NG has always been and still is number 1 PERIOD
I'm glad that you get some upright attention

At 6/16/07 04:35 AM, blamurai wrote: I also have a Question, who's the dude in charge of the servers, I am learning about that shit right now... And I would like to ask the guy a few questions about managing servers and what not, I am trying to become a Systems Admin.

Tim is the NG Sys Admin. PM him if you have questions.

I'd say newgrounds is on the brink of mainstream. So many friends of mine have stopped saying, "what?" when I tell them about ng and have started saying, "oh yeah I've been on that". The member count is ever on the increase and the quality of submittions keeps on getting better and better.

There was a time before Tom. Before Tom there was no social security, and communism reigned supreme. Nazi's and zombies terrorized children and Hobo's governed the masses. Before Tom there was no such thing as dinosaurs and Green Day was actually a good band. God saw these horrible things happening to his world, so he sent his son to fix them. His name was Tom Brady. Tom Brady used his powers for evil. In the 1930's, the American Liberty League was formed, consisting of the worlds finest including Sean Connery, Gerald Ford, Abraham Lincoln, Batman, and The girl from Lazy Town. Founded on the principal to stop Tom Brady, they were sworn to America to dispatch and destroy not only Tom Brady, but all evil. However, in 1998 a Meteorite hit the Earth off the coast of Japan, and with it created a species so powerful and complex it threatened to destroy humanity. This is known as emergence day, the day Pokemon took over the world. This is when Tom Fulp first appeared. Armed with a Starmie, Tom became the world's first true Pokemon Master. He then defeated Tom Brady and his Snorlax, and as punishment forced him to be the star quarterback for the New England Patriots. The New millennium brought about a new threat. People of different religious and cultural backgrounds then americans. The American Liberty League thought the best way to deal with this new threat was to exterminate them. Tom Fulp lead the charge. He single handily killed Saddam Hussein, Borat, Kim Jong limwhatshisface, Hitler, and Santa Clause. Santa was a mistake.

You work too hard, Tom.

If it makes you feel any better, whenever people talk about the new multimedia explosion and sites that people think started it, I always shut them up with newgrounds.

Congratulations on the awesome EDGE Article.

It seems pretty clear to me why Newgrounds doesn't get more media attention or popularity, though. Most forumers continuously say that Newgrounds is a place where people like to be free from rules, where they can upload and post anything they want, no matter how offensive it is, because free speech is a right. Most people like Newgrounds the way it is, and I'm fine with visiting it myself.

However, if Newgrounds is going to be like that (ie., offensive) I don't think anybody can expect it to get more attention. Sites like YouTube and Facebook get popular because of their professionalisim, their strict rules, and their overall cleanliness. Newgrounds has anything and everything. Cock jokes get 5s, daily awards, and win art contests (though personally, I think they're getting pretty old). There are links to porn on the frontpage and ads to spyware-infested scam pages. I would be afraid to visit this site from school or work, because you never know when something blatantly disgusting is going to pop up. I know this is the base that Newgrounds was founded on (having read the history page, etc.) and don't expect it to change anytime soon.

But that's reality - if you want to become popular, you have to conform to society, and society just doesn't feature sites that promote as much "freedom of speech" as Newgrounds does. YouTube is still fun: even with its professionalism and ethics.

Don't start flaming me here though - I'm personally fine with Newgrounds and its content. I'm just stating that others aren't. Sorry if a post like this was already made. 250 comments is alot to sift through.

At 6/16/07 08:55 PM, Septenary wrote: Congratulations on the awesome EDGE Article.

It seems pretty clear to me why Newgrounds doesn't get more media attention or popularity, though. Most forumers continuously say that Newgrounds is a place where people like to be free from rules, where they can upload and post anything they want, no matter how offensive it is, because free speech is a right. Most people like Newgrounds the way it is, and I'm fine with visiting it myself.

However, if Newgrounds is going to be like that (ie., offensive) I don't think anybody can expect it to get more attention.

You may be right, to a certain extent.

Sites like YouTube and Facebook get popular because of their professionalisim, their strict rules, and their overall cleanliness.

Hang on now a second.... have you actually read through YouTube comments pages?

There's stuff in YouTube comments that would make a NG BBS denizen blush.

Newgrounds has anything and everything. Cock jokes get 5s, daily awards, and win art contests (though personally, I think they're getting pretty old).

But from the above, I take it you're referring more to the actual MOVIES on YouTube being more... tidy and clean... than the flash movies and games on NG (and we like it that way, don't we?).

Not to comments vs. BBS.

Fair enough.

There are links to porn on the frontpage and ads to spyware-infested scam pages.

And there's that, too.

I would be afraid to visit this site from school or work, because you never know when something blatantly disgusting is going to pop up. I know this is the base that Newgrounds was founded on (having read the history page, etc.) and don't expect it to change anytime soon.

I can't go to any of the sites you're discussing at work, so it's a non-issue for me. In fact, I've never had a job where you can idly browse the web (all I do at work is google searches and mappings related to my job + check the traffic site before heading home at 5PM).

But... how is YouTube necessarily NOT NSFW? Please excuse the acronym-encoded double negative there, but my point is that in light of the comments I'm talking about on YouTube + plenty of NSFW stuff in the videos, too (plenty o' cursing, even if not as much VISUAL NSFW as NG's portal has)... YouTube isn't exactly an all-situations-friendly site on the whole, either.

It just happens to have a lot more "universally accepted" content than NG does, I suppose.

YouTube is still fun: even with its professionalism and ethics.

... Again.... heh. #;-}>

lol TOM GONE EMO! ahahaha, NG is still an awesome site. In my college, when I usually wear my NG shirt, theres always like 6 or 5 random kids that say while passing by "cool shirt". I bet the same thing will not happen if I put the youtube logo (which cannot be compared with our amazing tank man) or wikipedia's..(that would be a total failure).

Congrats tom for the magazine thing. Keep it up NG!

starwars...! yaaaa star wars

At 6/16/07 09:50 PM, gfoxcook wrote: There's stuff in YouTube comments that would make a NG BBS denizen blush.

Nah, Septenary is right.

To keep it brief and concise, the NG BBS is the root of all of Newgrounds problems and there's no way to deny it. Without the BBS, you have no platform for users to publicly complain, collaborate to spam the portal, see people's reactions to portal spam (which is why they do it), and see the true nature of some of the main demographic. That in no way means I don't think the BBS is great, I just think with the BBS's good comes a whole lot of bad stuff, but the good still outweighs the bad IF you enjoy and use the BBS. If you don't, which is the case of the majority of NG visitors, then it takes its toll. Youtube doesn't have a lot of that bad stuff (or they hide it REALLY well) because they don't have a public forum.

As for the Youtube comment system, yeah, it gets some bad comments obviously, but they constructed it thinking more about the CONTENT PROVIDER than Newgrounds has. They allow authors to delete comments which puts the power to clean up comments in the content creators hands, which is clearly how it should be.

Who is going to head NG wen ur done with it (and by ther sounds of it doesent seem to far way) plzzz dont leave though wel all miss ya XD and will start rioting and killing until you come back and forget about Havier the replacement !!!~ better e some oen better than some illigal immigrant if u do leave ... so leme know who ur thinking of cuz im jw if this site will be infested with tacos and sombraros (no offence mexicans ) thx - bigest fan

At 6/14/07 07:57 PM, TomFulp wrote: Underneath the smiles and positive attitude, I'll admit I've been in a bad mood lately.

Awww cheer up sunshine
we still love you the most

Newgrounds.com, the large Flash games and animation site that spawned Alien Hominid, has been accepting user-produced submissions since 1999. That it has been quietly spearheading for eight years what is only now being trumpeted about in the mainstream media is indicative of how overlooked the Flash games scene is."

I have a friend his alias is Alienorgy69 and he has been listening to me spout off about my love for newgrounds for 12 years now...he dosent go here any more yet he still mentions you Tom and your site when something of the subject jumps up...as have I since day 1

I just can't express how GOOD it feels to read that in a major publication...

Dont worry man Im pretty sure if you guys jsut keep Working HARD and RIGHT Newgrounds will continue to be a foce to be recconed with for many more years tocome.

But anyway, back to my own self-pity.

Dont feel to much self loath over being overworked. You guys got a shit load on your plate and I for one feel youve done an amzing job over the years....theres things id have done diff what have you...but then again thats why your head of the best nonporn site on the map and im jsut a soldier

But I'll say one thing: NG never stops moving.

You got that right man...you got sometin here you (theoreticaly) so massive and self sustaining that im guessing you could leave and it would carry itself for quite sometime before crashing with out your guidance
Basically Tom Im sorry you are feeling so bad at such a imprtant time of your wife and yours life...but judging from my time here yiull do good by everyone who matters...and if you thinik this is hard wait till you got a kid...lol
Thanx Tom(and everyone else on staff <3 <3 <3 <3 <3)

At 6/16/07 10:15 PM, DFox wrote:

At 6/16/07 09:50 PM, gfoxcook wrote: There's stuff in YouTube comments that would make a NG BBS denizen blush.

Nah, Septenary is right.

To keep it brief and concise, the NG BBS is the root of all of Newgrounds problems and there's no way to deny it.

If that's true, then why is Wade Fulp constantly saying the BBS is of little importance/factor in the overall NG picture?

The amount of people who come to NG and get an account is a low %. The amount of the people who make an account and use it to post on the BBS is an even lower % of a low %.

The BBS takes up little space, very little bandwidth, and is of minimal important on the site compared to the flash games and movies.

Pray tell how it could be the root of ALL of NG's problems?

Without the BBS, you have no platform for users to publicly complain, collaborate to spam the portal, see people's reactions to portal spam (which is why they do it), and see the true nature of some of the main demographic. That in no way means I don't think the BBS is great, I just think with the BBS's good comes a whole lot of bad stuff, but the good still outweighs the bad IF you enjoy and use the BBS. If you don't, which is the case of the majority of NG visitors, then it takes its toll. Youtube doesn't have a lot of that bad stuff (or they hide it REALLY well) because they don't have a public forum.

Nah... users couldn't possibly collaborate to spam the portal on... say, another site on the net... a site... with lots of Stars... and a Syndicate is involved somehow.

And yes, they started out on the BBS. But if there hadn't been a BBS, you don't think NG fans wouldn't have made discussion groups somewhere else on the net on their own?

Wade's always threatening to delete the BBS. Are you saying if he followed through that suddenly NG would be all perfectly suitable to the media and critics and NG'd get tons of good publicity?

Why is almost every big story I've ever seen about NG about something to do with controversy over a FLASH, then, eh? Could it be because of that whole 99%+ of NG is flash, less than 1% is BBS and other such concerns.

As for the Youtube comment system, yeah, it gets some bad comments obviously, but they constructed it thinking more about the CONTENT PROVIDER than Newgrounds has. They allow authors to delete comments which puts the power to clean up comments in the content creators hands, which is clearly how it should be.

As opposed to how authors here can't delete reviews of their work?

Sure, that's fine. But comments on YouTube are far more like a BBS than NG's reviews are. You can't have a back and forth conversation in NG reviews unless you keep reviewing the author's flash with a different account each time and he keeps replying back.

Hence me making BBS/comments comparisons, not reviews/comments comparisons, as you seem to be.

At 6/16/07 11:08 PM, gfoxcook wrote: The BBS takes up little space, very little bandwidth, and is of minimal important on the site compared to the flash games and movies.

... replace that important with either import or importance, plz...

Why is almost every big story I've ever seen about NG about something to do with controversy over a FLASH, then, eh? Could it be because of that whole 99%+ of NG is flash, less than 1% is BBS and other such concerns.

Add a ".... thing" after concerns at the end of that sentence, plz....

Damn, but I've been making a lot of errors typing today. I think I'm tired. Hell, I probably didn't even notice half the errors in my post upon my quick skimming of it just now. 5+ ERRORS I DIDN'T CATCH WHILE TYPING? Ohhhh noeeee... the world is over. ;_;

At 6/16/07 11:08 PM, gfoxcook wrote: And yes, they started out on the BBS. But if there hadn't been a BBS, you don't think NG fans wouldn't have made discussion groups somewhere else on the net on their own?

Yeah, some might have. My underlining point is that the BBS gives people a public place ON Newgrounds to question the authority. If I want to question the authority on Youtube the best I can do is contact them. Youtube constantly deletes users and videos. Do you ever see any individuals question those moves on a large scale? I know I haven't, and that's because Youtube doesn't give them the platform and most people aren't going to go out of their way to find it.

The NG admins have even admitted that the BBS uses a ton of human resources which is why they re-instituted the advertisements. So aside from creating problems, it requires a lot of attention from staff, and there's no denying that as Wade stated that as a reason for the ads. So if you don't believe my whole thing about the BBS being the root of problems, at the very least it takes human resources away from cleaning up other aspects of the site.

As opposed to how authors here can't delete reviews of their work?

Sure, that's fine. But comments on YouTube are far more like a BBS than NG's reviews are. You can't have a back and forth conversation in NG reviews unless you keep reviewing the author's flash with a different account each time and he keeps replying back.

Hence me making BBS/comments comparisons, not reviews/comments comparisons, as you seem to be.

Whether the youtube comment system is more like a BBS or review system is completely irrelevant.

The fact of the matter is NG reviews and youtube comments are the way you give feedback on the sites content.

Here's what doesn't make sense about the NG review system, whether you want to look at it as a similar system to the youtube comment system, or not, either way the following applies. It's constantly said that the NG review system is to BENEFIT the content creator. Now, why should other users and review moderators have the ability to determine if my comments are helpful to the flash author. Do the other NG members and review moderators have super mind reading powers that allow them to determine whether or not my review is helpful to the content creator? If they do, then that's amazing. I was always under the impression that the only person who can determine whether something is helpful to them is the person who MADE the content. That brings me to this point, why should a content creator not have the power to delete reviews/comments? If the review isn't helpful to them, then why does it remain there?

What if someone comes along, leaves a constructive review on my entry, and breaks one of the many, soft, confining review rules, and one of the many stat whores marks it as abusive, and a review mod deletes it? What if that review would have helped me improve my skills? Why should I not see any reviews that I haven't deemed unhelpful?

The current NG review system makes no sense if you look at it from a logical standpoint.

I understand where your comming, but I mean, think about it. NewGrounds it's self may not get huge attention, but it has inspired millions. We were the first at a hell of a lot of things. People have also taken our things because they are jelous. You may be behind in some things, but don't get yourself down about it. You have been here through and through.

<3

the people at newgrounds think it kicks ass. so the point now, here, in the present, isnt necessarily to be 100% known over the web. so what, its taken almost 12 years to get where this site is, and will probably take longer. but the Time of Newgrounds will come, ad it will be a place where only the best quality flash movies, games, and any other creation that is submitted everyday, is allowed to stay and be viewed. my point is, it may not be the most popular site now, but the day and time is coming faster than you expect it.

P.S. tom, ur doing a damn good job. and we are all proud of you and thankful for your effort. keep it up!!

Congrats on EDGE Magazine. I'm sure to forget about NG's being in it and never pick in up. 12th aniversarry huh? Wow, that's like 2 years younger then me.

dont be sad tom we all love what you have done for the web and i have to sya NG is were i got to get uplifted whenever im depress i watch a violent video or a somthing funny and because of NG and all the artists my life and alot of other ppls lives have beenn better be proud of yourself tom and take pride in what you have accomplished

well tom the only thing i can say about how "far behind" ng is, is that it's been in my bookmarked pages since even before i signed up for an account. it works just the way it is so we can wait until you guys got it perfected enough to your likin'.

also, if you hired some coding temps, pay 'em shit wages, and have 'em work 10 hour days, maybe then it would get done faster?

just a thought.

At 6/17/07 03:00 AM, mhb wrote: also, if you hired some coding temps, pay 'em shit wages, and have 'em work 10 hour days, maybe then it would get done faster?

And then he can tell 'em to code 'em some killer scripts and then he can make 'em be the bitches while he beats 'em like teh programming slaves! Sounds like a plan.

My dude HellboundNinja sent me here and told me how down you are about the site. I haven't been here in a while but I've been too caught up feeling sorry for myself. Now you're making me feel sorry for how you're feeling. How's that for empathy? Maybe I was just drunk (check my profile pic. You'll see.)

Anyway, NG is the bastion of community based sites. You've stayed true to your ethos and that's respectable. If the out-pouring of support doesn't say it all then I'll give it my best shot. Ahem, let me get my game face on. -Grunting, beating my head, etc.- (that's how you get pumped, right? I've watched films of althetes doing that. Kinda' feel dizzy now.)

-If I could save all the hours I've spent on NG over the past years, I would spend them at a 100+ hour bath house. Given, they'd need to have the real life equivelant of a censor bar because I'm ashamed of my body.

-If NG weren't around, I'd probably think that Salad Fingers was my Grandma's nickname when she prepared dinner (I've seen it first hand people.)

-Alien Homonid taught me that dreams can come true (HBN, I'm looking at you...)

-Paris Hilton's in jail. If that doesn't make you smile, then my post means nothing.

-In all fairness, you were the originator of this whole reality TV stuff. If you suck, then you're booted off. I'll coin the phrase and call it "So you think you know flash?" (yeah, that's lame I know.)

-NG taught me that it's better to blam than to recieve (you know what I mean.)

-NG taught me to protect and preserve

I'll stop now. I don't even find myself ammusing tonight (and that's all I live for. Just to ammuse myself.) I hope I helped. I fear for the posts I'll get about this post. Nevertheless, live with no regrets. I do it, you should too. The site can only get better because it's been sooo damned good any time I've logged on. Maybe a farse towards yourself, you could call this internet 1.9. Just a few more steps further than the 2.0 guys who have just been inching forward. Much love Tom.

Tom don't be sad...NG is a great achievement.I can't believe more people don't know about it.I like it not being hugely well known like Myspace! it feels like this is a small secluded spot where everyone can just hang out and not have a large mass of idiots in the site.

Newgrounds is fine as it is, and if you can make it better, everyone will back you wholeheartedly.

As for the post you made, There is a reason that it still is the largest flash portal on the web. :P

Wow EDGE.

I can't wait until the redesign.

Tom, your site is the very imbodiment of the internet. The people submit, and rate their art as a community. Please don't feel bad about not getting enough done, because with the amount of great flash on this site there will always be room for improvement. I may not know what it is like running a website and creating games, but I feel I am part of something greater.

Go Team NG!

You just need more people to handle the coding and stuff, I've always thought the team was small for such a big project as Newgrounds. Hell if google needs loads of people for such a simple thing as searching the web, it's no wonder that newgrounds with only handful of people won't accomplish as much as was planned.

At 6/14/07 08:13 PM, Mogly wrote: Yeah man. Go team NG.

Tom, I wore my NG shirt to download festival this weekend, and people were noticing and reckognising even if they were a little shy. I noticed after people had passed me walking i'd hear "Hey Newgrounds" over my shoulder whispered. I like that NG is sooorrt of underground.

I didnt see the shirt :(

if I had I would have been all like "SUP LOL".

And then im sure there would have been a deadly silence and you would have walked off, but still, its the thought that counts!

At 6/16/07 11:24 PM, DFox wrote: Now, why should other users and review moderators have the ability to determine if my comments are helpful to the flash author.

The author has the ability to reply or rebut any review. This allows them to get in the last word and show if they think the review was helpful or not. If an author has the ability to delete reviews, then many (SS, KK, ect) would simply delete all of the reviews that were not 10s, in order to drive their average review score up and to make it seem as their flash is the best thing ever. Deleting a review that may not be glowing but is constructive is not fair to the user who took the time to review the submission. The review system encourages people to review because they know that their review will not be deleted if it doesn't break the rules. I know you argued that the rules are too confining, but they are there for a reason.

At 6/17/07 11:38 AM, CaptainBob wrote: The author has the ability to reply or rebut any review. This allows them to get in the last word and show if they think the review was helpful or not. If an author has the ability to delete reviews, then many (SS, KK, ect) would simply delete all of the reviews that were not 10s, in order to drive their average review score up and to make it seem as their flash is the best thing ever. Deleting a review that may not be glowing but is constructive is not fair to the user who took the time to review the submission. The review system encourages people to review because they know that their review will not be deleted if it doesn't break the rules. I know you argued that the rules are too confining, but they are there for a reason.

I think you made some good points and I see where you're coming from, but that brings me to my next argument, review scores. All the review scores seem to provide is a second score for the entry that doesn't make sense. Also, if NG decides what features they make based on how the SS and KK will abuse it, in general, that is just pathetic. I think I can speak for almost everyone when I say NG features should be catered to the people who actually want to use them and develop their Flash skills, get publicity, and not the people who just like to spam.

Relating back to the topic of this thread, why NG doesn't receive much press, maybe it has to do with the lack of web 2.0 features. I know the re-design will bring many more, but the whole thing on the web now is being able to discuss content. Newgrounds doesn't provide an ally for that as of now. Like it was said before, the review system doesn't provide and avenue to actually discuss the content. And the BBS isn't a valid avenue as I very rarely see threads for lesser known Flashes. So here's the point I'm making: What does the current review system offer that a comment system wouldn't? I only see pros to making it a content-creator modable comment system. First, a comment system actually allows the Flash author to get valid feedback. I don't know how many times I've seen someone leave a review stating a bug they found in the Flash. As a Flash developer, I'm well aware that fixing any bug involves some back and forth. A comment system would allow for that and improve the avenue for user feedback.

I just feel the NG review system as is is stuck in the middle. It doesn't allow for true user feedback, and it doesn't allow for conversation on the entry. All the current review system offers is a one way, 1998ish method for "feedback", and an easily riggable award to go with it. To put it blunt, the Youtube comment system kills the NG review system because it gives the content creator the power (the person who SHOULD have it), allows for more advanced feedback, and overall is very effective. Even more depressing is that the copycat portals also provide comment systems which are more effective than the current NG review system, and their comment systems aren't even that well made. If NG built a state-of-the-art comment system it would be great. It would finally allow actual discussion AND feedback on the all-important content.

Again, I'm not saying this to try to be very critical, I'm saying it simply because I firmly believe this is a major area NG is lacking in and other alternative sites are doing better.