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The point of discussion and argument is not really to change anyone's mind but to examine your own.

At 10/2/08 01:44 AM, Grammer wrote:

ARGUING ON THE INTERNET ACCOMPLISHES SOMETHING

ESPECIALLY RELIGION. YOU CAN CONVINCE PEOPLE BY ARGUING RELIGION. I MEAN ITS NOT A PERSONAL THING OR ANYTHING

So doesn't that make your post about 10 times as useless?

At 10/2/08 01:06 AM, rompiscatole wrote: Religio . . . to bind. . . .religare

Wrong.

Religo [1] is "To tie out of the way; bind fast; moor"

If the verb was religio, the 2nd principal part would be religiare, not religare. Two different verbs.

Moreover, religo is related to the verb ligo [1] "To bind, fasten; attach; tie up"
"re" being the prefix to intensify to the verb.

The verb has no connection to our modern terms "religion".

The closest you get is the noun (and related adjective), religio, onis [f]= supernatural feeling of constraint; religious awe; superstition, etc etc.

The two are unrelated in any philogical sense.

it is not worth the trouble to abide by religion.

Fair enough, but you're gonna have to use another argument to show that, because I just DESTROYED your "argument from Latin".

At 10/2/08 11:31 AM, Grammer wrote:

At 10/2/08 06:21 AM, Drakim wrote: Actually, more than once I've gotten a PM from some person who says I changed their mind on some religious topic.

Because no one lies on the internet

<<

The nature of the PM gives me no reason at all to belive he was lying. (especially since we had been posting 10 posts back and forward in a topic) Why the frack would somebody lie about this? I mean, it's not exactly that you can use it as a sneak attack. All you do is strengthen the position of the arguer.

SadisticMonkey changed his mind due to e-arguing. Check his first posts and he was a Christian. And he credits it all to e-arguing. I've heard from a few deconverts that it was arguing on the internet that did it for them.

To be on-topic, of course we don't need religion. If there exists atheists, or people without religion, then we don't need religion. Whether people want to do without it is another question, and even from a religious person's point of view, if they're intellectually honest, the only reason religion exists is because God wants us to follow His religion, so it's not like the religion stories make it necessary either.

At 10/2/08 05:08 PM, Earfetish wrote: SadisticMonkey changed his mind due to e-arguing. Check his first posts and he was a Christian. And he credits it all to e-arguing. I've heard from a few deconverts that it was arguing on the internet that did it for them.

and RIchard Dawkin's website has a long list of people who de-converted by reading his book.

But I ain't gonna read it, sound boring as fuck. I say that to claim religious people wouldn't change their minds due to arguing is to call them retards, basically.

At 10/2/08 05:16 PM, poxpower wrote:

At 10/2/08 05:08 PM, Earfetish wrote: SadisticMonkey changed his mind due to e-arguing. Check his first posts and he was a Christian. And he credits it all to e-arguing. I've heard from a few deconverts that it was arguing on the internet that did it for them.

and RIchard Dawkin's website has a long list of people who de-converted by reading his book.

But I ain't gonna read it, sound boring as fuck. I say that to claim religious people wouldn't change their minds due to arguing is to call them retards, basically.

It's a great book, I love the language. It is really a book for people who "are sitting on the fence," not for reasoned atheists like us. Still it was an interesting read; funny at times and quite a resource of information. I don't agree with him entirely (the Big Bang stuff and all), but dr. Dawkins sure did a great job of kicking the religious nuts in their, well, nuts - by very decent means.

I really recommend it to any fencesitter, Deist or otherwise less unreasonable religious person.

GOD IS REAL!

And Everybody Knows That...

At 9/30/08 07:29 PM, Baalphegor wrote:

At 9/30/08 07:09 PM, Frattochino wrote: No one demanded you agree with the church's view. I demand you shouldn't forcefully try to change their tradition

Well, that would be good and well as long if the church were a isolated community far away from the rest of society, where people were magically born only heterosexual and minded their own business.

Sadly, this is not the case. The church influences society at large, your views affects the rest of us too. Like a social parasite clinging on to the public, feeding off their common sense and sanity, you need society to live, without masses of worshippers there would never be a church. Your thoughts, beliefs, faith and view are up to you to choose. However, what a person is thinking, believing and worshipping for will affect how a person acts. And when you preach hatred, the actions will be motivated by hatred. It's not a "leave us alone" scenario, because you push your dogma upon us. You taint us, and we will have none of it.

No the church doesnt preach hatred. It preaches that if you're gay, you're going to hell.

Also You're not born heterosexual, its subconsciously taught it by visuals, words, books, and experiences around every fucking second of your infant-young child years. If the world was 100% homosexual, do you think I'd heterosexual right now? Hell fucking no.

At 10/2/08 06:49 PM, Pencil-Clock wrote: GOD IS REAL!

And Everybody Knows That...

You feeling it necessary to bold your text and desperately following up with something that the last page of this thread alone proves false makes you a poor candidate for promoting your beliefs.

Truth is, nobody knows.

At 10/2/08 07:39 PM, Grammer wrote: Ever. Never ever. Never ever never ever NEVER.

Maybe not, but at least we can make them feel uncomfortable.

At 10/2/08 07:39 PM, Grammer wrote:

DO YOU HONESTLY BELIEVE FOR A SECOND THAT YOU CAN CONVERT SOMEONE WHO WAS RELIGIOUS PREVIOUSLY

here's a few hundred: http://richarddawkins.net/convertsCorner
oops

All bow down to SPODE!!!

sorry...too much Spore. lol

At 10/2/08 08:29 PM, Grammer wrote:

Fixed. Happy now?

So on NG, you're saying the religious people are much stupider and would never change their minds?

Or are you saying that the people who converted by reading Dawkins are soft-minded flil-floppers who'd go to a Branden Frazer movie?

You know how pathetic it is that they get mad at that?

I'm pretty sure you're the only one who's angry right now.
You type angry.

At 10/2/08 08:33 PM, Grammer wrote:

Holy shit that's fucking pathetic.

well if you spend YOUR ENTIRE LIFE being religious, I think that trumps internet debating by many MANY orders of magnitude.

Religion gives us purpose, a place to go when we don't know what to do, i myself have turned to god for help in my darkest times, and while there is conflict over it i still believe that we as humans need it for the sake of us having a friend who'll always stick by us

At 10/2/08 10:08 PM, Grammer wrote:

Oh, I believe in a God. I pray every once in a while,

why don't you pray for me to get a life?
Haha.

YOUR GOD SUCKS, CAN'T EVEN GET ME A LIFE

Grammer, if this is sooo pathetic and pointless, and it's not possible to change other people's opinions on the internet, then why the fuck have you made no less than a dozen replies to this thread in the past day, trying to change our opinions?

At 10/2/08 11:59 PM, Grammer wrote:

At 10/2/08 11:54 PM, poxpower wrote:

why don't you pray for me to get a life?

right...

Just out of curiosity, what do you even pray for?

At 10/3/08 12:39 AM, Grammer wrote:

At 10/3/08 12:31 AM, SadisticMonkey wrote: trying to change our opinions?

You can believe whatever the fuck you want

That wasn't my point.

You bitch and moan in all caps about how pointless it is, but then you spend post after post doing it yourself.

At 10/3/08 01:11 AM, anarchist665 wrote: But I leave you with this: One person may need religion to accept reality, while other stronger people don't. The question becomes, "Do you need religion to accept the physical world?"

Atheists exist, therefore the answer is no.

At 10/3/08 12:59 AM, Grammer wrote:

I used to do loooooooooooong ass prayers. Like, holy shit like 5 minutes long. And if I messed up somehow I would redo that one verse. Needless to say, I was holy shit fucking hardcore Christian. Eventually I grew out of that (with a lot of initial guilt), and then I stopped praying for a while. Now I just do The Lord's Prayer. Take 10 seconds.

Hey that reply was like 7 sentences.
hihihihi

So what did you ask in prayers?

At 10/3/08 01:24 AM, Grammer wrote: Seems to be something wrong with what you're saying.

If you did it once, fair enough.

But you make like a dozen posts about it, all because people didn't agree. Which means you were trying to change their minds.

At 10/3/08 01:31 AM, Grammer wrote: Nope. I guarantee you poxpower still thinks it's okay to debate religion, and ya know what?\

I said you were trying to try change his mind.

And sure, this may support your claim that you can't change opinions, but my point is after you preached on about how you shouldn't do it, you kept on doing it yourself.

I think this is my 4th post of the thread, I dunno :S

it's actually possible to go back and count them you know.

At 10/3/08 01:25 AM, Grammer wrote:

Guide, protect, spiritually bless persons

Did you pray for useless things because you knew that if you prayed for something real like super powers or money, it wouldn't work?

But I leave you with this: One person may need religion to accept reality, while other stronger people don't. The question becomes, "Do you need religion to accept the physical world?"

The question is defunct as it starts with a biased presumption.

If the question presumes a lack of religion creates "stronger" people, you're not asking if religion is necessary, you're asking if someone is/is not a pussy as YOU define them.

It's the difference between asking "Are you gay?" and "How gay are you?".

In your case, I'd make an initial assumption and ask the second question....... ;)

At 10/3/08 02:07 AM, Grammer wrote:

Why would God give me super powers, and why should God give me money just because I prayed for it? Seems a bit conceited, if you ask me

How is what you prayed for any different then?

At 10/3/08 01:38 AM, SadisticMonkey wrote: And sure, this may support your claim that you can't change opinions, but my point is after you preached on about how you shouldn't do it, you kept on doing it yourself.

truth be told, I see him as a foil to all the equally loud atheists who can't make a valid point for the life of them.

Annoying? Yes. Distracting? Yes. Pointless? Hell yes.

But at least the Christian perspective on that is fresher than that of the Atheists.

I'm an Apathetic myself......and if everyone were like me, we'd be in utopia already.

At 10/3/08 02:23 AM, Grammer wrote: You say basic shit but make it sound smart, and with a lot less words than I would use

Teach me your ways

PM plz

Start with an Apathetic belief. Then have a natural tendency to see Irony and point it out in every instance.

Also, be on a Hell-bent mission to shape up the forum by not arguing points, but by pointing out the flaws in each person's argument, in an attempt to raise the intelligence bar slightly above "Pawn scum" levels.

Also, learn Greek so when people throw Bible quotes, you remind them you can read the NT in the original friggin language, and their translation and subsequent interpretation is bull-fuck-crap.

I also demand use of the term bull-fuck-crap.

At 10/3/08 03:09 AM, Grammer wrote:
I am now going to use the term bull fuck crap (dropping hyphens cause I'm a rebel)

Yeah, because taking what someone else made and changing one detail makes you rebellious, just like all the other kiddies.

Go get that tat of an asian symbol and preach non-conformity like all the other kids.

Even when you're a rebel you conform......sucker....

Holy shit, this is like my 11th post just on this PAGE. I blame myself for constantly double posting, but in my defense people have been addressing me a lot.

Because you're being loud and annoying, and people generally get off on that. The rule about "Don't feed the trolls" is a myth.

*runs*

Take anarchist665 with you.
Might as well be his actual name.....title anarchist, then his serial number.

That's right kiddies, rebellious behavior has itself become the consensus, making y'all no longer cool or unique. Fall in line with your other rebellious peers!!!

Or be truly rebellious and just get smarter than all of them.....