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At 7/26/09 05:39 PM, ngmastah wrote:

you never hear of a scientist or atheist donating lots of money to people in need.

Umm, excuse me? Ever heard of BILL GATES? The owner of Microsoft? The damn rich guy who once had enough money to buy an areal the size of Africa but gave damn much money to charity and still does every day? He's given more than billions of dollars, and you don't know about him?

Think before you speak, :P

At 7/26/09 05:39 PM, ngmastah wrote: but you never hear of a scientist or atheist donating lots of money to people in need.

Richard Dawkins.

At 7/26/09 05:58 PM, Psychophobia wrote: The existence of the Universe.

Their are literally thousands of other theories, much more logical and realistic theories, explaining the creation of the Universe. I'm not stating they're correct, but does the fact we can't disprove any of these make them the correct one?

There is evidence to support it, but there is no evidence against it.

There is no evidence concerning God, it is no more believable than "A Giant Spaghetti monster," yet I can't disprove that either. Just because something can't be disproved doesn't mean it has been proved.

Atheism is a fucking synonym for ignorance.

Not to be redundant but I've made my choice to be Atheist based on logic. How much logic is there behind any religion? Yet people deny accusations of God not existing and claim him to be real based on this lack of logic. That is truly ignorant.

I was a Christian at one point and based all of my beliefs on "faith." Faith is only grand when there is something there to have faith in. God my friend is not.

you dont be religous to help out the unfortunate, i know a good amount of atheist that volunteer, donate and even buy food and take them to shelters

helping out your fellow man has nothing to do with believing in god

I can't wrap my head around the fact that no one is control of their lives and that it's up to a superior being. And there are so many things Christians have done to repel me against thinking about the beliefs.

At 7/26/09 06:04 PM, Psychophobia wrote: Everywhere. Everywhere in life it is logical to put faith into something that there isn't a shred of evidence against, but evidence to support.

Logic, by definition, is reliable. Your nonsense isn't reliable. It is illogical. It's incredible that you think otherwise,

Yes I have viewed the facts, and I have made a rational decision based on them.

Your decision is no more rational than believing that you're going to get good luck by throwing money into a wishing well.

And all the surveys are completely unbiased? idontthinkso.

I didn't say surveys, I said statistics. Take the USA for example. Out of the ten states with the highest percentages of church attendance, only two of them are in the top 50% for average IQs. Out of the ten states with the lowest percentages of church attendance, four of them are in the bottom 50% for average IQs. You can compare these statistics yourself here, and here. And as you can see, both sets of statistics are unrelated, which means there's no kind of bias.

Now I will openly point out there are states with low church attendance that also have lower average IQs, but you can clearly see when you compare the numbers that generally the states with less church attendance tend to be the ones with the highest average IQs, and vice versa. Part of the reason I made this point is because I know that you'll immediately cling onto the low IQ score for Nevada and never let go of it, insisting that in some way it disproves the overall correlation, which it of course doesn't.

Does this then prove that religion leads to ignorance and low intelligence? Not necessarily, and even if it does, that wasn't my point anyway. I was merely correcting this ridiculous idea that Atheism is somehow related to ignorance and low intelligence. You might have your 'faith' to justify these claims, but Atheism has numbers, and numbers don't lie.

At 7/26/09 06:30 PM, yurgenburgen wrote: ... and numbers don't lie.

I agree 110% !

At 7/26/09 06:20 PM, reveihca wrote:

At 7/26/09 05:58 PM, Psychophobia wrote: The existence of the Universe.

Their are literally thousands of other theories, much more logical and realistic theories, explaining the creation of the Universe. I'm not stating they're correct, but does the fact we can't disprove any of these make them the correct one?

Because I have logic.

There is evidence to support it, but there is no evidence against it.

There is no evidence concerning God, it is no more believable than "A Giant Spaghetti monster," yet I can't disprove that either. Just because something can't be disproved doesn't mean it has been proved.

I have proof, you do not, I win.

Atheism is a fucking synonym for ignorance.

Not to be redundant but I've made my choice to be Atheist based on logic. How much logic is there behind any religion? Yet people deny accusations of God not existing and claim him to be real based on this lack of logic. That is truly ignorant.

Not to be redundant but I've made my choice to be Religious based on logic. How much logic is there behind the nonexistence of God? People deny accusations of God not existing and claim him to be real based on this lack of logic, and the logic proving God. That is true logic.

I was a Christian at one point and based all of my beliefs on "faith." Faith is only grand when there is something there to have faith in. God my friend is not.

I am proud to say, I have never been an Atheist, although one day I thought about God, and if he was real, it was then, that I came to the definite conclusion, that there is a God.

Atheism=obviously correct and full of win

At 10/25/08 07:35 PM, peanutbutterclawk wrote:

At 10/25/08 07:33 PM, ZeroAsALimit wrote: I think Atheists are whiney and annoying.

I think Christians are whiney and annoying.

I agree with both of you.

At 7/26/09 06:44 PM, Psychophobia wrote: Because I have logic.

No you don't.

I have proof, you do not, I win.

By your attempts at logic it's obvious that you have no proof and the mere fact that you need to exclaim that you've won has lead to your down fall and the community tearing you and your pitiful arguments a new ass hole.

Not to be redundant but your logic very rarely involves answering simple questions about your faith. Rather than defend it and provide real evidence you just exclaim it can't be disproven in mock forms in hopes that you're convincing anyone other than yourself that you are correct. The mere fact that you think this is an intelligent form of debate is laughably embarrassing.

I am proud to say, I have never been an Atheist, although one day I thought about God, and if he was real, it was then, that I came to the definite conclusion, that there is a God.

So because of your personal preference it is mandatory that God is a fact? God is no more significant than any other fictional character of the last thousand years.

At 7/26/09 06:44 PM, Psychophobia wrote:

At 7/26/09 06:20 PM, reveihca wrote:

At 7/26/09 05:58 PM, Psychophobia wrote: The existence of the Universe.

Their are literally thousands of other theories, much more logical and realistic theories, explaining the creation of the Universe. I'm not stating they're correct, but does the fact we can't disprove any of these make them the correct one?

Because I have logic.

There is evidence to support it, but there is no evidence against it.

There is no evidence concerning God, it is no more believable than "A Giant Spaghetti monster," yet I can't disprove that either. Just because something can't be disproved doesn't mean it has been proved.

I have proof, you do not, I win.

I am proud to say, I have never been an Atheist, although one day I thought about God, and if he was real, it was then, that I came to the definite conclusion, that there is a God.

you remind me of my neigborhood priest, telling me he has proof c, i dont force my views on anyone im just asking questions, you say you have proof, OK, prove to me that a man can die, come back from the dead, have healing powers, has the power to watch over EVERYONE in the world and cause random miracles

show me actual proof of that

At 10/25/08 07:32 PM, MonkeyV wrote: They are people who don't believe in a god.
Nothing more to say.

but we're right...

I think atheism is rubbish too, but being agnostic I respect their beliefs.

At 7/26/09 06:57 PM, aListers wrote: I think atheism is rubbish too, but being agnostic I respect their beliefs.

i dont even know what i am, what is agnostic?

"The universe exists, therefore God had to exist in order to make the universe", is arbitrary nonsense. A piss-poor excuse for an argument.

1) Current human understanding regarding the beginnings of the universe is limited to theory and speculation.. we have only just begun to investigate this matter. There are all manner of possibilities open; the issue is not merely divided into a black-and-white dichotomy of either; there is a God which made the universe, or the universe just magically exploded from nothing. Absolutely not. Consider theories of a universe in a perpetual motion of Big Bang-Big Crunch; or the multiverse.

2) Just because current human knowledge cannot provide an answer, that is not proof of God; this is a logical fallacy known as the God of the Gaps fallacy (ie. God is relegated to the holes in scientific knowledge). This is a ridiculous proposal; to assert that your own 'model' is correct only because of the lack of hard evidence for other models.

At 7/26/09 06:48 PM, JackPhantasm wrote:

At 10/25/08 07:35 PM, peanutbutterclawk wrote:

At 10/25/08 07:33 PM, ZeroAsALimit wrote: I think Atheists are whiney and annoying.

I think Christians are whiney and annoying.

I agree with both of you.

Not all of them; only the self-proclaimed messengers/messiahs of either persuasion. which seem to make up 95% of the NG population...

I myself don't believe in god, but I don't go around force-feeding it to everyone... I wouldn't even if I did believe. And anyone that does shouldn't consider themselves to be a good (better) or smart(er) person. Forcing your opinions onto others doesn't make you any better than, let's say, Adolf Hitler.
Neither side can give good enough reasons/arguments or pieces of evidence to prove/disprove either belief system (not yet anyway). So no point in arguing.

So can we please start behaving like normal people, and just make silly cock-humor?

At 7/26/09 07:08 PM, pauly-walnuts wrote: Forcing your opinions onto others doesn't make you any better than, let's say, Adolf Hitler.

And for another thing I'm sick of all this stand-offishness where we all 'respect' each others' beliefs by default, simply because people have a right to have them.. I did not agree to do that. I don't agree to respect a female Muslim's right to walk around in disguise, simply because she has been indoctrinated into a coercive, male-centric, farcical belief system that wants to strip me of my rights. Yeah, you have a right to believe what you want; but that does not mean you get to walk around in a bubble where nobody is allowed to question what you believe, lest they be labelled a racist, or an Islamophobe, or whatever other political-correctness absurdity the left-wing liberals want to throw away our freedom for.

People talk about the importance of showing religion 'respect' constantly in these threads... but I have never seen a single reason to. Respect is earned, not handed out mindlessly like you so-called 'agnostics' are so eager to do.

At 7/26/09 07:29 PM, Victory wrote: And for another thing I'm sick of all this stand-offishness where we all 'respect' each others' beliefs by default, simply because people have a right to have them...

This is something I strongly agree with. The thing is, people only bring up the 'You have to respect everyone's beliefs' thing when they realise they are losing an argument. It's like the kid at school who goes around provoking people into arguments and fights, and then cries to be left alone when he realises he's gone out of his depth.

The existence of god argument is not one that can be determined through evidence or logic. It is possible to put evidence against certain forms of a religion, but as long as a religion believes that there is evidence of a God that transcends what humans can perceive, then the religion cannot be logically debunked.

I think Atheists are misrepresented by the trolls who bash religion. just like how christians are misrepresented by the Neo conservatives.

They are the only people in this world who make an sense at all.

I'm atheist and proud.

At 7/26/09 05:32 PM, ngmastah wrote: Personally, I think it's satanic, and I think anyone that is an atheist cannot possibly be a good person. I mean, how could someone be good when there is no god in their lives? It's impossible.

I agree these satanic heathens must be cleansed from the earth grab your guns christian soliders and lets head to the atheist conventions.

At 7/26/09 07:45 PM, iscrulz wrote:

At 7/26/09 05:32 PM, ngmastah wrote: Personally, I think it's satanic, and I think anyone that is an atheist cannot possibly be a good person. I mean, how could someone be good when there is no god in their lives? It's impossible.

I agree these satanic heathens must be cleansed from the earth grab your guns christian soliders and lets head to the atheist conventions.

aight muthafucker ima start up a devil army and we going to go to all churches with satan on our side an kill babies in holy water bring it (sarcasm)

At 7/26/09 06:05 PM, UnknownOne wrote:

At 7/26/09 05:39 PM, ngmastah wrote:

you never hear of a scientist or atheist donating lots of money to people in need.

Umm, excuse me? Ever heard of BILL GATES? The owner of Microsoft? The damn rich guy who once had enough money to buy an areal the size of Africa but gave damn much money to charity and still does every day? He's given more than billions of dollars, and you don't know about him?

Think before you speak, :P

I am not agreeing with what ngmastah said, because its stupid, but Bill Gates and others (Even christians for this matter) donate in order to lower their taxes. Pretty much everyone who does it, is still pretty greedy.

But about this topic, neither side is EVER going to convince the other side of anything! These arguements all go the same way.

Christian: God is real!
Atheist: Prove it.
Christian: Nature
Atheist: Fuck you, thats stupid. Big Bang.
Christian: God did it. (Link to "proof")
Atheist: HES NOT FUCKING REAL (link to "proof")
Christian: Prove he DOESN'T exist.
Atheist: I don't see him.
Christian: Well still. Enjoy hell.

Seriously, we don't need 6 pages of replies when we will surely only see a pattern similar to this.

At 7/26/09 07:33 PM, yurgenburgen wrote:

At 7/26/09 07:29 PM, Victory wrote: And for another thing I'm sick of all this stand-offishness where we all 'respect' each others' beliefs by default, simply because people have a right to have them...

This is something I strongly agree with. The thing is, people only bring up the 'You have to respect everyone's beliefs' thing when they realise they are losing an argument. It's like the kid at school who goes around provoking people into arguments and fights, and then cries to be left alone when he realises he's gone out of his depth.

I failed to see where I made an argument in my post, and it's not because I say I don't believe in god that it automatically means I agree with everything someone with that same persuasion says or thinks... By saying I don't believe, you immediately classified me with EVERYONE else that thinks so.

And I never said you have to show respect to everyone. I only said that people shouldn't care whether a person believes in something or not, and that's not the same thing as "showing respect". I couldn't care less if someone told me he's a christian or islam or whatever. Good for them! Who am I to question what he thinks? That's not respect; that's indifference.

At 7/26/09 06:44 PM, Psychophobia wrote:

At 7/26/09 06:20 PM, reveihca wrote:

At 7/26/09 05:58 PM, Psychophobia wrote: The existence of the Universe.

Their are literally thousands of other theories, much more logical and realistic theories, explaining the creation of the Universe. I'm not stating they're correct, but does the fact we can't disprove any of these make them the correct one?

Because I have logic.

There is evidence to support it, but there is no evidence against it.

There is no evidence concerning God, it is no more believable than "A Giant Spaghetti monster," yet I can't disprove that either. Just because something can't be disproved doesn't mean it has been proved.

I have proof, you do not, I win.

But, spaghetti is real, and some buildings are huge (or, GIANT). Why not combine the two? The supposed Giant Spaghetti Monster is just a way to capture his worst fears in one artificial being. Just as religion is a way to

1) Control People
2) Fill the gaps in our knowledge of our universe. If a religious person doesn't know something? GOD DID IT!

Atheism is a fucking synonym for ignorance.

Not to be redundant but I've made my choice to be Atheist based on logic. How much logic is there behind any religion? Yet people deny accusations of God not existing and claim him to be real based on this lack of logic. That is truly ignorant.

Not to be redundant but I've made my choice to be Religious based on logic. How much logic is there behind the nonexistence of God?

Uh... Quite a bit actually. Does it really make sense to you that there is some, giant, all-seeing, all-powerful being? One being that controls everything? How can you deny the nonexistence of this thing? If "it" truly did have power over everything, there would be no atheists, no alternate religions.

And how can you deny scientific evidence? If you read the bible, most of the crazy feats and explainations are disproved by science!

I was a Christian at one point and based all of my beliefs on "faith." Faith is only grand when there is something there to have faith in. God my friend is not.

I am proud to say, I have never been an Atheist, although one day I thought about God, and if he was real, it was then, that I came to the definite conclusion, that there is a God.

What? You just decided, "There's a god. I'ma go make a sammywich!"? How can it be that simple for you? Don't you need justification, explainations of everything that happens? Or are you just so ignorant to everything around you that you will blindly follow whatever your parents force upon you?

That leads me to another issue--parents forcing religion on their children. It just disgusts me.

I believe

in god

I respect people's beliefs and their right to them, but I don't believe in people telling you what you should believe in. Thats my Belief.

Atheists are the reason that Stan Laurel doesn't have a girlfriend. Just kidding. Atheists are special people too, even though they don't believe in what they consider to be blatantly not there.