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mhb
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-18 20:57:27 Reply

wow you guys have a great debate goin' on. the answer is Ab aug.


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MusicalRocky
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-18 21:54:09 Reply

At 6/18/06 08:57 PM, mhb wrote: wow you guys have a great debate goin' on. the answer is Ab aug.

Uhhh how is that the answer? Uh asked for the notes in a chord, not the name of a chord, right? Or am I missing something? And I assume you mean Ab major, right?

mhb
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-18 21:57:51 Reply

At 6/18/06 09:54 PM, MusicalRocky wrote:
At 6/18/06 08:57 PM, mhb wrote: wow you guys have a great debate goin' on. the answer is Ab aug.
Uhhh how is that the answer? Uh asked for the notes in a chord, not the name of a chord, right? Or am I missing something? And I assume you mean Ab major, right?

no. i meant Ab aug. that's the third inversion of an E major with an augmented 5th.


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MusicalRocky
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-18 22:16:23 Reply

At 6/18/06 09:57 PM, mhb wrote:
no. i meant Ab aug. that's the third inversion of an E major with an augmented 5th.

Hm, isn't Ab augmented the first inversion of that? And wouldn't a third inversion be the same as no inversion? (For a fifth) Because E major with aug. 5th would be E Ab B#, right? So, 1st inversion Ab B# E (Ab augmented). If you understand my ramblings, would you mind explaining further?

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ntacms
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-18 22:31:02 Reply

it makes sense

MusicalRocky
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-18 22:40:30 Reply

At 6/18/06 10:31 PM, ntacms wrote: it makes sense

What makes sense? lol

xXDathDalerXx
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 00:56:02 Reply

At 6/18/06 10:16 PM, MusicalRocky wrote: Hm, isn't Ab augmented the first inversion of that? And wouldn't a third inversion be the same as no inversion? (For a fifth) Because E major with aug. 5th would be E Ab B#, right? So, 1st inversion Ab B# E (Ab augmented). If you understand my ramblings, would you mind explaining further?

I'm not always right. Now you have proof.

the first inversion is the chord played normally,with the root at the bottom...the second inversion is putting the 5th at the bottom & the third inversion is putting the 3d at the bottom
1-3-5 = 1sy
5-1-3 = 2nd
3-5-1 = 3d

about the other guy and the Ab thing it's the same as G#,it's actually G# if you want to be theoretically correct
i know this is confusing cause it's basically all the same shit but on paper it's different


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LoneInstrumentalist
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 07:08:04 Reply

At 6/19/06 12:56 AM, xXDathDalerXx wrote:
At 6/18/06 10:16 PM, MusicalRocky wrote: Hm, isn't Ab augmented the first inversion of that? And wouldn't a third inversion be the same as no inversion? (For a fifth) Because E major with aug. 5th would be E Ab B#, right? So, 1st inversion Ab B# E (Ab augmented). If you understand my ramblings, would you mind explaining further?

I'm not always right. Now you have proof.
the first inversion is the chord played normally,with the root at the bottom...the second inversion is putting the 5th at the bottom & the third inversion is putting the 3d at the bottom
1-3-5 = 1sy
5-1-3 = 2nd
3-5-1 = 3d

about the other guy and the Ab thing it's the same as G#,it's actually G# if you want to be theoretically correct
i know this is confusing cause it's basically all the same shit but on paper it's different

but then again there r ppl like me, who actually wont mind sum lesiure reading time
doing exam in 12 weeks X] might as well get used to it

cheerios~ @_@ S......T......D...........................
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.............Y

MusicalRocky
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 09:11:42 Reply

At 6/19/06 12:56 AM, xXDathDalerXx wrote:
the first inversion is the chord played normally,with the root at the bottom...the second inversion is putting the 5th at the bottom & the third inversion is putting the 3d at the bottom
1-3-5 = 1sy
5-1-3 = 2nd
3-5-1 = 3d

Actually, I hate to say this, but I think you're wrong.

1-3-5 = Root Position
3-5-1 = 1st Inversion
5-1-3 = 2nd Inversion
1-3-5 = 3rd Inversion (oddly the same as Root Position since it's a triad)

about the other guy and the Ab thing it's the same as G#,it's actually G# if you want to be theoretically correct
i know this is confusing cause it's basically all the same shit but on paper it's different

You are correct. Same tone, but definitely different visually and theoretically.

MusicalRocky
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 09:14:06 Reply

Sorry for the double post, but I'd also like to note that 3rd inversion is the same as Root Position except that it's an octave higher.

Glad to see this is becoming a productive thread :)

xXDathDalerXx
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 11:15:05 Reply

At 6/19/06 09:11 AM, MusicalRocky wrote: 1-3-5 = Root Position
3-5-1 = 1st Inversion
5-1-3 = 2nd Inversion
1-3-5 = 3rd Inversion (oddly the same as Root Position since it's a triad)

aaah you're right


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MusicalRocky
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 11:18:20 Reply

At 6/19/06 11:15 AM, xXDathDalerXx wrote:
aaah you're right

Surprisingly.

mhb
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 11:40:23 Reply

At 6/19/06 11:18 AM, MusicalRocky wrote:
At 6/19/06 11:15 AM, xXDathDalerXx wrote:
aaah you're right
Surprisingly.

wrong. the first inversion is the normal chord, just like the first mode is the normal scale. therefore the 3rd inversion (starting on the third note within' that scale of the chord) is Ab aug. yes it G# in it's proper term 'cause there s no flats in an augmented chord or scale but it's still the exact same thing. kudos to the guy that understood what i was sayin'.


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Winterwind-NS
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 12:05:04 Reply

At 6/19/06 11:40 AM, mhb wrote: wrong. the first inversion is the normal chord, just like the first mode is the normal scale. therefore the 3rd inversion (starting on the third note within' that scale of the chord) is Ab aug. yes it G# in it's proper term 'cause there s no flats in an augmented chord or scale but it's still the exact same thing. kudos to the guy that understood what i was sayin'.

ur right about the first inversion of a chord being the "normal" chord but.
The third inversion does NOT mean that the root note is the third of the scale
An inversion is when the root is switched to the top and the next note is the root.
thus like rocky said, the third root would be the same as the first inversion,
if you imagine it in ur head, except an octave higher

no kudo's the to guy that "understood" what you were saying lol


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mhb
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 12:07:13 Reply

wrong.


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MusicalRocky
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 12:11:45 Reply

At 6/19/06 12:07 PM, mhb wrote: wrong.

Important Stuff

Watch and learn.

Winterwind-NS
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 12:14:45 Reply

young sir mhb, you just got owned


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mhb
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 12:38:52 Reply

At 6/19/06 12:14 PM, Winterwind-NS wrote: young sir mhb, you just got owned

not entirely. i never said that it was the triad that was bein' inverted. all i said was the 3rd inversion of an E major augmented 5th. that doesn't mean the triad. that means the entire chord and scale. the only possible answer when both are added together is an Ab augmented. not a G# augmented. but an Ab augmented. the mathematical part of theory comes in at that point. where you actually have to divide one chord by another triad minus the scale frequency in order to get the answer. i figured you guys would have Good answers and you did. but you're still wrong. the answer is Ab aug.


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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 12:38:54 Reply

this isn't about who's pwning who,it's about learning :P


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MusicalRocky
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 12:39:02 Reply

Okay, I think we beat that issue into the ground. Any more questions? Unless someone else wants a further explanation?

L
O
L

MusicalRocky
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 12:40:40 Reply

At 6/19/06 12:38 PM, xXDathDalerXx wrote: this isn't about who's pwning who,it's about learning :P

Exactly. (sorry for double post, AGAIN *sigh*)

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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 12:45:51 Reply

ok here's a simple question, what exactly is a 13th?


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Winterwind-NS
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 12:58:42 Reply

a 13th could be referred as the 13th note of a scale
like in a C scale, the 13th would b A

It was said that Sergei Rachmaninov could play a 13th with one hand
google him up. His hand is HUGE!
they have a model of his hand in the wax museum in DC i think
I saw chopin's


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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 13:05:34 Reply

At 6/19/06 12:58 PM, Winterwind-NS wrote: It was said that Sergei Rachmaninov could play a 13th with one hand
google him up. His hand is HUGE!
they have a model of his hand in the wax museum in DC i think
I saw chopin's

Yeah, I heard about their hands. I can play like an octave lol. That's it.

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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 13:05:55 Reply

At 6/19/06 12:38 PM, mhb wrote: you actually have to divide one chord by another triad minus the scale frequency in order to get the answer.

you don't know what you're talking about obviously...


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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 13:32:48 Reply

At 6/19/06 12:58 PM, Winterwind-NS wrote: It was said that Sergei Rachmaninov could play a 13th with one hand

i can do that too...on guitar hahahahahahaha
a 13th comes into play in polychords

1
2
3
4
5
6
7
1 (8)
2 (9)
3 (10)
4 (11)
5 (12)
6 (13)

so it's actually just the 6th note played at an octave,on guitar we do subtitutions to be able to play such chords


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MusicalRocky
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 13:42:49 Reply

At 6/19/06 01:32 PM, xXDathDalerXx wrote:
a 13th comes into play in polychords

1
2
3
4
5
6
7
1 (8)
2 (9)
3 (10)
4 (11)
5 (12)
6 (13)

so it's actually just the 6th note played at an octave,on guitar we do subtitutions to be able to play such chords

I've never played guitar, but that makes sense. Lol. Any more questions, people?

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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 14:16:39 Reply

i'm more interested in the musical aspect of music (what??)
i mean the actual composing part of it...theory is fine an dandy but i find it tedious and boring,i'm more interested in how to apply the theory,get what i mean??

melody,consonance,dissonance,harmony
the things that really make music,music...i know most of this stuff by ear but i don't know any actual theory behind it

i don't know if i'm expressing myself correctly


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MusicalRocky
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 14:25:01 Reply

At 6/19/06 02:16 PM, xXDathDalerXx wrote: i'm more interested in the musical aspect of music (what??)
i mean the actual composing part of it...theory is fine an dandy but i find it tedious and boring,i'm more interested in how to apply the theory,get what i mean??

melody,consonance,dissonance,harmony
the things that really make music,music...i know most of this stuff by ear but i don't know any actual theory behind it

i don't know if i'm expressing myself correctly

I get you completely. But if a song sounds good, you use theory anyway. Something that doesn't use theory effectively (or uses it badly) wouldn't sound good. Get me?

Also, chord progressions are part of music theory. It may not seem important, but they're very useful in creating a certain feeling within a song.

However, I do understand what you're saying. What a song sounds like is more important than the theory behind it. I think. Lol.

MusicalRocky
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Response to The Official Music Theory Thread 2006-06-19 14:30:19 Reply

Oops. Excuse me. I meant most of the time good songs denote usage of theory. Not always though. Take Winterwind's Prelude no. 3 for example. It uses almost no theory at all, but still pwns. Lol