At 4/14/13 05:26 PM, IGreenI wrote:

I believe we have a winner srs; likening the only proof we have that an atom exists is observed affects.

this sentence makes no sense to me

At 4/14/13 04:31 PM, Sequenced wrote: Has anyone realised this?

After the Romans executed jesus, they realised that this is a perfect opportunity to keep citizens in order for the empire. Thats the whole reason why the bible was made. By the romans, to keep the citizens from committing crime and keeping them happy in their little shell.

The first half of the Bible was written before the Romans even existed, i.e. Old Testament.

Not sure if trolling or dumb.

At 4/10/13 11:58 PM, CoolBerries wrote: Who here, on Newgrounds, can say with confidence that they are a Christian? And yes, being Catholic, Presbyterian or anything like that counts. I just want to see the responses that you may have.

I was raised by a devout Seventh-Day Adventist family. When I turned 15, there was something missing. I dug deeper into the meaning and my life.
To make a long story short, I am now free from religious titles and have reverted back to what I believe is 'right.' I dropped all belief that one religion has and broke off to basically create my 'own'. I just go with what I believe is right. Many would call me an idealist but I see it on a bigger scale. There is definitely something that controls space and time, whether it be God or God in the Force I don't know. What I do know however is that there is a right and wrong/good and evil. We can only hope that in time, we will come close to hoping to understand it.
I do in fact believe in God, so I would consider myself to be a 'christian' in it's meaning.

Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The "Force"(God et.) shall free me.

At 4/14/13 07:18 PM, ruinitforme wrote:

The first half of the Bible was written before the Romans even existed, i.e. Old Testament.

Not sure if trolling or dumb.

someone doesn't know their history. Romans have been around more than 600 years BC.

At 4/14/13 07:31 PM, Sequenced wrote:

At 4/14/13 07:18 PM, ruinitforme wrote:

The first half of the Bible was written before the Romans even existed, i.e. Old Testament.

Not sure if trolling or dumb.

someone doesn't know their history. Romans have been around more than 600 years BC.

That's my point, most old testament books are written thousands of years BC.

You can give up now.

God is awesome fuck everything else

Not me.

At 4/14/13 08:58 PM, ruinitforme wrote:

That's my point, most old testament books are written thousands of years BC.

You can give up now.

"most". they started writing about 2000 years bc. romans came along around 1200 years later. So what I said is still a plausible theory.

I was raised by a devout Seventh-Day Adventist family. When I turned 15, there was something missing. I dug deeper into the meaning and my life.
To make a long story short, I am now free from religious titles and have reverted back to what I believe is 'right.' I dropped all belief that one religion has and broke off to basically create my 'own'. I just go with what I believe is right. Many would call me an idealist but I see it on a bigger scale. There is definitely something that controls space and time, whether it be God or God in the Force I don't know. What I do know however is that there is a right and wrong/good and evil. We can only hope that in time, we will come close to hoping to understand it.
I do in fact believe in God, so I would consider myself to be a 'christian' in it's meaning.

Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, I gain strength.
Through strength, I gain power.
Through power, I gain victory.
Through victory, my chains are broken.
The "Force"(God et.) shall free me.

You know, people like you make me smile. In fact, you reflect a little bit of Jesus in you, for you understand the depth perception this life has to serve you, and you do have the ability to oversee living other than how people treat you as a human. I would recommend you study in depth some more, if you are willing. Call me up!

At 4/14/13 07:31 PM, Sequenced wrote:

At 4/14/13 07:18 PM, ruinitforme wrote:

The first half of the Bible was written before the Romans even existed, i.e. Old Testament.

Not sure if trolling or dumb.

someone doesn't know their history. Romans have been around more than 600 years BC.

And God has lived far longer than that, always remember.

At 4/15/13 12:42 AM, SwankyVagrant wrote:

did you make this thread to just tell atheists they were wrong in a passive aggresive way?

let's make babies.

At 4/14/13 07:32 PM, TNT wrote: It is rather difficult to call myself a Christian. I say this because everyone who claims to be a Christian (or any other branch of Christianity like Chaotic, Baptist, Methodist, etc.) tends to vary on opinions regarding what should be done in society. For instance (which I'm surprised this hasn't been brought up yet), we have the KKK. Very devoted Christians, yet they are very racist to anyone who is not "white", and are not tolerant to anyone who does not hold their Christian values. History has also shown them to be violent by lynching anyone who wasn't "white" for their political gain, which contradicts one of the Ten Commandments "Thou shall not murder/kill".

I would bring up the Westboro Baptist Church, but it has already been mentioned in detail.

There's a funny story I had regarding Christianity one day. Almost a year ago, I was moving furniture and boxes into my first apartment. I was really excited to finally be on my own without my parents or RAs watching my back. My roommate was still at his mom's house, so I was on my own for the first couple of days.

About a half an hour later, two men who were in their thirties noticed I was unloading stuff to my apartment alone. So they decided to approach me and ask if I needed any help. I told them that I'm in no need of help, and I wanted to do this on my own. The two men assisted that they wanted to "work", but that part went through my head thinking they meant "help". After thinking about it I decided to let them help by saying, "Well if you guys really want to".

For the first ten minutes it went smoothly, but then I overheard them talking about money. It occurred to me that they wanted to work for money and I had no cash on me, so I told them to stop what they were doing right quick. I explained that I had no money on me, and if you guys like to stop then go right ahead. One of the men was furious! He started to yell at me, probably thinking I was really dense or something, and I tried to explain it was a misunderstanding. This went on for a minute then he asked me if I would help move furniture for someone for free. I told him, "If they ask for help, yes I would." It was then I got the most interesting response. "So you're some sort of Christian? Because I'm not religious!"

We eventually negotiated and the two men left, thankfully the other guy was very understanding. Now, I brought this story up because he believes that when people help others, that makes them Christian. I disagree with his response. I help people out because I believe (I would say "know" but that might come out arrogant) it is the right thing to do. Christianity has nothing to do with my willingness to help others, and I've volunteered to a handful of organizations from charities to animal shelters. I can understand how some people who helped others get the idea from Christianity or the Bible, but this is something I learned on my own and from the community around me.

And regarding if I go to church, it's rare that I do. I have no disrespect for churches at all, but it's just something I don't go to on a regular basis. I've read bits and pieces of the Bible, but not the whole thing.

The reason why I find it hard to call myself a Christian is because I shaped my own character based on my surroundings. I also have some different viewpoints (I support gay-marriage, Christianity doesn't for example). For me, and this goes for any religion, Christianity is like a guide that someone could use if they are in doubt about the meaning of life. In most cases they will help them become good people, but sometimes it can be abused if they take everything seriously, or misunderstood a passage (like Al Quada, the WBC, and not forgetting the KKK). Personally, I believe that you don't necessarily need religion to be a good person as the community, education in general, and yourself can make that happen.

I think you are 100% correct, my friend. Christian organizations such as the KKK set a bad example for us, for it is definitely NOT our intentions to be like this, but sometimes people misinterpret what the Bible really says to people and people may make their own perception of it. And yes, I do find it ironic some Christians decide to go extreme, and against their own base beliefs, and that people are in the religion for political reasons, which I think should not be done, for the Bible doesn't tell you about how to be a good politician, but it does teach you to be a good person. About your story, I agree, you don't have to be Christian to be a good person, either, but Christianity does support it, and help you become of which. With the church, I used to be the same, I used to never go to church, like, ever, until I entered a youth group at the beginning of eighth grade. I got saved, and didn't think it a big deal, but I listened more in depth to the scriptures, and I was moved to what Jesus had to say as well as God's teachings. And, you know what, I agree with you in Gay Marriage, I fully do support it, though I know God writes he does not support homosexuality clearly in the bible. But, to be honest, if there was one bible verse I would want to take out, it would be the one that states that, for I think it only makes a mess of things, community wise, religious wise, political wise, love wise, Everything Wise, and I really wish it didn't. Let's talk about this via PM, for your views are indeed reasonable, and I would like to discuss them more.

At 4/15/13 12:42 AM, SwankyVagrant wrote:

At 4/15/13 12:36 AM, CoolBerries wrote:

And God has lived far longer than that, always remember.

did you make this thread to just tell atheists they were wrong in a passive aggresive way?

Of course not, if you are athiest, or a different religion, or anything else, I DO respect your beliefs, I'm mainly here for fellow Christians or people who aren't quite sure whether they are or not. If I am offending you, I am truly sorry, for I am not meaning to.

Eastern Orthodox

1+3+3=7 yay post

At 4/14/13 10:41 PM, Sequenced wrote:

At 4/14/13 08:58 PM, ruinitforme wrote:

That's my point, most old testament books are written thousands of years BC.

You can give up now.

"most". they started writing about 2000 years bc. romans came along around 1200 years later. So what I said is still a plausible theory.

The Torah (First five books of the bible) has nothing to do with the Romans, it was written for the Jews.

Since when are moderators trolls?

At 4/15/13 01:41 AM, ruinitforme wrote:

The Torah (First five books of the bible) has nothing to do with the Romans, it was written for the Jews.

Since when are moderators trolls?

since the beginning of time

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46 NLT) If you buy a Hebrew slave, he is to serve for only six years. Set him free in the seventh year, and he will owe you nothing for his freedom. If he was single when he became your slave and then married afterward, only he will go free in the seventh year. But if he was married before he became a slave, then his wife will be freed with him. If his master gave him a wife while he was a slave, and they had sons or daughters, then the man will be free in the seventh year, but his wife and children will still belong to his master. But the slave may plainly declare, 'I love my master, my wife, and my children. I would rather not go free.' If he does this, his master must present him before God. Then his master must take him to the door and publicly pierce his ear with an awl. After that, the slave will belong to his master forever. (Exodus 21:2-6 NLT) When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT) When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)

You guys really believe the creator of the universe approved of regulated slave trade?
Seriously?
Really?

CHRIST I am NOTHING!

At 4/15/13 04:06 AM, 372 wrote:

You guys really believe the creator of the universe approved of regulated slave trade?

Yes. You have to understand the culture was different back in those times. We are not in that time period now, so why are you bringing that up?

Seriously?
Really?

Why are you so angry at religion? You are just as preachy as religious fanatics. I've met a few atheists that were actually rational. They knew the Bible so they had credibility to what they were opposing. At this point, you just fall into the category of dumb and no one is taking you seriously.

At 4/15/13 08:51 PM, ruinitforme wrote:

At 4/15/13 04:06 AM, 372 wrote:

You guys really believe the creator of the universe approved of regulated slave trade?

Yes. You have to understand the culture was different back in those times. We are not in that time period now, so why are you bringing that up?

so you think because the culture of the times was different, the creator of the all the universe, who is perfect and good in every way, approved of slavery ? Or was it because it was a story made up...by someone...of that...culture...

I lol'd.
I'm not preachy. It's a topic about christianity so I'm going to say what I think of christianity. I'm not going to just not say anything because I'm afraid I might offend someone.

At 4/15/13 09:07 PM, 372 wrote:

At 4/15/13 08:51 PM, ruinitforme wrote:

At 4/15/13 04:06 AM, 372 wrote:

You guys really believe the creator of the universe approved of regulated slave trade?

Yes. You have to understand the culture was different back in those times. We are not in that time period now, so why are you bringing that up?

so you think because the culture of the times was different, the creator of the all the universe, who is perfect and good in every way, approved of slavery ? Or was it because it was a story made up...by someone...of that...culture...

You're taking it out of context.

I lol'd.
I'm not preachy. It's a topic about christianity so I'm going to say what I think of christianity.

You can't say what you think about something if you are ignorant of what it is. All you are doing is pigeon holing verses and saying that's what it is instead of discussing it as a whole.

I'm not going to just not say anything because I'm afraid I might offend someone.

It sounds like that's your main reason for your opinion, is to offend people, but you're not even doing that.

At 4/15/13 09:15 PM, ruinitforme wrote:

At 4/15/13 09:07 PM, 372 wrote:

At 4/15/13 08:51 PM, ruinitforme wrote:

At 4/15/13 04:06 AM, 372 wrote:

You guys really believe the creator of the universe approved of regulated slave trade?

Yes. You have to understand the culture was different back in those times. We are not in that time period now, so why are you bringing that up?

so you think because the culture of the times was different, the creator of the all the universe, who is perfect and good in every way, approved of slavery ? Or was it because it was a story made up...by someone...of that...culture...

You're taking it out of context.

I lol'd.
I'm not preachy. It's a topic about christianity so I'm going to say what I think of christianity.

You can't say what you think about something if you are ignorant of what it is. All you are doing is pigeon holing verses and saying that's what it is instead of discussing it as a whole.

I'm not going to just not say anything because I'm afraid I might offend someone.

It sounds like that's your main reason for your opinion, is to offend people, but you're not even doing that.

1. I was born into a Christian and have been to church many many times. I even went to those sunday religion classes. I took tests on Christianity and made my communion
2. How is it out of context? The bible is supposedly the word of an all knowing, all powerful, perfect God who loves all his creations, yet in it he states some weird rules regarding regulated slave trade...
3. It's perfectly logical to quote the Bible, THE HOLY BOOK, of Christianity to make points about the practice and belief of christianity.
4. What about what I am saying is out of context? I am saying that it is a flaw in logic to believe the creator of the universe, who is good and combats sin, would write his holy book with the mindset of a male slave owner in the 2nd century.
5. If you think I'm sharing my opinion just to offend you, you need to get over your semmelweis reflex.
6. You don't agree with me, that's okay. But that does not discredit my point.

I've never understood why non believers try to inject human comprehension into the *god head. There is no such thing as good/bad when used to explain the *omniscience of reality.

I'll give you an example: Would you break into your neighbors home and slit his throat for no other reason than to know what it feels like to do so? No, you can't and neither can I because we 'think' we know that's wrong, but more importantly we think we know why it's wrong.

So for someone that doesn't understand ( regardless of their belief/non belief ) why it's wrong, or just doesn't think it's wrong at all won't have the same moral obligations as you and I. Now you may think to yourself that every person on the planet inherently understands the difference[s] between right and wrong, but that couldn't be further from the truth, as 'they' wouldn't murder with such malice if only they had 'figured out' what you have about life. If you think elsewise, this means that indeed you are capable of committing such an act, at any given time. If this is true, then I wouldn't feel comfortable leaving even my dog around you. Think about it.

To the point: what you think is right, is only relevant to those who share your same understanding, so for you ( non believer ) God takes absolutely no stock. And for you to assume [its] even aware of your existence isn't in keeping with your non belief, so you should drop the subject all together when brought up by believers, else you contradict your identity. But you can't do that, can you?

Also, for a believer to suggest a non believer will be punished for his/her sins against the lord isn't in keeping with your identity, either. The bible clearly states any man having heard the name of Jesus, and still refuses will indeed face judgment. So how can you in good conscious condemn the non believer as he/she obviously hasn't heard the name of your understand of the Lord, else they'd believe.

The irony of this exchange is that the arguments for or against cancel each other out, and anyone who truly knows the god head will understand that in perpetuating the argument will turn them into one or the other.

I can't finish this, I'm drinking.

@372

may I take a stab(metaphorically speaking) at the slavery thing?

At 4/15/13 09:45 PM, badfurrykitty wrote: @372

may I take a stab(metaphorically speaking) at the slavery thing?

go ahead, you don't have to ask me, lol.
I'm down to listen.

At 4/15/13 09:28 PM, 372 wrote:

1. I was born into a Christian and have been to church many many times. I even went to those sunday religion classes. I took tests on Christianity and made my communion
2. How is it out of context? The bible is supposedly the word of an all knowing, all powerful, perfect God who loves all his creations, yet in it he states some weird rules regarding regulated slave trade...
3. It's perfectly logical to quote the Bible, THE HOLY BOOK, of Christianity to make points about the practice and belief of christianity.
4. What about what I am saying is out of context? I am saying that it is a flaw in logic to believe the creator of the universe, who is good and combats sin, would write his holy book with the mindset of a male slave owner in the 2nd century.
5. If you think I'm sharing my opinion just to offend you, you need to get over your semmelweis reflex.
6. You don't agree with me, that's okay. But that does not discredit my point.

Is that why you are so mad? I've heard this many times. "Oh, the church is bad and stupid, that must mean that's what God is then". The modern day church does not represent the previous one mentioned in the Bible. That's just a common excuse for your hatred of God. You have a pattern of misdirecting things and manipulating words to your own opinion.
You're taking verses out of a time period, and referring them to today's way of life. That is illogical.

This isn't some huge religion you think you are opposing. Christianity has a small following and will always have one. If you say that their is a lot of buildings with a cross statue on them and I'm wrong, that's very ignorant of you and a excuse for your sin.

Honestly I think you're so anti-god because you want attention. You're wasting your time.

At 4/15/13 10:24 PM, ruinitforme wrote:

At 4/15/13 09:28 PM, 372 wrote:

Honestly I think you're so anti-god because you want attention. You're wasting your time.

You have to understand that bugging him and forcing your religion on him won't make him any more of a believer. People have different beliefs. I consider myself an atheist.
I respect people with faith, though I can't comprehend what they believe in.

At 4/15/13 10:30 PM, triplenoob wrote:

At 4/15/13 10:24 PM, ruinitforme wrote:

At 4/15/13 09:28 PM, 372 wrote:

Honestly I think you're so anti-god because you want attention. You're wasting your time.

You have to understand that bugging him and forcing your religion on him won't make him any more of a believer. People have different beliefs. I consider myself an atheist.
I respect people with faith, though I can't comprehend what they believe in.

I think he's trying to troll me now or something..
if he's not I don't wanna continue this conversation...

At 4/15/13 10:30 PM, triplenoob wrote:

At 4/15/13 10:24 PM, ruinitforme wrote:

At 4/15/13 09:28 PM, 372 wrote:

Honestly I think you're so anti-god because you want attention. You're wasting your time.

You have to understand that bugging him and forcing your religion on him won't make him any more of a believer.

I did not do either of these things. He's the one who came into this thread and starting bashing religion for no reason. Do you honestly think I am trying to force my religion on him or think he will change? That's not Christianity. Religion is a choice. Just because some inbred is holding up a dumb sign does not categorize me with them.

People have different beliefs. I consider myself an atheist.

I stated this clearly in my previous post.

I respect people with faith, though I can't comprehend what they believe in.

Ok.

You guys really believe the creator of the universe approved of regulated slave trade?

No.

I don't think you got clear picture.(don't we all? lol) The bible is filled with information that seem to scribble around things mentioning in previous scriptures, books, and chapters...

I'm only going to argue one point here cause it's pretty long for me to explain

Here's why: (fyi I'm using Exodusfor this part)

In this time, The Israelites were in slavery of the Egyptians

it's stated in Exodus 1:13-14 where "Egyptians made the sons of Israel slave under tyranny..And they kept making their life bitter with hard slavery.. and with every form of slavery in the field.. every form of slavery of theirs in which they used them as slaves under tyranny"

Then it goes further in 2:23-25 where "the sons of Israel continued to sigh because of the slavery and to cry out in complaint, and their cry for help kept going up to the [true] God because of the slavery"
(next verse)
".. God heard their groaning and God remembered his covenant with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. So God looked on the sons of Israel and God took notice"

Exodus6:6-8:
"I shall certainly bring YOU out from under the burdens of the Egyptians and deliver YOU from their slavery... and YOU will certainly know that I am YOUR God who is bringing YOU out from under the burdens of Egypt. And I shall certainly bring YOU into the land that I raised my hand in oath to give to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob; and I shall indeed give it to YOU as something to possess..."

Then after being freed from Egypt, HE DID INDEED allowed slavery among his people in Israel but in a vastly different from what we think of slavery now today...

This didn't really answer fully the question the information you provided I just wanted you to know that he does disprove slavery by works of men

final scripture:

Ecclesiastes 8:9- All this I have seen, and there was an applying* of my heart to every work that has been done under the sun, [during] the time that man has dominated man to his injury

*âEUoeThere was an applying.âEU( In Heb. this is a verb in the infinitive absolute, indefinite as to time and impersonal)