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Did Cenk do anything wrong?

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StCyril
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Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2017-12-29 10:34:52 Reply

This is an interesting time we live in where I am having to defend Cenk Uygar.
This is a guy who wrote a whole piece denouncing the Armenian Genocide, named his organization the Young Turks, and has since been an apologist for them and their actions when in power. This is not a credible individual as anyone who denies genocide shouldn't be taken seriously as a media outlet.
Yet exclusively in the case of what he's being accused of, he's done nothing wrong.
The Gateway Pundit, a right-wing news source posted what amounts to a political attack against the man for comments he made almost 20 years ago. Don't get me wrong, what he said was edgy and in some cases inappropriate, but was anyone harmed by what he said?
Cenk didn't help his case when he claimed that he said these things because he was a Republican at the time, which is a bs excuse. He was young, stupid, and... a bit of a horn dog at the time.
He later issued an apology for it and I recommend watching it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Mh47xjCqqI
The apology is perfect. That's exactly what any human being should say. There is nothing wrong with it. If you can't accept that apology, then there is something wrong with YOU. If you can't accept it, likely you're part of the extremist cult of social justice looking to grasp moral advantage in what will become a purity inquisition... and the so-called Justice Democrats will suffer for it.

His resignation over an 18 year old post is ridiculous. He did something stupid when he was younger, who hasn't? He took responsibility, apologized for it and has grown since then. He openly disavows what he said back then, he regrets it, and there really shouldn't be any more to it. This is a non-issue.

The response from the Justice Democrats is laughable at best:
https://twitter.com/justicedems/status/944356205476106240?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.huffingtonpost.com%2Fentry%2Fjustice-democrats-ousts-cenk-uygur_us_5a3eb4d1e4b025f99e178181

This speaks to a much larger problem of radical purity testing on the left. When someone does something like what he did, realizes he did something wrong, takes full responsibility and apologizes for it, an adult accepts that apology and moves on. It never comes up again.

The people putting Cenk through said purity test are not perfect. I guarentee you that if we dig through their histories, we'd find some pretty bad stuff there too.


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Gario
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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2017-12-29 12:28:16 Reply

He did wrong, but he did it 18 years ago, apologized and moved on (not to mention he's changed party affiliation and virtually all of his political positions since then, and removed the comment because he thought it was awful years ago). It wasn't illegal nor was it harassment, so it's not exactly something that should have long lasting rammifications, either. Definitely caused a ruckus, though - pretty pathetic for the organization he founded to kick him out over it. His cofounder (Kyle ... er, the guy from Secular Talk) left the organization over it, to boot - not going to lie, this hurts JD quite a bit.

Pretty much a centrist Democrat hatchet job, and it did it's job. I'm disappointed that there was no contingency for something like this in their organization, but whatever - what's done is done. I'm not against hard political tests to be a part of a party (e.g. you HAVE to be for/against something to be called a Democrat/Republican), and I disagree that's what's at play here - it's purely people making a decision based on the idea that the optics would give the association a worse chance come the primaries. I think they're 100% wrong and that this snubs progressives (which is JD's target audience), but whatever.


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super old news, plus more facts about the Armenian Genocide have come to light, plus if your Turkish and you still got family in Turkey and you've got any sort of light on you you kind of have to in fear for your family's safety.

but who cares its Cenk Uygur, and its not like the Justice Democrats are going to get any vetted seats with the big parties anyways, no one cares about their touchy feely bullshit or social justice and the identity politics that come with them.


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Sause
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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2017-12-29 18:02:43 Reply

I’m really happy this #MeToo thing started.

...

What, you want more? That’s all I got.

SolidPantsSnake
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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2017-12-31 07:10:34 Reply

Cenk used to be an even bigger prick?


I'm the guy with the funny name.

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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2017-12-31 10:09:47 Reply

Now what shit culture produced an awful language that came up with the name Cenk!

Only the greatest culture to produce the mightiest and renowned empire in all the western hemisphere

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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2017-12-31 18:28:11 Reply

At 12/29/17 12:51 PM, Tony-DarkGrave wrote: and its not like the Justice Democrats are going to get any vetted seats with the big parties anyways

that's what was said about the alt-right and...

At 12/29/17 06:02 PM, Sause wrote: I’m really happy this #MeToo thing started.

...

What, you want more? That’s all I got.

have you ever had more to offer than 1-liners?

At 12/31/17 07:10 AM, SolidPantsSnake wrote: Cenk used to be an even bigger prick?

he's a cenk-off.

Sause
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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2017-12-31 20:09:17 Reply

At 12/31/17 06:28 PM, S3C wrote:
At 12/29/17 06:02 PM, Sause wrote: I’m really happy this #MeToo thing started.

...

What, you want more? That’s all I got.
have you ever had more to offer than 1-liners?

Whats wrong with one-lined responses?

ADR3-N
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@Gario and @Tony-DarkGrave covered practically everything of value I could have added to this discussion. I will say, OP, you're right, Cenk Uygur is generally not worth paying attention to. Has almost always struck me as out-of-touch and backward-thinking. even when I was a progressive lefty. Lately, the various character smears have done their job and brought others to my side of the table but for the precisely wrong reasons. He denied the Armenian genocide over a decade ago, apologized later, and changed his views.

Now, people are saying he's a misogynist on top of that old news. Who cares, really? He may not be the kinda guy I want around my daughter, but if misogyny was something people really cared about, Bill Clinton never would have made it through the primaries. Or Trump, for that matter. People only bring up these tertiary issues when they're too brain dead to attack the political positions of their opponents efficiently.

The worst part is, instead of just owning up to his mistakes, Cenk blames his conservative past. It's kinda hard to watch.

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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-01 05:46:14 Reply

At 12/31/17 08:09 PM, Sause wrote:
At 12/31/17 06:28 PM, S3C wrote:
At 12/29/17 06:02 PM, Sause wrote: I’m really happy this #MeToo thing started.

...

What, you want more? That’s all I got.
have you ever had more to offer than 1-liners?
Whats wrong with one-lined responses?

nothing

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Well its only ironic though considering they have offended the feminist god. But yes, its ridiculous and he's not guilty in anyway. The fun thing is the "Justice Democrats" that he and Kyle Kulinski founded was a way to fight the corporate media only to be taken over by SJWs, well Kyle resigned after he had to choose between either to pretend he doesn't know Cenk in this case scenario i think or that he'd be fired.

So the good thing is they have to aknowledge that SJW hurts both sides if one is to debate about issues and ideas, if they ever plan on doing that which i recommend. Getting offended over everything is what is killing actual issues of discussion that are legit reasons to debate on (and i mean actual issues that actually have relevance not hysterical ones like "Cultural appropriation" which is not stealing its sharing, its only stealing if you dont give credit on a historical level, like thats a nonsensical dumb issue to mention a few, in comparison to for example actual racism, ghettos, societal problems).

So i think this is at best a wake up call... If they grab onto it. Which they probably will not

Lazy-Lampshade
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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-01 06:58:35 Reply

I think whether or not you did something wrong is somewhat framed by the morality you're spouting at the time. I'm not advocating for relativistism, I just think hypocrisy matters-- and if Cenk was still and edgy, darkly humored, jackass that advocated for people to act in the way he used to, then it would be more fine than it is now for him.

He's changed considerably from when he wrote that initial post, however, and by the standards of the morality he spouts now, he did do something wrong and should be held to his own standards in regards to assessing his past actions.

To me the question of whether he did something wrong back then, whether he should be held to the fire as if he just said those things currently, and whether or not he should have resigned over those comments are three different questions.

Did he do something wrong back then?
Eh, by the company he keeps-- yeah. That's really all that matters. I don't really care, but it's not really shitlord sensibilities he's trying to pander to.
Should he be held to his current morality for who he was back then?
Not really, but he should be aware of how his past is going to color him to his contemporary allies, and given the people he's gotten in bed with, it's probably going to be unforgivable because:
(Should he have resigned?)
They're a new name in politics and it's going to be hard for them to push their agenda if they have someone heading them that has such a glaring vulnerability. That being said, they very well may just be true believers that might have cast him out despite this bit of context... and as for that... I mean ... ideologues gonna ideologue.

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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-01 08:50:28 Reply

At 12/31/17 06:28 PM, S3C wrote: that's what was said about the alt-right and...

lol the Alt-Right, sure bud whatever you say.


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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-01 16:15:47 Reply

No one should be pissed over this we all said dumb shit when we were younger and we change over time. I'm no fan of Cenk and disagree with the things the Young Turks say but we should judge him by what he is doing and saying now and not years ago. Honestly if we held everyone to that standard we would all hate each other for what we did or said many years ago. But maybe that's just me and none of us ever do regrettable in our past and are all perfect little snowflakes that can do no evil but certainly see it in others no matter how small or dumb and virtue signal how superior we are to them. TL;DR Cenk did nothing wrong

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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-01 17:25:17 Reply

At 1/1/18 08:50 AM, Tony-DarkGrave wrote:
At 12/31/17 06:28 PM, S3C wrote: that's what was said about the alt-right and...
lol the Alt-Right, sure bud whatever you say.

whatever I say.

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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-02 12:08:44 Reply

At 12/31/17 06:28 PM, S3C wrote:
At 12/29/17 12:51 PM, Tony-DarkGrave wrote: and its not like the Justice Democrats are going to get any vetted seats with the big parties anyways
that's what was said about the alt-right and...

That was when the alt-right was just neo Nazis and white supremacist.
Now the alt right has expanded to include moderates on both sides,
Classic liberals,
Skeptics,
Mainstream Republicans,
Liberal professors who stand up to the extreme progressive narrative,
Bernie Supporters,
Everyone accused of sexual misconduct,

Essentially, any one who doesn't fit the radical left narrative is alt right now.


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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-02 15:37:17 Reply

At 12/31/17 08:58 PM, ADR3-N wrote:
The worst part is, instead of just owning up to his mistakes, Cenk blames his conservative past. It's kinda hard to watch.

Legit question: what does "owning up" to his mistakes look? Other than acknowledging that almost two decades ago he held those opinions and explicitly stating that those opinions were wrong, what else would you have to do?

I can't think of anything else, so I'm wondering what you wanted him to do, there. :/


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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-02 20:19:47 Reply

At 1/2/18 12:08 PM, StCyril wrote:
At 12/31/17 06:28 PM, S3C wrote:
At 12/29/17 12:51 PM, Tony-DarkGrave wrote: and its not like the Justice Democrats are going to get any vetted seats with the big parties anyways
that's what was said about the alt-right and...
That was when the alt-right was just neo Nazis and white supremacist.
Now the alt right has expanded to include moderates on both sides,
Classic liberals,
Skeptics,
Mainstream Republicans,
Liberal professors who stand up to the extreme progressive narrative,
Bernie Supporters,
Everyone accused of sexual misconduct,

Essentially, any one who doesn't fit the radical left narrative is alt right now.

don't rebrand the alt-right with your own definition so that you can deny the reality of who is/was in Trump's administration, son.

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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-02 20:23:06 Reply

At 1/2/18 03:37 PM, Gario wrote:
At 12/31/17 08:58 PM, ADR3-N wrote:
The worst part is, instead of just owning up to his mistakes, Cenk blames his conservative past. It's kinda hard to watch.
Legit question: what does "owning up" to his mistakes look? Other than acknowledging that almost two decades ago he held those opinions and explicitly stating that those opinions were wrong, what else would you have to do?

I can't think of anything else, so I'm wondering what you wanted him to do, there. :/

Cenk basically used this apology as an opportunity to grease the divisive anti-right platform he's on...

summary: "look I'm sorry for the stupid things I said when I was young- back then I was a conservative with warped views, so I'm sure you can understand. I've changed, have become a liberal and much better now"

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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-02 21:35:39 Reply

At 1/2/18 03:37 PM, Gario wrote: Legit question: what does "owning up" to his mistakes look? Other than acknowledging that almost two decades ago he held those opinions and explicitly stating that those opinions were wrong, what else would you have to do?

I can't think of anything else, so I'm wondering what you wanted him to do, there. :/

Honestly, something more than blaming his mistakes on the crowd he used to run with. It's not that hard. All you have to do is say, "Yeah, I was wrong, and I don't believe that anymore." Simple.

At 1/2/18 08:23 PM, S3C wrote: Cenk basically used this apology as an opportunity to grease the divisive anti-right platform he's on...

summary: "look I'm sorry for the stupid things I said when I was young- back then I was a conservative with warped views, so I'm sure you can understand. I've changed, have become a liberal and much better now"

This. Besides being a really lame excuse for his past and present douchebaggery, it makes him read like a spineless jellyfish towing the party line to keep his head above water -- a bandwagoner. So far, I haven't really seen evidence to the contrary.

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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-03 00:49:59 Reply

Alright, so y'all are offended that in blaming his conservative views in the past he is by extention blaming conservatives in general (and by extension, is calling you out if you're conservative). Y'all know he's a progressive (to the point of being even anti-centrist Democrat) and that message isn't inconsistent to what he's said about conservatives for years, right? Man, if I went online and complained every time Tomi Lahren or Ann Coulter said mean things about liberals...

Eh, whatever - I'm not the target of this slight so I have no real place to stand on this, I s'pose. You guys do you, eh?


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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-03 01:46:25 Reply

At 1/3/18 12:49 AM, Gario wrote: Alright, so y'all are offended that in blaming his conservative views in the past he is by extention blaming conservatives in general (and by extension, is calling you out if you're conservative). Y'all know he's a progressive (to the point of being even anti-centrist Democrat) and that message isn't inconsistent to what he's said about conservatives for years, right? Man, if I went online and complained every time Tomi Lahren or Ann Coulter said mean things about liberals...

Eh, whatever - I'm not the target of this slight so I have no real place to stand on this, I s'pose. You guys do you, eh?

lol I'm not offended in the slightest.

I follow TYT so I know his message was consistent with their premise. That is precisely the problem here, IMO, when you're going to bring other innocent (generally speaking) groups into a personal apology, it instantly becomes insincere.

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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-03 08:18:44 Reply

At 1/2/18 09:35 PM, ADR3-N wrote: Honestly, something more than blaming his mistakes on the crowd he used to run with. It's not that hard. All you have to do is say, "Yeah, I was wrong, and I don't believe that anymore." Simple.

yup yup as long as he acknowledges his mistake and admits it wrong, he's right because the last time I checked people were allowed to change their views, its just the ones that are hypocritical about defending they're stance on their previous views and getting all defensive about it.

This. Besides being a really lame excuse for his past and present douchebaggery, it makes him read like a spineless jellyfish towing the party line to keep his head above water -- a bandwagoner. So far, I haven't really seen evidence to the contrary.

yet he says he's against the DNC and its " Centrist Corporate Democratic" overlords holding back his "progression" and made his own little Party and PAC which hasn't done anything, lol!


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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-03 12:16:35 Reply

At 1/2/18 08:19 PM, S3C wrote: don't rebrand the alt-right with your own definition so that you can deny the reality of who is/was in Trump's administration, son.

Oh the irony... I'm not. My post was a flippant jab at a growing us vs. them mindset on the left where everyone who disagrees with a narrow interpretation of a narrative is lumped in with the alt right. You'd have to be blind to have not seen it.


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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-03 17:23:08 Reply

I don't agree with what he wrote 18 years ago, but it's the kind of foolishness that I'd expect a young man to occasionally say. People start out dumb as rocks, but they live and learn. I do enjoy the irony of Cenk being taken down by the same leftist religiosity that he preached for so long, though. I don't feel a need to particularly defend him when he's being destroyed by his own ideology.

This particular branch of leftism has a real problem with cannibalistic "purity testing", as you mentioned. The somewhat effective people like Cenk get destroyed by those who know nothing and have done nothing, and you end up with a movement full of useless people. Even ignoring this dredging up of past mistakes, effective people will occasionally make mistakes and create controversy. That's not to say that all leftism is doomed to fail, but those which adopt self-destructive ideas like identity politics and strict egalitarianism have signed a deal with the devil, and are at a severe long-term disadvantage.

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Response to Did Cenk do anything wrong? 2018-01-03 17:24:31 Reply

At 1/3/18 12:16 PM, StCyril wrote: Oh the irony... I'm not. My post was a flippant jab at a growing us vs. them mindset on the left where everyone who disagrees with a narrow interpretation of a narrative is lumped in with the alt right. You'd have to be blind to have not seen it.

my bad (NewGrounds Braille is still in beta)