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At 9/1/09 06:59 PM, verycoolguy wrote:

At 9/1/09 12:46 PM, Supersteph54 wrote:

At 8/30/09 03:25 PM, Heki wrote: I think the worst is Olimar. Without the little olimars he's useless, and even if he has those olimars, he's stilla a below-average character imo.

I 100% agree with you. Oh, and those 'little olimars' are Pikmin, FYI :P.

Hey buddy lets play again. I'll turn that 100% agreement, into a 100% disagreement.

Lol OK, but can we put the items up to medium this time. SSBB sucks without items.

(And please, nobody call me a noob for using items. Items are there to be used, not to become 'noob material'.)

At 8/30/09 02:14 PM, burrito15 wrote:

At 3/23/08 07:09 PM, DarkSoldier wrote:

At 3/23/08 07:04 PM, PsycoticDemon wrote:

Sonic cant kill shit without his final smash though.

If you know how to use it. You can own.

If you mean spamming the same rolling attacks over and over again, then yes.

...
lrn2playssb n00b.

all items off and on "none".

At 8/29/09 12:53 PM, dajudge wrote:

At 8/29/09 12:23 PM, klad5 wrote: not sonic cuz the "your to Slow!" Is Funny Toon Link Is Easy to k.o.

How is telling your opponent that he's too slow is funny?

Plus, TL isn't easy to KO. He a bitch to hit with his god damn item gimping.

His bombs, boomerangs and arrows, not the ones in the item menu.

true but Tl can be k.o'd with 999% funny thing is that Tl can't get that much damage

In me point i think 30% cause like, yes i suck with olimar but say if the best SSBB player in the world plays with olimar and he kicks ass. do you know what im talkin bout??

At 9/2/09 05:32 AM, Supersteph54 wrote: Lol OK, but can we put the items up to medium this time. SSBB sucks without items.

No. Items are ridiculously broken as hell, unfair, and totally random and gay. And Brawl has a great competitive scene (ironically...). Items would just make Smash a slot machine, except in Brawl, many items kill before 20%, which is retarded. Items are fun in three-four player matches though.

We're playing match-up practice, to see if you really hate Olimar, for what he is, and with no interference of random pops of items that kill at any percent.

At 9/2/09 07:00 PM, verycoolguy wrote:

At 9/2/09 05:32 AM, Supersteph54 wrote: Lol OK, but can we put the items up to medium this time. SSBB sucks without items.

No. Items are ridiculously broken as hell, unfair, and totally random and gay. And Brawl has a great competitive scene (ironically...). Items would just make Smash a slot machine, except in Brawl, many items kill before 20%, which is retarded. Items are fun in three-four player matches though.

We're playing match-up practice, to see if you really hate Olimar, for what he is, and with no interference of random pops of items that kill at any percent.

No, I disagree. Items do come up randomly, but that gives the person a challenge to get to it before his opponent does, and by using items, you learn how to time dodging right, get used to which angle to throw it, and turn the tables on your opponent.

Well... here's the deal. We add the Smash Ball and set the items to medium. Agreed?
Oh and, it won't be fair if I beat you or you beat me because of lagging. I lagg every few seconds, and it stays stuck for at least 1 second with me, and because of that, I can't move, dodge, or add a direction to my special move or smash attack. Lagging sucks. So in other words, this'll only be for fun, and nobody can make me think Olimar as powerful unless they really own the heck out of me >: ).

Ness

At 9/3/09 06:43 AM, glintbeetle wrote: Ness

Ugh. NEW character.

Olimar, he's terrible!

At 9/3/09 05:58 AM, Supersteph54 wrote:

No, I disagree. Items do come up randomly, but that gives the person a challenge to get to it before his opponent does, and by using items, you learn how to time dodging right, get used to which angle to throw it, and turn the tables on your opponent.

Well... here's the deal. We add the Smash Ball and set the items to medium. Agreed?
Oh and, it won't be fair if I beat you or you beat me because of lagging. I lagg every few seconds, and it stays stuck for at least 1 second with me, and because of that, I can't move, dodge, or add a direction to my special move or smash attack. Lagging sucks. So in other words, this'll only be for fun, and nobody can make me think Olimar as powerful unless they really own the heck out of me >: ).

Yeah if we are on opposite sides of the stage, and the Golden Hammer or the Fan appears behind me, you totally have a chance to get that item, and it's totally fair. Also item play would just give speedy characters a huge advantage
From what i remember, the only person who KO'd me was myself as I SD'd. I remember many 5 stock matches and you haven't taken one stock from me by yourself. I am not used to that lag either, but not being able to take a life in a many 5 stock matches would have nothing to do with lag. It's just the huge gap in player skill.

At 9/3/09 07:12 PM, verycoolguy wrote: From what i remember, the only person who KO'd me was myself as I SD'd. I remember many 5 stock matches and you haven't taken one stock from me by yourself. I am not used to that lag either, but not being able to take a life in a many 5 stock matches would have nothing to do with lag. It's just the huge gap in player skill.

Sounds like some online raep. Good job vcg.
And items are crap. if it can be thrown, you have a major advantage.

Seriously, who tries to one-hit kill with the baseball bat when it kills just as fast with throws?

All of that aside, Olimar is an extremely powerful newcomer. All of Olimar's attacks (excluding tilts and Nair) involve his Pikmin, which means that all of these attacks have 'disjointed' property; in other words, they are weapons that aren't part of the user's body(swords, lucario's aura, ness's bat, etc), and they serve as shields as much as they do weapons, because if said weapon is hit, the user receives no damage. Since almost all of Olimar's attacks are like that, he can pretty much just win by jiggling the Cstick like an epileptic person going through a seizure, since the attacks are fast, overpowering and block physical attacks AND projectiles.

His Up Smash kills at about 90%; ridiculous.

Side B is is camping game.

Olimar's Neutral B and Down B GUARANTEE he'll always have Pikmin by his side.

Also, have you seen his grab range? Freaking reaches 3 Olimars in front of him, and blue pikmin Back Throw is like an OHKO at like 70%.

At 9/3/09 07:12 PM, verycoolguy wrote:

At 9/3/09 05:58 AM, Supersteph54 wrote:

No, I disagree. Items do come up randomly, but that gives the person a challenge to get to it before his opponent does, and by using items, you learn how to time dodging right, get used to which angle to throw it, and turn the tables on your opponent.

Well... here's the deal. We add the Smash Ball and set the items to medium. Agreed?
Oh and, it won't be fair if I beat you or you beat me because of lagging. I lagg every few seconds, and it stays stuck for at least 1 second with me, and because of that, I can't move, dodge, or add a direction to my special move or smash attack. Lagging sucks. So in other words, this'll only be for fun, and nobody can make me think Olimar as powerful unless they really own the heck out of me >: ).

Yeah if we are on opposite sides of the stage, and the Golden Hammer or the Fan appears behind me, you totally have a chance to get that item, and it's totally fair. Also item play would just give speedy characters a huge advantage

Then why not learn to dodge your opponent's golden hammer attacks, or shoot your opponent with a weapon if you have one? Plus, if you're Kirby, you can land on your opponent with the down special attack when he has the golden hammer, which an stop him, and if you're in a big level like the Temple, some places can't be reached with the golden hammer in your hands. Items are there to make the game fun and challenging, not to make fun of. If it was a serious match, I'd agree not to use items, but in a normal match where the winner doesn't win anything apart from the pride of victory, it won't hurt to use some items.

From what i remember, the only person who KO'd me was myself as I SD'd.

I KO'd you many a times. You must have a pretty bad memory if you didn't remember me smashing you out of the screen.

I remember many 5 stock matches and you haven't taken one stock from me by yourself.

I am not used to that lag either, but not being able to take a life in a many 5 stock matches would have nothing to do with lag. It's just the huge gap in player skill.

It's the second time I went online so I don't know any player tactics whatsoever, so I have to admit I'm no master at the game, but a huge gap in player skill? I beat multi man brawl with all characters, all star on insane with only a few characters left to win it with, beat the Subspace Emissary on Insane on all levels, beat all target practice levels in a decent enough time to win a challenge, beat Boss Battle on Insane and got all of the CD's. Probably a lot of people in this thread did these things too, but last time I checked, noobs aren't able to do those. Plus, I lag a lot in my country. I dunno if it's the same for you, but every 2 seconds or less, it lags for about a second and I don't know what I'm doing, and sometimes it goes through a phase where it lags more than it doesn't. This may sound like a pathetic attempt of an excuse, but it's true. I'd beat you pretty easily if you were in my position, I'll give you that.

And yeah, OK, you beat me. It's only a freakin' game, no need to brag about it like you just climbed Mt. Everest or something.

At 9/4/09 05:41 AM, Supersteph54 wrote:
It's the second time I went online so I don't know any player tactics whatsoever, so I have to admit I'm no master at the game, but a huge gap in player skill?

"I'd beat the hell out of quite a lot of players if I had to be someone who in their opinion is a bad character, unless of course it's Junkypuff, sorry, Jigglypuff, since I'm experienced and know the pros and cons of quite a few characters."

Contradictions much?

At 9/4/09 07:53 AM, Crink wrote:

At 9/4/09 05:41 AM, Supersteph54 wrote:
It's the second time I went online so I don't know any player tactics whatsoever, so I have to admit I'm no master at the game, but a huge gap in player skill?

"I'd beat the hell out of quite a lot of players if I had to be someone who in their opinion is a bad character, unless of course it's Junkypuff, sorry, Jigglypuff, since I'm experienced and know the pros and cons of quite a few characters."

Contradictions much?

I said quite a lot not all. I beat everyone who went against me in my country anyway, so I was referring to them.

At 9/4/09 08:18 AM, Supersteph54 wrote:

At 9/4/09 07:53 AM, Crink wrote:

At 9/4/09 05:41 AM, Supersteph54 wrote:
It's the second time I went online so I don't know any player tactics whatsoever, so I have to admit I'm no master at the game, but a huge gap in player skill?

"I'd beat the hell out of quite a lot of players if I had to be someone who in their opinion is a bad character, unless of course it's Junkypuff, sorry, Jigglypuff, since I'm experienced and know the pros and cons of quite a few characters."

Contradictions much?

I said quite a lot not all. I beat everyone who went against me in my country anyway, so I was referring to them.

And which country would that be?

Oh yeah man, I can beat anyone on my block in this game. But they really suck, so it doesn't make any difference.

Please don't say you beat 1 player modes in an attempt to make yourself "not as noob".

If you lag that bad I would recommend getting a better internet provider.

At 9/4/09 12:44 PM, kRaZyAzN wrote:

At 9/4/09 08:18 AM, Supersteph54 wrote:

At 9/4/09 07:53 AM, Crink wrote:

At 9/4/09 05:41 AM, Supersteph54 wrote:
It's the second time I went online so I don't know any player tactics whatsoever, so I have to admit I'm no master at the game, but a huge gap in player skill?

"I'd beat the hell out of quite a lot of players if I had to be someone who in their opinion is a bad character, unless of course it's Junkypuff, sorry, Jigglypuff, since I'm experienced and know the pros and cons of quite a few characters."

Contradictions much?

I said quite a lot not all. I beat everyone who went against me in my country anyway, so I was referring to them.

And which country would that be?

Oh yeah man, I can beat anyone on my block in this game. But they really suck, so it doesn't make any difference.

Please don't say you beat 1 player modes in an attempt to make yourself "not as noob".

If you lag that bad I would recommend getting a better internet provider.

That country is a small island in the middle of the mediterranean sea called Malta, if you really want to know.

Yeah, so can I. I beat anyone who went against me over here and never went online until now, so I don't know how good other players are, do I?

Why shouldn't I say that? I'm only showing that I have some skill in the game and that I only suck in online because of an insane amount of lagging. I don't have any other achievements apart from saying that I beat loads of guys who went against me in my country (in a non-lag match).

And yeah, I guess I should get another internet provider -.-.

At 9/4/09 05:41 AM, Supersteph54 wrote: Then why not learn to dodge your opponent's golden hammer attacks,

You can't. Unless you're Metaknight or another character that can stall away from the stage. Dodge moves don't guarantee full invincibility, so while your character is invincible for .7 seconds, the Hammer will hit you in the .3 seconds where you are vulnerable.

or shoot your opponent with a weapon if you have one?

What if you don't have one?

Plus, if you're Kirby, you can land on your opponent with the down special attack when he has the golden hammer, which an stop him, and if you're in a big level like the Temple,

It won't stop the Hammer user if the user is not retarded and gtfo of the way, and hit Kirby while he's released from his Stone.

I KO'd you many a times. You must have a pretty bad memory if you didn't remember me smashing you out of the screen

Memory serves me right, I lived up to 200% almost every match with all stocks.

I beat multi man brawl with all characters, all star on insane with only a few characters left to win it with, beat the Subspace Emissary on Insane on all levels,

Who cares about 1P mode?

I'm not bragging, I'm just nullifying your Johns.

Really i'll Ko You All if i have to.

At 9/4/09 02:14 PM, verycoolguy wrote:

At 9/4/09 05:41 AM, Supersteph54 wrote: Then why not learn to dodge your opponent's golden hammer attacks,

You can't. Unless you're Metaknight or another character that can stall away from the stage. Dodge moves don't guarantee full invincibility, so while your character is invincible for .7 seconds, the Hammer will hit you in the .3 seconds where you are vulnerable.

Then why not be a character who can stall at the edge of the stage? If you're so scared of items, you can be someone who can dodge them properly. Plus, I'll repeat, you can choose a large stage like the Temple and New Pork City.

or shoot your opponent with a weapon if you have one?

What if you don't have one?

You make sure you choose a character who has one before the match or use the items that are around you. If there are no good ones, then OK, you're dead, but the chances of you not being someone with a weapon or someone who can stall at the edge of the stage, and are in a stage which isn't big plus you have no items to use altogether is pretty low.

Plus, if you're Kirby, you can land on your opponent with the down special attack when he has the golden hammer, which an stop him, and if you're in a big level like the Temple,

It won't stop the Hammer user if the user is not retarded and gtfo of the way, and hit Kirby while he's released from his Stone.

I'm only saying that to use as a last resort when you've dodged as much as you can and he's got a little time left with the hammer. That will give you more time to survive, and he might run out of time with the hammer. Besides, what's the big deal of getting hit by a golden hammer? One's bound to arrive next to you in other matches, plus it's only a game... It's not the end of the world if your opponent hits you with a hammer.

I KO'd you many a times. You must have a pretty bad memory if you didn't remember me smashing you out of the screen

Memory serves me right, I lived up to 200% almost every match with all stocks.

Yeah, now you're saying almost every match. Before you said every match. Besides; it doesn't matter anyway. I don't have much of a chance beating anyone with my lagging problems.

I beat multi man brawl with all characters, all star on insane with only a few characters left to win it with, beat the Subspace Emissary on Insane on all levels,

Who cares about 1P mode?

Maybe every SSBB player? I'm pretty sure you won a lot of the things I mentioned, if not all of them, and even if you didn't, 1P mode is enjoyable anyway, and without it, you wouldn't get all the characters you have now. Games aren't all about Multiplayer, you know.

I'm not bragging, I'm just nullifying your Johns.

I'm not bragging either. Those are the only achievements I have. How the hell can I get the achievement of beating people online when I lagg for a long time every freaking 2 seconds?

This thread is getting off-topic. Why don't we stop it here instead of continuing the argument?

Sadly i've Been K.o'd By ALOT of People

Continuing off my point that Olimar doesn't suck... watch the below videos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zzM9TEy0 o0&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzRrONs56 8c&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgnkwnfmZ O4&feature=related
____________________
Now, on the topic of items. It's true that, if dispersed evenly to all players, items still make the match somewhat even for all the characters, if not even more even. However, items are extremely fast and powerful, killing people at ridiculously low percentages. It's true that they can be avoided sometimes, but the very notion that most items can blow people straight to hell with a simple, unpredictable input of Forward and Z, with an extremely low chance to avoid, is simply unacceptable in most competitive play.

That said, items are all fine and dandy in friendly play, especially in Free For Alls, but if you're trying to compete to see who's the best, or you're trying to prove one character is better than the other, items are simply too hazardous to show the true skill of the players, and more importantly, the characters themselves, since items aren't part of a natural character's moveset and therefore makes it impossible to determine which character is better than the other.
____________________
Supersteph54, go to your Start browser and start your program 'Run.' Type in 'cmd' and click OK. A command prompt will open up. Type "ping/t www.newgrounds.com" without the quotes and hit enter. The program will begin to ping Newgrounds and a list will start to manifest on the program. On each line, there should be a phrase that says 'time=XXms.' Figure out the average time you get. If it's 60ms or less, the lag likely isn't your fault, but rather; the distance between you and your opponents. If it's ridiculously large, like, for example, in the triple digits, then it's likely the lag was your fault.

If that is the case, with the triple digits, simply restart your computer and make sure you have no Youtube videos or chatrooms open when you decide to start playing Brawl wifi again, and the lag will have likely resolved itself.

True But I Always SELFDECUCT

At 9/4/09 04:45 PM, John12346 wrote: Now, on the topic of items. It's true that, if dispersed evenly to all players, items still make the match somewhat even for all the characters, if not even more even.

I have to admit, that isn't likely to happen :\, but I think that by setting items to medium or low and removing some like the baseball bat, fans and hammers, it could make the match both fair and enjoyable.

That said, items are all fine and dandy in friendly play, especially in Free For Alls, but if you're trying to compete to see who's the best, or you're trying to prove one character is better than the other, items are simply too hazardous to show the true skill of the players, and more importantly, the characters themselves, since items aren't part of a natural character's moveset and therefore makes it impossible to determine which character is better than the other.

That's exactly right. I just wanted items for the simple reason that I wanted to make the match less boring.

Figure out the average time you get. If it's 60ms or less, the lag likely isn't your fault, but rather; the distance between you and your opponents. If it's ridiculously large, like, for example, in the triple digits, then it's likely the lag was your fault.

It's about 50 - 60 ms, approx. Occasionally it goes a little over 60 but mostly it's late 40's and 50's. I don't know if I should be relieved or unhappy O_o.

At 9/4/09 06:08 PM, Supersteph54 wrote:

At 9/4/09 04:45 PM, John12346 wrote: since items aren't part of a natural character's moveset and therefore makes it impossible to determine which character is better than the other.

That's exactly right. I just wanted items for the simple reason that I wanted to make the match less boring.

But you're not doing a casual match, for fun. Verycoolguy wanted a more serious and fair match, to show you that olimar isn't shit.

At 9/4/09 06:18 PM, Crumption wrote:

At 9/4/09 06:08 PM, Supersteph54 wrote:

At 9/4/09 04:45 PM, John12346 wrote: since items aren't part of a natural character's moveset and therefore makes it impossible to determine which character is better than the other.

That's exactly right. I just wanted items for the simple reason that I wanted to make the match less boring.

But you're not doing a casual match, for fun. Verycoolguy wanted a more serious and fair match, to show you that olimar isn't shit.

I don't really mind that. I never exactly thought Olimar was bad, I really meant I suck with him. There are definitely loads of people out there who could own the heck out of me when I'm Olimar. No characters are naturally bad, it depends on how you use them. I just said he's bad by meaning I'm bad with him.
If it were a match to prove who's a better character in the hands of 2 different players, for example, then I wouldn't ask for items, or just merely ask for a Smash Ball with items on medium, since it requires skill to get the smash ball and the Final Smash is part of a character's moveset, but I see the match Verycoolguy asked for as only a match for fun with him being Olimar, and some items wouldn't hurt.

At 8/25/09 01:23 PM, Crink wrote:

At 8/25/09 12:44 PM, 51430 wrote: Honestly, just because you think another character is bad doesn't mean he is bad, it just means you suck with that one character.

Everybody has their preference.

No it doesn't you sap, characters in the game are BAD.

Ganondorf and Captain Falcon are BAD characters, that doesn't mean that I suck with them, it means they sucks.

You fail epically. I kick fucking ass with both those characters! I never get tired of hearing Falcon Punch!

I'd say Olimar probably, but I'm really not sure...
I get the efeeling that they're all more or less balanced, some just take a while to get used to.

At 9/5/09 06:53 AM, Misterinferno wrote: You fail epically. I kick fucking ass with both those characters! I never get tired of hearing Falcon Punch!

You are stupid.

At 9/5/09 06:53 AM, Misterinferno wrote:

You fail epically. I kick fucking ass with both those characters! I never get tired of hearing Falcon Punch!

You are also retarded and ugly.