At 5/6/06 10:11 PM, Rainan wrote: I guess you do have the right.

The only thing is that you seems to THINK you know what is going on.

So do you, in that you think the official explanation is accurate. I do not claim to KNOW what happened, however. Thought and knowledge are different things.

Its great that you can raise questions, but I think it is incocievable to think that Bush or anyone in the government is smart enough to plan this out.

See, right there? You THINK it's inconcievable. You don't KNOW that it is. For what it's worth, I agree you with you in so much as I don't think Bush is smart enough to have pulled this off. His daddy on the other hand, with over 40 years of connections and business to his name could certainly be involved. I don't believe there is some all-powerful ring leader though, that's over-simplified hollywood bullshit. For the conspiracy stuff to be true (and you will note at no point have I ever declared that it absolutely IS true, merely that I am open to the possibility) it would have to be both more complex and much simpler than we imagine it to be, otherwise it simply wouldn't work.

You would think that the American people would have learned a little skepticism by now.

They've seen 40 years of CIA wrongdoing, including ridiculously implausible plots like assassinating Fidel Castro with a cigar and the Kennedy Assassinations.

They've seen unlikely government conspiracies proven beyond a shadow of a doubt, plots like Watergate and the MKULTRA mind control experiments.

For God's sake, the U.S. government has even confessed to feeding radioactive mush to retarded children -- just to see what would happen. The real question isn't "Why would you believe the U.S. government was behind September 11?" Rather, the question is "Why wouldn't you?"

At 5/7/06 12:34 AM, James_Monroe wrote: For God's sake, the U.S. government has even confessed to feeding radioactive mush to retarded children -- just to see what would happen. The real question isn't "Why would you believe the U.S. government was behind September 11?" Rather, the question is "Why wouldn't you?"

the only thing i heard/read that slightly convinces me is how the Tower fell. It got hit, so if it was going to collapse it'd fall on it's side, or the floor above the crash would. The way it fell down like a house of cards convinces me of a bomb.

Also the FBI took the tape from the gas station near the pentagon

At 5/6/06 12:17 AM, capn_g wrote:

\

So what you're saying is you'd prefer to believe that the government is merely incompetant and the billions spent on national defence every year are completely wasted?

What I preffer to believe has nothing to do with any of this. Hell, I preffer to believe that big bad bush masterminded the whole thing and that we can blame everything on him. God knows it would make for some great drama. But it's about what is true; the government had nothing to do with this, and yes, the billions spent on national defence is a totall waste.

At 5/6/06 12:23 AM, Cajunspirit wrote:

Why oh why then Mr.Clock did the pentagon only release 5 frames of the Pentagon crash?

As I said earlier, probably to hide evidence of incompetency.

What do they have to hide? Where were the impact points of the wings, or the corresponding engine?

I've seen pictures of the impact point from birds eye view. Lemme see if I can find the picture.

Loose change does not claim to be absolute truth but only points of the fallacies of the stories reported. The government is not helping with their " 5 frame " movie either.

Like I said, I can name so many inacurracies it would make your head spin. To be honest, I love to debate you since you always seem to be smart and on top of things, but it stuns me you could do something so dumb as to believe that flight 93 never existed, and all the people on it are being held prisoner by NASA, or any of those other stupid conspiracies.

At 5/6/06 05:22 PM, HAcoreRD wrote:

That was Gettysburg

Nope, the battle of Gettysburg gave him the fuel for the "Gettysburg address", NOT the emancipation proclomation. Believe me.

At 5/7/06 11:08 PM, LettuceClock wrote: But it's about what is true; the government had nothing to do with this, and yes, the billions spent on national defence is a totall waste.

Truth is a personal thing, one man's truth is another's lie. I think what you meant was it's about fact. Unfortunately facts can be skewed, obscured or otherwise spun to suit the agendas of those presenting the facts (I did a course on this back in college, some of the shit advertisers do to cloud otherwise straightford information would make your head spin).

If, however, the billions spent on defense are indeed wasted, then the government is absolutely responsible by way of inaction, if not for the attacks directly.

I'll sum up my opinion on the matter in a few short words:

everything's a fucking conspiracy these days, according to reporters and similar filth who have nothing to do but worry about their next paycheck. They need interesting stuff, stuff that shocks people and makes them ru nfor the nearest news-stand to find out more about it.

hence the Loose Change, the Holocaust falsification, and more.

At 5/8/06 12:30 AM, capn_g wrote:

If, however, the billions spent on defense are indeed wasted, then the government is absolutely responsible by way of inaction, if not for the attacks directly.

Condaleza (sp) Rice was given a fully detailed report saying that Osama Bin Laden was going to use the CIA training we had given him while fighting the soviets to attack U.S national landmarks, most likely using hijacked planes as projectiles. Since he had already attempted to take down the WTC with a carbomb and failed, it must have crossed their mind that he would try again. They chose to ignore the threat and not bother with it, giving it minimal attention. To say their incompetence was a factor in the terrorist attacks would be the understatement of the century.

Well then you can't really say the government had NOTHING to do with it, can you? They created Al-queda, trained and supplied them, etc. Any way you slice, either by direct involvement or just plain dumb-fuckery, the majority of the blame lies there.

The holocaust is a completely different matter. I don't see how anyone can say it didn't happen. I do find it odd that the number keeps gong up though. When I was 12 it was estimated that 4 million died in german camps. Now it's commonly held to be 6 million. I fully expect it to be 8 million by the time I'm 50. It's particualrily odd considering a census done in 1936 indicated an overall jewish population in europe (not counting Russia) around the 6 million mark. Since Hitler didn't succeed in his plan, you gotta wonder where all those extra bodies came from...

I've heard that some person in Bushes government, has slipped out that in fact it is a conspiracy. Perhaps just a story but it lets Bush go to war with Iran which, Oh, it has oil doesn't it? Making Bush rich, and making him seem the perfect hero.
Could be true, maybe not. Will be along time before anybody really finds out the truth. Some of that 'Loose Change' shows promise in the theorys it presents.

Let's just say for a second that it was a conspiracy?

Why would the government do that to their own people?

At 5/8/06 11:35 AM, Bryjorrin wrote: Let's just say for a second that it was a conspiracy?

Why would the government do that to their own people?

Money. Iran, Iraq Afghanistan has oil fields. Nasty fat westerner comes over and gets rich.
Now, if there was no war going on, America would have to buy this oil! And this would not do, as it would be very expensive off the honest arab.
Like a dictator, if there is money on the line, they wil do anything for it don't you agree?

Search "Loose Change Viewer Guide" on Google.
Other people have done the research for you if you look for it.
Screw Loose Change also works, but that one's a video and I like to read the text so I have time to confirm it if I don't beleive it.

At 5/8/06 11:42 AM, Tinnymin wrote:

At 5/8/06 11:35 AM, Bryjorrin wrote: Let's just say for a second that it was a conspiracy?

Why would the government do that to their own people?

Money. Iran, Iraq Afghanistan has oil fields. Nasty fat westerner comes over and gets rich.
Now, if there was no war going on, America would have to buy this oil! And this would not do, as it would be very expensive off the honest arab.
Like a dictator, if there is money on the line, they wil do anything for it don't you agree?

Why would the United States destroy its own military installation (Pentagon) when the WTC was more than enough to get people angry at the Terrorists?

That's a much better question, most of the time the best answers I can get are "Because you wouldn't be expecting it!" and "They knew you would think that!"

Meh sorry I shouldn't have ressurected this post, should have known when I saw it on uncyclopedia that it had been there a while...