Welp, been a while since my commission sheet has been posted. Not a single bite. Since I’m drunk enough to ask, anyone wanna give me reasons my art isn’t getting anywhere? Can’t hurt any worse to know the truth then to keep guessing right?
Just need some advice from artists and viewers
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Yeah, just wish you hadnt mentioned that you're drunk so I'm going to cut a lot of what I'd say because I cant take your request very seriously if you're only going to ask while inebriated. I basically expect you to forget that this ever happened/and or ignore the information.
You have no followers, no audience and so no way to get your commission sheet to eyes who may be interested regardless of the quality of your art or what you're offering.
Then theres your art, its completely specialized to sonic characters, meaning youve hamstrung yourself to a specific audience. The sonic niche is full of a lot of really skilled people, so your competition is quite fierce and you arent really doing anything to distinguish yourself even within the niche youve chosen.
Then theres the commission sheet itself, the information of what you do and do not offer is good but its hard to read because for some reason you decided to hand write the information. Never do this. Information needs to legible at a glance to maximize the chance that a person will read what you've set in front of them, which is already a dismal prospect.
You need to rethink your entire strategy to find any success, offer something unique that has a demand and market yourself in spaces that are relevant to your niche. This is like, kind of common sense.
At 3/28/24 12:55 AM, TheMagyar wrote: Welp, been a while since my commission sheet has been posted. Not a single bite. Since I’m drunk enough to ask, anyone wanna give me reasons my art isn’t getting anywhere? Can’t hurt any worse to know the truth then to keep guessing right?
Do not fret, I haven't received a single commission through NG ever. The downside to NG is that it's everything by everyone, IE everyone on this site is an artist and artists are perpetually poor. I recommend getting into some RP communities because there's almost always someone lookin' for someone to make art of their RP character.
just keep drawing shit that is not pornographic in any way possible and eventually someone is gonna ask you for a porn comission
Hmm, well I do have other socials and shit. So I was trying to more or less branch out and advertise shit everywhere. RP being “role play” right? So where would I find these communities, and please tell me they ain’t all werid.
Ah, so more or less the big bucks is porn? Well fuck, ether sell my dignity for cash, or remain penniless for the sake of artistic integrity or some shit. Thank you for the comment, at least it was honest
Oh please, don’t feel any sort of need to pull any punches for my personal choices of purging my depression with alcohol. I’m DRUNK, not suffering from Alzheimer’s. Yet… Yeah, fair point to the first. Kind of just started using this site to get my art out there. Okay, fair point with the Sonic shit too. I do make other shit, and have been meaning to make a sheet for the human crap I make. So I’ll get on that when I’m not working myself to death. How would you say I’m not making myself stand out or being distinguished enough? I see, guess I could probably make the font clear. Figured I wouldn’t be boring and advertise shit that feels more like “me”, ya know? Though I figured my handwriting was eligible enough, least that’s what everyone I showed told me. But I’ll just swap it with one of the fonts I use for comics. Define “unique”, and what’s always in demand is porn, fetish shit, or some “do this for exposure” crap. So what would you say is “in demand” if not those things? I’m a boomer of my generation, so I don’t know shit honestly
At 3/28/24 02:17 AM, TheMagyar wrote: Hmm, well I do have other socials and shit. So I was trying to more or less branch out and advertise shit everywhere. RP being “role play” right? So where would I find these communities, and please tell me they ain’t all werid.
Yeah, I don't have any specific places to point you to, but I do know that DnD horror story readers on youtube often have a link to their discord that's usually full of RPG folks.
The community I was more familiar with was the Second Life RP community, but I think that game's pretty dead and the community I did know has since dispersed years ago.
Well, your fundies are getting there; it's nice to see that you push yourself to do technical stuff like dynamic light and perspective. So, it's one of those deals where you're on the right track as far as your growth is concerned, you're just not there yet.
As Temp said, I think pigeonholing yourself as a sonic fanartist really narrows your appeal, and it might be holding your progress back somewhat. Branch out, shoot for getting frontpaged, stick around the forums for advice, get some followers, try again when you're more established and a bit more polished.
Hmmm, fair enough then. I suppose I could search around, see if any of those communities are looking for artists. Thanks for the advice, any and all suggestions are appreciated.
Thank you, glad I'm getting some shit right I suppose. To be fair, what artist truly is "there" yet? The road to improvement is arbitrary, and long. So I'll stop getting better on my own terms, as we all won't. Yeah, to be fair I do a lot of Sonic shit because I work with Archie Sonic Online. So that's why I've more or less kept doing it, though I do have and am working on human shit I probably should start showing more. How exactly do I get on the front pages? Thanks for the advice, I'll give it a try.
At 3/28/24 05:47 PM, TheMagyar wrote: How exactly do I get on the front pages? Thanks for the advice, I'll give it a try.
You know, I was just making some minor tweaks to my Frontpage Guide, weird how that goes.
The short version is "draw good; frequently; get lucky, or play the zeitgeist."
Also, you don't need to follow this one -- be yourself and all that -- but referring to your drawings as "Sonic shit" doesn't read as great for potential clients. This isn't a job board so it's not a big deal, but if you're trying to build an audience you gotta be a palatable to your audience... and well, with the art you're posting your audience is gonna be Sonic megafans.
At 3/28/24 06:21 PM, SourCherryJack wrote:At 3/28/24 05:47 PM, TheMagyar wrote: How exactly do I get on the front pages? Thanks for the advice, I'll give it a try.You know, I was just making some minor tweaks to my Frontpage Guide, weird how that goes.
The short version is "draw good; frequently; get lucky, or play the zeitgeist."
Also, you don't need to follow this one -- be yourself and all that -- but referring to your drawings as "Sonic shit" doesn't read as great for potential clients. This isn't a job board so it's not a big deal, but if you're trying to build an audience you gotta be a palatable to your audience... and well, with the art you're posting your audience is gonna be Sonic megafans.
Oh, well how convenient then. Welp, sadly I don't have the time for the frequent thing, but I'd say I draw good enough. how do I "play the zeitgeist"? And okay, fair enough. I admit I'm a bit self-deprecative, so I suppose I could try to tone that down. Yeah, I kind of see how I might be shooting myself in the foot there. Hence why I'm gonna make a human commission sheet soon enough. Just again, have to find the time. Thank you for the advice
making a more general com sheet is only a small fraction of what you can do to fix the issue. you're going to make it, it will be more legible and flexible.....and then you're not going to get any hits again...because the core issue is not addressed.
You assume that's all I'll be doing? I've taken to heart your advice and put it all into consideration. When I find more time, I'll be developing more of what it is I can offer that stands out from the competition. The core issue will be addressed, so I wouldn't presume as though I don't understand it
At 3/28/24 05:47 PM, TheMagyar wrote: To be fair, what artist truly is "there" yet? The road to improvement is arbitrary, and long.
Well, you want to do commissions; one marker is when people start wanting them from you. Plenty of people are "there."
The "arbitrary" elements of improvement come secondary to the objective, structural elements: a strong visual library, second-nature fundamentals, high levels of accuracy and consistency. Every employable artist has those. When it's non-negotiable, it's not arbitrary. You've got some fundamentals, you're consistent within a narrow range of subject matter, but you're gonna have to look at successful artists, be honest with yourself and consider what they have that you lack right now. That's what your would-be clients are doing.
At 3/28/24 08:47 PM, TheMagyar wrote: how do I "play the zeitgeist"?
Draw what is currently popular. A new Zelda game comes out? Draw Zelda stuff and post it on it's launch day/general release window.
Also if there's a Newgrounds holiday coming up (Next one is Pico Day on May 18th) draw something related to the holiday. You got Robot Day, Madness Day, Clock Day, Pixel Day. I'm sure there are more I'm missing.
Response to Just need some advice from artists and viewers 2024-03-29 20:49:16 (edited 2024-03-29 20:58:53)
At 3/29/24 07:30 PM, Skoops wrote:At 3/28/24 05:47 PM, TheMagyar wrote: To be fair, what artist truly is "there" yet? The road to improvement is arbitrary, and long.Well, you want to do commissions; one marker is when people start wanting them from you. Plenty of people are "there."
The "arbitrary" elements of improvement come secondary to the objective, structural elements: a strong visual library, second-nature fundamentals, high levels of accuracy and consistency. Every employable artist has those. When it's non-negotiable, it's not arbitrary. You've got some fundamentals, you're consistent within a narrow range of subject matter, but you're gonna have to look at successful artists, be honest with yourself and consider what they have that you lack right now. That's what your would-be clients are doing.
I'm of a different mind that skill =/= commissions, it is one of the many ways you can distinguish yourself to get peoples attention and certainly one of the most important modifiers for getting an actual professional job but for private commissions I would put skill in like B tier as far as what people actually care about when they commission you. Its important but its not the actual deciding factor.
I think the most important thing is being able to actually market yourself, because it doesnt matter how good you are if nobody knows you exist, and marketing yourself requires aggression and finding a way to sell yourself that makes you stand out, which is not the same as being good. You can make yourself stand out and still be completely mid at art.
Playing the flavor of the month is a decent way to gain traction over a long period of time but it can also do nothing if you're not advancing the trend. Drawing Zelda in a cute pose in a sea of zelda does nothing for you, animating zelda twerking with ganon while suavemente plays in the background is going to get you exponentially more followers and attention even if the animation itself, from a technical perspective, sucks.
Response to Just need some advice from artists and viewers 2024-03-29 23:14:23 (edited 2024-03-29 23:30:05)
At 3/29/24 08:49 PM, Template88 wrote:At 3/29/24 07:30 PM, Skoops wrote:I'm of a different mind that skill =/= commissions, it is one of the many ways you can distinguish yourself to get peoples attention and certainly one of the most important modifiers for getting an actual professional job but for private commissions I would put skill in like B tier as far as what people actually care about when they commission you. Its important but its not the actual deciding factor.At 3/28/24 05:47 PM, TheMagyar wrote: To be fair, what artist truly is "there" yet? The road to improvement is arbitrary, and long.Well, you want to do commissions; one marker is when people start wanting them from you. Plenty of people are "there."
The "arbitrary" elements of improvement come secondary to the objective, structural elements: a strong visual library, second-nature fundamentals, high levels of accuracy and consistency. Every employable artist has those. When it's non-negotiable, it's not arbitrary. You've got some fundamentals, you're consistent within a narrow range of subject matter, but you're gonna have to look at successful artists, be honest with yourself and consider what they have that you lack right now. That's what your would-be clients are doing.
I think the most important thing is being able to actually market yourself, because it doesnt matter how good you are if nobody knows you exist, and marketing yourself requires aggression and finding a way to sell yourself that makes you stand out, which is not the same as being good. You can make yourself stand out and still be completely mid at art.
Playing the flavor of the month is a decent way to gain traction over a long period of time but it can also do nothing if you're not advancing the trend. Drawing Zelda in a cute pose in a sea of zelda does nothing for you, animating zelda twerking with ganon while suavemente plays in the background is going to get you exponentially more followers and attention even if the animation itself, from a technical perspective, sucks.
I don't totally disagree. I'm not out there chasing comms, because I hate the hustle - there're lots of people like me out there. But I know I must have crossed some of whichever thresholds there are, considering I get approached for them anyway. I don't post my rates, I've never made a "comms open" announcement, I only do fanart when I actually want to, so I'm convinced that all these tricks to gaming the system are for after you've met a certain minimum skill level, not a replacement for it; at least for the type of art we're dealing with here.
The Suavamente school of thought is more in the wheelhouse of memeing and shitposting. It's a valid approach if you're in it for those punctuated moments of attention, but if the goal is getting commission work, I dunno how useful it is. It might be. Maybe a balance of shitposts and good art is the way to go - I don't know because I minmaxed for meeting industry standards, not community-building.
At 3/29/24 11:14 PM, Skoops wrote:At 3/29/24 08:49 PM, Template88 wrote:I don't totally disagree. I'm not out there chasing comms, because I hate the hustle - they're lots of people like me out there. But I know I must have crossed some of whichever thresholds there are, considering I get approached for them anyway. I don't post my rates, I've never made a "comms open" announcement, I only do fanart when I actually want to, so I'm convinced that all these tricks to gaming the system are for after you've met a certain minimum skill level, not a replacement for it; at least for the type of art we're dealing with here.At 3/29/24 07:30 PM, Skoops wrote:I'm of a different mind that skill =/= commissions, it is one of the many ways you can distinguish yourself to get peoples attention and certainly one of the most important modifiers for getting an actual professional job but for private commissions I would put skill in like B tier as far as what people actually care about when they commission you. Its important but its not the actual deciding factor.At 3/28/24 05:47 PM, TheMagyar wrote: To be fair, what artist truly is "there" yet? The road to improvement is arbitrary, and long.Well, you want to do commissions; one marker is when people start wanting them from you. Plenty of people are "there."
The "arbitrary" elements of improvement come secondary to the objective, structural elements: a strong visual library, second-nature fundamentals, high levels of accuracy and consistency. Every employable artist has those. When it's non-negotiable, it's not arbitrary. You've got some fundamentals, you're consistent within a narrow range of subject matter, but you're gonna have to look at successful artists, be honest with yourself and consider what they have that you lack right now. That's what your would-be clients are doing.
I think the most important thing is being able to actually market yourself, because it doesnt matter how good you are if nobody knows you exist, and marketing yourself requires aggression and finding a way to sell yourself that makes you stand out, which is not the same as being good. You can make yourself stand out and still be completely mid at art.
Playing the flavor of the month is a decent way to gain traction over a long period of time but it can also do nothing if you're not advancing the trend. Drawing Zelda in a cute pose in a sea of zelda does nothing for you, animating zelda twerking with ganon while suavemente plays in the background is going to get you exponentially more followers and attention even if the animation itself, from a technical perspective, sucks.
The Suavamente school of thought is more in the wheelhouse of memeing and shitposting. It's a valid approach if you're in it for those punctuated moments of attention, but if the goal is getting commission work, I dunno how useful it is. It might be. Maybe a balance of shitposts and good art is the way to go - I don't know because I minmaxed for meeting industry standards, not community-building.
I wish there was a salute emoji.
I just don't think there is anybody on NG who is looking to pay money to commission SFW Sonic fanart. You're appealing to an audience that is just not present here.
Response to Just need some advice from artists and viewers 2024-03-30 15:16:51 (edited 2024-03-30 15:17:44)
Sonic
At 3/30/24 03:32 AM, tydaze wrote: I just don't think there is anybody on NG who is looking to pay money to commission SFW Sonic fanart. You're appealing to an audience that is just not present here.
Oh, really? I sort of assumed that Sonic content was a thing people would want here. If not that, what kinds of thing (in your opinion) would people be more inclined towards?
At 3/29/24 11:21 PM, Template88 wrote:At 3/29/24 11:14 PM, Skoops wrote:I wish there was a salute emoji.At 3/29/24 08:49 PM, Template88 wrote:I don't totally disagree. I'm not out there chasing comms, because I hate the hustle - they're lots of people like me out there. But I know I must have crossed some of whichever thresholds there are, considering I get approached for them anyway. I don't post my rates, I've never made a "comms open" announcement, I only do fanart when I actually want to, so I'm convinced that all these tricks to gaming the system are for after you've met a certain minimum skill level, not a replacement for it; at least for the type of art we're dealing with here.At 3/29/24 07:30 PM, Skoops wrote:I'm of a different mind that skill =/= commissions, it is one of the many ways you can distinguish yourself to get peoples attention and certainly one of the most important modifiers for getting an actual professional job but for private commissions I would put skill in like B tier as far as what people actually care about when they commission you. Its important but its not the actual deciding factor.At 3/28/24 05:47 PM, TheMagyar wrote: To be fair, what artist truly is "there" yet? The road to improvement is arbitrary, and long.Well, you want to do commissions; one marker is when people start wanting them from you. Plenty of people are "there."
The "arbitrary" elements of improvement come secondary to the objective, structural elements: a strong visual library, second-nature fundamentals, high levels of accuracy and consistency. Every employable artist has those. When it's non-negotiable, it's not arbitrary. You've got some fundamentals, you're consistent within a narrow range of subject matter, but you're gonna have to look at successful artists, be honest with yourself and consider what they have that you lack right now. That's what your would-be clients are doing.
I think the most important thing is being able to actually market yourself, because it doesnt matter how good you are if nobody knows you exist, and marketing yourself requires aggression and finding a way to sell yourself that makes you stand out, which is not the same as being good. You can make yourself stand out and still be completely mid at art.
Playing the flavor of the month is a decent way to gain traction over a long period of time but it can also do nothing if you're not advancing the trend. Drawing Zelda in a cute pose in a sea of zelda does nothing for you, animating zelda twerking with ganon while suavemente plays in the background is going to get you exponentially more followers and attention even if the animation itself, from a technical perspective, sucks.
The Suavamente school of thought is more in the wheelhouse of memeing and shitposting. It's a valid approach if you're in it for those punctuated moments of attention, but if the goal is getting commission work, I dunno how useful it is. It might be. Maybe a balance of shitposts and good art is the way to go - I don't know because I minmaxed for meeting industry standards, not community-building.
Oh god, what have I done?
At 3/29/24 08:39 PM, SourCherryJack wrote:At 3/28/24 08:47 PM, TheMagyar wrote: how do I "play the zeitgeist"?Draw what is currently popular. A new Zelda game comes out? Draw Zelda stuff and post it on it's launch day/general release window.
Also if there's a Newgrounds holiday coming up (Next one is Pico Day on May 18th) draw something related to the holiday. You got Robot Day, Madness Day, Clock Day, Pixel Day. I'm sure there are more I'm missing.
Hmmm, I guess that doesn't seem to hard to do. So, is there a calender for these Newground Holidays I can find or is it sort of random?
Response to Just need some advice from artists and viewers 2024-04-02 16:02:33 (edited 2024-04-02 16:02:52)
At 3/29/24 07:30 PM, Skoops wrote:At 3/28/24 05:47 PM, TheMagyar wrote: To be fair, what artist truly is "there" yet? The road to improvement is arbitrary, and long.Well, you want to do commissions; one marker is when people start wanting them from you. Plenty of people are "there."
The "arbitrary" elements of improvement come secondary to the objective, structural elements: a strong visual library, second-nature fundamentals, high levels of accuracy and consistency. Every employable artist has those. When it's non-negotiable, it's not arbitrary. You've got some fundamentals, you're consistent within a narrow range of subject matter, but you're gonna have to look at successful artists, be honest with yourself and consider what they have that you lack right now. That's what your would-be clients are doing.
Hmmm, fair enough. Guess I'll have to keep studying other artist. And by study, I mean creeping on their shit like a goblin
At 4/2/24 03:57 PM, TheMagyar wrote:At 3/30/24 03:32 AM, tydaze wrote: I just don't think there is anybody on NG who is looking to pay money to commission SFW Sonic fanart. You're appealing to an audience that is just not present here.Oh, really? I sort of assumed that Sonic content was a thing people would want here. If not that, what kinds of thing (in your opinion) would people be more inclined towards?
I don't know, it seems like most of the time when I see somebody post a commission here, the artist says it was done for somebody on another social media. But when I do see Newgrounders commissioning each other, it is usually their OC, or they are looking for help with art for a project like an animation, comic, or game. I just don't see a lot of Newgrounders with Sonic OCs who are buying SFW art (plenty of NSFW though)
At 4/2/24 04:00 PM, TheMagyar wrote: Hmmm, I guess that doesn't seem to hard to do. So, is there a calender for these Newground Holidays I can find or is it sort of random?
Newgrounds Calendar. Offhand I don't know exactly when these fall, but I believe they're all on there.
For past collections of event days, and the general window of when these site holidays fall here's the Collections page where among other collections and collabs are playlists of past holiday submissions.
It's easy to jump to negative conclusions, but I think all you need to get started is to learn a little about marketing / how to promote yourself. Keep in mind, It takes awhile to get the word out that you're taking commissions, especially with a smaller audience. One thing I would consider is replacing the handwritten text with easier to read typed text. Think about how can you simplify your commission sheet so that it's easier for people to understand without too much reading. Check around and see how your favorite artists are laying out their prices / examples if you need inspiration.
Also, I think you can simply list things you will and won't draw. You don't have to defend only wanting to do SFW art. Just say you don't do NSFW. Saying things like "That's just, well weird. And I'm not your guy for that kind of crap." Is not great because potential customers might feel put off and it looks unprofessional. It helps to be friendly if you want to attract new people to your page.
Blooming even after the darkest of seasons
