I aint do no more voting I vote 4 obama and i done get screwed by obamacar dont fall for this foolish reptilan vote sytem

This sounds like a good and much-needed change.

Someone may have already said this, but if you decide to allow score changing but not review editing, you should put a note at the bottom of the review saying that the score was changed.

Considering you pretty much invented this game, have you ever considered that to this day nobody has been able to come up with a non exploitable and truly fair/level playing field?

Just a thought, don't chew on it too long :3

Anyway this all sounds interesting, fire it up and we'll see what happens next.

I'm glad the XP system will be added in audio portal since I usually listen to random music. Editing review is cool too! But one thing which bugs me so much is troll votes. Here is my request for this : Can you add a quick vote statistic? I mean something like play store's review section. With that, anyone can see the vote cast for each score and can easily know they're trolled or not by looking at the curve.

I like this a lot. Great ideas

Sounds sweet, though I hope you can reprise blam and save animations, for those few diligent or lucky enough to have settled a movie/game submission. Maybe with half stars, vote results will be a bit more precise?

At 1/12/15 09:27 AM, TomFulp wrote:

The new voting system will be universal for all Portals (games, movies, audio, art).

Perfect

You will gain 2 XP for each vote, with a max of 10 XP daily.

Not sure, as I like the uniqueness of having a non-zero ending digit, as it signifies I've been here since the dawn of time, but seems fine otherwise

On weekends you will be able to log up to 20 XP daily.

Sure, whatever

All existing score data will be backed up but no longer used. Review scores will become the new existing score data.

Users can only vote once on each piece of content and can edit that vote whenever they want.

The score that shows in your review is the same score as your vote, there is just one location on the page to enter you score.

You can hide your score or submit a review without a score (many people are anti-scoring).

So it's basically merging the reviewing and voting systems. This seems fine in theory, the number of people that have asked in wi/ht over the years "but why am i not getting experience wtf" when reviewing is testament to that. That said...

Let me know your thoughts on this plan!

While the idea is great in principle, it's somewhat missing the entire point of voting. The point of voting is to GET RID OF THE SHIT. The good stuff has always risen to the top. What's more important is the ability to get rid of the tests. The works in progress. The 5 second movies. The terrible stick figure movies. The crap that's imported from Youtube or wherever so badly that it looks like a blurred mess. The awful Madness ripoffs. The shovelware (thanks to whoever removed all of enagames' rubbish by the way). Version 28457389476 of Pong. People are talking about zero bombers - there's a reason why 99% of my votes are zero - because I can always find 5 submissions that are under judgment that should be blammed, and which never are because voter tendencies have declined so bad that voting is basically meaningless.

Do everything that you're suggesting, but at the same time:

- reintroduce the whistle. If I can just flag all of the stuff that shouldn't be submitted to the Portal in the first place, I can move on to actual good submissions.
- raise the score which submissions need to avoid being blammed. It shouldn't be the case that 90%+ of stuff is protected. Give the junk a chance to go away, the majority of users clearly don't know how things worked correctly 10 years ago, so the admins need to do something about this.

Another thing that would give reviewers more incentive to write reviews is to also vote on the review and give XP for that as well. That way it also curates the types of reviews coming in and would put some better reviews at the top.

NOPE.
The system is perfect and I haven't seen anything similar anywhere, I just think you should get XP from audio and art too.
The 5 votes minimum is fantastic and the daily reward too, please don't change it, it's perfect as it is.

The box that says "__ XP to next level" is way too basic-looking. It needs a little bit more pizazz. Also, in the review box, if we press "enter/return", will it add another line of text like the normal post box does? I don't want the redesign to encourage really basic comments as opposed to actual criticism.

wait wait, I don't get it. We can still vote(stars,0-5,whatever) without writing a review right?
I get it that we can write reviews without scores but what abaout the opposite?srry if this is dumb

Perhaps the scores from submissions could be averaged out and displayed on the user profile page to encourage people to check out their content?

At 1/12/15 09:52 AM, TomFulp wrote: Site activity is generally heavier on weekends and people have more time to check stuff out, which is why the double XP concept seems like it could be fun and boost activity even more.

I know this has been an idea you've had for a long time Tom and when it's come up before I recall you being conflicted about it potentially cheapening the efforts of the long term users who have put in the hard yards (well, as much as you can call clicking a voting panel 5 times 'hard yards') over years and years of loyalty to NG. Combined with some of the other statements you've made here it seems fan service is becoming less and less a priority over userbase growth. I absolutely understand that that needs to be a critical focus for any successful website and business but it is disappointing to watch the things that made your experience so enjoyable slowly diminish.

That's really more of an aside, so to address the point at hand - yeah, a double XP weekend is fun. If I was new to NG I would be absolutely stoked to hear such a thing could be coming very soon. I just wish I had more to strive for and earn with those extra points. :P

At 1/12/15 11:43 AM, TomFulp wrote: NG did feel more like a game in the early days, then in recent years we downplayed the game/stats aspect. I let pushback into my head about that stuff being "childish" and we reduced it in 2012 to the detriment of the user experience for a lot of people.

yo das it mane, das me right hurr. I loved those b/p movies so much and had a sweet idea for a level up movie that made me want to get good enough at Flash to give it the treatment it deserved (and the quality it needed). Never turned out though.

I feel like this has been a bit too depressing, I don't wanna be a Negative Nancy here. Overhauling the scoring system to have scores more accurately reflect the quality of the entry is an excellent thing and I'm all for it. GG Tom.

[thumbs up emoticon]

Sounds great! I love that it's going to include art and music. That will give people some more motivation to vote on those submissions.

Great news guys!

Is there going to be any weight or sort for number of votes? Now, (for audio at least) it's just by high score. Someone with one vote of 5 will be higher up than someone with many more votes that average in the 4.x range.

At 1/12/15 09:27 AM, TomFulp wrote: Users can only vote once on each piece of content and can edit that vote whenever they want.

I like this one. For years people have posted things like, "Game is broken! 0 stars! I'll change vote when it works." lol...

At 1/12/15 09:27 AM, TomFulp wrote: Once you write a review, it always appears above the other reviews on the page, so you can see what you wrote and edit (or delete?) if desired.

This is good too. It used to be like this, didn't it?

You can hide your score or submit a review without a score (many people are anti-scoring).

I like this too. Sometimes I want to leave a comment but adding a score doesn't seem appropriate, lol...

I like these changes, especially since a minimum vote number isn't required. On most days I may watch 3 movies and not have enough to deposit points.

I think the 10 xp daily maximum should be 10 xp for every 24 hours rather than for every calendar day (unless it works like that already). An alternative would be to allow users to bank points if they vote more than 5 times in a day. That way, the maximum is still 10 xp daily, but the user can watch as many videos as possible.

It should be more clear that a written review is not required with a rating.

I also suggest making the written review consistent with ratings and using a 5 point system rather than the 10 point system that currently exists for written reviews.

Being able to edit reviews for at least 5 minutes after submitting would be nice and only reviewing once is also a plus.

No! Now I won't be able to rig the system by voting my stuff up every day! (PS, I don't do that.)

In all seriousness, there's one major problem with all this that you might've missed. If you can only vote for each submission once, and your experience for the day is still capped, then if you "do overtime" by voting for no experience then you'll never be able to get experience for the extra stuff you voted for. One solution that I can see is to change everyone's routine by just doing away with the cap altogether, and have it be like the way Armor Games used to be. You can vote as many times a day as you like since there are only so many submissions to possibly vote on.

And I have an idea regarding the concerns about how all the submissions' scores are going to change. The current game ratings can be merged with the review ratings by having an NG bot place a special review on each submission equal to the game's rating, perhaps worth a lot of votes. Maybe this special NG bot can even have each of its reviews be worth a different amount of votes depending on how many votes the game got previously.

At 1/12/15 09:46 PM, TharosTheDragon wrote: doing away with the cap altogether

That would make my 2426 days (6 years 236 days) of depositing obsolete.

Another flash game site might not have a cap, but I don't see how that means that Newgrounds shouldn't, either. Newgrounds has a great system. It's a system so great, it has made me visit the site each day for 2426 days. Stop and think about that. 2426 days of Newgrounds, 6 years 236 days of Newgrounding, over the last ~7 years. Brand loyalty like that is rivaled only by cocaine and potato chips.

And you seem to be under the impression that experience would somehow be lost when you vote on more than 5 submissions in a day. That is not the case. There are far more than 5 submissions per day. I don't know the stats for each individual portal, but I'd imagine there are close to 150-200 submissions across the site per day. Even if you voted on every single one of them, 150-200 more would take their place the next day.

It's a system where there is absolutely no shortage of New submissions. Even if you voted on all ~700,000 some odd submissions because you were bored, you'd have another 150-200 submissions to vote on for your experience the next day.

Edit: And I don't want some random Korean guy to visit the site one day and decide to spend the next few days voting on every single submission until he's level 61 and dethrones @pimp (Why do I @ you? I know you have a script that tells you when people post about you.) who has been here since 1999, before most Armor Games users were born.

At 1/12/15 07:29 PM, jonthomson wrote: - reintroduce the whistle. If I can just flag all of the stuff that shouldn't be submitted to the Portal in the first place, I can move on to actual good submissions.
- raise the score which submissions need to avoid being blammed. It shouldn't be the case that 90%+ of stuff is protected. Give the junk a chance to go away, the majority of users clearly don't know how things worked correctly 10 years ago, so the admins need to do something about this.

I agree with this all the way. These points definitely need implemented if we're going to pull a revamping of the voting system. I want some positive change for once.

At 1/12/15 10:02 PM, Bit wrote: Another flash game site might not have a cap, but I don't see how that means that Newgrounds shouldn't, either. Newgrounds has a great system.

I'm not sure you understand what I'm trying to say here. I agree that Newgrounds has a great system. But we're not talking about the current system, we're talking about the new system that's coming into place. And yes, the new system sounds great too, but there's this problem that I'm worried about.

Yes, I suppose we're not really in danger of running out of things to vote on because of all the new submissions coming in every day. But not everyone operates like you or uses Newgrounds the way you do. Maybe they don't want to play or watch the new stuff on any given day for whatever reason. Maybe they want to be credited for what they have rated because they don't rate or play that much stuff. If voting for no experience means you'll never get experience for that submission, that's incentive to not vote, which we don't want.

Although since I suppose the cap is important, there may be ways to solve this and keep the cap. Two more solutions I thought of. The system could automatically backlog the experience you'd get for voting so that if you vote for a bunch of stuff on one day you'll get experience for many days to come, even if you're inactive. It's kind of similar to having no cap but it keeps spammers from just immediately shooting up to a high level. Perhaps the better solution would be to have the submissions remember if you voted for them without getting XP so you can check in later to claim the XP.

At 1/12/15 10:58 AM, Little-Rena wrote: Underdog is an award for a movie/game that didn't stand out. Low score vs Most favourites?
I also assume this doesn't change the current blam/protect system?

Yeah !!!

But... I'll miss the Pico heads.

I've been meaning to give feedback on more content. Hopefully this will help me develop good habits.

All existing score data will be backed up but no longer used. Review scores will become the new existing score data.

Whoh, this is gonna set the audio portal on fire, they have been asking for this for like 10 years. Though I do wonder what the purpose of votes are at all if reviews are what matter.

Thumbs up though. Sounds good to me.

At 1/12/15 09:27 AM, TomFulp wrote: The new voting system will be universal for all Portals (games, movies, audio, art).
You will gain 2 XP for each vote, with a max of 10 XP daily.
XP is logged instantly, no more five vote minimum requirement.
Let me know your thoughts on this plan!

For wanting to keep my current level icon this wouldn't be good for me since I use the needing to vote 5 times to be able to still vote on some stuff but not have the experience from doing so since I avoid ever hitting 5. With this change it would mean even voting once would give some experience which would end up eventually getting rid of the best level icon available that wouldn't take years of constant voting to get, which would be kind of irritating since been trying to keep it for as long as possible.

Something I think I forgot to mention: I think having Underdog as high score vs low views would make sense, since something with few views didn't get very noticed but the few who did notice it really appreciated it, and getting Underdog would then put that submission in a place with the other portal awards where it would get additional exposure, which should probably be the purpose of Underdog imo.

Finally!
So stoked!!

Not sure if it's been addressed yet, but are you going to do anything about users who make a bunch of alt accounts to abuse the voting system to take down stuff they don't like?

http://richard.newgrounds.com/reviews/
He admits to doing exactly that in his recent movie reviews, for example.

I think it should be a perma-bannable offense.