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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 00:46:03 Reply

At 3/7/11 12:01 AM, big-jonny-13 wrote:
At 3/6/11 11:43 PM, Lintire wrote:
At 3/6/11 07:39 PM, BizarroJoe wrote: Honestly, that's not a model to look up to...
Yeah, this is pretty much it. He didn't say anything I haven't already read - on the internet or in a book - 50 million times before.
He also did not sound nearly as badass as I was hoping he was.... actually, he didn't sound badass at all.
I was saddened by this.

he sounds like kermit the frog lol. i thought of it and then it turns out one of the top comments also said that.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 01:34:32 Reply

At 3/6/11 07:39 PM, BizarroJoe wrote: And you'd assume wrongly, considering who Todd McFarlane is...
He doesn't say anything that you can't find at every "how to draw whateva" book.
Honestly, that's not a model to look up to...

as i said, havent watched the vids, only know who he is through his comics, teach me to make assumptions

but if you want anatomy vids i swear my life by this guy > LINK < some great tuts in there and some nice speedpaints too

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 06:00:48 Reply

At 3/6/11 06:17 PM, Occluded wrote: <Bitch> The ads for "Ceasary" on frontpage. Fucking godawful. Insultingly bad. Just yuck.</Bitch>

Yeah, I agree. Whoever put it together did a real sloppy job, since they've used 3 different pics made by different artists with different styles, and the overlaying text ... bleugh.

I've tried refreshing the page to provide a screenshot, but I've given up after a while. But yeah, I know what you mean.


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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 08:49:40 Reply

At 3/7/11 06:00 AM, TurkeyOnAStick wrote: I've tried refreshing the page to provide a screenshot, but I've given up after a while. But yeah, I know what you mean.

Maybe it was removed after they saw Occluded's post and realized "Lol, this ad is whack."

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 09:30:26 Reply

Changing streams here, a Picasso piece has broken the record for the most expensive painting.
Thoughts?

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 09:47:27 Reply

At 3/7/11 09:30 AM, big-jonny-13 wrote: Changing streams here, a Picasso piece has broken the record for the most expensive painting.
Thoughts?

people have too much money to waste, i myself do not consider art to be as valuable as the high horse posh fellows usually bidding on these pieces do, you can't put a price on it. Also, it grinds my gears when someone immediately finds a painting amazing because of the fact it is worth so much, such as Jason Pollocks work. But it's each to their own of course, i wouldn't mind getting my hands on Picasso's "The Old Guitarist" such an amazing painting (a print of course)

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 09:59:34 Reply

At 3/7/11 09:30 AM, big-jonny-13 wrote: Changing streams here, a Picasso piece has broken the record for the most expensive painting.
Thoughts?

Sold at auction, sorry*. Pollock is still in the lead with $140 million.

*although all the paintings in this table have been sold at an auction house ...

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 10:07:10 Reply

At 3/7/11 09:59 AM, TurkeyOnAStick wrote:
*although all the paintings in this table have been sold at an auction house ...

the top 3 were sold in a private auction, the rest have risen due to inflation
you pillock


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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 10:27:02 Reply

At 3/7/11 09:59 AM, TurkeyOnAStick wrote: Sold at auction, sorry*. Pollock is still in the lead with $140 million.

And it still looks like the worst part of my worst night out in years.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 10:36:47 Reply

At 3/7/11 09:47 AM, Toast-Tony wrote:
people have too much money to waste, i myself do not consider art to be as valuable as the high horse posh fellows usually bidding on these pieces do, you can't put a price on it. Also, it grinds my gears when someone immediately finds a painting amazing because of the fact it is worth so much, such as Jason Pollocks work. But it's each to their own of course, i wouldn't mind getting my hands on Picasso's "The Old Guitarist" such an amazing painting (a print of course)

Had I hundreds of millions of dollars to spend, I surely wouldn't buy some of the most expensive art on the market. That said, I think you have it backwards; the art is valuable because of what it means to the art world. Pollock and Picasso's works go for exorbitant amounts because they represent a shift in art, from representational works to more abstract and ultimately to the completely nonobjective. The monetary value is a reflection of the social value.


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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 10:44:30 Reply

At 3/7/11 10:36 AM, BlackmarketKraig wrote: The monetary value is a reflection of the social value.

In my opinion is the monetary values in these cases are an insult towards everything else that money could've done to further engage the human race as a sucsessful form of life. Art is awesome, but there's a level of priority gone missing if someone thinks its better to spend that amount of money owning a repulsive image because someone else decided its important to art history.

Just saying.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 11:04:09 Reply

Fully understood Kraig, but putting it simply, it's not hard to say that ,despite it's meaning to the art world, $140,000,000 is just plain ridiculous. You are very right on the point that the monetary value represents the social value of art because when it comes to looking so deeply into the mind of an art critic, those kinds of people i see whilst strolling the galleries of barcelona, stood for 10 minutes staring at 3 canvases bestowing upon them one, single, jolted line and looking on to it like it is the greatest and most intriguing thing they have ever seen really really really boggles me beyond belief. I cant bring myself to indulge in the meanings and what not of a piece of art when at the end of the day, it is a line, it is a blue canvas etc. with these being so popular that would then mean theoretically i could shit on a canvas and given enough background to it and deep feeling (in my bowels) it would become a well known popular piece of art?

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 13:21:22 Reply

As much as I hate to admit it, yes art is horrendously overpriced. Its hard to put a value on some pieces. A few have historical significance, and you cant imagine selling. Other pieces are incredibly personal to the artist, or had weeks and weeks, even years of work put into them so sticking a price tag on it seems bizarre. Granted with the last one once the artist is dead its harder to gauge, although its not like the artist ever sees the money after the initial buy which typically isn't for anywhere remotely near what the later prices become.

I think its because of that last bit that dictates how art is bought sold and priced. Most of the people buying incredibly expensive pieces do it because they believe it will appreciate in value. They buy it at a semi reasonable price from the artist or dealer directly, then hang onto it and over time if the artist continues to produce and sell more work, the piece they originally bought for $200 suddenly has more demand for it, so they could resell it for $1k. And that person could sell it for $3k and so on. Then once the artist dies the prices can get jacked up like no ones business. Each time a piece of that artist sells, suddenly the others are worth more as well. Art is an investment and a gamble for some buyers. They want to believe that they are buying something that will pay off down the line.
Yes there are those who buy it just for looks as well.

I have sold art to both and quite honestly I much prefer selling the stuff to people who just like it for how it looks. I do have at least 2 people i know of who bought the stuff and now follow me around making sure i make more work, that is worth more, which gives them an idea of what the pieces they bought for a steal are now worth should my stuff get a high demand. I know that one of those people must be happy because the 3 pieces they bought of mine for $50 can now be sold at at least $250 since the remaining ones in the series are. And the one who bought another for $600 must be licking their lips at the rest of that series now going for upwards of $3k

I do feel bad selling art at such high prices. Even though i spend ages on all my pieces, it still comes down to something that is just a piece of paper or panel with some pencil on it with tons of negative space. I initially priced my stuff so low, because I didn't believe people would buy it for so much, and because it didn't feel right. However many shows and dealers later my stuff has sky rocketed in price and to be quite honest while I love when people do buy the work for those prices, it makes me feel kinda crappy. Not just for the sucker who bought a piece I didn't even like but because now I am put in an awkward position. I am forced to make work to continually sell at these high prices, otherwise its like I'm doing them a disservice buy halting the value appreciation on the pieces they did buy.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 14:29:11 Reply

At 3/7/11 10:44 AM, LaserKarl wrote:
In my opinion is the monetary values in these cases are an insult towards everything else that money could've done to further engage the human race as a sucsessful form of life. Art is awesome, but there's a level of priority gone missing if someone thinks its better to spend that amount of money owning a repulsive image because someone else decided its important to art history.

Just saying.

I'm kind of split on this.

A couple of points I've pondered:
- Does the, frankly insane, amount of money spent on pieces like this elevate art as a whole or diminish it? Meaning: does it make people appreciate the true value of art in society or does it make people scoff and think that it's just money thrown away that could be used towards a better end?

- What IS art worth to society? Surely $140 million is, if it were split across all art lovers and artists as a whole, not much of a price to put on being able to express whatever one wishes in a visual way?

At 3/7/11 11:04 AM, Toast-Tony wrote: Fully understood Kraig, but putting it simply, it's not hard to say that ,despite it's meaning to the art world, $140,000,000 is just plain ridiculous. You are very right on the point that the monetary value represents the social value of art because when it comes to looking so deeply into the mind of an art critic, those kinds of people i see whilst strolling the galleries of barcelona, stood for 10 minutes staring at 3 canvases bestowing upon them one, single, jolted line and looking on to it like it is the greatest and most intriguing thing they have ever seen really really really boggles me beyond belief. I cant bring myself to indulge in the meanings and what not of a piece of art when at the end of the day, it is a line, it is a blue canvas etc. with these being so popular that would then mean theoretically i could shit on a canvas and given enough background to it and deep feeling (in my bowels) it would become a well known popular piece of art?

Ah, yes, contemporary art, in the form of minimalism and nonobjectivism, is a sticky point in the art world and on these forums. It's hard to defend as it is usually so simple and, seemingly pointless, and when there are pieces out there that are obvious bullshit. But, imo, you have to think about the struggle and time it took to get art to this place. I would just die if art were rolled back to the time when it was religious iconography or nothing. Art has progressed far, if it's too far, that's up to the art critics and collectors, not me.

To address your question, if taking a dump on a canvas inflames some sort of meaningful movement in art or society, it, very well may, someday, go for a hundred million dollars.


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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 15:30:13 Reply

Starting to think I have ADHD, I find myself becoming distracted halfway through reading all your too long to read posts guys. <.< Maybe between every paragraph you should post a pic of a kitty to keep me from becoming distracted. lmao

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 16:10:27 Reply

At 3/7/11 03:30 PM, Abbyka wrote: Starting to think I have ADHD, I find myself becoming distracted halfway through reading all your too long to read posts guys. <.< Maybe between every paragraph you should post a pic of a kitty to keep me from becoming distracted. lmao

I would if I could post more than one picture per post.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 16:31:26 Reply

At 3/7/11 02:29 PM, BlackmarketKraig wrote: To address your question, if taking a dump on a canvas inflames some sort of meaningful movement in art or society, it, very well may, someday, go for a hundred million dollars.

Be right back, got some business to take care of.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 17:11:44 Reply

At 3/7/11 04:31 PM, Toast-Tony wrote:
At 3/7/11 02:29 PM, BlackmarketKraig wrote: To address your question, if taking a dump on a canvas inflames some sort of meaningful movement in art or society, it, very well may, someday, go for a hundred million dollars.
Be right back, got some business to take care of.

Oh, Kraig, you mischievous thing...
He can't go further than this, and you know it.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 17:23:58 Reply

At 3/7/11 05:11 PM, BizarroJoe wrote: He can't go further than this, and you know it.

Haha, Manzoni, loveable bastard.

But anyhow, taking a dump on a canvas is not going to do a lot these days, that was just hot shit (pun.. semi-intended) back in the 60's and 70's. 80's maybe. The problem is it's very hard to stay with current art and artforms because it always takes a few years before we realise what the fuck they were doing.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 17:31:30 Reply

I think this is the main problem. I feel like Americans view Money as a true way of gauging worth. And it's just not the case. Almost ever. This speaks to a larger problem I have with Ayn Rand, American Economics, and the ideology of Capitalism.

Money almost never accurately represents worth. In general food, energy, and clothes are grossly underpriced. Property, and higher end services grossly overpriced. How much is a person's time worth compared to someone else? How is a shirt that takes 4 hours to make worth less than a stock that took 2 minutes to trade? How is a 4 bed 2 bath house in North Dakota worth less than a studio apartment in harlem? Sure risk, supply, and demand effect cost. And they should. But the system isn't fair or egalitarian at all anymore. Art has a secondary value not just as the object or idea but as an investment. People buy art like they would buy stock. I talked to a hedge fund manager who sometimes buys art he never sees in lots. And I think if property, services, and other goods can be so grossly overpriced, how is art an exception? And why should we care? It's a minor symptom of a larger disparity.

Sorry, I constantly argue with people back home about economics. It makes me want to scream. There is a pervasive belief in western society that money is either indicative of or determined by value. And it's largely a load of shit.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 17:37:49 Reply

At 3/7/11 04:10 PM, SoConfused wrote:

I would if I could post more than one picture per post.

Seems to be enough for me! lol

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 17:45:46 Reply

I don't know how anyone would pay money for this.
Let alone $140 million.
Wtf.
I can do this.

And thats saying something.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 17:49:59 Reply

At 3/7/11 05:45 PM, Kakashi1930 wrote: I don't know how anyone would pay money for this.
Let alone $140 million.
Wtf.
I can do this.
And thats saying something.

People are morons. Instead of paying good money for crap like that they could do it themselves and it would be more fun. Splash art/spill art is so insanely easy a toddler could do it.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 17:53:13 Reply

At 3/7/11 05:45 PM, Kakashi1930 wrote: I don't know how anyone would pay money for this.
Let alone $140 million.
Wtf.
I can do this.
And thats saying something.

Just to make sure.. Troll?

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 18:30:27 Reply

At 3/7/11 05:45 PM, Kakashi1930 wrote: I don't know how anyone would pay money for this.
Let alone $140 million.
Wtf.
I can do this.
And thats saying something.

Maybe you could have done it, but you didn't, Jackson Pollock did. Next time you come up with something that revolutionizes the art world then you can say you actually did something.


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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 18:47:42 Reply

I'm honestly kind of confused people still make those statements.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 19:31:35 Reply

At 3/7/11 01:34 AM, Ashman wrote: but if you want anatomy vids i swear my life by this guy > LINK < some great tuts in there and some nice speedpaints too

Shit, I forgot to comment on this one... THAT is what I call a GOOD tut. Good find

Funny, I'm sure I've seen this guy somewhere else... But I can't remember.
At 3/7/11 05:45 PM, Kakashi1930 wrote: I don't know how anyone would pay money for this.
Let alone $140 million.
Wtf.
I can do this.

...Aaand Kashi goes back to square one!
Wow, that's a strong image... Kakashi walking on a giant board of the Goose game where, instead of a skull space, there's a Pollock painting on the floor which warps Kash to the start...
This idea could be developed into something cool...

And now, changing subjects, today is International Woman's Day.
So, you all know how it goes, go get one.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 19:41:08 Reply

At 3/7/11 06:30 PM, BlackmarketKraig wrote:
At 3/7/11 05:45 PM, Kakashi1930 wrote: I don't know how anyone would pay money for this.
Let alone $140 million.
Wtf.
I can do this.
And thats saying something.
Maybe you could have done it, but you didn't, Jackson Pollock did. Next time you come up with something that revolutionizes the art world then you can say you actually did something.

Oh, blah. Kraig beat me to it. I wanted to say something along these lines.
There's more that goes into art than just skill; Jackson Pollock, like Picasso, did something that was extraordinarily different. His work has been debated for the better part of a century, and I think it's kind of an aged argument by now. Whether you or all of the others who hold him in disdain like it or not, I'd have to say that it's crystal clear that Pollock's work was a resounding success.

Nevermind the fact that Pollock has been dead for more than half a century.

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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 19:51:38 Reply

At 3/7/11 07:31 PM, BizarroJoe wrote:
And now, changing subjects, today is International Woman's Day.
So, you all know how it goes, go get one.

That sounds like work BizarroJoe...


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Response to Art Forum Lounge 2011-03-07 19:55:44 Reply

At 3/7/11 07:51 PM, BlackmarketKraig wrote:
At 3/7/11 07:31 PM, BizarroJoe wrote: And now, changing subjects, today is International Woman's Day.
So, you all know how it goes, go get one.
That sounds like work BizarroJoe...

I heard you can buy them.....