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Voting System Overhaul Proposal

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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:08:15


That will be cool !!
I was forced to vote all 5 once I open My internet !!
Coz my net sucks ! This plan is better !
And The vote equals stars , this will stop people who zero bomb a submission !

BUT WAIT , this means No more UNDERDOG Trophy


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:08:43


Be able to edit reviews and double XP on weekends? Where do I sign?


At 1/12/15 10:03 AM, TomFulp wrote: I've been conflicted on this one for years and it is one of the concerns that has held up progress on a change. Part of it comes down to how much we let nostalgia hold us back, when NG needs to also bring in new users, to whom the vote bar has no relevance and can even be a detriment. We're walking a fine line between making the site appealing to new users and making the site not "compete" with the content on the page, while also making oldschool fans feel at home and feel like this is still Newgrounds.

Well, you could always develop a vote bar that can be toggled on and off in the user options that is designed in the 5 star format, but implements the faces of Pico in it for more nostalgic members.

Just ignore me if my ideas are silly.


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At 1/12/15 09:58 AM, TomFulp wrote: I guess another thought behind it is that it would "feel" special; knowing you have a limited window to get more XP would make it more compelling / exciting to take advantage of the window, vs having the same window 365 days per year.

If that's what you're going for, why not also make it feel a bit more personal? Then it certainly would feel special to each user.

I've got a suggestion that would do that and also solve the international user problem:

1) The weekend period of 2x the cap is per-user instead of sitewide, and depends on the user's time zone.
2) For any given week, if the user changes their time zone on their profile, the current week's double XP period stays the same, only to change for the next week.
3) There must be a minimum of 5 days between double XP periods.

This guarantees that:

a) No user is left behind
b) It feels tailored to each user
c) There is no room for abuse

EDIT:

I realize there is also the case of the current user without any time zone information on their profile. A site-wide notice may appear informing them to update their profile, and will stay up until either dismissed or until the information is added. In the meantime, the timezone used is the timezone of the server. For future new user registrations, it's made a mandatory piece of information.

Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:15:52


Awesome, great job Tom!!
:U

Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:16:09


legit.

definitely a lot more user friendly than the current one.


lel

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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:20:07


YES YES YES YES, AND YES!

No complaints here. :D


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:22:16


At 1/12/15 10:08 AM, Sectus wrote: Well, you could always develop a vote bar that can be toggled on and off in the user options that is designed in the 5 star format, but implements the faces of Pico in it for more nostalgic members.

Keeping certain assets for the sake of nostalgia is a really poor idea. It drags progression down for no good reason whatsoever.


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:31:14


2xp per vote will definitely help me gain something at least. It may even allow people to watch the content more instead of just voting on five videos for xp! Good one Tom.

Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:31:51


At 1/12/15 10:22 AM, test-object wrote: Keeping certain assets for the sake of nostalgia is a really poor idea. It drags progression down for no good reason whatsoever.

Not if it is an option that is individual to each user, and by default is turned off.


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:35:51


At 1/12/15 10:31 AM, Sectus wrote:
At 1/12/15 10:22 AM, test-object wrote: Keeping certain assets for the sake of nostalgia is a really poor idea. It drags progression down for no good reason whatsoever.
Not if it is an option that is individual to each user, and by default is turned off.

Not to mention that we'd never end up seeing these bad boys in use!

Voting System Overhaul Proposal

Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:39:25


New voting system sounds nice! But what would happen to the thing with pico's faces depending on what you think of the content? would you get rid of that?


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:46:22


Fantastic! I love it!
I've been waiting for some big change in the voting system.


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:46:29


At 1/12/15 10:08 AM, DIWAKAR wrote: BUT WAIT , this means No more UNDERDOG Trophy

CRAP good point... Maybe underdog should be highest score vs lowest views? Or lowest score vs highest views?


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:55:27


At 1/12/15 10:08 AM, Sectus wrote: Well, you could always develop a vote bar that can be toggled on and off in the user options that is designed in the 5 star format, but implements the faces of Pico in it for more nostalgic members.

Just ignore me if my ideas are silly.

That has actually been considered. :)


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:58:36


At 1/12/15 10:46 AM, TomFulp wrote:
At 1/12/15 10:08 AM, DIWAKAR wrote: BUT WAIT , this means No more UNDERDOG Trophy
CRAP good point... Maybe underdog should be highest score vs lowest views? Or lowest score vs highest views?

I don't think views would be a good indicator, currently it's Low Score vs High Reviews, it should be a low score, since a high score generally nets a daily award except on busy days and to me, Underdog is an award for a movie/game that didn't stand out. Low score vs Most favourites?

I also assume this doesn't change the current blam/protect system?


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:58:55


The layout may be a bit confusing for some users. They may be under the impression that they need to write a review to deposit their experience. To fix this, you could only show the voting option when a user views a submission, and then after they vote a message would appear saying "Experience desposited! (+2XP) Would you like to leave a review to give feedback to the author?" along with the "Leave Review" button.

Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 10:59:16


At 1/12/15 10:25 AM, The-Eternal-Abyss wrote: do tell me this , tom... as it is right now the star system is a bit more accurate from the rating system, as you noticed , and that is because 0 and 5 bombing voters tend not to put the effort into reviewing flash , so with one rating system in place how do you think that will effect the ratings of a flash ?, I can foresee a terrible outcome .

in other words, the people out there who put the effort into reviewing and giving stars to flashes usually end up voting fairly, where as the ones who don't review tend to just care about the B/P and EXP

This is a good point and is scary... The "accurate" votes of reviewers could be drowned out by the votes of the general voting population. We could still have the option of only looking at the scores attached to reviews, if we wanted to come up with a dedicated "review score" stat. I THINK that would still be as accurate as the current review scores.


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 11:00:59


At 1/12/15 10:58 AM, Little-Rena wrote: I don't think views would be a good indicator, currently it's Low Score vs High Reviews, it should be a low score, since a high score generally nets a daily award except on busy days and to me, Underdog is an award for a movie/game that didn't stand out. Low score vs Most favourites?

I also assume this doesn't change the current blam/protect system?

Following up another reply I just made - we COULD base it on low overall score vs high score from people who wrote reviews. Could also consider score vs favorites.

Shouldn't impact the blam/protect system.


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 11:02:40


At 1/12/15 10:58 AM, Bit wrote: The layout may be a bit confusing for some users. They may be under the impression that they need to write a review to deposit their experience. To fix this, you could only show the voting option when a user views a submission, and then after they vote a message would appear saying "Experience desposited! (+2XP) Would you like to leave a review to give feedback to the author?" along with the "Leave Review" button.

That was something that came up - making you vote before the review option becomes available. This would be ok if we want to require voting to review something but over the years I've met a lot of artists who don't like to score things, so the option to review without voting seems favorable.

Maybe if the review text box mentions the review is optional? Also the XP bar will react to the click of the vote bar, so it should be clear when they vote that they have gained their XP.


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 11:02:46


At 1/12/15 09:27 AM, TomFulp wrote: The score that shows in your review is the same score as your vote, there is just one location on the page to enter you score.

You can hide your score or submit a review without a score (many people are anti-scoring).

Wait, so can you vote without the review or is that text field mandatory to submit your score? Might people be less likely to vote if they had to do 'OMG_ALL_THAT_EXTRAWORK!?'

Tho, it would persuade people to vote more fairly instead of just blamming anything that said sprite or madness or little pony or clock or gamegrump or whatever without even watching.

Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 11:03:36


At 1/12/15 11:02 AM, Pop-Tart wrote: Wait, so can you vote without the review or is that text field mandatory to submit your score? Might people be less likely to vote if they had to do 'OMG_ALL_THAT_EXTRAWORK!?'

Review is not mandatory (the text field should probably note that).


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Wait, this might have just been answered lol...

edit: dude you're quick


I like it, and I like not allowing more than one vote per content per user (I won't be able to spread 5's on my favourites every now and then ;-) ).

I'm not sure if I understood this one:

All existing score data will be backed up but no longer used. Review scores will become the new existing score data.

This means that all the scores of existing contents will change after the update?
EDIT: already answered, ignore this part

Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 11:14:03


Two things I feel like I've felt like NGs is lacking in the review department:

It would be nice for there to be a little more back-and-froth. I like to reply to reviews when someone has a question or a quality piece of feedback. It would be nice if we had the ability to have a bit of a discussion. There might need to be a limit or 2-3 replies, or else people would spam 100s of responses.

I think the more important feature missing is for co-author responses. In collabs, someone could say "I like ___'s part the best". I remember when I was in some of my first collabs, that meant the world to me but I couldn't reply to thank the person. In other instances (like for games), they may have a question directly for someone with a co-author credit.

I like the idea of merging the voting systems. I would just like to see reviewing further improved while we're at it.


GAH!

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My only concern is the "edit score" aspect of the proposal. Something just doesn't sit right with me about changing one's vote.

Aside from this, I'm all for the new changes.

Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 11:17:36


At 1/12/15 11:10 AM, lynn-ng wrote: I'm not sure if I understood this one:

All existing score data will be backed up but no longer used. Review scores will become the new existing score data.
This means that all the scores of existing contents will change after the update?

Yup this is one of the "scary" items... The review scores would become the new existing vote data, meaning a lot of submissions would only have a few existing votes - some would have none. We would plan to make a list of the "least voted on" content, so users can help bring everything up to a more reasonable level. One cool thing about logging one vote per item is that everyone can have personal access to everything they've voted on (could make finding old content easier if you didn't favorite it) and everyone can have stats on how many total items they've scored in each Portal.


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 11:20:57


At 1/12/15 11:14 AM, Noodle wrote: Two things I feel like I've felt like NGs is lacking in the review department:

It would be nice for there to be a little more back-and-froth. I like to reply to reviews when someone has a question or a quality piece of feedback. It would be nice if we had the ability to have a bit of a discussion. There might need to be a limit or 2-3 replies, or else people would spam 100s of responses.

I think the more important feature missing is for co-author responses. In collabs, someone could say "I like ___'s part the best". I remember when I was in some of my first collabs, that meant the world to me but I couldn't reply to thank the person. In other instances (like for games), they may have a question directly for someone with a co-author credit.

The co-author response has always been an intended feature that never arrived. Hoping we will tackle that one this year.

The back-and-forth option would definitely be nice. In retrospect I kinda wish reviews and blogs were built off the same system and both were set up better for back and forth discussion.


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 11:23:17


At 1/12/15 10:03 AM, TomFulp wrote:
At 1/12/15 09:54 AM, LDAF wrote: Just a little confused by what this means, exactly. Let's say a submission has a score of 3.0, but the reviews (currently) average out to 7.0. Would this mean that the new score for the submission is 7.0?
Yes, although everything would still be represented with a 5 star scale, so the score would visibly become 3.5 stars. One thing that has become painfully obvious in recent years is that our review scores are WAAAAAY more accurate than our voting scores.

I agree to that wholeheartedly, and even though I don't like changes, this one seems very legit.

Just one thought that crossed my mind: When 200 people vote, but only 20 of them leave a review with the vote, do I have to switch through numerous pages with empty text boxes to reach a real review?

I would suggest to put the votes with actual reviews always on top and the ones without any text behind them.


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Response to Voting System Overhaul Proposal 2015-01-12 11:23:18


At 1/12/15 11:20 AM, TomFulp wrote: The co-author response has always been an intended feature that never arrived. Hoping we will tackle that one this year.

Looking forward to it!!

The back-and-forth option would definitely be nice. In retrospect I kinda wish reviews and blogs were built off the same system and both were set up better for back and forth discussion.

I meant to mention that I wish this existed in blogs as well. It probably makes more sense to see that feature in blogs. But I would find it useful in both.


GAH!

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