At 10/18/06 03:27 PM, MaestroRage wrote: guys I think the attitude around us all is getting overly too negative.

Oh boy, here it comes, there's word for it... Uh...

Compromise.

Poetic_Reven may have not done the best way to do it, but in the end, this is all just a hip hop competition kind of thing, right?

It's a hip hop battle 2 settle da end, aka, Poetic's attempt at "taking it 2 the next lvl", in other words, revolutionize anti-art, the gangsta hip hop treatment.

I mean they have rap battles right?

We're talking people of little intellect trying to outdo eachother with nonart, "I gotsda hot beats like mad skillz and me and homeyz gonna rawk the joint harder then (name competitors)".

I assume he wants a hip hop battle, I personally really don't see why everybody is so riled up and I believe most of these comments are aimed to attack Poetic, and not actually the thread he posted in.

Yeah, that's the point. It's about all the things he's done that's led to his 'career' based on nothing.

*Breath noises*

The rage is strong in this one

*breath noise*

The arguments on the AP are getting so repetiviness it's starting to sicken my very soul, this is all very petty. Erkie, im not sure why you're bothering, you know you're better than this...

At 10/18/06 04:31 PM, Love-Hate-War wrote: Erkie, im not sure why you're bothering, you know you're better than this...

That's the most typical response among mediators who want to end the discussion for the sake of it being negative.

It's also typical among mediators who don't actually read/comprehend what's actually being said.

But no, this isn't a shot or anything.

At 10/18/06 11:26 AM, Poetic-Reven wrote: fuck Paragon she got more talent than me i don't care...

Paragon's not a... oh forget it.

FUCK U... and have a nice day

PMS much? ^_^ And I will have a nice day, thank you.

well im not gona dissagree that you have been here a long time if that makes you a legend but i know you got talent and stuff and i know that makes you a legend im not trying to compete with someone whose been making music longer than me and probly knows more about music than me im just trying to come up and see how people like my music, i never talk about the haters and shit ( okay mabey once lol)thans all and we all have to remember newgrounds is just a site

Anyway!

Why can't everyone just get along?

I mean this would be a much nicer place is there was more love, and less hate, I mean come on! aren't we all here for the same reason?

To make music! So what! if you happen to hate a particular genre right?

Anywhoo!

please explain to me one thing?

What is it that makes a great Hip-Hop tune?

I'm new to the genre, well I haven't attempted it yet! but before I begin, I just need a few basic pointers, I generally Do Rock

are there any rules, that Hip-Hop and rock share?

Like I say I'm new to Hip-Hop and well I'm considering participating in this, just to see if I can do it more than anything!

Oh MaestroRage check your PM please! when you've got a second

At 10/18/06 04:00 PM, Erkie wrote:

At 10/18/06 03:27 PM, MaestroRage wrote: guys I think the attitude around us all is getting overly too negative.

Oh boy, here it comes, there's word for it... Uh...

Compromise.

Poetic_Reven may have not done the best way to do it, but in the end, this is all just a hip hop competition kind of thing, right?

It's a hip hop battle 2 settle da end, aka, Poetic's attempt at "taking it 2 the next lvl", in other words, revolutionize anti-art, the gangsta hip hop treatment.

I mean they have rap battles right?

We're talking people of little intellect trying to outdo eachother with nonart, "I gotsda hot beats like mad skillz and me and homeyz gonna rawk the joint harder then (name competitors)".

I assume he wants a hip hop battle, I personally really don't see why everybody is so riled up and I believe most of these comments are aimed to attack Poetic, and not actually the thread he posted in.

Yeah, that's the point. It's about all the things he's done that's led to his 'career' based on nothing.

stop disrespecting me u punk ass bitch....personally i started music because it was a hobby to me at first.....if u have a problem with me put a dick in your mouth and smile...stop directin yur little punk ass replys towards me......

fuck u and have a nice day

~1~

Yo Poetic-Reven

Just do your own thing man!

Don't worry about the negativity, it happens!

Don't suppose you could offer some advice for me could you, if you read my last post, I got a few questions for pointers there!

Cheers!

Peace Out!

Stealth

Some people can say all hip-hop sucks. But there are some hip-hop that isn't normal hip-hop. Im talking about stuff that means something. Instead of words that aren't in the dictionary in the song there can be lyrics where this song means something to you. Yes I know hip-hop has mostly no effort but I can say when I make hip-hop I but my hardest effort to make to sound cool and perfect.

At 10/18/06 09:24 PM, Para-Noid wrote: Some people can say all hip-hop sucks. But there are some hip-hop that isn't normal hip-hop. Im talking about stuff that means something. Instead of words that aren't in the dictionary in the song there can be lyrics where this song means something to you. Yes I know hip-hop has mostly no effort but I can say when I make hip-hop I but my hardest effort to make to sound cool and perfect.

I think anyone who says a specific genre "sucks" is ignorant. Simply because they don't like that particular type of music doesn't mean it is crap. There are plenty of genres which I don't care for (hip-hop included), but I would never say that that genre sucks. Tastes in music is like tastes in foods, or taste in sports. People seem to forget that their opinion isn't the only right one.

At 10/18/06 09:40 PM, DavidOrr wrote:

I think anyone who says a specific genre "sucks" is ignorant. Simply because they don't like that particular type of music doesn't mean it is crap. There are plenty of genres which I don't care for (hip-hop included), but I would never say that that genre sucks. Tastes in music is like tastes in foods, or taste in sports. People seem to forget that their opinion isn't the only right one.

That is basically what I was going to but yeah Lol. At least somebody is nice and isn't a jackass.

At 10/18/06 08:08 PM, stealth-annihilator wrote: I mean this would be a much nicer place is there was more love, and less hate, I mean come on! aren't we all here for the same reason?

You mean a chance at a one night stand with Chronamut? If anyone here is here for any other reason then that then they are just kidding themselves. Anyways... everyone... cut the crap... we've all heard the "Every genre takes skill to make" and "if you say a specific genre sucks then you're just ignorant" routines. Then we go on to say, "FL nor Reason are better than each other, they are equal" and "Girls can make music too! No really, they can!" There seems to be a compromise for every situation here in the AF where everyone magically wins.. whoopie-tee-do. Our own little fantasy world where everything is equal and no one can ever give any straight foward opinions or facts because we're too afraid to offend someone. Be realistic, damnit. Certain audio softwares, believe or not, are better than others. Certain genres DO take more skill and work to produce a track in. And guys REALLY CAN make music better than girls, and girls can sing better than guys, so we all have our little in-born talents... before you go off and start flaming me for being a sexist or something.

Basically, if you are going to play mister pacifist and post some generic fairy tale crap that we've all heard before about how making a 4 bar beat and calling it hip hop is no more difficult than composing a 10 minute trance song... then just don't post at all, because you're obviously not saying anything new or original... and it doesn't make you look "cool" whatsoever.

P.S. I'm not bashing hip hop, nor am I saying it is easy to make... I'm just saying... get your heads out of the clouds, if everything was so damn equal then we wouldn't have duality.. and things like hot and cold, long and short, or good and bad.

To make music! So what! if you happen to hate a particular genre right?

Don't worry about the negativity, it happens!

I think anyone who says a specific genre "sucks" is ignorant. Simply because they don't like that particular type of music doesn't mean it is crap.

Look at this, it happened over and over and over again with blatant disregard to valid points.

Where does "anti-art" not set in for you guys?

I make a philosophical implication and you shrug it off like a negative opinion, simply because you don't have the intellectual capacity to understand it. I guess hip hoppers do have a maximum for everything, why, their music shows just how clear and flagrant their inhibition is.

stop directin yur little punk ass replys towards me......

Of all the petty responses, this isn't a defense, just a direct slander against me. Stuff like this is grounds for a ban.

At 10/18/06 11:58 PM, Kirizzle wrote: You mean a chance at a one night stand with Chronamut? If anyone here is here for any other reason then that then they are just kidding themselves. Anyways... everyone... cut the crap... we've all heard the "Every genre takes skill to make" and "if you say a specific genre sucks then you're just ignorant" routines. Then we go on to say, "FL nor Reason are better than each other, they are equal" and "Girls can make music too! No really, they can!" There seems to be a compromise for every situation here in the AF where everyone magically wins.. whoopie-tee-do. Our own little fantasy world where everything is equal and no one can ever give any straight foward opinions or facts because we're too afraid to offend someone. Be realistic, damnit. Certain audio softwares, believe or not, are better than others. Certain genres DO take more skill and work to produce a track in. And guys REALLY CAN make music better than girls, and girls can sing better than guys, so we all have our little in-born talents... before you go off and start flaming me for being a sexist or something.

Kirizzle, You may wanna read my first post in this thread, Ok?
cos the last one of mine you refer to, is perhaps a bit of fantasy!

But that fact stil remains, that PoeticReven has started this thread, perhaps to push boundaries, are you telling me you don't ever try and push yourself?

Isn't one really good way to get good at something, to set yourself a challenge?

The answer to that is of course YES!!! if you think not, then it's you that has your head in the clouds!

Look it appears to me that you, like other people whom have made comments in this thread, are perhaps just trying to stir up shit!

Maybe some genres do take a bit more skill to produce than others, however there are gonna be people who will do a particular genre better than others, who perhaps do not specialise in that particular genre!

Now I'm not trying to say PoeticReven is the Dogs bollox at Hip-Hop, nor am I trying to say he's a pile of shit at it, I shall remain neutral to this

All I'm saying is that PoeticReven has started out with some good intentions, A challenge if you will! he wants to push boundaries, push himself, and who knows he might even rise to this little challenge, and who knows? he might even come out with some Shithot Hip-Hop

Give the guy a break for crying out loud!

Me a Pacifist? No you don't know me yet!

But I'm willing to back anyone up that's being given shit for no particular reason, other than the reason that people whom do not like his choice of genre, try and slate him for that choice

Now the way i see it is, if you do not have an interest in making Hip-Hop or perhaps you wanna come in and cause some shit, then do yourself a favour, and piss off cos all you're really doing is making yourself look like an asshole for doing it

That's all

Stealth

At 10/19/06 04:17 AM, Erkie wrote:

To make music! So what! if you happen to hate a particular genre right?

Don't worry about the negativity, it happens!

I think anyone who says a specific genre "sucks" is ignorant. Simply because they don't like that particular type of music doesn't mean it is crap.

Look at this, it happened over and over and over again with blatant disregard to valid points.

Where does "anti-art" not set in for you guys?

I make a philosophical implication and you shrug it off like a negative opinion, simply because you don't have the intellectual capacity to understand it. I guess hip hoppers do have a maximum for everything, why, their music shows just how clear and flagrant their inhibition is.

stop directin yur little punk ass replys towards me......

Of all the petty responses, this isn't a defense, just a direct slander against me. Stuff like this is grounds for a ban.

o i'm sry my ghetto ass ..likes snaping...at ppl like u.....yea to me it is a defense cuz all u did wuz put me down...so in my eyes....i felt like sayin somethin in my own way...if i get banned i get banned thats up the admins...not up to u....check my profile and see my hip hop music...yup and I do everything with FL

~1~

At 10/18/06 06:31 PM, Erkie wrote: That's the most typical response among mediators who want to end the discussion for the sake of it being negative.

It's also typical among mediators who don't actually read/comprehend what's actually being said.

But no, this isn't a shot or anything.

What the hell man? Every time I try and be nice you throw it back in my face! Im sure you'll throw some clever/witty reponse back at me again, further lowering my respect for you. And what if I am a mediator. Im not trying to end it because it's negative, it's because it's petty and over nothing important, over the internet. I thought some people were bigger than that. I joined this place to discuss audio and stuff, not read through countless arguments about shit all.

At 10/19/06 09:04 AM, stealth-annihilator wrote: But that fact stil remains, that PoeticReven has started this thread, perhaps to push boundaries, are you telling me you don't ever try and push yourself?

Let's just say that if I was a super hero my super hero name would be Koala Man.

Isn't one really good way to get good at something, to set yourself a challenge?

Aye aye Captain! But a contest isn't a challenge if you aren't actually working agaisnt someone or if it doesn't have any conditions or rules in it. You just make a song and hope it's better than everyone elses'... but isn't that what every audio artist does for every song, every time, anyway? This isn't really a challenge if you're picking up what I'm downing down.

The answer to that is of course YES!!! if you think not, then it's you that has your head in the clouds!

I agree that a challenge makes a person excel or perform better, but I disagree that this contest is actually a challenge and/or a competition... it's more of an excuse to boast some egos. It'd be a challenge if you had to make the hip hop song in specific subgenre of hip hop... it'd be a challenge if you had to make it a certain length at a certain tempo... it'd be a challenge if you had to use specific samples and acapellas in your song... BUT THIS HAS NONE OF THAT! The challenge is: make a hip hop song. WTF? You call that a challenge? That's what every hip hop artist normally does anyway, the only thing Reven is doing is now throwing the label of "contest" over it. As you can see, as I've said a billion times, this is just an excuse to flaunt egos because there is absolutely no real challenge in this contest, other than "make a hip hop song." Hah.

Look it appears to me that you, like other people whom have made comments in this thread, are perhaps just trying to stir up shit!

Speaking one's mind always stirs up controversy, or else it wouldn't be speaking one's mind.

All I'm saying is that PoeticReven has started out with some good intentions.

Yea, good intentions, but they were poorly executed. If he wants a challenge he should have set up some more guidelines or rules of how to make the hip hop song... perhaps taken a few of my suggestions from above.

But I'm willing to back anyone up that's being given shit for no particular reason, other than the reason that people whom do not like his choice of genre, try and slate him for that choice

Didn't you say earlier that you like to remain neutral or something? And now you tell me that you always pick the underdog's side of the argument? That doesn't sound very neutral to me, it doesn't even sound that smart, getting involved in arguments that you feel are unnecessary in the first place.

Now the way i see it is, if you do not have an interest in making Hip-Hop or perhaps you wanna come in and cause some shit, then do yourself a favour, and piss off cos all you're really doing is making yourself look like an asshole for doing it

Yea, I'm an asshole, and your expectations are fairly low if you consider making a hip hop song a challenge... especially if only hip hop artists will participate. Maybe if Reven asked a classical composer to make a hip hop song then it'd be a challenge... at least for the classical composer guy.

Anyways, get it across your thick skulls, I didn't start this "shit" because I dislike hip hop, I really couldn't care less about hip hop to be honest. I started it to say that this is not a contest, it's an ego's cry for attention disguised in a shitty contest. DavidOrr could have started a trance contest exactly like this one and I still would have said all the same things. Although I would have been nicer because I have more respect for Orr than Reven, for starters, Orr types in correct grammar and spelling.

At 10/19/06 10:06 AM, Love-Hate-War wrote: it's because it's petty and over nothing important, over the internet.

Every argument is like that... and yet we still have them.

Anywhooo... I'm done here, there is nothing more to say.

At 10/19/06 04:17 AM, Erkie wrote:

Look at this, it happened over and over and over again with blatant disregard to valid points.

Where does "anti-art" not set in for you guys?

I make a philosophical implication and you shrug it off like a negative opinion, simply because you don't have the intellectual capacity to understand it. I guess hip hoppers do have a maximum for everything, why, their music shows just how clear and flagrant their inhibition is.

I agree with you to an extent. I personally don't feel rap and hip-hop is music as much as it is a contemporary form of poetry (which is in fact art). What you need to realize is that art is a form of self-expression. It doesn't matter if you like it personally or not, nor does it matter if you agree with the message being sent to the listener. Hip-hop is still a form of self-expression, which is art.

This is why rappers and the like are referred to as "rap artists" not rap musicians. There is more poetry involved in the piece than music. But just because they are using a different medium other than music to express themselves, it doesn't mean they are anti-artists.

I think a more accurate term would be anti-music, because you could use society and recent increase musical ignorance within society itself to help backup that statement. Regardless, this is getting way off topic, as do all of the threads similar to these. As I have said multiple times before, the Newgrounds Audio Forum is clearly not the place to post topics like these.

Let's just say that if I was a super hero my super hero name would be Koala Man.

Hi Koala Man XD

Aye aye Captain! But a contest isn't a challenge if you aren't actually working agaisnt someone or if it doesn't have any conditions or rules in it. You just make a song and hope it's better than everyone elses'... but isn't that what every audio artist does for every song, every time, anyway? This isn't really a challenge if you're picking up what I'm downing down.

Yeah fair points, Reven has stated this as a contest, rather than a challenge, I probably kinda read between the lines anywhoo, and perhaps, myself see this as a challenge, as it's something I've not done before!

I agree that a challenge makes a person excel or perform better, but I disagree that this contest is actually a challenge and/or a competition... it's more of an excuse to boast some egos. It'd be a challenge if you had to make the hip hop song in specific subgenre of hip hop... it'd be a challenge if you had to make it a certain length at a certain tempo... it'd be a challenge if you had to use specific samples and acapellas in your song... BUT THIS HAS NONE OF THAT!

Fair point and I agree thay maybe Reven has poorly executed this too!

Speaking one's mind always stirs up controversy, or else it wouldn't be speaking one's mind.

and you like anyone else is entitled to your opinion, granted!

Yea, good intentions, but they were poorly executed. If he wants a challenge he should have set up some more guidelines or rules of how to make the hip hop song... perhaps taken a few of my suggestions from above.

Okay fair enough!

But I'm willing to back anyone up that's being given shit for no particular reason, other than the reason that people whom do not like his choice of genre, try and slate him for that choice

Didn't you say earlier that you like to remain neutral or something? And now you tell me that you always pick the underdog's side of the argument? That doesn't sound very neutral to me, it doesn't even sound that smart, getting involved in arguments that you feel are unnecessary in the first place.

My neutrality was about whether I felt he was highly skilled, etc... I've not heard enough of his stuff to have formed an opinion either way as yet!

Yea, I'm an asshole, and your expectations are fairly low if you consider making a hip hop song a challenge... especially if only hip hop artists will participate. Maybe if Reven asked a classical composer to make a hip hop song then it'd be a challenge... at least for the classical composer guy.

Like I said above, Hip-Hop isn't something I've done before so I see it as a bit of a challenge, though I won't know how easy/hard it is til I try!

Anyways, get it across your thick skulls, I didn't start this "shit" because I dislike hip hop, I really couldn't care less about hip hop to be honest. I started it to say that this is not a contest, it's an ego's cry for attention disguised in a shitty contest. DavidOrr could have started a trance contest exactly like this one and I still would have said all the same things. Although I would have been nicer because I have more respect for Orr than Reven, for starters, Orr types in correct grammar and spelling.

Well You shouldn't have any less respect for anybody else, as you do for Orr, now don't get me wrong here, Orr's Music is of an extremely high standard, on the other hand I'm not saying that no one else has that high standard, but you, like I and anybody else know's Orr's Music is top notch

Maybe it is an ego's cry for attention! but eh!

Oh well Who know's maybe Reven will come back and reitterate!

Peace Out!

Stealth

At 10/19/06 04:49 PM, stealth-annihilator wrote: Oh well Who know's maybe Reven will come back and reitterate!

Peace Out!

Stealth

Perhaps it would be better if he didn't, because it would only promote further arguments and the like. I'm going to try very hard not to reply any more in this topic because most of the poeple posting here have very strong opinions one way or another, and there isn't any point in trying to change their point of view here because I don't believe anyone here is really "wrong".

I have a never produced a hip-hop track before. But I've been producing music for around 7 year. I was around during the moog modulars and tr-70's. In other words. I was around. :D I'll beat battle you Reven, whatever that is. I'll PM you.

At 10/19/06 06:23 PM, Glib wrote: I have a never produced a hip-hop track before. But I've been producing music for around 7 year. I was around during the moog modulars and tr-70's. In other words. I was around. :D I'll beat battle you Reven, whatever that is. I'll PM you.

After all of this grime and shit, someone finally gets it back on track. :D

not read through countless arguments about shit all.

Then don't.

As far as I'm concerned, I don't think anything of you, you're a regular and a good one at that.

further lowering my respect for you.

K.

The only respect I get around here is because I'm a completely arrogant ass, but apparently that balances a lot of other egos.

Hip-hop is still a form of self-expression, which is art.

"Self-expression" isn't a valid counter-argument against what's being expressed, which in the case of modern rap music is a metaphysical attack against a race and a boast of it's stereotypes.

If I make art about how all humans deserve to die horrible deaths, it doesn't negate the messege because the purpose of art is to interpret if it means something to you or not.

If you feel strong disgust, then you won't think twice about it. But if you feel pleased, then you share the expression of the artist. The idea is not just to express, but to share and strengthen the showcased ideal, not just show off any emotion that comes to mind arbitrarily.

There is more poetry involved in the piece than music.

Q: Contemporary rap music = poetic?
A: What era are we talking about? I'm talking about today, when the clap replaced the snare. Here's a slice of your "poetics":

(Ref: 50 Cent)

Yea, I don't know shit about gymnastics I summersault bricks
Black talents start flyin, when a nigga flip
I cook crack in the microwave, niggaz can't fuck with me
Man my cold days, they called me chef boy are 50
Check my logic, smokers don't like seeds in their weed shit
Send me them seeds I'll grow 'em what they need
Them ain't chia pet plants in the crib thats chronic
And I'm sellin them 500 a pop god damn it
I sold everythin I'ma hustler, I know how to grind
Step on grapes put in water and tell you its wine
If you analyze me, what you'll find is the DNA of a crook

I think a more accurate term would be anti-music

Music = Expression = Emotional Value infliction through judgement = Definition of "Art" + Modern hip hop/rap music = anti-art. It is anti-art of the musical kind.

MF-Doom, Aesop Rock, Mos Def. They all keep it real though.

At 10/19/06 04:49 PM, stealth-annihilator wrote: But you, like I and anybody else knows Orr's Music is top notch.

He does make some good tunes ^^

At 10/19/06 10:19 PM, Erkie wrote: The only respect I get around here is because I'm a completely arrogant ass.

Yup, that's why I respect ya.

But apparently that balances a lot of other egos.

Which is a good thing!

Love-Hate-War, Erkie here is the only arrognant ass I know that doesn't over do it, but does it enough to put certain people in their place, which is why it's good to have him around the AF to scare n00bs and stuff ^^ Plus, he has great logic and it's really entertaining to read his arguments. Oh yea, and this picture is just awesome:

Well I'm sorry if I didn't get my point across like i wanted to i'm just a normal high school graduate...going to music college..i am better speaking with a person man to man...next just a regular hip hop tune is fine.....I understand everything you guys are saying......i am sorry for snaping at you guys it's just I have a very short temper......

when I say I'm hip hop artist ppl portray me as trying to be a 50 cent......which is extremly wrong i hate 50 cent with a passion...."oh i'm gangsta buy my cd"...then when i'm making millions i wanna sing all the time i mean come on.....

third.....I'll show u what i mean by poetic.....reven......I'll show u guys some of my lyrics....

~Lord Why~....By: Luis Aponte aka Reven......

Said Is It wrong for me to kill a man ?
Make an example show the world just how real I am...
The realest man I'm not trying to be a thug or G....
But it's just sometimes you have to take respect from enemies ...Lord you feelin me?
Is it bad for me to wanna die?
You know sometimes in my mind I'm just tired of life.....
Tired of living ...is it a sin for me to alwayz hate....?
I'm tired of niggas standing in my way...
I'm just trying to make it I'm not tryna be the greatest....
Cuz life's a game and it's hard enough to maintain..
Lord why?
Must I struggle through these hard times....
Life is hell and they still tryna take mine.....
See me crusified...
Thorns lay upon my head..
But I'm just tryna make mine lord before i'm dead....
Break break is it a sin for me to turn my cheek?
I think it's bad cuz when i do people think i'm weak...
So why not put an end to me ...then i'm free...
Cuz life's to short to have to worry about a enemy...
As It may be...
And lord you kno i wanna live right...
But it's hard cuz u kno what I live like...
I live life..I'm a soldier to the very end....
And when i die me and my family gonna ride again.....

now is that 50 cent shit......simple words...i just spoke....now .....am I like 50...I just try to rap about my struggles and the shit i'm went through plus everything people around me have been through....

At 10/20/06 12:16 AM, Poetic-Reven wrote: <rap lyrics>

That is a nice piece of lyrical eye candy.

now is that 50 cent shit......simple words...i just spoke....now .....am I like 50...I just try to rap about my struggles and the shit i'm went through plus everything people around me have been through....

Now see, 50 raps about how he grows weed and how he is a gangster. AKA, bullshit. The lyrics you wrote above are nothing like them; they are much better.

Just keep doing what you're doing.

Religious overtones kind of kill it.

With more work let's hope your music does something a little like that.