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At 2/7/11 10:19 AM, Chronamut wrote: what I want to see is a "sent to all fans" fudction in your inbox where you can say "hey I made a new song - <link> go check it out!

for someone like me with over 1200 fans, it' be a huge feedback venue to take advantage of.

Excellent idea, I'd love to have that feature too.
Is there any staff member we can talk to and ask for this feature?

How about having to write a review if youre going to vote whatsoever.
That way people actually ahve to listen to your music, and if they just spam some hershaherpa in the comment box they are emediately busted.

At 2/14/11 09:44 AM, Calamaistr wrote: How about having to write a review if youre going to vote whatsoever.
That way people actually ahve to listen to your music, and if they just spam some hershaherpa in the comment box they are emediately busted.

What if one reviews
"I vote 0 on your songs cuz I'm jealous and I don't want you to get any exposure" :P

if people zero vote out of jealousy, then this is one cruel place.

At 2/15/11 09:35 AM, LfunkeyA wrote: if people zero vote out of jealousy, then this is one cruel place.

welcome to newgrounds

At 2/15/11 09:48 AM, Acid-Paradox wrote:

At 2/15/11 09:35 AM, LfunkeyA wrote: if people zero vote out of jealousy, then this is one cruel place.

welcome to newgrounds

Every time someone -- the actual AP system -- zero-bombs one of my compositions, I will take it to mean their jealous. Just my way of makin' it through another day :P

Now nice thread! Bookmarked!

Thank you for making it!

At 2/15/11 02:44 PM, RampantMusik wrote:

At 2/15/11 09:48 AM, Acid-Paradox wrote:

At 2/15/11 09:35 AM, LfunkeyA wrote: if people zero vote out of jealousy, then this is one cruel place.

welcome to newgrounds

Every time someone -- the actual AP system -- zero-bombs one of my compositions, I will take it to mean their jealous. Just my way of makin' it through another day :P

Two of my recent submissions got zero-bombed over three times each in the span of five hours. I think I'll try to take that as a compliment now.

At 5/30/11 07:30 AM, DonCarrera wrote:

Two of my recent submissions got zero-bombed over three times each in the span of five hours. I think I'll try to take that as a compliment now.

Yea, I noticed that when I listen to your more recent songs... Somebody really must hate you lol... but meh, just gather up more followers, and hopefully you can gain a better audience (which I'm still being lazy about hahaha)

honestly i do believe some revamp is past due for the voting system in the AP.

Lets say (to make things easier for myself) that a user starts with a 5 score. If 4 other user vote that down with a 1, then it becomes a 1.5 average score. So it evens out very quickly if the song is just being voted up by the user. However if someone drops a SINGLE 0 bomb on you then it would take 24 people to vote 5 to even bring you back to a 4.8 (that's 25 votes of 5 and one vote of 0). Now, any song with 25 5 votes and one 0 has blatantly been 0 bombed, and that's a really unlikely example, but you can plainly see that a massively negative vote has a far greater impact than a fair vote. This example also doesn't take repeat voting and weighting into account either.

It's simple really, anyone taking the time to vote a 0 on ANYTHING is doing so for underhand reasons. If you hate a song, then a 1 is low enough, no matter what you think about it, the producer took time and effort to make it and that deserves SOME score at least. For me, actually taking time out of your day to go into a song and vote it 0 is just spiteful and allowing people to do this day in and day out is wrong.

The site should have implemented a system to occasionally weed out accounts which vote 0 on a higher ratio than the average at least. If an account does this on a regular basis, votes 0 more than once on a song or does it consistently over a period of time, then you know what; their input is not good input and it's not helping anyone on the site.

Anyway, I read through the first page of this thread and the last and I have a suggestion to make which may help reduce the amount of zerobombers. I'm sorry if this has already been suggested, I just don't want to look through the other 20 pages.

If a user votes anything from 0-2 on a submission they will be required to write a review stating why they thought the submission was worth such a low score. the vote will not be added to the score until the review is submitted.

Two things may result from this;
1. A user will actually write a proper, honest review on why they think the submission sucks. This sort of response I think would be more acceptable than a simple low vote and will give the submitter a chance to see what they did wrong.

2. A user will put nonsense in a review and will probably not make sense, (what a true zerobomber would do). If these "nonsense" reviews are flagged or considered useless by too many users then the vote and the review score should automatically be deleted.

The reason I put the range of 0-2 voting is because a score of anything less than 3 seems low. If this seems like a good idea to most people then I hope it will reach the site moderators. Hope I helped!

Had an idea before which I thought would be a good system for the AP.

What if we only had a 'Like' button on every song? It's simple, the more likes you get, the further up the charts your song moves. If someone doesn't like it, they can simply just leave the page. Yeah, you'd have to take away people's ability to vote on their own songs but I think this idea would put a stop to zero bombing without too much of a change to the system, wouldn't it?

I know this will never happen but it's just a thought.

At 6/1/11 04:38 PM, zelazon wrote:

At 5/30/11 07:30 AM, DonCarrera wrote:

Two of my recent submissions got zero-bombed over three times each in the span of five hours. I think I'll try to take that as a compliment now.

Yea, I noticed that when I listen to your more recent songs... Somebody really must hate you lol... but meh, just gather up more followers, and hopefully you can gain a better audience (which I'm still being lazy about hahaha)

They don't hate or jealous, 0-bombers or trolls just have nothing to do in hand beside screwing up other's work.

I like Supersteph54's idea, may keep these cunts out for a while. Nechura's solution isn't bad at all, but think about to redesign all the rating systems, it will be a huge job for the admins.

All of my work recently just get voted down badly also, seems like someone targeted my stuff just for fun.

This may or may not work for 0 bombing... but hear me out.

Why not keep a log of everyone who's voted on a certain song on that song's page. Like right down next to the 0-5 icons with little yellow text that reads "see who voted". When that little yellow text is clicked, a separate window pops up with a list of everyone's username who's voted. Included on that list is the score they voted, and how long they remained on the page before voting.

I don't know why voters have to be kept private, and by doing this 0 bombers can be weeded out and either banned or punished, their ability to vote stripped from them, or perhaps made public on a forum of all known 0 bombers.

However this is just a thought... and I haven't been keeping up on what the NG redesign entails, or if it's been established on what's going to be done about the AP voting redesign... but yeah. Any input on this idea?

Getting zero-bombed is a time honoured tradition here at Newgrounds. The only, and BEST thing to do to coutner it, is ignore it. Don't judge yoru song's worth by it's score alone, or at all. It's the reviews, and the support of the audio community that matters.

The above has been explained multiple times before...

Yes i realize this, but 0 bombing is something that's trying to get solved for the new redesign, is it not? I recall reading a thread by Tom not too terribly long ago, him asking the community what to do about it. I'm just posting my suggestion to the problem, and however you don't really have an answer or any true important input to what I've proposed; I respect your thoughts that it's some type of "tradition".

However I don't feel it's a tradition. And it would be safe to assume that we don't judge our song's quality on merely the score, of course reviews and support comes into play, but the score reflects our positioning on the lists, which fuels more support. The only support we really get is when the song is first posted and displayed on the AP front page for that short duration of time as other people submit their work as well. The Audio Advertisement thread really does no good, and the review request club is decent, but it isn't all that great either in terms of getting your music out there, you know?

Just throwing it out there.

The tradition comment was sarcastic -_______________-

Either way, a voting log has been brought up COUNTLESS times. Lil jim has even written pages on how it would be inconvenience.

Basically people would get butt hurt and go after other people for giving low scores, I honestly give out a lot of 2s and 3s and to people who are getting 5 votes per song every vote is a BIG DEAL to them. Apart from that its a anonymity thing. Glance through this thread to find more thought out responses about it pro and counter.

At 1/1/12 05:50 PM, montehawks wrote: I recall reading a thread by Tom not too terribly long ago, him asking the community what to do about it.

Because back then there were lesser people, which means the audio portal had lesser douche-bags and there weren't genre like 'Dubstep' for them to praise yet.

The Audio Advertisement thread really does no good, and the review request club is decent, but it isn't all that great either in terms of getting your music out there, you know?

The Audio Ad has its pro and con. Personally I think it has more pros than cons. Also you have contests are going on almost every months. You have 101 ways to get your stuff notice on here. You use a bit thinking and everything will be fine.

end rants...

At 1/2/12 03:41 PM, Computer112 wrote:

At 1/1/12 05:50 PM, montehawks wrote: I recall reading a thread by Tom not too terribly long ago, him asking the community what to do about it.

Because back then there were lesser people, which means the audio portal had lesser douche-bags and there weren't genre like 'Dubstep' for them to praise yet.

"not too terribly long ago" as in maybe a month ago, but less than two months. Dubstep was genre, and I doubt the number on the AP increased that dramatically over that last month.

The Audio Advertisement thread really does no good, and the review request club is decent, but it isn't all that great either in terms of getting your music out there, you know?

The Audio Ad has its pro and con. Personally I think it has more pros than cons. Also you have contests are going on almost every months. You have 101 ways to get your stuff notice on here. You use a bit thinking and everything will be fine.

I agree that everything has it's pros and cons, and yea I suppose I haven't gotten myself involved with competitions as of yet, but I've noticed over the past couple years it's mostly the same people that enter over and over again, and the top NG artists usually win time and time again. So yeah there's a chance you could get noticed, but it's unlikely in my opinion. However I could be wrong, and I am probably wrong - I'll have to enter one :3

And jpbear, I agree with you that a log could be bad because people would be set on revenge, so why not make it so only mods can view the logs after a complaint has been made? If the mod sees that a person has repeatedly voted 0's across the board, maybe a PM warning would be in order. If that doesn't fix the issue, a ban from voting or something.

And coming to my mind about the whole 0 bombing thing would be fake accounts people make just to vote 0s. I just want to address that quick by saying a newbie account thats low level wouldn't affect anything much... and to leave a real impact you'll need an account with more weight... and I don't think people would spend weeks leveling up an account to just get it banned from voting after 0bombing a few things. Idk.

And to address the huge increase in complaints this system would most likely create... I suggest volunteer mods who only deal with this issue. I'm sure there's plenty of people here that would love an opportunity to do the AP some good. Myself included.

At 1/2/12 04:42 PM, montehawks wrote: it's mostly the same people that enter over and over again, and the top NG artists usually win time and time again. So yeah there's a chance you could get noticed, but it's unlikely in my opinion.

That-IS-True. Once you are popular then you are the king/queen. Anyway, although I don't believe in chance and fate shit. But now I have to admit that if your stuff is 'luckily' get into some kick ass flash, you are fast upon the sky like a rocket.

Also, you need public relation for notice-boost.

Back in 2009, almost none of my tracks have used flash. In 2010 I submitted only a one lonely track. Luckily an artist went by and decided to side up mine with 2 other kick-ass tracks by Classical veterans on NG in his flash. Shit gets great since then.

And to address the huge increase in complaints this system would most likely create... I suggest volunteer mods who only deal with this issue. I'm sure there's plenty of people here that would love an opportunity to do the AP some good. Myself included.

I have been fighting the damn thing for almost a year now. First, we have this AudioVotes, think of it as turn-based voting, but later the founder dumped it down the trash can. Not a word from him since then.

I do promotion posts every 2-3 weeks or so on my frontpage-per-14-days post for newcomers. And some off site promotions too. Seems to have some effects lol.

and of course I rarely promote myself.

Back in 2009, almost none of my tracks have used flash. In 2010 I submitted only a one lonely track. Luckily an artist went by and decided to side up mine with 2 other kick-ass tracks by Classical veterans on NG in his flash. Shit gets great since then.

Not all of us are fortunate enough to be featured in an animation :3

I have been fighting the damn thing for almost a year now. First, we have this AudioVotes, think of it as turn-based voting, but later the founder dumped it down the trash can. Not a word from him since then.

Not exactly sure what to say about this one. Seems horribly ineffective. Lol.

Also... I noticed all of my latest tracks are now 0.1x lower in score. I guess I shouldn't have submitted my suggestion. What a shame that is.

simplicity of trance
helpful criticism is needed

At 1/11/12 09:56 PM, cecilyokami wrote: simplicity of trance
helpful criticism is needed

Then post it in the Audio Advertisements thread.

seriously... please remove voting and leave it to review only. people won't be able to 0bomb anonymously and without constructive feedback anymore.

At 57 minutes ago, SirSirius wrote: seriously... please remove voting and leave it to review only. people won't be able to 0bomb anonymously and without constructive feedback anymore.

Eh, no. Taking away the voting won't increase the amount of reviews you'll get, let alone that they'll be more constructive. Besides, how will the top of the week be decided then? Would be pretty unfair to base that on downloads or review scores only, because then we would see nobody else but xKore, Waterflame, NIGHTkilla, F-777, ParagonX9 and all other artists who happen to have the biggest fanbases on here.

Then just remove the voting power... seriously thats retarded shit. 5 people vote 5 stars, then one guy comes and im below 4... dafuq?

At 21 minutes ago, SirSirius wrote: Then just remove the voting power... seriously thats retarded shit. 5 people vote 5 stars, then one guy comes and im below 4... dafuq?

Maybe because he votes 0?

At 5 minutes ago, DJDela wrote:

At 21 minutes ago, SirSirius wrote: Then just remove the voting power... seriously thats retarded shit. 5 people vote 5 stars, then one guy comes and im below 4... dafuq?

Maybe because he votes 0?

so? 6 votes, total 25 stars... 25/6 = 4,16