problem with us, and tell us to get effed, all you're doing is handing us weapons to fight back with.

In brief, if you don't like us, at least respect us!!!

Why should we respect you? You come here insulting our beliefs, (or lack of them) call us cowards and Spam our club. You say we are all destined for Hell yet you fail to realise that it means nothing to us. In your eyes we're just lost souls that are in need to salvation where you also fail to realise that we do not want it. We believe in something you don't and pisses you off. Why should you care about us? You don't, you just want more people on your side giving you the good feeling that what you are believing is correct because many people follow it. Then you try to disprove what we believe and ignore the things that disprove you. I was religious, I did pray and guess what? It was no different to what it is now. Expect I cared less about my life since I had the idea that Heaven would be better but now I appreciate my life thinking it is all I have. You give the impression that Atheism is wrong and then demand that we respect religion. Why the fuck should we respect Religion when you keep attacking us? And it's not easy to defend Atheism when all you use is faith to defend Religion.

Either of you didn't come here trying to save souls or defend Religion. You came here looking for an argument in which case GTFO you spamming troll. I cannot believe that you came just after we agreed not to Spam Religious threads in retaliation for jackasses like Spamming us.

Don't really see where I was whining, either.

It's funny that this WeissDraconis only has three posts, they're all in here, and is saying he's DEFENDING himself, rather than attacking us, when it's very obvious he's not. He's clearly trolling, I don't particularly care because I have utmost confidence and can argue him down any day, but it is clear hypocrisy. (bottom layer of Hell); definite hypocrisy with the insults, too.

We're not doing anything that he's claimed we are, we're not attacking the religious or throwing their beliefs in their face, they're all coming in here and attacking us, and they don't like it when we argue back with better responses.

When will you religious people that keep posting in a thread you dont even belong in leave us alone. I mean trying to convince us atheist that there is a god is useless. You're not convincing any of us so if you're not an atheist STOP FUCKING POSTING IN HERE! YOU RELIGIOUS PEOPLE ARE ANNOYING! I mean why cant you just respect our beliefs? You leave us alone and we'll leave you alone, everyones happy okay? You're not going to convince us of any of your beliefs so you can just stop.

Attention to all Atheists!

If these Religious people keep attacking this thread, don't call the mods just simply say:

I deny the Holy Spirit; I deny the existence of God and Jesus Christ. I think the Bible is false and I am the enemy of Jesus Christ and believe he is not my savoir or leader.

That way they will define us as lost causes. They will stop telling us what we believe is wrong and stop thinking we can be saved.

Or just call the mods and say there are assholes spamming the club.

Hi, what are the conditions to join ?

I want to join where can i sign up?:P

Zomg I like the discussion here... it`s just astonishing how theists believe that quoting the bible (which has HUNDREDS of inconsistencies) will help them xD

It`s special, because theists sometimes like to say the bible is just reference, and sometimes theists like to say we should do exactly what it says...

They change their arguments over and over to match the moment. And this with every single other statement.

"A test of faith" (when god wont answer) vs "It`s a miracle!" (when god supposedly chose one motherfucker and gave him a miracle)

Is it just me or God is one pain in the ass ? Why does he give miracles to so many rich white people when poor black kids die from starvation in Africa... I don`t see a plate of food spontaneously appearing in their tables there.

"The bible is just reference or metaphores" vs "The bible says..."

Hahahaha, so bitches, when are we supposed to know the bible is just reference or a manual to life ?

And even in your so beloved bible, god is a fucking monster, killing gay people, killing hardworking people (the sabbath thing), etc...

God is a killing machine, and your reference/manual to life says so.

One day, I will track the posts of a theist, and paste them in word, and when he suddenly posts something that goes against something he already said about god/religion/faith I will post it in his face.

They just keep changing arguments or standpoints in order to counter our questions, when we never change ours. We are the ones who should go to heaven xD

Now, a little dance:

*Dance*

At 9/18/07 12:21 PM, NeoSoviet wrote: Now, a little dance:

*Dance*

Yes it is a problem when debating with Religious people. They claim what is metaphorical and what is literal just by guessing. The famous Noah's ark was considered literal 100 years ago and is suddenly claimed metaphorical considering you cannot get all the species of animal onto one boat regardless of its size. What is clearly disprove in the Bible with Science or simple common sense is now just a story or myth. Ask anyone 500 years ago how old the Earth is and they would tell you it around 5-6 thousand years. Yet now they claim that 1 year for God is a million years for us which would incorporate the idea of the big bang, the Dinosaurs and Evolution as true.

They guess how the world works and things that are wrong or considered inhumane are forgotten or changed and the things have the smallest ounce of truth are considered factual to them. I mean look at Evolution for example, I know there is a possibility that is could be wrong. I know the possibility that my beliefs are wrong. But for many Religious people, they consider what they believe to be true and what they think to be fact, just because they believe in it.

*Makes love to Brick-top*

At 9/18/07 02:30 PM, NeoSoviet wrote: *Makes love to Brick-top*

I'll bring the whip and the edible underwear LOL

The only reason there were any religous wars is due to human flaws, our aggressive nature our nature to claim territory, our nature to dominate. You can only blame ourselves for these wars not religion itself.

At 9/18/07 03:53 PM, OrangeBase wrote: The only reason there were any religous wars is due to human flaws, our aggressive nature our nature to claim territory, our nature to dominate. You can only blame ourselves for these wars not religion itself.

Since people use Religious quotes to forward their argument I'm going to try this tactic.

If a man still prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall say to him, "You shall not live, because you have spoken a lie in the name of the Lord." When he prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall thrust him through. (Zechariah 13:3 NAB)

This why people use Religion as an excuse to start wars. Because almost all religions at one point or another say to kill people who believe differently to them. Which kicks off wars.

At 9/18/07 03:53 PM, OrangeBase wrote: The only reason there were any religous wars is due to human flaws, our aggressive nature our nature to claim territory, our nature to dominate. You can only blame ourselves for these wars not religion itself.

I can say the SEGREGATION DUE TO RELIGION causes wars, ie Sunni / Shi'ite, Catholic / Protestant, Muslim / Christian, etc

And I can also say any Holy Book that was The Truth would not encourage its believers to wage war on each other, nor would God allow His religion to be sullied by immoral acts committed in its name.

Ummmm..... should I put a link to this in my sig?
If I do, I'll have to take another link out.

At 9/18/07 06:13 PM, alicetheDroog wrote: Ummmm..... should I put a link to this in my sig?
If I do, I'll have to take another link out.

Can do if you like. I mean, people can just click Profile instead of the link. But I just linked it because it's easier.

At 9/18/07 06:10 PM, Earfetish wrote: I can say the SEGREGATION DUE TO RELIGION causes wars, ie Sunni / Shi'ite, Catholic / Protestant, Muslim / Christian, etc

And I can also say any Holy Book that was The Truth would not encourage its believers to wage war on each other, nor would God allow His religion to be sullied by immoral acts committed in its name.

And the Bible says these things? Pssht! Jesus said not to resist violence and to love pray for your enemies.

"But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. If anyone wants to sue you and take away your tunic, let him have your cloak also."
Matthew NT, 5:38-40

"But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven; for He makes His sun rise on the evil and on the good, and seens rain on the just and the unjust."
Matthew NT, 5:43-45

Just to point something out...

At 9/18/07 07:24 PM, balto-boy wrote: Just to point something out...

True that, although Jesus was still a big fan of the Old Testament.

There are still cases, though. And other points from the same post still stand, even if you disagree with this one.

Cruelty and Violence in the New Testament

Damn! The mods wont help, they say its not getting out of hand with these religious people who are wasting their time trying to convince us there is no religion, I cant believe it!

At 9/18/07 07:24 PM, balto-boy wrote:

At 9/18/07 06:10 PM, Earfetish wrote: I can say the SEGREGATION DUE TO RELIGION causes wars, ie Sunni / Shi'ite, Catholic / Protestant, Muslim / Christian, etc

And I can also say any Holy Book that was The Truth would not encourage its believers to wage war on each other, nor would God allow His religion to be sullied by immoral acts committed in its name.

And the Bible says these things? Pssht! Jesus said not to resist violence and to love pray for your enemies.

"But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. If anyone wants to sue you and take away your tunic, let him have your cloak also."
Matthew NT, 5:38-40

"But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven; for He makes His sun rise on the evil and on the good, and seens rain on the just and the unjust."
Matthew NT, 5:43-45

Just to point something out...

Heres something to point out.

If your brother the son of your farther, or of your mother, or your son or daughter or the spouce whom you embrace tries to secretly seduce you saying 'let us go and serve other Gods.' You must kill him, your hand must strike the first blow in putting him to death and the hands of the rest of the people following. You must stone him to death, since he has tried to divert you from Yahweh your God.

Put this scenario on a large scale and got yourself a war.

Religion in the past and occasionally the present has shown to be murderous, jealous, racist, sexist, homophobic, vile, vindictive, unforgiving etc.

Apparently it's easy to bless your enemy, but everyone else is done for. lol

Hell even Abraham the farther of the most popular Religions killed his only son in the name of God and Moses the man who brought the 10 commandments down to Earth killed prisoners making him no better than Hitler or Saddam.

hey guys and gals. Sorry for not being on for a while. Anyway, i've caught up with what has been going on. I have to say, WHAT IN THE WORLD ARE YOU DOING HERE!!! I'm talking to you Draconis and Balto-boy. None of us go to your forums and flame you. In fact, I even went to the Catholic Club and asked them very politely, (as in no flames, no offence, nothing that would warrant a flame at all), to make sure that none of their guys come and flame us. And don't try to say that you're "defending" yourselves. Um, what!? Like I said, no one here ever did anything to you. You want us to stop trolling on your forums and respect you, fine. But you have to give it us first. We atheists are tolerant of your beliefs. We don't flame, we don't troll, and we try not to offend. What you are doing is basically like what Hitler did to the Jews. Also, just in case you didn't know, Hitler was a Catholic. I researched this fact myself on reliable websites. And finally to end my little rant, if you want to insult us, fine. Cause we'll just turn our cheek, just like someone in this forum said. Who was that? I can't remember. Wait... wait... OH!!! That's right, it was YOU, wasn't it Draconis? Well, how ironic indeed.
Sincerely, Cabosetek.
P.S. Leave our forum before we have to take drastic measures.