Anyone got links to content with these reviews? It would be nice if I could look over them to make sure this isn't just some act of trolling.

@Phobotech

There are websites I used to frequent which aren't worthy of a "shout out". Many of them long dead. Some of them still around. I'm sure most people who've been around the Internet a while can say the same. So it's really nothing against you. I'm sorry if you took it personally.

It's like how IRL sometimes you cut ties because you got in with a bad group or maybe something as simple as cutting ties with ex-girlfriends and those associated with them. It happens. Same thing but online.

At 8/14/14 12:53 AM, NuclearInfected wrote: Anyone got links to content with these reviews? It would be nice if I could look over them to make sure this isn't just some act of trolling.

3rd page in the review section (at this moment anyway)
There's more but I forgot where they were. I didn't keep a catalogue.

Here's an image of the most recent ones though:

At 8/13/14 04:49 PM, Damien wrote: Okay, so the title wasn't very accurate.

So I've been seeing more and more young users leaving comments like "This is not suitable for this website, please remove it" or things like "Please change the rating this is not appropriate".

Where is all this stuff coming from? I'm not just talking about my content. I've seen it everywhere.

I get that we're trying to be less of an adult website, and these reviews don't really have a big impact.
But it just bothers me how there seems to be this "standard" for a "clean" internet. Everything that slightly crosses the line, there's someone out there that gets "triggered" by it, and has to voice his complaint.

The internet is turning into a bunch of softies man.

It's simple, don't watch mature crap if you're a kid. And if there is something rated E but isn't suitable, flag that crap. Don't leave a review saying "change the rating, this is inappropriate", cause no one gives a sh*t about it.

At 8/13/14 10:07 PM, NeonSpider wrote: What would kids (prior to highschool age) actually need the Internet for?

The Internet is for everyone, and for all of my cynicism stemming from how people behave online, it's still a valuable learning tool. I used to be given little Dorling Kindersley books on Ancient Greece or Rome and I loved them because of how they supplemented what I learned in school, but there was comparatively little there. To add to that, it's not like every Brit can walk into their local library to grab any book they want, they're struggling due to a lack of support and so the selection is typically very small outside the cities. The nature of school and the topics they have to cover means that a student of any age will not always be interested. As a kid I would've loved having some time on the Internet, even if it's just to read Wikipedia about something I am interested in, not something the (usually conservatively-minded) exam board officials set. Some of it would've gone way over my head - which still happens anyway even when I'm 24 - but I think children tend to have a thrill for any kind of learning. The Internet satisfies that, and that's without even getting into how it's an unavoidable part of so many social lives. I think the idea that the Internet is an all-adult, all-male zone where everyone can be edgy just because is a bit of an anachronism. I don't think it's a question of far-right Americans, the Internet is worldly, commercial, and - at the risk of using the sort of marketing talk Microsoft or Apple might use - a thing with which to discover new things.

As for protection and the thread in general, there's not much I can say but to do your bit. I don't think there's much to be taken from isolated review comments; in fact, I'm sure they've been around for years, before people could point to Tumblr and "triggers" and all that. Do your bit with the rating confidently and you can do little more. I also doubt that that many of them are made by children. That wasn't the first thing we thought of writing, when my friends and I first started using Newgrounds when we were 12. We thought it was hilarious to kill Pokemon and annoying celebrities in mediocre Flash games. We were children. Yes, the Internet may be comparatively "sanitised" now (in good ways as well as bad), but another important aspect about kids to keep in mind is that they're cheeky, they like breaking the rules. I could believe the comments were being left by older people, at least some of the time.

At 8/14/14 02:06 AM, NuScarab wrote:

We'll just have to disagree then. Because, IMO, kids don't belong on the Internet. Instead of pandering and fixing things to make them "kid-safe" remove kids from the equation entirely. Problem solved.

For a child's level, enough can be learned from encyclopedias and books more geared to their age ranges and so forth. I don't want them on the Internet. I wasn't on the Internet at those ages. I don't think they should be either.

Actually it'd be great if all the "Facebook people" would leave too. That is, the people who otherwise wouldn't be caught dead using computers except after Facebook came along they're glued to that all the time. Smartphone Internet users too.

I prefer the days when you actually had to know a bit about computers before you could even access the Internet at all. Sadly those days are over.

At 8/14/14 02:33 AM, NeonSpider wrote: We'll just have to disagree then. Because, IMO, kids don't belong on the Internet. Instead of pandering and fixing things to make them "kid-safe" remove kids from the equation entirely. Problem solved.

For a child's level, enough can be learned from encyclopedias and books more geared to their age ranges and so forth. I don't want them on the Internet. I wasn't on the Internet at those ages. I don't think they should be either.

Actually it'd be great if all the "Facebook people" would leave too. That is, the people who otherwise wouldn't be caught dead using computers except after Facebook came along they're glued to that all the time. Smartphone Internet users too.

I prefer the days when you actually had to know a bit about computers before you could even access the Internet at all. Sadly those days are over.

Fair enough about agreeing to disagree regarding the kids (though I don't really think any content needs to be made "kid-safe"), but I don't understand this point about "Facebook people". Talking wholly about stereotypes, I'd honestly take a "Facebook person" over, say, a "4chan person"... or even a "Newgrounds person" for that matter.

I study from home, which has its advantages. The big disadvantage of course is it being much harder to meet new people, people who share your interests on a more intellectual level. I'm not on Facebook any more, but Twitter has been a big help in this regard. A good chunk of the people I've met and chatted to don't seem like typical "Internet people" in the slightest, going by that early-mid 2000s definition. They've saved me a fair bit of grief even!

Wow, what the fuck has this world come to, man.

Don't worry about it, though-- I'm sure they'll come to their senses when they're older, or they won't and they'll end up crazy.

At 8/14/14 08:45 AM, WahyahRanger wrote: And oh, this thread isn't even about the whole site in general, it's in your own interest because you're stupid.

Am I not allowed to address an issue that is affecting me? Should onlyworry about others? Is that what you are saying? What about people like Spazkid? Talented artist that has moved away from Newgrounds for similar reasons. Newgrounds is getting rid of a specific user base that help build this site. So yes this is in my own interest as a user and not just as a "content" creator.

Newgrounds being conflicting as always. Shocker.

At 8/14/14 11:10 AM, Damien wrote: What about people like Spazkid? Talented artist that has moved away from Newgrounds for similar reasons. Newgrounds is getting rid of a specific user base that help build this site.

I don't follow the portals (and I don't know who Spazkid is) but I'm still interested to hear about how they've done this. When you say this, you go from isolated comments which don't really mean much to the staff re-branding the site... which is something I haven't really observed myself by lurking and not really having an interest in Flash. At some point, it would seem appropriate to flag a staff person's attention to this thread if you feel this is so.

At 8/14/14 11:27 AM, WahyahRanger wrote:

At 8/14/14 11:10 AM, Damien wrote: Am I not allowed to address an issue that is affecting me? Should only worry about others? Is that what you are saying? What about people like Spazkid? Talented artist that has moved away from Newgrounds for similar reasons. Newgrounds is getting rid of a specific user base that help build this site.

I think users like that moved to Youtube because they actually get money off of it, but that's just me.

Basically this. Seeing as that is what that matters now. I remember when people just did this stuff for fun but now those days are dead and gone.

As for the original question those kids need to learn the history of this site. Newgrounds was made because of what they are bitching about. It was what attracted me to the site when I was 14. It dared to go where other sites wouldn't. Censoring NG to make it "kid friendly" Is the equal of plague clogging up arteries to the heart.

At 8/14/14 11:27 AM, WahyahRanger wrote: I think users like that moved to Youtube because they actually get money off of it, but that's just me.

Last I checked adult content wasn't allowed on youtube. And I wasn't talking about people like Oney or whatever. Talking about people like Spazkid.

Like I said before, is there really any proof showing that the people making those comments are all children? The mindset in those comments is the last thing I'd imagine most children of the Internet-accessing age having, even today. I don't count typing all in lower case and with multiple exclamation or question marks like this!!! as proof, my father's in his late fifties and he writes like that on the rare occasions he's posting something online, outside of a work-orientated e-mail.

The comments are continuous with the complaints Tom used to get in the era when his audience was almost entirely university students, some of which he used to have displayed (might still do, idk). So many of them had adult-sounding "your parents would be very disappointed" overtones; the one I remember him showing distinctly being from a child was a "this game sucks, it's too hard!" one (followed by his father apologising).

It's a tricky position for Newgrounds really, because by its very nature it attracts children. Games, violence, nudity are all still here regardless of any "cleaning up", I can see a lot of children just entering their teens being into all of that, me and my friends certainly were. Like I also said earlier, I'm unaware of any extensive moves on the part of the staff, you just have to be strong with your rating and hope the parents are strong with their protection.

I think Newgrounds is too hard on children sometimes... which is clearly strange when it has to have some gearing towards children and some childishness in its content (I'm going to have to be debated with hard before I really take on the "it's an intelligent creative enterprise, honest!" line).

At 8/14/14 01:23 PM, NuScarab wrote: Like I said before, is there really any proof showing that the people making those comments are all children? The mindset in those comments is the last thing I'd imagine most children of the Internet-accessing age having, even today. I don't count typing all in lower case and with multiple exclamation or question marks like this!!! as proof, my father's in his late fifties and he writes like that on the rare occasions he's posting something online, outside of a work-orientated e-mail.

The comments are continuous with the complaints Tom used to get in the era when his audience was almost entirely university students, some of which he used to have displayed (might still do, idk). So many of them had adult-sounding "your parents would be very disappointed" overtones; the one I remember him showing distinctly being from a child was a "this game sucks, it's too hard!" one (followed by his father apologising).

It's a tricky position for Newgrounds really, because by its very nature it attracts children. Games, violence, nudity are all still here regardless of any "cleaning up", I can see a lot of children just entering their teens being into all of that, me and my friends certainly were. Like I also said earlier, I'm unaware of any extensive moves on the part of the staff, you just have to be strong with your rating and hope the parents are strong with their protection.

I think Newgrounds is too hard on children sometimes... which is clearly strange when it has to have some gearing towards children and some childishness in its content (I'm going to have to be debated with hard before I really take on the "it's an intelligent creative enterprise, honest!" line).

Well these is one little problem here. Newgrounds is for Teens and older and it is written in the TOS when you sign up to be a member. So the fact of the matter is even though it may "attract" kids the site is not for kids. So if they come to this site watch something and get offended that is their fault not Newgrounds.

It is the same kind of BS I see coming from a lot of parents talking about how they need to do something about things that are perfectly Ok just because their children many of times who are the offenders watch something they shouldn't and get scared by it.

It is just another BS excuse to have other people do their jobs as parents. With ratings and warnings ok that is what the sites and TV shoes on have to do. However, that is all the people who are making these shows/sites have to do. It isn't their fault that kids who aren't suppose to be there or watch something they shouldn't have do it, and they should be made to change stuff because of it.

We have lost way too many good things because parents don't want to do their jobs and blame the people who make the stuff and I would be really ticked off if something like this happened to NG.

At 8/13/14 05:15 PM, NeonSpider wrote: Pretty much right-wing religious bullshit, in a nutshell. Anything which isn't appropriate for a 5 year old apparently shouldn't exist at all, according to them. Seriously.

They literally want to control everything. Hence why they always try to get religious bullshit laws passed or mixed in with politics and so forth.

So they could as much be some kid as they are some 50 or 60 year old fuddy duddy. That's what you get when a good amount of the nation is right-wing fundamentalists.

They're part of what holds the nation back so much (in education, human rights, etc...) vs. the rest of the civilized world.

lol hardly Right wing's fault its all the Lefts fault with this Touchy feely shit where they think everyone is equal when in reality your not. they're the ones holding back the country.

At 8/14/14 03:13 PM, LittleWashu wrote: Well these is one little problem here. Newgrounds is for Teens and older and it is written in the TOS when you sign up to be a member. So the fact of the matter is even though it may "attract" kids the site is not for kids. So if they come to this site watch something and get offended that is their fault not Newgrounds.

It is the same kind of BS I see coming from a lot of parents talking about how they need to do something about things that are perfectly Ok just because their children many of times who are the offenders watch something they shouldn't and get scared by it.

It is just another BS excuse to have other people do their jobs as parents. With ratings and warnings ok that is what the sites and TV shoes on have to do. However, that is all the people who are making these shows/sites have to do. It isn't their fault that kids who aren't suppose to be there or watch something they shouldn't have do it, and they should be made to change stuff because of it.

We have lost way too many good things because parents don't want to do their jobs and blame the people who make the stuff and I would be really ticked off if something like this happened to NG.

The ToS will protect the site itself, and I agree that it's a parents' job to do what they can while the creators attach suitable ratings, because that's all they can do. I never said otherwise in any of my posts here, really!

My comments about attracting kids are really more aimed at the "grr, them kids!" sentiment that I see here and in so many other threads over the years. I think it's reasonable for them to want to come to Newgrounds, like I did. I wouldn't advocate for it necessarily because the rules are set, but I wouldn't lay much of the "blame" (I'm still not sure what we're really blaming them for here) on the children directly. I'm still not convinced that those messages are wholly written by children, and I think it's more common than not for parents to act when necessary and provide their own protection. Again I speak from experience, as this is what my parents did (briefly). Maybe I'm non-typical, but well, I can't really speak otherwise.

Honestly, I'd think a bigger incentive to change would be financial backing. I remember when they introduced an "English only" rule to the BBS despite there being complete, seemingly cordial, threads in the Clubs forum written in foreign languages; I think the incentive was that a foreign sponsor could see something bad (that the predominantly English-speaking mods wouldn't pick up on) and pull out.

I think pro wrestling is a good analogy, as it shares the same sort of violent and sexual content of Newgrounds along with a solid young fanbase. So many older wrestling fans seem to harp on about how mainstream promotions sacrifice their "best bits" (women exposing themselves, grown men cutting themselves deeply for our entertainment) for "them kids!!"; surely, if you want to "blame" anyone, you'd blame huge globally-reaching companies like Mattel, who offer big chunks of money in order to circulate merchandise. If Mattel or any of its many, many investors see something "dodgy" or contrary to their corporate image, they can pull out that money and that's bad. Newgrounds isn't a massive corporate entity like either WWE or Mattel, but it's still a business, all about money, and always has been, like every other "independent" venture into the arts in the 21st century. Like in a particularly bitter case, I'm thinking back to when no one contributed to a Kickstarter they were backing, so they left a sarcastic "thanks for the support guys" message at the top of the page.

In short, I'm not sure if I can really think of many things that we "lost" due to children, and I'm still lost as to where Newgrounds' targeting of a "new audience" is. Things seem reasonably stable to me: there's certainly no shortage of nudity looking into the art portal, and I see all sorts of gory stuff elsewhere. Again I'l admit to not really having an interest in Flash or whatever, I'd need to be filled in on the actualities.

At 8/14/14 03:21 PM, Tony-DarkGrave wrote: lol hardly Right wing's fault its all the Lefts fault with this Touchy feely shit where they think everyone is equal when in reality your not. they're the ones holding back the country.

Okay then you tell me who is more likely to censor things. Right-wing religious person who wants anything which his/her religion disapproves of censored for everyone? Or left-wing person?

Also don't fall into the trap that left-wing = Democrat party. They're more centrist than leftist.

At 8/14/14 08:23 PM, Sensationalism wrote: The rating should match the content though. It'd be like going to see a PG movie that is actually an R movie, but labeled wrong. Totally not cool when younger kiddos are involved.

If I'm correct, I believe there exist PG-rated movies that contain full frontal nudity. Moral of the story is don't let a ratings system parent your kids. Pre-screen content yourself first. Yes if it means watching a movie twice (once to screen it and once with your kids) then you do so.

Ditto with video games and everything else. Parents really need to learn to take the time to parent and stop taking shortcuts.

That is why I spend ninety percent of my time on hard core porn sites, just to avoid the softies.