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At 6/5/10 01:07 PM, MajesticBob wrote: I told you. I mean come on the cover art was a red flag, you even mentioned it! Well that shit storm is behind you now. As long as you NEVER watch the movie "The Mangler 2" your golden. I...I never saw it myself. I was... uh ... Playing video games. Video games I say!

yep I should have seen it coming. But even so I still needed to watch it, even if I knew it was going to be bad. I Kind of try to watch all zombie movies. But hey at least it is not the worst zombie movie I have seen.

Cough* Resident Evil: Extinction. House of the Dead 1 and 2 Cough*

At 6/5/10 05:35 PM, Kinsei01 wrote: yep I should have seen it coming. But even so I still needed to watch it, even if I knew it was going to be bad. I Kind of try to watch all zombie movies. But hey at least it is not the worst zombie movie I have seen.

Cough* Resident Evil: Extinction. House of the Dead 1 and 2 Cough*

cough* resident evil movie thats in the making *cough

At 6/5/10 05:23 PM, TurkeyOnAStick wrote:

At 6/5/10 05:14 PM, big-jonny-13 wrote: I've actually gotten numerous PMs in the past about people complaining to me for locking their thread.

muahahahahahaha

I guess some users are so stupid thst they don't even know that users that are real mods. Yay! Everybody can be a mod! That's so awesome.

At 6/5/10 06:01 PM, Fifty-50 wrote: Everybody can be a mod! That's so awesome.

Keep talking and I'll ban you fifty-50

At 6/5/10 06:09 PM, angryglacier wrote:

At 6/5/10 06:01 PM, Fifty-50 wrote: Everybody can be a mod! That's so awesome.

Keep talking and I'll ban you fifty-50

Oh crap, the police are on to me! You'll never ban me alive copper! >:D

LOL?

At 6/5/10 08:17 PM, big-jonny-13 wrote: Sorry bout the double post, but.....
Has anybody noticed lately that all the art tree links are broken?
Every time you attempt to view someone's scouts it takes you to this. If you want to view their scouts, you have to replace "1" with their username.....

yeah that was brought up a while ago, by luxembourg i think, toas said the admins are messing about with the system or something and that itll be fixed soon

wow.... I am fucking drunk... >.>... just ask nae she heard me...

anyway... whats going on guys? Anything good?

At 6/6/10 04:48 AM, Kinsei01 wrote: wow.... I am fucking drunk... >.>... just ask nae she heard me...

anyway... whats going on guys? Anything good?

Taken on a new project, namely fixing up the Writing Forum, which is a complete wreck.
We need a set of rules of guidelines over there so that we can have a workable environment where creative juices can flow.

Jjjjjuuuuuuiiiccccces.

Such a dirty word.

At 6/6/10 04:48 AM, Kinsei01 wrote: wow.... I am fucking drunk... >.>... just ask nae she heard me...

anyway... whats going on guys? Anything good?

+50 points for being able to type while drunk. Or sitting borderline between 20/20 and mildly fuzzy?

At 6/6/10 05:11 AM, RNNR wrote:
Taken on a new project, namely fixing up the Writing Forum, which is a complete wreck.

You'll have to explain to me how the Writing forum is more of a wreck than the Art forum is.

At 6/6/10 05:23 AM, Lintire wrote:

At 6/6/10 04:48 AM, Kinsei01 wrote: wow.... I am fucking drunk... >.>... just ask nae she heard me...

anyway... whats going on guys? Anything good?

+50 points for being able to type while drunk. Or sitting borderline between 20/20 and mildly fuzzy?

no.... I'm drunk.... not shit faced.... bit drunk as hell... bout another glass or so and I'll enter the realm of shit faced....

I have wiped out over a half of a bottle of scotch by my self tonight.,.... Good bye to my kidneys and liver, they were good while I knew them...

At 6/6/10 05:32 AM, Re2deemer wrote:

At 6/6/10 05:11 AM, RNNR wrote:
Taken on a new project, namely fixing up the Writing Forum, which is a complete wreck.

You'll have to explain to me how the Writing forum is more of a wreck than the Art forum is.

Well just from browsing through it quickly, there are 3 pages of threads, and 1 lock
That 1 lock was a scam thread.

Either all those threads are great and only a few major or minor flaws or there's no guidelines for moderation or minimum requirement for thread quality.

my moneys on the latter, but it's a lot harder to moderate writing than it is art, and a lot more work

question to the mod.
this is mostly trolling.
As we all know, some threads are specifically aimed for trolling, right? So My main question is how do we define trolling around here and should we report the thread via PM to a mod if we suspected trolling?

If a user is being an ass for no given reason, isn't that grounds for banning? Not even if they are intentionally trying to be funny? What if extreme responses arise completely unprovoked. Should we consider that an act of trolling?

Lastly, not really asking for any sort of favoritism, but should regulars be held to not only a higher standard, but as well considered more trustworthy than those who are not regulars?

I would really like some answers, but I guess you could brush this off as some ramblings of a drunk man.

At 6/6/10 06:20 AM, TurkeyOnAStick wrote:

At 6/6/10 05:11 AM, RNNR wrote: Taken on a new project, namely fixing up the Writing Forum, which is a complete wreck.
We need a set of rules of guidelines over there so that we can have a workable environment where creative juices can flow.

I was reading through the lounge post, and it does seem that it's very easy there for the guys to get their knackers in a twist.

For the most part, I agree with what Ass-Crumb said, and either ignore posts that piss you off, or ask a mod to clean it up. Some of the guys in there are horribly petty. There's a few in there who have aspirations of modship, too.

funny thing is, this gives me a piece of mind over my own little question as well, but in all truth, sometimes we all get called out and it it very, very hard to be mature about it and even ignore some things.

Took a peek in the lounge to see what toas was talking about
My god I'd go mad in those threads, I'm all for well thought out posts but you could write a story from some of those.
I can understand the forums basis is writing but not every response has to be an essay

physcopath
Not a troll, can't take criticism.
I admire the response you took to this kinsei, and would be the best way to handle this situation.

"You have just proven that you cannot take a critique properly ... I'm sorry I have taken my time to try and help critique your art. If it has offended you, then I apologize for that as well. ... Thank you for your time, and have a great day. I have no further reason to post in this thread."

I take it counter-ranting is bad, then?
Still, this has helped define what Art-forum trolling really is. I can now safely live in the knowledge that if some crazy asylum person tries to assault society in general with a tablet, I'll be able to tell that from 'normal' people assualting society in general with a tablet. Fun times.

At 6/6/10 06:44 AM, TurkeyOnAStick wrote: physcopath
Not a troll, can't take criticism.
I admire the response you took to this kinsei, and would be the best way to handle this situation.

ToaS, I have to thank you for this, I have been kind of screwing up lately, both on the Forum and in life and my confidence has been quite shaken. Its obvious all all over the place and I can tell. I guess this is why I have gone in to trying to help Bob so much. I guess I thought if I could have helped someone else I could have felt better about myself. So thank you ToaS, I know what you just said isn't much, but saying I handled that well meant a lot to me. it was something I needed.
I'll continue to try and be a better regular in the future,

Honestly, when the times comes for it, kinsei's one of the best we have around here for critiques. Other people have valid points and helpful advice as well when it comes to helping the occasional guy out, but no one things them out to the level kinsei does.

On other people who help people out, telling people to find a tutorial on something is great, but without linking one or suggesting an artist who does good ones its just about as good as giving someone a map with no landmarks on it.

There are A LOT of tutorials, some better than others, and some by people who frankly should not be giving advice to anyone. Fishing through these can be tedious, I know, I've done my share of it.
When I come across one that's particularly helpful to me, I bookmark it and share that with other people who are looking for something along the lines of it.

It just kind of urks me that people seem so eager to help, but don't feel like putting in the effort to give some proper help.

At 6/6/10 07:38 AM, ornery wrote: This pretty much describes why I don't critique nearly as much as I could. Most of the stuff submitted isn't really looking for a real honest critique. What they want is just some pointless comments praising them and stroking their ego, instead of listening to what is being told to them. Although in their defense the majority of people who do give critiques aren't much better. They either don't take the full effort to figure out what will be useful to the person and what is just flapping their lips. A successful critique requires willing participation from both sides of the criticism. The artist needs to be willing to listen to and aknowledge what people are saying, and the critiquer needs to know their own limitations.
What I really wish would happen is for artists to stop putting up 100% finished work that they did for shits and giggles and asking for an in depth analysis of something that doesn't even warrant a critique. And for critiquers to stop feeling like they know everything. It pisses me off when an artist gets overly defensive or posts absolute rubbish, but its even more annoying when people start talking out of their asses and give miserably poor, or completely incorrect advice.
I suppose the biggest reason why I dont critique nearly as much as I could or should is because most of the stuff is so far from being anywhere near good that it would take nothing short of 4 full posts to even begin to tell the person what they did wrong or how they can improve. And I would rather say nothing than short change someone.

Well, guilty on all accounts - I tend to just point out an error or two, add some comment on what they could improve but no indication as to show them HOW, basically labeling me as the average douche-bag criticizer. Well, I do like to fool myself into thinking that I hand out good reviews and critiques using the review functions, I'm still undeniably a degenerate when it comes to the Art forum itself. Kind of eye-opening - while I still won't bother with running over the whole thing, not having the time to write 4 full odd posts, I'll still try and add more length, meaning, and general helpfulness to those who bravely expose themselves on this forum.
Kind of like being a douche-bag, though. Saved writing anything more than two lines on anyone's thread. Being a genuinely helpful stepping stone to any artists would be much more rewarding for both members of the party - it's decided, no more intentional douchebaggery on my part.
Starting tomorrow.

At 6/6/10 07:05 AM, M-Vero wrote: Honestly, when the times comes for it, kinsei's one of the best we have around here for critiques. Other people have valid points and helpful advice as well when it comes to helping the occasional guy out, but no one things them out to the level kinsei does.

On other people who help people out, telling people to find a tutorial on something is great, but without linking one or suggesting an artist who does good ones its just about as good as giving someone a map with no landmarks on it.

There are A LOT of tutorials, some better than others, and some by people who frankly should not be giving advice to anyone. Fishing through these can be tedious, I know, I've done my share of it.
When I come across one that's particularly helpful to me, I bookmark it and share that with other people who are looking for something along the lines of it.

It just kind of urks me that people seem so eager to help, but don't feel like putting in the effort to give some proper help.

Except there is a wonderful map of internet called google that makes it easy to find out which tutorials are good. There are tons of forums out there, not only newgrounds, where you can search for reviews on which are good or nawt.

And to be honest, tutorials pfft, they are useless. The only way you can help yourself improve is by practicing and using your abstract part of brain, and from personal experience tutorials do not help giving you a natural understanding of art. Sure, you find some tutorial on how to draw a face, but you're just following instructions and not actually learning. Let's also not forget there is a limit on how far you can get, meaning talent that few honestly do have. Even so, you need to experiment, activate the brain in a new kind of way. That's the only way you do get better and actually make yourself learn. When it comes to art, it is doubtful tutorials help, but a theoretical textbook is a different story, such as learning how to drive. You learn how to use the gear, the gas pedal, traffic rules and how to break and how and when to apply these action, but it doesn't actually teach you how to drive professionally, nothing can. After getting your license, you may be able to drive but nothing will teach you how to drive better as it is all up to how your brain handles all the input from the enviornment forwarding it to the nervous system that controls movement. Just like with art, some people can't process the world into a visual style looking good, and I have noticed that those with talent actually can illustrate objects into something recognizable although the lineart may be a bit off proportion.

And I can't really blame people who don't put effort helping out. Do you expect everyone to be enthusiastic about contributing with critiques? Are everyone good at it? Nope. You should know this, that to get served you also need to serve, nothing is for free. People half assedly comment on other peoples art, saying something nice or giving "critiques" just because theirs are not getting any attention. It is just psychology, social tactics for rewards.

At 6/6/10 09:44 AM, TurkeyOnAStick wrote: Couldn't disagree more. Mind-games, my arse.

I've only commented or critiqued on something because I felt the need to respond to it. Much like this discussion. The only times I've ever felt guilty is with the tech support thread or locking threads. However, it's only because I knew what the answer was, and that delaying a response is stupid.

I can think of no occasion when someone has made a comment in order to advertise themselves; only to ascert their opinion (good or awful).

I see, but I can only think this way, and this is what I assume because of past experiences: people generally don't care about others, they don't trouble helping others when they themselves have their own issues to care about. If you want something in return, then you need to do a favor.
My personality is pure paranoia however, I'm brainfucked ;O

But, I promise you I was not trying to insist that you do this as a mind-game. When I used to browse this forum (no account back then) during these times when the art forum did not exist, a lot of beginners were spamming not even close to half-decent pictures, praising in an exaggarative fashion along with invaluable criticism. I could not think that was an action taken for nothing but trying to get nice comments themselves. Annoying nontheless.