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I have not eaten meat since March 19th. I'm not a strict vegeterian, but I don't eat processed meats of any kind. Since that decision I have noticed no effects either adverse or positive to my own physical or mental well-being.

At 4/13/09 05:08 PM, hhcash wrote: PETA is awesome

My problem with PETA is that they sometimes do ridiculous things that sort of give other vegetarians a bad name (sea kittens? come on).

YAY I AM SO HAPPY THIS CREW EXISTS.

I'm a former meat-addict, been sober for 21 days today!

I'm doing it for the environment, and for my health and because the more I think about it, those poor little animals are getting killed! I went to see a dietitian today and I think I'm doing everything right, though I need to ensure I get enough iron and zinc. I do get a lot of B12 because I buy stuff that's fortified with it.

I almost had a slip up and then I resisted the temptation of a turkey dinner.

So I think it's pretty much here to stay. I am going home to a very meat-eating family so I hope I'm not too much of a pain in the ass for them. Time to peruse this thread for great ideas!

Do you guys know any brands of vegan fake meats? All of the fake meats I've had so far have had some kind of milk or egg, especially egg whites.

Do vegetarians eat animal crackers?

At 4/16/09 04:40 PM, hhcash wrote: Do you guys know any brands of vegan fake meats? All of the fake meats I've had so far have had some kind of milk or egg, especially egg whites.

Actually, two days ago my big brother's girlfriend (who is a vegetarian) brought me a packet of this dust stuff that you just add water and fry to make vegan friendly burgers. Forgot what it's called but I'll check out the name if you're determined.

At 4/16/09 05:11 PM, Sk8erGirl14 wrote: Do vegetarians eat animal crackers?

Potatoes in animal shapes.

I'd think so.

At 4/16/09 02:05 PM, TropicalParadise wrote: YAY I AM SO HAPPY THIS CREW EXISTS.

I'm a former meat-addict, been sober for 21 days today!

I've been off meat products for just over a week.

I'm doing it for the environment, and for my health and because the more I think about it, those poor little animals are getting killed! I went to see a dietitian today and I think I'm doing everything right, though I need to ensure I get enough iron and zinc. I do get a lot of B12 because I buy stuff that's fortified with it.

Ah, I never got into the dietitian thing. Just ended up checking through what are animal products, making sure there isn't any in what I eat and then just eat it. I got involved for dietary and health reasons.

I almost had a slip up and then I resisted the temptation of a turkey dinner.

I had a slip up about three days in when I had a pinch of cheese and then realised a second later what I'd done.

So I think it's pretty much here to stay. I am going home to a very meat-eating family so I hope I'm not too much of a pain in the ass for them. Time to peruse this thread for great ideas!

My family are very into meat but as long they're not close minded I'm sure they'll be willing to cater to your needs.

If they'll make fun of you is a different matter entirely.

At 4/16/09 02:05 PM, TropicalParadise wrote: YAY I AM SO HAPPY THIS CREW EXISTS.

Lol, "meat addict" "sober", I love it!! If you're looking for recipe ideas, I encourage you to check out Vegweb. You can find recipes you like and then put them in your 'recipe box'. I had a grilled avocado sandwich with tomatoes tonight that tasted delicious, found the recipe there.

At 4/16/09 04:40 PM, hhcash wrote: Do you guys know any brands of vegan fake meats? All of the fake meats I've had so far have had some kind of milk or egg, especially egg whites.

Tofurkey or Yves are good if you want deli type meats. Boca and Health Is Wealth are good also.

At 4/16/09 05:11 PM, Sk8erGirl14 wrote: Do vegetarians eat animal crackers?

Some brands have milk, but some are fine.

Do non-cannibals eat sour patch kids?

At 4/16/09 06:16 PM, F-E-A-R wrote: If they'll make fun of you is a different matter entirely.

After a couple of years, the teasing stopped for me! Haha.

I've never told my doctor about my eating habits, I'm afraid I'll get yelled at. I'm fine without having a doctor bitch at me.

At 4/16/09 05:11 PM, Sk8erGirl14 wrote: Do vegetarians eat animal crackers?

no, the sodium content is too high for us

At 4/16/09 05:11 PM, Sk8erGirl14 wrote: Do vegetarians eat animal crackers?

Yes! And I usually start with their heads!

At 4/17/09 12:56 AM, Sensationalism wrote:
Lol, "meat addict" "sober", I love it!! If you're looking for recipe ideas, I encourage you to check out Vegweb. You can find recipes you like and then put them in your 'recipe box'. I had a grilled avocado sandwich with tomatoes tonight that tasted delicious, found the recipe there.

Thanks!! I'm always looking for vegetarian recipes, right now I'm just cooking what I would regularly without any meat, so it's lacking a little bit of spice, but I soon move to a new place with a HUGE kitchen and so I'll have so much more space to cook. I went to a dietitian that my school has to make sure that I wasn't missing anything important, and she said that vegetarianism is really healthy if done properly and good for you!

At 4/17/09 12:56 AM, Sensationalism wrote:

4/16/09 04:40 PM, hhcash wrote:

Do you guys know any brands of vegan fake meats? All of the fake meats I've had so far have had some kind of milk or egg, especially egg whites.

Tofurkey or Yves are good if you want deli type meats. Boca and Health Is Wealth are good also.

Haha they don't have those locally. I'm going to have to go downtown to see. I might just have to deal with what i have, my parents won't let me be a vegan anyway :(

One more question, how shitty does soy milk taste like?

At 4/20/09 04:50 PM, hhcash wrote:

At 4/17/09 12:56 AM, Sensationalism wrote: Tofurkey or Yves are good if you want deli type meats. Boca and Health Is Wealth are good also.

Haha they don't have those locally. I'm going to have to go downtown to see. I might just have to deal with what i have, my parents won't let me be a vegan anyway :(

One more question, how shitty does soy milk taste like?

You could eat lentils, beans, soup, hummus, stuff like that instead of fake meats. Or peanut butter or something like that.

My sister liked soy milk since the first time she tried it, I didn't like it until after a few months. I started out putting it in cereal and then slowly transitioned to drinking it straight. It's important to experiment with brands and flavours until you find one you like.

At 4/17/09 12:56 AM, Sensationalism wrote:

At 4/16/09 04:40 PM, hhcash wrote: Do you guys know any brands of vegan fake meats? All of the fake meats I've had so far have had some kind of milk or egg, especially egg whites.

Tofurkey or Yves are good if you want deli type meats. Boca and Health Is Wealth are good also.

Veggie Patch also makes really delicious chicken nuggets that taste like the real thing! I don't know if they have eggs or milk in them though, but they're in the specialty food aisle at Sobeys!

At 4/21/09 12:27 PM, TropicalParadise wrote:

At 4/17/09 12:56 AM, Sensationalism wrote:

At 4/16/09 04:40 PM, hhcash wrote: Do you guys know any brands of vegan fake meats? All of the fake meats I've had so far have had some kind of milk or egg, especially egg whites.

Tofurkey or Yves are good if you want deli type meats. Boca and Health Is Wealth are good also.

Veggie Patch also makes really delicious chicken nuggets that taste like the real thing! I don't know if they have eggs or milk in them though, but they're in the specialty food aisle at Sobeys!

Why would you go Vegetarian in the first place if you're gonna miss the taste of meat? If you want to taste meat, eat some fucking meat. It's not gonna kill you. Hell, it'll probably be better for you. There's no such thing as a replacement for meat taste wise unless it's made from some artificial test experiment(aka artificial food made in a lab as such as fruit snacks, frozen pizza, etc) that will be just as bad as you think meat would be bad for you. If you're a veg, and least stick to what you're going through for. Soy meat is still meat.

Another question I have, and this is quite a controversial one, why do vegetarians go veg for the wellness of animal rights? Hell, if I would of known better, just as many if not more animals are being slaughtered due to the collection of grain and what not with farming tools. Read this artical and see for yourself if you think you're protecting the environment: http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/
c.cgi?u=grill

It's all still being collected by farmers that really don't care about the animals they kill, as long as they get some pay.

At 4/21/09 04:41 PM, doctorjmcgee wrote:

Hell, it'll probably be better for you.

Meat makes you fat, highers cholesterol, and can easily spark heart disease (if it's in your genes). It can also cause a lot of cancers.

Another question I have, and this is quite a controversial one, why do vegetarians go veg for the wellness of animal rights?

I can go on about this one, but i'll keep it simple. One of the main reasons I became a vegetarian is because I studied animals, and learned that they are much more sophisticated than I thought before. They are exploited for their flesh and abused heavily, forcibly, mostly because everyone thinks animals have no feelings and are worthless, which has been scientifically proven wrong.

http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/
c.cgi?u=grill

This article is probably the most hypocritical article I have EVER read. Not only is it filled with bad grammar and spelling and vile trolling against vegetarians, but this article insists that being a vegetarian is killing animals, even though the writer is obviously a meat-eater, which is, if you haven't noticed, eating murdered flesh. And how the hell is going to back from a vegetarian to a meat eater going to SAVE MORE ANIMALS? The logic in this article sounds like it was written by a 12-year-old redneck.

At 4/21/09 04:41 PM, doctorjmcgee wrote: Why would you go Vegetarian in the first place if you're gonna miss the taste of meat?

'cause you don't want to eat meat. It's like being a smoker; you want to smoke, but not smoking is better for you. Also, fake meat doesn't really taste like meat, but it tastes good, and replaces the texture and general flavor quality (savory) of meat in your meal, just like mushrooms or tofu.

If you want to taste meat, eat some fucking meat. It's not gonna kill you.

That's debatable, seeing as meat has a myriad of chemicals and compounds and whatnot that will fuck you up. Carcinogens, cholesterol, fat, etc.

Hell, it'll probably be better for you.

Not really, no.

There's no such thing as a replacement for meat taste wise unless it's made from some artificial test experiment(aka artificial food made in a lab as such as fruit snacks, frozen pizza, etc) that will be just as bad as you think meat would be bad for you.

Most of the flavor of meat comes from the spices and sauces used, not the meat itself. Humans are the only meat-eating creature that finds uncooked meat unappetizing.

If you're a veg, and least stick to what you're going through for. Soy meat is still meat.

I know what you're trying to say here, but just to play the devil's advocate, i'm going to disagree with you. Soy based "meat" isn't meat, because it's not the cooked flesh of an animal.

Another question I have, and this is quite a controversial one, why do vegetarians go veg for the wellness of animal rights?

Some of them do. Others do it for health reasons, environmental reasons, anti-capitalistic reasons, religious reasons, or as an economic necessity.

Hell, if I would of known better, just as many if not more animals are being slaughtered due to the collection of grain and what not with farming tools.

That's like saying we're all going to inhale secondhand smoke, so we should all be chain smokers.

Read this artical and see for yourself if you think you're protecting the environment:

Well technically, you are protecting the environment by not eating meat. Factory farms release shitloads of toxins and greenhouse gases, and that's not taking into account the transportation necessary to shuttle the livestock to a different farm, and then to a meat processing plant, and so on. Vegetables require much fewer steps. Also, killing an animal doesn't mean you're harming the environment, it means you're killing something. There is a difference. And like I said, there are more reasons than environment and ethical to be vegetarian.

http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/
c.cgi?u=grill

Maddox is not a legitimate source, even if he quotes other sources.

It's all still being collected by farmers that really don't care about the animals they kill, as long as they get some pay.

Well, since people sometimes hit animals on the road, I might as well just start eating a burger every day.

You know, man, what's it to you if we don't eat meat? It's not negatively impacting your life. You're just like the guys who give straight edge kids a hard time.

At 4/21/09 04:41 PM, doctorjmcgee wrote: Why would you go Vegetarian in the first place if you're gonna miss the taste of meat? If you want to taste meat, eat some fucking meat. It's not gonna kill you. Hell, it'll probably be better for you. There's no such thing as a replacement for meat taste wise unless it's made from some artificial test experiment(aka artificial food made in a lab as such as fruit snacks, frozen pizza, etc) that will be just as bad as you think meat would be bad for you. If you're a veg, and least stick to what you're going through for. Soy meat is still meat.

I'm going vegetarian because of higher, non-sensory, desires. There are plenty of things I would love to do, but chose not too. For example, I don't really want to have a shitty job, but I might have to get one so that I can afford to go traveling etc. I'm also still transitioning, I haven't learned how to cook with tofu and other things and so in the mean time, cooking what I used to cook but just without the meat is a good way to become vegetarian while I learn how to cook without use meat replacements.

Another question I have, and this is quite a controversial one, why do vegetarians go veg for the wellness of animal rights? Hell, if I would of known better, just as many if not more animals are being slaughtered due to the collection of grain and what not with farming tools. Read this artical and see for yourself if you think you're protecting the environment: http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/

c.cgi?u=grill

My family members are all farmers. NO animals get killed during the collection of grain. The only animal deaths in the collection of grain would be rabbits who don't understand that that big machine has blades, and run into the blades, which I've only seen happen once. I try not to name call when I argue, but here I can't resist, that statement is stupid. Absolutely stupid.

I'm not even vegetarian for animal rights, I do it for the environment and the animal welfare is just a nice perk! And Maddox, REALLY? REALLY? That's a joke, I bet he has never in his life eaten 3x the meat because he was in the presence of vegetarians. Say there is 10 vegetarians in this thread and you want to spite us all, can you even eat 30x your normal meat consumption without exploding?

It's all still being collected by farmers that really don't care about the animals they kill, as long as they get some pay.

What a lovely blanket statement!

At 4/21/09 04:41 PM, doctorjmcgee wrote: Read this artical and see for yourself if you think you're protecting the environment: http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/

Maddox is not a reliable source of information. Your argument is now null and void as a result of thinking otherwise.

So let's run through this list and I'll go more in depth into all of them.
First off, "going vegetarian is good for the environment and good for animals" as quoted by a what I'm starting to hear pop-up today, 'hardcore veg'. Well, if you cared so much about the environment and animals then why would you be so selfish as to want to have a longer life? Why not want to advance the length of normal animal's lives?
That sounds stupid just thinking about it. Improving the length of our lives. If meat is so harmful, then why is my friend's 90+ year old great grandmother still kicking? She's ate what would amount to a carton of eggs almost every week. Physical fitness has helped her live longer, along with the high amounts of protein that she receives and transfers it to muscle and energy. Can't do that with lettuce. Give me at least 25 names of people who've lived past 100 without eating a single bit of meat.
Meat provides supplements and proteins that most people, especially during the '70's, thought that was bad for you such as eggs. Eggs are probably one of the most beneficial foods that you could enter in your system if you're physically active. There's two things that are required if you want to 'live long': -physical endurance and -good health
If most of you vegetarians are just sitting on your ass eating fruits and vegetables all the fucking time, it's not going to benefit shit. Maybe lose some unhealthy weight, but other than that nothing that I'd trust.
And another thing that busted a nerve:
are animals that more sophisticated than us? Really? Tell me when the last time a ferret did something of use to you other than make shit and die. The theories of survival of the strongest always proves right, and the ironic thing is that you vegetarians need to notice nature and how the bigger and smarter animal out there will be victorious no matter what.
Vegetables are good, I'm not going to lie, but replacing a food group almost as important as meat, with meat, is highly unhealthy and not at all a good choice. It's like having $100 given to you every day then dropping it to $50 a day. God I'm starting to pick up all these awful analogies that you guys have been posting in debate of my statement. Shit.

And by the way, I'm not a 'fan of Maddox' I just happened to stumble upon that article while searching around health benefits on physical outlooks. As far as I know that article had no grammatical nor spelling errors. You think its biased or hypocritical? If you want to save animals, go ahead and try. All of them are going to die eventually, whether it be from us, from you and your need to eat the primary food that they eat, and from the environment, the thing you want to save(especially today) by turning on your computer that thrives off of a power plant burning excess fuel to reply to my post.
But how the fuck does going vegetarian affect the environment? It's not like your turning off all the power in your home to eat a meal of soy meat.

At 4/22/09 06:25 PM, doctorjmcgee wrote: First off, "going vegetarian is good for the environment and good for animals" as quoted by a what I'm starting to hear pop-up today, 'hardcore veg'. Well, if you cared so much about the environment and animals then why would you be so selfish as to want to have a longer life? Why not want to advance the length of normal animal's lives?

Because living longer is fun. Living longer doesn't impact the environment, exponential growth does. I don't give a shit about the length of my life, I just want to be happy and satisfied with who am I am and what I become.

That sounds stupid just thinking about it. Improving the length of our lives. If meat is so harmful, then why is my friend's 90+ year old great grandmother still kicking?

Because more factors that just meat consumption go into the length of a life. If we knew why some people lived to 90 and others died in their mid 60s, we'd figure that shit out and tell everyone how to live to be 100.

She's ate what would amount to a carton of eggs almost every week. Physical fitness has helped her live longer,

Well duh. Exercise is going to prolong anyone's life, meat or no meat. It burns excess calories that would otherwise be stored as fat, and it reduces cholesterol.

along with the high amounts of protein that she receives and transfers it to muscle and energy. Can't do that with lettuce.

You can, however, do that with lentils, beans, peas, soy, spirulina, wheat, barley, corn, nuts, seeds, and other plant sources. Actually, every natural food has protein in it.

Give me at least 25 names of people who've lived past 100 without eating a single bit of meat.

First of all, I doubt you could name 25 people who lived past 100, period. Second of all, the vast majority of the world eats meat at least once in their life, because vegetarianism is most often a conscious decision.

here's a list of vegetarians on wikipedia, why don't you go through it and try to find some fucking centenarians.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_veg etarians

Also.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetariani sm#Longevity

Meat provides supplements and proteins that most people, especially during the '70's, thought that was bad for you such as eggs.

Eggs also have a shit-ton more cholesterol than other foods do. Bashing eggs isn't going to do you a whole lot of good, only a few of us here are actually vegan. I eat eggs.

Eggs are probably one of the most beneficial foods that you could enter in your system if you're physically active.

So are a lot of foods, seeing as physical activity negates a lot of negative effects of foods.

There's two things that are required if you want to 'live long': -physical endurance and -good health

My grandma hasn't worked out in some 20 years, eats ice cream all the time, and barely eats any real food. She is 89. There are innumerable factors that go into the long-life formula. Most of it seems to be genetic.

If most of you vegetarians are just sitting on your ass eating fruits and vegetables all the fucking time, it's not going to benefit shit. Maybe lose some unhealthy weight, but other than that nothing that I'd trust.

Vegetables are good, I'm not going to lie, but replacing a food group almost as important as meat, with meat, is highly unhealthy and not at all a good choice. It's like having $100 given to you every day then dropping it to $50 a day. God I'm starting to pick up all these awful analogies that you guys have been posting in debate of my statement. Shit.

None of this even makes sense. Replacing meat with meat? We're not fucking replacing a steak with another steak, we're replacing it with a meat substitute, which has different nutritional properties than the real thing; less fat, less cholesterol, same amount of protein. It can even be fortified, Jesus Christ.

All of them are going to die eventually, whether it be from us, from you and your need to eat the primary food that they eat,

Oh, how nihilistic of you. It's pretty apparent that you're not listening to us, nor have you done any actual research into the vegetarian ethos. It's not about how long they live. It's not about their eventual deaths. It's about reducing the suffering they go through.

and from the environment, the thing you want to save(especially today) by turning on your computer that thrives off of a power plant burning excess fuel to reply to my post.

This sentence does not make sense. First of all, how is the environment going to kill all the animals we don't eat? Is a goddamn tidal wave going to come out of fucking nowhere and wipe them out? Is a tree going to fall on them? Natural predators may eat them, sure, but that's how it's supposed to be. I don't have anything against a cougar kicking the shit out of a rabbit, that's just what it does.

But how the fuck does going vegetarian affect the environment? It's not like your turning off all the power in your home to eat a meal of soy meat.

Goddamn. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environment al_effects_of_meat_production

At 4/22/09 06:25 PM, doctorjmcgee wrote:

That sounds stupid just thinking about it. Improving the length of our lives. If meat is so harmful, then why is my friend's 90+ year old great grandmother still kicking?

It's not just about living to be a billion years old, it's the actual feelings of health, feeling awake and brain ready, and also resisting diesease, so we're not sick all the time.

If most of you vegetarians are just sitting on your ass eating fruits and vegetables all the fucking time

Wow, that's what you really think we do ALL THE TIME?

And another thing that busted a nerve:
are animals that more sophisticated than us? Really? Tell me when the last time a ferret did something of use to you other than make shit and die.

Most animals are like children. Sure they don't contribute anything to society that much, but they are ALIVE. They are loving to their families and their environment, and mind their business. And by the way, animal shit is good for the soil.

Vegetables are good, I'm not going to lie, but replacing a food group almost as important as meat, with meat, is highly unhealthy and not at all a good choice.

A well balanced vegetarian diet has been proven the most healthy diet out there. You think meat is the only source of protein? No. Soy and legumes are great, natural protein. In addition, nuts contain fat, but it's the healthy fat. Meat fat however, is the bad fat. Have you imagined vegetables making someone fat? No, because they don't.

If you want to save animals, go ahead and try. All of them are going to die eventually, whether it be from us, from you and your need to eat the primary food that they eat, and from the environment, the thing you want to save(especially today) by turning on your computer that thrives off of a power plant burning excess fuel to reply to my post.

Why, you are such a dark person saying animals are going to die eventually. Chew on this: would you rather spend your life in a cage, not being able to move, or be in a the free, beautiful wild with your family and your friends. It's the EXACT same thing with animals, except they can't tell us how they feel.

But how the fuck does going vegetarian affect the environment? It's not like your turning off all the power in your home to eat a meal of soy meat.

-50% of all water used in the U.S. goes to raising animals for food.
-The majority of the Amazon rainforest gets cut down to grow a single crop, all going to raise animals for food.
-Cows produce 20% of all greenhouse gases.
-Most animal waste from factory farms gets deliberately dumped into nearby bodies of water, polluting OUR water and killing millions of fish at a time.

doctorjmcgee, just shut the fuck up and leave, you're being proven wrong on multiple cases from multiple people, and you're making yourself sound stupid.

BTW, happy Earth Day guys!

At 4/22/09 06:25 PM, doctorjmcgee wrote: And by the way, I'm not a 'fan of Maddox' I just happened to stumble upon that article while searching around health benefits on physical outlooks. As far as I know that article had no grammatical nor spelling errors. You think its biased or hypocritical?

With full and absolute confidence, yes. It is bias and hypocritical. It doesn't matter that it has very few or no grammar errors, it's still a very poor source of information.

If you want to save animals, go ahead and try. All of them are going to die eventually, whether it be from us, from you and your need to eat the primary food that they eat, and from the environment, the thing you want to save(especially today) by turning on your computer that thrives off of a power plant burning excess fuel to reply to my post.

Using that logic, it's fine if we don't cure cancer or if we don't help that psychologically unstable person because people are going to die anyway. If it's not from cancer or murder by a psychotic individual, then by an accident, a different disease, suicide, old age or any of the other many ways to die.

doctormcgee, I challenge you to find one essential nutrient that is in meat and is not in other products.

B12 doesn't count! B12 comes from bacteria!
Vitamin D doesn't count! We get vitamin D by the sun!
Essential amino acids like arginine, histidine, isoleucine, leucine, lysine, methionin, phenylalanin, threonine, tryptophan and valine all come from plants and bacteria originally.

Cows are big, strong and fairly healthy, if not very bright. They eat grass.

Think of simple trophic levels when considering why raising animals is worse than raising plants. How much plants would a person have to eat before obtaining their fill vs. how much plants a cow would have to eat to have their fill and how much the person would have to eat of the cow to have their fill.

Only about 20% of energy goes from trophic level to trophic level. So by reducing the number of cultured trophic levels, ie. plants -> people, from plants -> cows -> people. We're reducing the amount of environmental energy used up.

It's very, very simple. I really don't know how people can argue with vegetarianism as a principle!

At 4/23/09 02:43 PM, TropicalParadise wrote: It's very, very simple. I really don't know how people can argue with vegetarianism as a principle!

they like meat too much :P

At 4/23/09 06:41 PM, D3NTATUS wrote:

At 4/23/09 02:43 PM, TropicalParadise wrote: It's very, very simple. I really don't know how people can argue with vegetarianism as a principle!

they like meat too much :P

Sure, but that's in practice! If they like meat, or animal rights/environment isn't a priority, or they don't have time to make a proper switch, that's all disagreements with the practice, but I've never heard a good argument regarding the principle!

At 4/23/09 07:04 PM, TropicalParadise wrote: Sure, but that's in practice! If they like meat, or animal rights/environment isn't a priority, or they don't have time to make a proper switch, that's all disagreements with the practice, but I've never heard a good argument regarding the principle!

The truth is there really isn't any concrete reasons against it. All anti-vegetarian arguments I've seen thus far can be remedied by a slight change in diet (e.g. supplements), or are entirely based in subjectivity.

At 4/23/09 07:10 PM, D3NTATUS wrote:

The truth is there really isn't any concrete reasons against it. All anti-vegetarian arguments I've seen thus far can be remedied by a slight change in diet (e.g. supplements), or are entirely based in subjectivity.

Normally people who hate on vegetarians think the concept of it is so stupid that is is seemingly mockable to them. In other cases, male vegetarians/vegans (such as myself) get called "pussies" and such all the time for not eating meat.

At 4/22/09 06:25 PM, doctorjmcgee wrote: are animals that more sophisticated than us? Really? Tell me when the last time a ferret did something of use to you other than make shit and die. The theories of survival of the strongest always proves right,

So, it's a good thing when animals go extinct? It's good when their habitats and the ecosystem is upset? I mean, they're worthless anyway. We should stop trying to preserve them, they have no value on this Earth. Open up all the zoos, and let lions and bears and jaguars roam the streets killing people, because those animals are stronger than us, so we should be killed by them.
The theory is called "Survival of the fittest. I also don't think you fully understand it.
An interpretation of the phrase to mean "only the fittest organisms will prevail" (a view sometimes derided as "social Darwinism") is not consistent with the actual theory of evolution. Any individual organism which succeeds in reproducing itself is "fit" and will contribute to survival of its species, not just the "fittest" ones, though some of the population will be better adapted to the circumstances than others. A more accurate characterization of evolution would be "survival of the fit enough."[5] The phrase "survival of the fittest" is sometimes misunderstood to simply mean "survival of those who are better equipped for surviving," which is a rhetorical tautology. What Darwin meant was "better adapted for immediate, local environment", tracking changing environments by differential preservation of organisms better adapted to live in them. The theory is not tautological as it contains an independent criterion of fitness http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survival_of _the_fittest

and the ironic thing is that you vegetarians need to notice nature and how the bigger and smarter animal out there will be victorious no matter what.

As vegetarians, we notice nature and are attentive of the animals around us. We have this respect for animals that I'm sure you don't have.

If I had to guess, I would say that you are one of those people who think he's at the top and that all animals are below him. Humans aren't even at the top of the food chain, we get eaten by other animals. And if you go even further than that, even bacteria consumes us when we die and so we are all connected in the great Circle of Life. The heron and the otter are my friends. And we are all connected to each other in a circle, in a hoop that never ends. Taking things from Disney movies, yes. But I live my life according to that stuff. Colours of The Wind especially. I found so many things I agreed with in that song when I was a kid, and so I grew up trying to live accordingly.

Vegetables are good, I'm not going to lie, but replacing a food group almost as important as meat, with meat, is highly unhealthy and not at all a good choice. It's like having $100 given to you every day then dropping it to $50 a day. God I'm starting to pick up all these awful analogies that you guys have been posting in debate of my statement. Shit.

What? Do you mean replacing meat with things like soy, beans, nuts, and the like? You are a bit misinformed. Getting rid of an entire food group is not a good idea or a healthy choice. Vegans/vegetarians do not do that however. Meat, eggs, beans, tofu are all in the same food group together. So we are able to do what we do without consuming meat. It's pretty much the same as a person not eating apples but eating other fruits. Not eating a certain food, but still eating foods from that food group.
I love how all of a sudden you are an expert on nutrition. The reality is that you quite obviously don't know the first thing about it. The way we eat is often more healthy than eating meat.

But how the fuck does going vegetarian affect the environment? It's not like your turning off all the power in your home to eat a meal of soy meat.

I recently did an assignment about the externality costs of factory farming. I don't have it with me now because I turned it in and don't have it saved, but factory farms were responsible for something like 20-30% of air pollution or something like that, more than what is produced from vehicle emissions. Factory farms also create super bacteria strains from all the antibiotics they pump their animals full of. That's all I can remember right now, it's late.

But being vegetarian positively affects the environment in many ways. There are rainforests being cleared so people can raise cattle for meat. If you look it up, you'll find a lot of things. Animal rights is more my thing, I just enjoy that I'm also being good to the environment while being good to animals and myself.

At 4/23/09 09:54 PM, hhcash wrote: Normally people who hate on vegetarians think the concept of it is so stupid that is is seemingly mockable to them. In other cases, male vegetarians/vegans (such as myself) get called "pussies" and such all the time for not eating meat.

That pisses me off because I think in actuality, people who choose not to eat meat are stronger than those who do. I think it's more of a "pussy" move to ignore the reality of the process through which your food ends up on your plate. I seriously think it takes guts to seek out information that is unpleasant and then to go against the norm and refuse to support it. And then to have to defend your beliefs against a population that just doesn't get it. They're the "pussies."

So, how many of you are actually vegetarians who don't eat fish.

At 4/24/09 04:14 AM, Maximus wrote: So, how many of you are actually vegetarians who don't eat fish.

I'm a vegan and I don't eat fish at all.

At 4/24/09 04:14 AM, Maximus wrote: So, how many of you are actually vegetarians who don't eat fish.

I'm a vegan and I don't eat fish at all.