At 12/15/12 01:02 AM, Lintire wrote: "Mr Lanza has said his brother was believed to suffer from a personality disorder and be 'somewhat autistic'"

It's official, autism needs to be banned.

At 12/15/12 12:20 AM, Halberd wrote: Gun restrictions really need to be lessened.

A teacher could have been equipped with an automatic rifle to combat this school shooter and it might have saved many lives.

Wow, ok. And that teacher could have gone psycho instead of her son. Or a child could have gotten ahold of that gun.
Statistics show that countries that ban guns completely, have close to none shootings.
It's easier to run from a knife than a gun.
Guys, nobody hunts to survive anymore, we don't need guns at all.

At 12/15/12 02:09 AM, xxxcreep wrote:

At 12/15/12 12:20 AM, Halberd wrote:

Guys, nobody hunts to survive anymore, we don't need guns at all.

No, but some people like to have guns.

Americans are supposed to be able to have something if they want it.

That's why drugs and prostitution should be legal.

At 12/15/12 02:09 AM, xxxcreep wrote: Statistics show that countries that ban guns completely, have close to none shootings.

That's cool let's all compare other normal countries to America

Wow I'm late to this thread, yeah heard about this earlier today.
It's all pretty sad.....those kids had were innocent.

For anyone arguing in favor guns after this incident, go fuck yourself. No, seriously.

LINK - (Published yesterday)

1 - America is an unusually violent country.

Kieran Healy, a sociologist at Duke University, made this graph of âEUoedeaths due to assaultâEU in the United States and other developed countries. We are a clear outlier.

As Healy writes, âEUoeThe most striking features of the data are (1) how much more violent the U.S. is than other OECD countries (except possibly Estonia and Mexico, not shown here), and (2) the degree of change-and recently, decline-there has been in the U.S. time series considered by itself.âEU

2 - More guns tend to mean more homicide.

The Harvard Injury Control Research Center assessed the literature on guns and homicide and found that thereâEUTMs substantial evidence that indicates more guns means more murders. This holds true whether youâEUTMre looking at different countries or different states. Citations here.

3 - States with stricter gun control laws have fewer deaths from gun-related violence.

Last year, economist Richard Florida dove deep into the correlations between gun deaths and other kinds of social indicators. Some of what he found was, perhaps, unexpected: Higher populations, more stress, more immigrants, and more mental illness were not correlated with more deaths from gun violence. But one thing he found was, perhaps, perfectly predictable: States with tighter gun control laws appear to have fewer gun-related deaths. The disclaimer here is that correlation is not causation. But correlations can be suggestive:

âEUoeThe map overlays the map of firearm deaths above with gun control restrictions by state,âEU explains Florida. âEUoeIt highlights states which have one of three gun control restrictions in place - assault weaponsâEUTM bans, trigger locks, or safe storage requirements. Firearm deaths are significantly lower in states with stricter gun control legislation. Though the sample sizes are small, we find substantial negative correlations between firearm deaths and states that ban assault weapons (-.45), require trigger locks (-.42), and mandate safe storage requirements for guns (-.48).âEU

Bolo if you want actually discuss things with adults who will shred your aguements go to the gun control thread.

At 12/15/12 03:34 AM, Bolo wrote: For anyone arguing in favor guns after this incident, go fuck yourself. No, seriously.

Oh really?

2 - More guns tend to mean more homicide.

Quite the opposite 2.5 Million crimes are stopped by legal residents with firearms and then their are the people like me with Concealed Carry. its the people who straw purchase firearms in large amounts for criminals thats the problem

3 - States with stricter gun control laws have fewer deaths from gun-related violence.

go to california in los angeles or the west side of Chicago for a week with a police scanner. they have uber strict gun control and thats has caused nothing but trouble for them. hell states in the Midwest (where I live) have the loosest gun laws and the least gun related deaths and violence in America ON AVERAGE. I wouldn't believe some bullshit statistic from some pussy behind a desk in the EU.

Map

full of shit turn california and Illionis and NY red then it would be much more realistic. otherwise that thing is just propaganda by the Pro-control crowd.

At 12/15/12 12:55 AM, kisame wrote:

At 12/15/12 12:46 AM, Sectus wrote: It is pretty sad that you can walk outside and get shot to death for no reason. I don't really know what is going wrong, but it definitely needs fixed to stop shit like this happening.

It's just a fact of life, my friend.

No, it isn't. I've been to a lot of countries in the world, a lot of big cities, and in almost all of them have never felt at risk of being gunned down at any moment. The exception? Living in Denver, Colorado, the only place I have ever actually witnessed a violent crime take place.

I know this isn't a debate about gun control, this is a terrible tragedy. It says a lot though that when I saw 'school shooting' on the BBC news website, I didn't for one second think that it happened here in the UK. I immediately assumed it was in the USA. There is a serious problem that America needs to face up to here, because this simply doesn't happen in other Western countries, despite the same access to the internet, video games, violent movies etc. The difference is access to guns, as simple as that.

"If you combine the populations of Great Britain, France, Germany, Japan, Switzerland, Sweden, Denmark and Australia, you'll get a population roughly the size of the United States. We had 32,000 gun deaths last year. They had 112. Do you think it's because Americans are more homicidal by nature? Or do you think it's because those guys have gun control laws?"

-Aaron Sorkin, Richard Schiff as Toby Ziegler, The West Wing

At 12/15/12 03:46 AM, Tony-DarkGrave wrote:

2 - More guns tend to mean more homicide.

Quite the opposite 2.5 Million crimes are stopped by legal residents with firearms and then their are the people like me with Concealed Carry. its the people who straw purchase firearms in large amounts for criminals thats the problem

Actually, you're wrong! Please read the link and the studies instead of posting an opinion. There's nothing to argue about this. Data does not lie. Gun control is correlated with reduced gun crime, period. There's honestly not even a debate to be had here.

full of shit turn california and Illionis and NY red then it would be much more realistic. otherwise that thing is just propaganda by the Pro-control crowd.

"Full of shit" yet based on data that is publicly available? Here's the thing: gun control laws are usually enacted for entire states. Those states as a whole have a correlated reduction of gun crime. Certain cities have might have higher gun crime, but that does not mean the entire state will. As a whole, there's pretty strong evidence that gun control works. European gun crime statistics (per capita, and raw numbers) are also vastly lower than America's.

At 12/15/12 05:00 AM, Bolo wrote:

Actually, you're wrong! Please read the link and the studies instead of posting an opinion. There's nothing to argue about this. Data does not lie. Gun control is correlated with reduced gun crime, period. There's honestly not even a debate to be had here.

i haven't read the whole argument but basically you mean that stricter gun control results in lower homicial rate.

i am afraid that your arugument is not valid if this is what you mean. anyone with a reasonable background in statistics would know that there is a difference between correlation and causation.

the study conducted by haravard university only illusrates that there might be a postive correlation between guns and homicide. but it says nothing about the causal relation between the two.,

At 12/15/12 03:34 AM, Bolo wrote: For anyone arguing in favor guns after this incident, go fuck yourself. No, seriously.

I'm glad that someone got there before me, and I shall contribute.

Suicide is still the leading cause of firearm death in the U.S. In 2007, the U.S. firearm suicide total was 17,352 an increase from the 2006 national gun suicide number of 16,883. The state of Illinois saw a 13.7% INCREASE in gun suicides from 372 in 2006 to 423 in 2007. Over half of suicides in the U.S. are committed with firearms.

In 2007, a total of 683 young Americans ages 10-19 committed suicide with firearms, a decrease of 11% from the 2006 total of 763 youth gun suicides. Unlike suicide attempts using other methods, suicide attempts with guns are nearly always fatal, meaning a temporarily depressed teenager will never get a second chance at life. Nearly two-thirds of all completed teenage suicides involve a firearm.

Access to lethal means, especially firearms, greatly increases the likelihood that someone will commit suicide.A gun in the home is 11 times more likely to be used to attempt or commit a suicide than to be used in self-defense. Homes with guns are 5 times more likely to experience the suicide of a household member than homes without guns. On average, 68% of suicides for youth ages 15-24 are committed with guns. Unlike suicide attempts using other methods, 92% of suicide attempts with guns are fatal, meaning a temporarily depressed teenager will never get a second chance at life.

i only logged on because for some reason i was expecting the guy to have a ng account

anyway the guy whose picture they originally plastered everywhere is p hot, welp bye

At 12/15/12 05:00 AM, Bolo wrote: Actually, you're wrong! Please read the link and the studies instead of posting an opinion. There's nothing to argue about this. Data does not lie. Gun control is correlated with reduced gun crime, period. There's honestly not even a debate to be had here.

no but the assholes who handle can smudge it a little for one political side for a little bit of $.

"Full of shit" yet based on data that is publicly available? Here's the thing: gun control laws are usually enacted for entire states. Those states as a whole have a correlated reduction of gun crime. Certain cities have might have higher gun crime, but that does not mean the entire state will. As a whole, there's pretty strong evidence that gun control works. European gun crime statistics (per capita, and raw numbers) are also vastly lower than America's.

take the midwest we have some of the loosest gun laws and more guns than anyone for every one person there are five firearms but you don't see crime like on the coasts or the south. and for Europe they have been systematically disarmed since WWII a good chunk of it during the cold war was controlled by the Soviets who favored Gun Control just so they wouldn't have a revolt and have docile citizens. And the Western countries had it so as to make sure there wasn't a Communist Revolution in their country due to the easy accessability of guns.

for the US we have been on a decrease of violence with firearms The FBI even Admits it. and this is the Fifth year running! you know why? because legal gun ownership by law abidding citizens is up and criminals wouldn't take the risk of losing their lives.

Hell the UK has had a 35% increase on gun violence and they have a zero firearm tolerance. linky

At 12/15/12 03:34 AM, Bolo wrote:

1 - America is an unusually violent country.

All the more reason for more people to be properly trained in the use of firearms.

2 - More guns tend to mean more homicide.

Except in countries like Switzerland or midwestern states. Inversely (kind of) gun related crime is rampant in nations where gun control is strictly enforced, such as the middle east, or big cities like NYC or LA.

3 - States with stricter gun control laws have fewer deaths from gun-related violence.

No

At 12/15/12 02:09 AM, xxxcreep wrote: Wow, ok. And that teacher could have gone psycho instead of her son. Or a child could have gotten ahold of that gun.

Keep them locked up. Like you're supposed to do with guns anyway. BTW, having a gun in the classroom would not make a teacher more prone to go on a shooting rampage. If they wanted to do that, they'd do it regardless of if a gun was in a classroom or not.

Statistics show that countries that ban guns completely, have close to none shootings.

Yeah, gun related crime is way low in the Mid-east, isn't it lol

It's easier to run from a knife than a gun.

Exactly. That's why I should have one so I can kill someone who wants to use a gun on me.

Guys, nobody hunts to survive anymore, we don't need guns at all.

Except to defend ourselves from idiots with guns.

At 12/15/12 12:02 AM, Austerity wrote: Don't you hate how every time something like this happens people around the world use it as an opportunity to talk trash about America? Also, don't you hate how some kid in a suburb can just decide to do something like this and then everyone in the world has to hear about it constantly for a month or more?

As I said before, more often than not there will be assholes using this as an opportunity to spout anti-American diatribe to either sound edgy or because they can, especially through the internet. You can find comments like these in YouTube videos including the Challenger shuttle disaster so that tells you something.

It's not surprising.

More importantly, if the perpetrator is a person of different race, people will come up and post racist garbage as well.

At 12/14/12 10:18 PM, desert116 wrote:

At 12/14/12 10:15 PM, Hybrid-Of-Souls wrote: the only game I've ever really seen that even allowed killing children was Skyrim

You can't kill children in Skyrim. Well, unless you mod the game, of course.

Oh, looks like I was misled.

If there's one problem it's that all the children are being missed. Nearly no attention is being given to the five teachers which is stupid in my opinion, they're children, i get it but just like the teachers they are humans so miss them all equally, if you're mom died and a her students did as well, you would miss your mom the most not the pupils, so i think its dumb how all the children are being missed and the others barely get any mourn-age.

At 12/15/12 11:25 AM, LemonCrush wrote:

At 12/15/12 03:34 AM, Bolo wrote:

1 - America is an unusually violent country.

All the more reason for more people to be properly trained in the use of firearms.

u wot

2 - More guns tend to mean more homicide.

Except in countries like Switzerland or midwestern states. Inversely (kind of) gun related crime is rampant in nations where gun control is strictly enforced, such as the middle east, or big cities like NYC or LA.

Thereare very low instances of gun related crime in NY or the middle east compared to how many people there are, way lower than most american states with little gun control.

3 - States with stricter gun control laws have fewer deaths from gun-related violence.

No

it is true in general, you are woefully misinformed

At 12/15/12 12:17 PM, BumFodder wrote: u wot

If crazy people are using guns to kill other people, I'd prefer to have a gun so I can defend myself. You don't bring fists to a gun fight, see?

Thereare very low instances of gun related crime in NY or the middle east compared to how many people there are, way lower than most american states with little gun control.

Do you know how easy it is to get a fully automatic AK47 in Pakistan? Or Libya?

it is true in general, you are woefully misinformed

I don't know man, I see gun control is pretty strict in LA, most of the US, the middle east, etc. And gun related crimes, as well as the black market gun trade, is pretty high. Meanwhile, countries like Switzerland have almost zero gun related crimes.

Please, this thread is for discussing the shootings in Connecticut, go make a thread in the politics forums if you want to talk about gun control.

At 12/15/12 12:54 PM, Dragen wrote: Please, this thread is for discussing the shootings in Connecticut, go make a thread in the politics forums if you want to talk about gun control.

already a thread for it.

At 12/15/12 12:57 PM, Tony-DarkGrave wrote:

At 12/15/12 12:54 PM, Dragen wrote: Please, this thread is for discussing the shootings in Connecticut, go make a thread in the politics forums if you want to talk about gun control.

already a thread for it.

Exactly. That's just even more of a reason why you don't need to discuss it here.

At 12/15/12 01:01 PM, Dragen wrote: Exactly. That's just even more of a reason why you don't need to discuss it here.

well I do it because these idiots are talking about restricting or putting limits on a right some of us exercise. and to be able to take apart their whole arguement and make them look like idiots is satisfying.

Not sure what's so confusing about this to anyone who replied to my earlier post. Correlation does suggest causation, even if it doesn't imply it. All data is about correlations. Anyone who has taken basic statistics should know this.

There pretty much isn't any debate about this. Data collected yesterday by the Washington Post suggests a pretty clear correlation between gun control in both the US and Europe and reduced gun crime. Period. There's no debate here. All arguments made to the contrary are preempted by the data presented.

yeah, whatever. i like to believe that the sun rises from the east because of me. i wake up early in the morning and pray to god. my success rate is 100%.

it is okay to make claims based on correlation. but i guess i am more interested in the exact mechanism and further evidence instead.

Damn. Every month all we get is bad news and this is by far the worst. My heart goes out to those people.

I'm about an hour drive from where this all happened (Not that it makes me special or anything, since nobody I know was effected) and a lot of people in Connecticut are freaking out right now. I was very sad and kind of numb to the whole situation.

Despite it being a possibility that things like these can always happen, I think now would be a good time to increase any budget for mental health care.

Killing kids that age is so fucking twisted oh my god it makes me actually sick and I want to hug my little brother so he can never leave me and go into this shitty world

fuck you