At 4/4/12 04:39 PM, SenatorJohnDean wrote: I don't get what the host has to do with anything. Teq has been doing it fine. The host's job will only be to hold the money and pick the beat, because we are DEFINITELY placing the money in someone else's Paypal upfront.

See though, without any contract being signed, the loser could get mad and easily sue. The contract isn't just about who is holding the money, there are so many loopholes here its not even funny.

I'll be sueing Red if I lose CLABTRAP

At 4/5/12 08:05 AM, PiGPEN wrote: COMBO BREAKER.

At 4/5/12 07:14 AM, SenatorJohnDean wrote: Sorry for dbl posting like the piglet, but who says NG has to judge this?
This is of course assuming that Akac and Pig don't live near each other. I know I don't live near either one of you.

Works for me. The more objective people the better it is for me. You and teq are the only people on NG who think im a big player with a cabal of internet friend votes. I definitely wouldnt have lost a battle to shitty-ass Blest if that were the case.

Oh, don't worry, piglet. I don't think you have any friends.

And Emergency, I know. I'm trying to draw up a contract right now, but seriously, what the hell is that really supposed to do? Who can enforce anything around here?

At 4/5/12 08:51 AM, SenatorJohnDean wrote: Oh, don't worry, piglet. I don't think you have any friends.

And Emergency, I know. I'm trying to draw up a contract right now, but seriously, what the hell is that really supposed to do? Who can enforce anything around here?

The Law? It is what it is. As a rapper, you can't do shit or you look you're snitchin. Unfortunately, I don't think PiG would give a crap if people saw him snitch. Then if PiG loses and no contract was signed, he can sue and say shit like he thought he won and never even legally agreed to the judges deciding the winner and what-not. You or him could have 100+ friends comment voting for him, and then say he won the popular vote and never agreed to the judge thing.

That's why you need a contract and you need a BigRed to enforce it.

At 4/5/12 09:05 AM, ThisIsAnEmergency wrote:

The Law? It is what it is. As a rapper, you can't do shit or you look you're snitchin. Unfortunately, I don't think PiG would give a crap if people saw him snitch. Then if PiG loses and no contract was signed, he can sue and say shit like he thought he won and never even legally agreed to the judges deciding the winner and what-not. You or him could have 100+ friends comment voting for him, and then say he won the popular vote and never agreed to the judge thing.

That's why you need a contract and you need a BigRed to enforce it.

LOL STOP SNITCHIN

Dude, I didn't grow up in the ghetto, I have no problem gettin the lawyers involved if need be. I have lawyers in my family. I DO hate cops though. But lol at the stop snitchin thing.

Maybe BigRed should hold the money. We know he has integrity and he does this professionally, so he definitely has a stake in seeing things go down smoothly.

Whaddya say BigRed? Feel like holdin $1000 for a couple of days?

I think that's a good idea. That way nobody can cheat and not pay. So here's the deal as I see it:

1. BigRed holds the money, gives it to the winner.
2. Contest is judged by the host's PERSONAL friends. NG votes are just for shits n giggles and will have NOTHING to do with who gets the money.

That seems to be fair to me.

Y'all some whiny bitches.

At 4/5/12 09:12 AM, PiGPEN wrote: Y'all some whiny bitches.

Eat shit, ho. Do you agree or not?

At 4/5/12 09:05 AM, ThisIsAnEmergency wrote: That's why you need a contract and you need a BigRed to enforce it.

And just so there's no confusion, Emergency, I agree with the idea of a contract. If Pig agrees to the battle rules for real, I'll draw one up.

No ones holding any money. The loser pays the winner. Im an adult so i have all my money in my debit cards not my fucking paypal, im not gonna go and lose a bunch of money in transaction fees and risk BigRed running off with my money to splurge on some Ben Spurgin level heroin just to prove to you that i have a week's worth of money.

Feel free to write up a contract but seems to me you're just stalling. One of us has honor.....honor and talent.

ON THE POINT OF THE ACTUAL BATTLE.
I want to do 8bar verses, you obviously dont because it gives me an advantage....so how about in exchange for the 8bar verses i'll be the only one that has to achieve a majority to win.
That being you will win if you get >50% of the votes per usual, i will only win if i get 60%+ majority....anything less for me will mean you dont have to pay me despite losing.

I guarantee PigPen will not do this battle. I fucking guarantee it. Especially if he has to put his money up front, lol.

He's not going to let anyone hold the money. He'll say it's because he doesn't trust anyone, but in reality it's because he knows he can't beat SJD and would just be throwing 500 dollars away.

This battle isn't going to happen so let's keep the hate train moving.

If by some miracle it does happen, and Pigpen wins, and the money transfer actually happens- I'll concede my tournament spot to Pig.

HAHAHAHA- I'm fucking Nostradamus.

At 4/5/12 09:40 AM, Teqneek wrote: If by some miracle it does happen, and Pigpen wins, and the money transfer actually happens- I'll concede my tournament spot to Pig.

>Implying i wont beat you fair & square.
Keep making excuses.

At 4/5/12 09:42 AM, PiGPEN wrote:

At 4/5/12 09:40 AM, Teqneek wrote: If by some miracle it does happen, and Pigpen wins, and the money transfer actually happens- I'll concede my tournament spot to Pig.

>Implying i wont beat you fair & square.
Keep making excuses.

You CAN'T beat me fair and square. You are a horrible fucking rapper. Now get back to talking about how you don't agree with SJD and you aren't gonna do this battle.

At 4/5/12 09:45 AM, Teqneek wrote:
You CAN'T beat me fair and square. You are a horrible fucking rapper. Now get back to talking about how you don't agree with SJD and you aren't gonna do this battle.

He's cut from the same cloth as War Sperm. Excuses, excuses, excuses; all talk. He challenges ME and then won't put his money up. Fuckin idiot pig, it's easy as shit to transfer money from a debit card to Paypal. Unless you don't have the codes cuz it's actually your mom's debit card.

Dude piglet, I'm not doin any goddamn majority / supermajority votes. Whoever takes it takes it. You ain't Kreayshawn, man, I don't need no head start off you.

Bottom line.

1. We BOTH give our money to BigRed ahead of time.
2. We agree to be judged by Akac's friends. What they say goes.
3. One verse, 32 bars. Every other grudge battle has been this way. This is an MC battle, not no goddamn piglet fuckin ...PIG BATTLE. MCs spit bars. That's what they do. LL didn't spit no damn 8 bar verses at Canibus. KRS didn't spit no 8 bars at Shan. Common didn't spit no 8 bars at Cube. Nas would slap you upside your fat head.

Either you work within the system or you shut your face. Everybody wants to talk shit to me but of all the shit talkers, only Bill has had the balls to just step the fuck up.

>Everybody wants to talk shit to me
>Everybody wants to talk shit to me
>Everybody wants to talk shit to me
>Everybody wants to talk shit to me
>Everybody wants to talk shit to me
>Everybody wants to talk shit to me
OH DEAR I WONDER WHY THIS TRAGEDY HAS BEFALLEN YOU.

On your HURR BOTTOMLINE I CONTROL THIS BATTLE DERPDEDERP... I don't agree with them but hopefully we'll come to a compromise with the help of our host.

At 4/5/12 10:48 AM, PiGPEN wrote:

On your HURR BOTTOMLINE I CONTROL THIS BATTLE DERPDEDERP... I don't agree with them but hopefully we'll come to a compromise with the help of our host.

Oh darling, I don't care about the shit talking. That just means you're full of shit while I eat caviar and sushi and sip the world's finest wines. And get head from Kreayshawn.

Well, it seems you have a legit cop out if the host can not come to an agreement. AKAC? Can you do something with this mess or does the pig get a pass?

Here are my two dealbreakers:

1. Someone else has to hold the money, cuz otherwise the pig won't pay.
2. Private judges, otherwise the pig will cheat.

That's all I'm askin. the pig seems to think this is too much, even though HE made the challenge.

I really don't see why we should be having trust issues....
I'm a 27yo white male, living in a city with one of the highest living expenses in the world.
You're a 19yo black male....ummm and....well you're obviously upper middle class but....mmmm yeaaaah.
Was that week you needed to get the money so you could pawn stuff? AHA RACISM (srsly though)

MONEY

OK, here's what I propose in terms of money holding. I don't think the whole "I'll pay you once I've lost" thing is really that airtight, so I think we need to have one paypal holding the money, which I think leaves us two options:

OPTION A:

- Give money to BigRed's paypal (given he consents). He's a long time Newgrounds- er and would never live down losing the trust of the NG community if he ran with the $1000. It would be the end to ClabTrap, and a lot of his friendships on the site.

OPTION B:

- I hold money in PayPal. Beside the fact I'm a practicing Buddhist and wouldn't ever steal from anyone, I'll give you guys my personal contact details, facebook, etc etc, and give someone like Red my passwords to release if I steal the cash, so you guys can trust I won't run out on you.

Obviously, I trust myself more than Red, so I feel better about Option B, but its your money.

VERSE STRUCTURE

Now, the given format for these things is 32- 32, and the strength of that has been that both rappers have enough time to give it their absolute all. However, I think half the fun of this is gonna be the flips so I'd like to suggest we do three sets of sixteen for each rapper, like a proper battle. I can find a beat long enough, provided I have the backing of you guys: I feel that's a fair compromise between SJD's request for long verses and PiG's request for more verses.

What's the feeling towards theses proposals?

SHIT forgot about JUDGES

I can find around twenty people to judge objectively if you guys feel comfortable about that. I know a load of local guys who spend quite a lot of time on the rap scene, and they won't have heard of you guys before. I'll need about a week to get a working jury, but if I was to get nineteen judges would that feel kosher? They will generally be North London middle class/ working class teenagers like myself, mind.

I'm cool with all that except the proposed holders. I'm way too jewish to trust you or red with my thousand dollars....ahem...500 dollars.
Trust you because you're having a Buddhist phase? Trust red because he's got NG-respect? Nope. And contact details dont mean shit when we're not in the same country... and possession is 9/10.
I'd rather take the risk i might not get paid rather then the risk i might get ripped off, if you plan on continuing gambling Milton i advise you take that to heart before you end up like this fella....

At 4/5/12 12:49 PM, AKACCMIOF wrote: SHIT forgot about JUDGES

I can find around twenty people to judge objectively if you guys feel comfortable about that. I know a load of local guys who spend quite a lot of time on the rap scene, and they won't have heard of you guys before. I'll need about a week to get a working jury, but if I was to get nineteen judges would that feel kosher? They will generally be North London middle class/ working class teenagers like myself, mind.

Can I volunteer to vote on this battle? I think PiG and SJD are both gaping assholes/super cool dudes!

At 4/5/12 12:49 PM, AKACCMIOF wrote: SHIT forgot about JUDGES

I can find around twenty people to judge objectively if you guys feel comfortable about that. I know a load of local guys who spend quite a lot of time on the rap scene, and they won't have heard of you guys before.

Just weighing in here, I'm not sure using judges that are personal friends of the host is such a good idea. I mean, people can be easily swayed. Everyone likes to think their thoughts are individual but most of the time that's just not true. If one guy is all like "That SJD rocks, and I hate Pig" or vice versa, that may sway others to think the same. If you're gonna do it like that you need to make sure all the votes are made in private and no-one else knows how the others have voted.

I'm sure there's a name for that kind of voting but I don't remember what it is.

16-16-16-16 bars will make the battle far more personal and far better IMO, so hopefully SJD agrees to that.

You NEED to have a middle man holding the money Pig; it's the only way to ensure the loser doesn't flake out on the payment. If you don't agree to that then the battle won't happen and my prophecy will come true.

Just give it to Red; he won't run off with it. And if you're still scurred then draw up a contract and get it notarized or some shit. Either way, you need some middle man to hold the money, that's just how this kind of thing works.

I've read some stupid shit on the internet (*ahem*YouTube), but I think this just about takes the cake:

verse 1 - Still sounds british, politics, then cooking instructions?
verse 3 - But he's not that monotone, too bad you can't turn off the accent.

Good work, napolitos. Keep living in your bedroom, isolated from the people, cultures and languages of the rest of the world. You are precisely the kind of close-minded, ignorant simpleton that I hate most. Kuss ummak.

At 4/5/12 02:08 PM, NogginmenAnimations wrote: I'm sure there's a name for that kind of voting but I don't remember what it is.

Secret Ballot? But that implies the ballot is anonymous...which wouldnt be very good for us since that lacks transparency.
Just have all the judges submit their votes privately then publicize their votes/reviews when it's been decided.

At 4/5/12 02:08 PM, NogginmenAnimations wrote:
I'm sure there's a name for that kind of voting but I don't remember what it is.

Secret ballot?

Man's got a point guys. I can tell a selected jury to vote and record a breakdown of how they thought the battle went before talking about it to anyone else, but that's all I can do.

Also, PiG, I can totally see where you're coming from with trust issues, but I don't think SJD trusts you to pay if you lose (which would be understandable, nothing personal).

If you don't trust me or Red, fine, but unless you can
a) come up with a different holder of the jackpot that you can trust,
b) convince SJD you're trustworthy (perhaps by exchanging some kind of deposit) or
c) come with some kind of deposit me or Red would have to put in to earn your trust, shit ain't going nowhere.

I mean, I don't think any of us are really all that trusting, but if we wanna do this with such a large jackpot, you and SJD have to find someone you can both trust to hold on to the money, or trust each other to hand over the money.

One thing I will say, if someone doesn't pay up after losing, pretty much everyone on NG will know them as a whiney pussy ass bitch forever.

AFTERNOTE: this gives a very brief overview of where UK law would stand if I ran off with cash: http://www.contractsandagreements.co.uk/law-and-verbal-agree ments.html. Essentially, we've reached a point where I've agreed to hold onto the money and pass 100% of the money onto the winner of the battle. If noone wins, the money gets split 50/50 between you guys. If I renege, you guys can call collections agencies to come harass the hell outta me and repossess my and my family's shit and/ or take me to UK court.

At 4/5/12 02:27 PM, Teqneek wrote: Either way, you need some middle man to hold the money, that's just how this kind of thing works.

Not really, him and killbill didnt need to for their battle.
We both have our honor.
...Queue 5 paragraph response from Teq about how i have no honor and that im human garbage.

At 4/5/12 02:27 PM, RampantMusik wrote: I've read some stupid shit on the internet (*ahem*YouTube), but I think this just about takes the cake:

verse 1 - Still sounds british, politics, then cooking instructions?
verse 3 - But he's not that monotone, too bad you can't turn off the accent.

Good work, napolitos. Keep living in your bedroom, isolated from the people, cultures and languages of the rest of the world. You are precisely the kind of close-minded, ignorant simpleton that I hate most. Kuss ummak.

Oh man I sympathise. You shoulda read some of the reviews on mine and FB's battle.

Also, when's our collab happening? xP

At 4/5/12 02:38 PM, PiGPEN wrote:

At 4/5/12 02:27 PM, Teqneek wrote: Either way, you need some middle man to hold the money, that's just how this kind of thing works.

Not really, him and killbill didnt need to for their battle.
We both have our honor.

That's cool as long as SJD trusts you. But, without getting into personals, I think people tend to be far less willing to pay out $1000 than $50 to someone they've just lost to.

ALSO specifying now: American or Australlian dollars? Just to clarify.

At 4/5/12 02:41 PM, AKACCMIOF wrote: ALSO specifying now: American or Australlian dollars? Just to clarify.

I've got American cash too. My american account, good enough?

At 4/5/12 02:49 PM, PiGPEN wrote:

At 4/5/12 02:41 PM, AKACCMIOF wrote: ALSO specifying now: American or Australlian dollars? Just to clarify.

I've got American cash too. My american account, good enough?

ffff.... so you can see dem american numbers....