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At 9/14/08 01:12 AM, X-Gary-Gigax-X wrote: With this topic, I hope I can save some atheists from getting fucked in the afterlife with this. I've said this before, but the topic went down before any people could really argue with me or see it, so I've created the ultimate question that proves God exists. It starts"what created man?" Let's start small, with my assistant, atheist mcaith. So mcaith, what DID create man?
"it was the atom you cunt!!! god doesn't exist!"
and what created the atom?
"energy you fucktard!!! Go kill yourself, god beleivers drag down everyones IQ!"
And, what created energy?
"um... um... well what created god you moron? see! He's a fairytale!"

well, ignoring that you completely dodged my question in an attempt to prove your evidence while acting like mine just vanished, I'll answer that. Because god is so powerful and beyond us, we can't comprehend how he came to be, maybe he doesn't even know. Now you should see my theory is more legitimate than their is no higher force, and matter appeared at the beginning of time like you atheists basically have to believe to be an atheist , but feel free to continue your worthless arguing
towards me. I would also like to add the bible and the torah and whatever is 90% shit writing, and you should only trust the morals in these books. Religous books were created by several wise men, but only morally wise. And since everyone has their flaws, they all made different opinions, and some even contradict eachother. So no, I am not a bible boy. Once again, feel free to argue with me. I'll be waiting.

Also, I'm going to bed.

I'd rather grow up than be born again!
Why is your god a 'he'? What purpose would a transcendental entity have for a penis.
Creationism or belief in your god, neither are a theory as they do not predict anything. Theories predict fruitfully or are replaced.
The christian bible can be dismissed as only the writings of humans on page 1 where it mentions God places two lights in the heavens (read sun and moon), even then humans knew the difference between a light source and a reflector.
Lets consider your god does not know where 'he' comes from. That statement is in direct conflict with the bible where it is stated god knows alpha to omega (read 'all'). Your god cannot know everything as 'he' cannot know what it is like to be not god.
If Evolution theory is found to be 'wrong' that does not make an alternative 'theory' right! Read about false dichotomies.
Eternity, have you ever considered that concept? think about the statement 'Eternity is a sentence, not just a word'.
Let go of your need for a security blanket and dare to be wise (sapere aude) or stay deceived and caged.

At 9/15/08 05:04 AM, Eoewe wrote: Any form of deity or godhead can neither be proven or disproven.

Which makes you wonder how these threads even get this big.

And I can prove I use my cock

At 9/14/08 01:16 AM, AlacritySoundz wrote: Wow. That WASTED MY TIME.

High five mine too.

Energy cannot be created or destroted and that still does not prove that god exists. It is imposible to explain what created god or the universe, so its pointless trying to "prove" that one or the other exist or not.

If that's your definition of god, then who says it's a sentient being... God could just be energy or a set of 'Higs Boson'. In any case, given empirical evidence, if god is sentient, I doubt that he cares much about the human race. The only things that make this world 'nice' is ourselves; humans support each other... As humans, we have structured this chaotic universe to meet our desires but without this man-made order, life would be a miserable experience for us.

If you MUST do so, look at it this way. What if you're (atheists) wrong? If you're wrong, you go te hell and get fucked up the ass with a fire hot, sand papery, 3 inch thick dildo whilst all of the cristians sit in heaven having a great time, always happy, no pain, no sadness. however, if I'm wrong (and Im not) then guess what happens to me? the same fuckin thing as everyone else: nothing.

"God exists" and thus, ignored completely by me. I read nothing.

Is the Earth 'made' for us, or are we 'made' for the Earth?

evolution certainly argues for the latter, religion for the former.

At 9/19/08 12:04 PM, Darthcow wrote: If you MUST do so, look at it this way. What if you're (atheists) wrong? If you're wrong, you go te hell and get fucked up the ass with a fire hot, sand papery, 3 inch thick dildo whilst all of the cristians sit in heaven having a great time, always happy, no pain, no sadness. however, if I'm wrong (and Im not) then guess what happens to me? the same fuckin thing as everyone else: nothing.

Meh, I've been there and now that I'm out of Christianity there is not a doubt in my mind that there is no heaven and hell as described in the Bible. I believe it so much that I don't even see the point of believing it 'just in case' I might as well believe in Leprechauns.
Secondly, what's to say that Christianity is the right religion? Maybe Muslims are right... In which case christians go straight to hell.... Maybe Hindus are right - hell again. At least if I'm non-religious I could say "Oh I'm sorry, I was just confused, the universal laws which you (god) have created were so perfect that I was fooled into believing them, take it as a compliment".

Another point; if I could choose between heaven and hell, I think I'd prefer hell in the long term... I don't know about you, but I don't think I could live a perfect life without any problems - I'd need to be challenged, I don't want to spend eternity just feeling 'wonderful' (I might as well do drugs if I want free feelings). Afterlife would have no meaning if there were no problems to solve... There would be no sense of accomplishment and rising up in the face of adversity; whereas in hell, while it might be horribly uncomfortable, at least I'd have the option of bettering myself and my condition, thus I would feel satisfaction. If I was raped by a sandpaper dildo as you described, at least I'd have accomplished something once I got out of this situation... At least in hell I could still have dreams; in heaven there would be no dreams because all dreams would be reality.

I'm not quite an atheist, because I choose to dedicate my religion into believing in multiple Gods.
Go ahead and try to prove me wrong that multiple Gods exist, it's only what people believe and what they choose to play a big role in their lives. If it's not what you believe, well, good for you but don't pesker around other people's heads for believing what you think is bullcrap.

This was a serious post, TL;DR? GTFO!

At 9/19/08 12:04 PM, Darthcow wrote: If you MUST do so, look at it this way. What if you're (atheists) wrong? If you're wrong, you go te hell and get fucked up the ass with a fire hot, sand papery, 3 inch thick dildo whilst all of the cristians sit in heaven having a great time, always happy, no pain, no sadness. however, if I'm wrong (and Im not) then guess what happens to me? the same fuckin thing as everyone else: nothing.

And if you go to church solely out of fear you get to go to hell anyway. Seriously Christian boy what if your wrong and you get to be reincarnated as a pig, yeah better to be safe and live your life by Brahma's rules then risk it right?

If you believe God appeared the same way you just said atoms can NOT, then you're stabbing yourself in the back, aren't you?

If you haven't guessed yet, yes, I'm an atheist, or however you spell it in English. Why is man so obsessed with religion? People from many hundreds of thousands of years back, have wondered how it all started. They couldn't find an awnser. There is none. There probably is, but we will never know. (Scientists, you may try - you will fail.) - simply because, once you've proven on how something came to be, another question will rise, being how did it occur? The awnser will be this and that reacted and stuff happened, but where did 'this and that' come from then? This can go on forever. We must simply acknowledge the fact, we will never know. There is no logical explanation to HOW, but more importantly WHY, everything exists. Only the thought of a question with no end is actually frightening. People *must* have an awnser. Thus came religion. People thought of an awnser themselves, in which they were willing to believe in. It gives them a form of structure, a feeling of hope and what not. Religion, is not a bad thing. It's a perfect substitute for that which is nothing. I do not believe in God. I respect those who do, I respect those who don't. We all have our views on this matter, and we are all wrong. However, what bothers me the most, is how we all think that we know the awnser. We *all* think, that we have proof. We have validation, but how can you validate that which does not exist? Certain philosophers thought that something, cannot emerge from nothing. (Don't we all?) So they set out to find the 'arch'. Something, that has ALWAYS been there and out of which all existance can be clarified.

I refer to this 'arch' as God. People claim that there must've been something, since the beginning of time.. *something*, that could be 'the' awnser to the question 'to be or not to be?'.. after all, if we cannot explain existance, then how can we explain who we are? Who are we? Do you know who you are? Then tell me. You may tell me your name. Does your name define who you are? It does not. You tell me it's your personality. Does personality define who you are? Again, it does not. Want to know what defines YOU? Then seek the definition, of definition. It is what other people think of you. What THEY think, is you. It's possibly this realization that spawned forth the idea of good and evil. Right, and wrong...

Heaven, and hell?

You could try to back out of this conversation right now. You could make up excuses as "but there's more than one religion!"

To which I will awnser "Yes, there are.", but then again, what defines religion? If I speak to you about religion, does a certain one come to mind? No, you will think of religion as a whole. That's not strange. For I have just given you the definition of religion. I have just clarified the awnser, to the unawnserable question. Then again, can you clarify the mind?

We're persuing illusions created by our misguided senses.

Scary thought, isn't it?

At 9/19/08 12:20 PM, Earfetish wrote: Is the Earth 'made' for us, or are we 'made' for the Earth?

evolution certainly argues for the latter, religion for the former.

big long essay on this particular subject written by me

At 9/14/08 01:20 AM, Orange-Jews wrote: maybe you should learn a little about the big bang theory before you make a fool out of yourself.

I concur.

And who were you having that conversation with?

OK as I've read something about atheists through the ages, I'd make the most common question they always asked the people who thought God was almighty:
If God is so mighty, can he create a stone that even he can't lift?

At 9/14/08 01:12 AM, X-Gary-Gigax-X wrote: "energy you fucktard!!! Go kill yourself, god beleivers drag down everyones IQ!"
And, what created energy?

;;;;;;;;;
Energy CANNOT BE CREATED OR DESTROYED ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !
It can only be CHANGED.

Stick that up your god theory (and or your ass )
Pointy Dagger gets it....Digital Terror doesn't you see Digi, it has always existed in one form or another DUH!!!
Pure Metal UTA has a clue as well.
AloysiusRexford is on the right track...but matter anti matter do not 'destroy' each other , they cancel each other (think positive & negative or as a plus & minus as in math)
Zannthebored is also on track
andy70707 is also on the right track
5 people out of 243 replies....that is fuckin scarey !

try to remember that God & existence or not of GOD has absolutely nothing to do with any Earth Religion.
NOT
ONE
DAMN
THING
!
!
!

At 9/19/08 03:00 PM, morefngdbs wrote: Pointy Dagger gets it....Digital Terror doesn't you see Digi, it has always existed in one form or another DUH!!!

I'm just saying that it is a theory, and he said that theories cannot be proven, thus contradicting himself. It's simple to understand, I'm not saying that it's wrong, but he contradicted himself, and that's all I'm saying.

At 9/19/08 03:10 PM, Digital-Terror wrote: and that's all I'm saying.

sure but it didn't need to be created....it already was !
it was just in a different form :)

So if energy cannot be created or destroyed according to science.

what created energy in the first place?

It defies explaination, so science cannot explain how energy was created.

and all REAL scientists will agree, the big bang theory or evolution IS NOT 100% PROVEN
every scientist will admit that there is a definite chance that evolution is complete bogus.

So you must admit, science could very well be flawed. (or you're in denial)

So, all you atheists must admit that your reasoning COULD be wrong.

Religion is just a different reasoning for how life was created.

So now all you atheists can stop insulting us because we have a different view on life

I personally cannot believe that over millions of years a single cell can mutate into an intelligent and sophisticated being.

I admit my reasoning could be wrong, but i don't believe that it is.

At 9/19/08 03:27 PM, skwurlll wrote:

and all REAL scientists will agree, the big bang theory or evolution IS NOT 100% PROVEN
every scientist will admit that there is a definite chance that evolution is complete bogus.

Woah woah woah! Evolution is the only theory accepted by scientists, and is proven beyond any significant doubt as the only means by which life could have formed on this planet. I've heard this argument spouted by the religious again and again, yet there is only ONE scientific theory, and only one theory accepted by scientists. The evidence for it is absolutely overwhelming- in the words of my first year evolution lecturer, an expert in the field, at least as convincing as the evidence that the Earth is round. Every piece of evidence fits the theory, it has been observed numerous times within various species, especially bacteria, and there are even mathematical formulas formulated for the rate of evolution over time. Just because the majority of people do not understand it does not make it any less true.

So you must admit, science could very well be flawed. (or you're in denial)

There may be small things (and don't misinterpret that as anything significant to the theory as a whole) that we don't fully understand, after all there are still thousands of scientists around the world doing research on science, but that doesn't make what we know flawed, just incomplete. Seriously, there are NO credible scientists that believe anything other than evolution, it is the very corner stone of biology- quite literally everything I have studied in my biology degree over the last 4 years has centred on evolution. While biological pathways, or medicine explain how things work, evolution explains why things are like they are. It is just as important and accepted within biology as the laws of thermodynamics and gravity are in physics. Hell, even many religious people believe in evolution, and have discarded creationism as the outdated fairytale that it is, no different to the Greek belief that the Sun was dragged around by a God in a chariot. Continued belief in something so patently false only damages the image of religion, the sooner it removes itself from creationism the better it will be for it. After all the religious are all too keen to distance themselves from a lot of the rest of the old testament, where God actively kills and maims at will, with clear hatred of women and homosexuals amongst other things, yet when it comes to this many seem stubbornly unable to banish it.

So, all you atheists must admit that your reasoning COULD be wrong.

Or religion could open its eyes and realise it is ignoring the blindingly obvious because they are scared their faith may be wrong.

Religion is just a different reasoning for how life was created.

With absolutely zero evidence supporting it.

I personally cannot believe that over millions of years a single cell can mutate into an intelligent and sophisticated being.

Then you don't understand evolution. That doesn't invalidate the theory.

I admit my reasoning could be wrong, but i don't believe that it is.

The fact is an unbiased observer needs to weigh the evidence on each side. One side has mountains of evidence in its favour, the other has none, and indeed is ridiculous based on any observations you care to make given the abject lack of a 'God' anywhere within our observable spectra. Just because we can't put back the clock and observe it, that doesn't make each option equally likely. Any logical person must choose the means with the most evidence supporting it, and that is without question evolution.

You can't create energy, just transfer it. And how about Religion answers one of our book load of questions rather than you asking us one invalid one?

Nobody can prove there is a god, or gods, or even afterlife. People are ignorant to think that we are the only planet with living organisms when there are billions of stars in our one galaxy, and billions of galaxies in our universe.

At 9/14/08 04:24 AM, aListers wrote: man I wish I was atheiest so I could prove energy was always there!

Man, i wish i was a believer so I could prove God was always there! Oh wait, you cant...

im pretty sure you cant create or destroy MATTER, but maybe its changed. it certainly will change if the large hadron collider is a success, because they are looking for antimatter. anti matter destroys its corresponding matter, so the 'you cant destroy matter' theory may be flawed.

At 9/15/08 04:52 AM, AbsintheClock wrote: I will go down on any mod that will close this thread.

Fuck yes, now I'm glad I skimmed through this LAME SHITHOLE of REHASHED OPINIONS that EVERYONE'S HEARD.

Anyway, the great thing about the god/no god debate is this: God is a belief. You aren't supposed to 'prove' he exists, because to attempt to do so is to admit that you doubt him, which is the very nature of sin itself. Believe me, I'm a confirmed Catholic.

But at the same time, atheist philosophy rejects belief in favor of that which can be proven by the rigors of logical analysis. The two are fundamentally incompatible. You can't prove to a believer his belief is false... it doesn't work that way. Same way you can't convince a non-believer to believe based on the strength of your own convictions.

I think the only thing that atheists will agree on is this: you can't prove that there is a God, and you cannot prove there isn't. Believers will agree with this: you can't prove that there is a God (and you needn't bother), and you cannot prove there isn't.

So, seeing as how theists are arguing faith and atheists are arguing proof... why can't we just all agree (especially after seeing how much everyone has to say on the subject without actually saying anything) that the entire argument is MOOT.

Consequently, I'm locking this thread. It'll reappear next week and you guys can all throw in your opinions again.