I guess the only good thing about it is that the judgements last longer. I bet alot of people also quit voting because of this. Why because the 56kers can't wait that long, and they will miss a lot of points.

At 3/23/05 03:19 PM, WadeFulp wrote: We still have problems with people not watching new content and voting based on who the author is, or other factors. Now that people have to wait for the vote bar to appear we are hoping they will watch more of the entry before casting their vote.

Finally! Maybe that'll stop the LegendaryFrog and Piconjo fanboys from automatically voting 5 just because it's their favorite author. We can only hope, though.

I guess this is fair. This is starting to put up some problems for my work computer though.

I'm not the type of person you want voting on movies? I've been here since the beginning. This is a massive inconvenience just like every other innovation. It's just not fun anymore.

At 3/23/05 07:53 PM, Nostrant wrote: I'm not the type of person you want voting on movies? I've been here since the beginning. This is a massive inconvenience just like every other innovation. It's just not fun anymore.

Oh Boo Hoo. What an inconvenience that you have to sit just a little bit more on your ass before voting. We're talking seconds here, not hours or even minutes. I'm kinda surprised at this kind of complaining from a higher level user who should understand why such features need to be implemented.

I think that is a great idea. Good for the new to flash users.

At 3/23/05 08:22 PM, MasterGehn wrote:

At 3/23/05 07:53 PM, Nostrant wrote: I'm not the type of person you want voting on movies? I've been here since the beginning. This is a massive inconvenience just like every other innovation. It's just not fun anymore.

Oh Boo Hoo. What an inconvenience that you have to sit just a little bit more on your ass before voting. We're talking seconds here, not hours or even minutes. I'm kinda surprised at this kind of complaining from a higher level user who should understand why such features need to be implemented.

well you haven't gotten a lot of experience from voting, most experienced users, can predict if a movie will be blamed or not within 1 or 2 seconds. Also 50 seconds for one crappy 5 mb stick movie?

Well for ppl with 56k it takes a while for them to load movies that are 5000k but its a good idea

At 3/23/05 04:31 PM, liljim wrote:

At 3/23/05 03:54 PM, TheShrike wrote: It needs a solution.

If you got on AIM, I could work this through with you.

Ok, it works in Safari now.

YOU ROCK, JAMES!
<3

I think what you have going there is a pretty great idea. Although I'll need to disagree with your timing scheme. On my DSL connection the time for the bar to appear is the same as the time for it to load. And on dial-up it's not even a fraction of the time needed for the flash to load and be watched. I saw you said a minimum of 15-30 seconds for all flash in one of your posts. Perhaps all flash under 500kb be 45 seconds. That's a good amount of time to rate the flash. Then add around 15 more seconds for each 500kb added? That'd work pretty nicely. It'd be annoying, but it'd work. ;)

At 3/23/05 03:19 PM, WadeFulp wrote: We have decided to experiment with a timer on the vote bar for users who watch entries that are "Under Judgment." Basically it delays the vote bar from appearing for a certain amount of time based on the size of the entry. So a 5MB entry would result in the vote bar being hidden for about 50 seconds. If the entry is 10k, the vote bar will appear almost instantly after the movie/game window is launched. We may play around and adjust the length of time the vote bar is delayed.

We still have problems with people not watching new content and voting based on who the author is, or other factors. Now that people have to wait for the vote bar to appear we are hoping they will watch more of the entry before casting their vote.

For those of you who want to defy the system and vote based on who the author is, keep in mind more people will be watching the entry and will base their vote on the content of the entry, not who submitted it. If you want to maximize the amount of BLAM and SAVE points you earn you need to watch the entry and cast an informed vote!

Some people may feel the timer is an inconvenience, but it shouldn't be if you are voting properly. If you complain about the delay then you aren't the type of person we want voting on Under Judgment entries. We award BLAM and SAVE points as a reward for taking the time to wade (har har) through all the new entries that flood into the Flash Portal on a daily basis. We want people to take their time and vote fairly.

Please take this off, Wade. I am on a dial up connection, so it takes me a long time to load a submission. by the time I can vote, the submission has been blammed. You may not have taken into concideration the people with slow internet connections like myself. If this continues, I may never be able to get anymore blam/save points.

this wont change anything.People who hate illwillpress will still mass vote 0 for her flashes. And whats wrong with voting fo rthe author,U think Firth and Lokken,and Dave deserve to be voted 5 without seeing their flash? I think so,I mean thye make great stuff,who cares what their making,it will be great always,and people should be able to hurry and get their shit 4. etc without wasting time.

At 3/23/05 10:01 PM, DrMoxley wrote: this wont change anything.People who hate illwillpress will still mass vote 0 for her flashes. And whats wrong with voting fo rthe author,U think Firth and Lokken,and Dave deserve to be voted 5 without seeing their flash? I think so,I mean thye make great stuff,who cares what their making,it will be great always,and people should be able to hurry and get their shit 4. etc without wasting time.

think about the less famous authors who submit their stuff. some of them also have movies. this new system "forces" people who vote on under-judgment flash movies/games to actually watch them, and not vote according to past records of the artist and/or the preloader (which is high most of the time). it also give an opportunity to the new flash authors who submit their stuff to the site.

this is a perfect example of what i'm talking about.

Oh great.. Now, when some newb uploads a 5 meg .swf wich consists out of 99% uncompressed .mp3 and you can basicly tell what it is just by looking at the profile and the comments, you have to waste your time waiting for some stupid pannel to pop-up.
Hmm..

Definitly a thoughtful idea. I remember talking about this quite sometime ago, and you guys expressing your concern.

This will definitly help the people who truely made a good flash, but have a shitty preloader or something get recognized.

My only complaint would be what if a 4,000 kb song is submitted, but that's it...then you have to wait 40 seconds or so for the voting panel to come up, when you know it is shit to begin with. This will also stop those power blammers and decrease the amount of blams and saves they get during a day. I doubt they will be happy, but it's better for NG in the long run.

As a new flash auther, this will definitly help people recognize my flash, rather than having people blam it striaght away becuase I don't have anything else in the portal.

Great update, keep them coming.

At 3/23/05 09:52 PM, Chrome- wrote: A movie that is 5,000 k and it's a short choppy stick fight that is a couple seconds long, with uncompressed audio. You're going to have to wait awhile for that.

Yeah yeah, everyone keeps bringing up that fact over and over. Here's my theory on that. Once, you see it is uncompressed audio crap the leave that screen up open up a new window (or tab for firefox users) and surf the BBS some. By the time you've made a post or two you'll be able to blam the crap flash. ;) Multitask and under judgement voting isn't a strain.

Man. This is really starting to piss me off. I keep seeing all these long, shitty flashes, and i wait to blam them, and as soon as I am finally able to, it turns out that they were already blammed! Please stop this.

At least if people are forced to watch some of the vid they won't automatically blam it for it being something they simply don't want to give any chance at all (often based on name alone)

Delay will be tricky to figure out. Has to take into account how long the film is, how big it is, and how long it'll take to dl. Maybe like 10% of the total # of frames? before the vote bar appears (min?) After its loaded. (Delay should wait to kick in Until the film has been downloaded).

I think its a decent response, tricky to get it working smoothly but once its in place I think people will adapt and voting will be Slightly more fair (a lot of people are going to be tempted to give 0s though, especially if they're forced to wait to vote).

I know my first (and so far only) submission got blasted pretty hard right off (and if you read the reviews it often sounds like a lot of them didn't even take the time to watch much of it before blamming) mainly from the title alone. Those who did and gave me constructive feedback, thanks!

If an artist isn't given a chance to grow, learn from their mistakes and improve but is instead greeted with a lot of blind negativity and no constructive input it can be extremely discouraging and might even cause them to simply give up. And there is a certain tendency in established communities to "bash the new guy" right off (be they flash, or otherwise). Constructive criticism is the only real way to help improve people's overall skill.

Hiding the batting average/number of other submissions might help (of course if people actually watch the vid its often likely they'll know who the author is after watching some of it if the author isn't new). But it might help some since it wouldn't force comparisons.

Too bad this system doesn't help out all the older flashes and potential artists that may've been destroyed simply because people wanted quick and easy blam points but oh well, any progress is still progress. Hope this works out.

At 3/23/05 09:05 PM, TheShrike wrote: Ok, it works in Safari now.

Yep. Just saw your other post now, Jim.

YOU ROCK, JAMES!
<3

YES!!

<3

sounds cool!

This will only slow down the system of getting the crap blammed and the good movies passed on . If a movie is submitted , and the titles's name has NO capital letters in it, the Author doesn't take time to write a comprehensable comment on his movie, or he DOESN'T WRITE ONE AT ALL, I blam it, and when I do watch these movies that are like this, they always turn out to be shit, 100% of the time. All I'm saying is that it's very obvious when a Author doesn't give a shit about what he's submitting, it's obvious when he put NO effort into it, most the time the comment will say "omg thsi sux blamm it lolz!!!111" I agree sometimes some score unfairly, and I can tell when someone tried really hard on a Flash and it didn't turn out that well because they are beginners, and I vote good on it even if I know I won't get a Blam or Protection point. I'm not trying to raise my points, I'm trying to police the never-ending stream of shit that comes onto this website. Maybe gettiing rid of Blam and Protect points altogether would work.

At 3/23/05 08:38 PM, AnzRage wrote:

At 3/23/05 08:22 PM, MasterGehn wrote:

At 3/23/05 07:53 PM, Nostrant wrote: I'm not the type of person you want voting on movies? I've been here since the beginning. This is a massive inconvenience just like every other innovation. It's just not fun anymore.

Oh Boo Hoo. What an inconvenience that you have to sit just a little bit more on your ass before voting. We're talking seconds here, not hours or even minutes. I'm kinda surprised at this kind of complaining from a higher level user who should understand why such features need to be implemented.

well you haven't gotten a lot of experience from voting, most experienced users, can predict if a movie will be blamed or not within 1 or 2 seconds. Also 50 seconds for one crappy 5 mb stick movie?

Actually, I'm pretty much the same way...
I'm not excluding myself from the users who can judge a movie within the first couple of seconds. There ARE indeed plenty of times where I feel that the Author has not taken advantage of all the features Newgrounds provides to hold my attention. There are lots of stupid mistakes that not-so-great submissions have, that are easy to do correctly, but reflect poorly on the author. I have certain personal standards that I try to go by, and I discuss them further here! I try not to be arrogant or anything, but damn, sometimes you DO just know that the person who submitted this just didn't give one shit at all.

Anyway, so yeah, I feel sometimes that I can judge a shitty movie right away. Not great ones right away, but the shitty ones. Maybe a good one might slip by in my judgement...
BUT, do I mind wasting a couple more seconds waiting for the voting bar to show up? No...it's simply not that big a deal...and the slip ups happen less because of it, I'm sure...

nice new change to the portal..... i wondered why it was taking forever to load the voting panel, but i think its a great idea for NG.

At 3/23/05 03:19 PM, WadeFulp wrote: (Long story here)

Well Wade, I have to say, that's a great idea :) I hope people will vote properly now :)

i think thats a good idear XD

oh and BTW most of you people wont realy cair but..
today was the last day at school XD its the eaqster holidays =D

Great idea IMO. Although it only seems to enforce the delay on people who are logged in. Can someone confirm that?

At 3/23/05 03:19 PM, WadeFulp wrote: So a 5MB entry would result in the vote bar being hidden for about 50 seconds.

Having a delay would work, but 50 s for a 5MB entry seems high when sometimes it's just the audio that takes up all the space.

Good idea, it was always too tempting to vote before it had loaded up.

I think this is a very good idea. Even if I don't like a particular artist, They may eventually put a good movie. Those people out there who don't watch the videos are losers and not real supporters of this site.

On one hand I agree that having a delay so that people view the flash before voting is helpful, but on the other hand sometimes it is readily apparent that a flash is utter crap within the first few seconds....

Overall, I think that the change will help more than it hurts...

Homer