Forum Topic: Why Does Ng Degrade Hip Hop

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endlessnumber

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Posted at: 12/17/07 06:41 AM

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Because alot of hiphop artists are idiots, one bad apple spoils the bunch.

Case in point.

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MJTTOMB

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Posted at: 12/17/07 12:04 PM

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At 12/17/07 06:41 AM, endlessnumber wrote: Because alot of hiphop artists are idiots, one bad apple spoils the bunch.

Case in point.

Why did you have to bring this back up? It was nice and dead, and now more flaming will erupt.


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YunVeroz

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Posted at: 12/17/07 12:18 PM

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You hit Horse for 500!
Horse has died.
You hit Horse for 391!
You hit Horse for 419!

Case in point: if you hate hip-hop so much, why do you even spend your precious time on this earth trying to rag on it, rather than contributing to your own signature genre of music?


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Bad-Man-Incorporated

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Posted at: 12/17/07 01:30 PM

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Well hell-o hip hoppers. haha.
I have to say...when I first joined NG, the amount of quality music coming from ALL genre's, really blew my mind. Then, to find out it was kids, teenagers at home on their computers, truly was a mind fuck for me.
I left reviews, and admiration for all the songs that were amazingly done. Whether I liked the genre or not. I'll be the first to admit that hip hop, rap...whatever...isn't on my list of things to listen to...But...I did listen to NG'ers hip hop/rap. I even left positive reviews, and made some "internet" friends of that genre.
Then, I was told to stay out of the hip hop section, (for reviewing) because my reviews (as a metalhead) weren't needed or wanted...because I knew NOTHING of the genre. This soured me quite a bit. I did do a "hip hop" song with a couple other metal heads from NG mocking the genre and "stereotypes" because, as in any genre...its easy to pick on its' stereotypes. Ya know?...Also, there will be another hip hop song coming soon, cause the last one was actually pretty fun. haha.

But anyways, sometimes, the stereotypes really can ruin the experience. haha. I think that is why hip hop is slammed sometimes. It almost seems that the stereotypical hip hoppers, have no clue that they fall into that category...and its truly entertaining, and laughable to see.
I'll be the first to say, that it really isn't "EASY" to do. I mean, making the beat is pretty simple, even the melody. But to rap...without sounding like a nervous kid at his first assembly, trying to "act"...thats pretty hard to do, really. Some dudes can sound pretty cool. I've been in the section a couple times since, and found some pretty amazing sounding pieces, but I haven't left many reviews.

I think, too...to see rap superstars that came from the "ghetto", where they probably DID have it quite bad...to still be rappin about it, billions of dollars later is pretty cliche.

So I doubt I really answered your question, but as easily as I COULD slam it, I won't and don't. I respect the whole music making process. Whatever the genre.

:meh my two cents (not 50) haha.

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Erkie

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Posted at: 12/17/07 02:42 PM

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It may be rubbish, but if you don't actually TRY to listen and appreciate other genres, you won't know if it's any good or not.

That goes without saying.

and they don't understand that hip hop music is made up of rhythms and melodies, harmonies and chords, which is the same things that make up their songs, they just use different guidelines to create the more specific hip hop sound.

This is technicality.

No, I didn't, not completely, but I've read through enough threads like this to understand what's going on.

Clearly not.

Do you think that I posted something other than "hip hop suxx!!!" just to stir up a shitstorm and get me some trolls on my back?

Read my post, then the subsequent posts that tried to understand it. The person who even asked the question has yet to even formulate a defense.

I'm just putting out my ideas that most people in here are fighting an argument that neither can win, and I'll be happy if anyone takes note of what I said and tries to be more considerate in the future.

Not how it works.

Everyone who has attempted to explain why it's awful has only been able to use technicality, which causes no more then an argument of subjective tastes; which is what you're trying to say.

Nobody has the gall or the smarts to define objectively why it's awful, only subjectively, which is relevant to no one.

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war-spawn

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Posted at: 12/17/07 03:54 PM

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At 12/17/07 02:42 PM, Erkie wrote: Nobody has the gall or the smarts to define objectively why it's awful, only subjectively, which is relevant to no one.

True. This post will only go around in circles to the point where we will all come to a point where we agree that pie is great. Off topic ftw.

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preffertobedead

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Posted at: 12/17/07 05:10 PM

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PIE IS GREAT!

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LaForge

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Posted at: 12/18/07 09:37 PM

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WHY DOES NG DEGRADE PIE!?

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InsaneSmilie

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Posted at: 12/18/07 09:45 PM

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At 12/18/07 09:37 PM, Nithalahk wrote: WHY DOES NG DEGRADE PIE!?

Good question, ask The Weeble

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aaronmusslewhite

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Posted at: 12/18/07 10:37 PM

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I'm not sure why most people dont like hip hop. But i personaly don't really except rap as music. An art form maybe, i'll go with you there but not necesarily music (yes.. music is art for those of you who would point that out, but apples are fruit but other fruits aren't apples, naw i mean!? :P) in anycase, i don't really feel it takes a whole lot of musical prowess to make the accompaniment that goes under the vocals of rap music. Usually its either A) a sample of someone else recording (which to me is a cop-out i mean.. even 3 note lines get excepted as music nowadays), or an incredibly watered-down repetitive drum loop with some almost monotoned saw wave stuff going on around it. These loops are usually like.. maybe 12 seconds long. To me ..as someone who enjoys progressive music with lots of changes, such as Opeth or Tool, that gets boring .. real quick. Another issue that lands on a sour note for me is that alot of popular artists (i say popular because i am by no means a connesuer of rap music, I'm just going by whats blasted at me by radio, mtv, stupid cheerleaders at pep rallys, and virtually everything else) seem to copy alot of each others' lyrical themes. Honestly one song about how much money you have is ok i suppose. Awesome I'm proud, you made it! No problem being proud of that. But when every other rapper on the planet is going "I got money!" "I'm getting paid" "baaaalllliiiin'!!!" it starts getting.. a little old. Especially when you yourself continue writing songs about the same exact topic. Money, how hard your gangster life is, how hot you are if you're a girl, and sex (and i'm not putting down the pleasures of sex by any means, trust me ;P it just gets really old to hear about someone else's promiscuos lifestlye really fast) are just a few themes repeated over and over i think rappers could shy away from for just a little while, just to make the flood of copy cats a little less intolerable.

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Adam-Beilgard

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Posted at: 12/19/07 12:40 AM

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At 11/29/07 01:16 AM, Stamper wrote: I like hip-hop.

I agrizzle, my nizzle. And this is not a unique thread. At least twice a month, someone comes in here complaining that Rap and Hip-Hop is underrated and underappreciated here at NG.

What people need to keep in perspective is that these are amateur musicians, using amateur equipment in their spare time. Akon gets paid bucoup $ to do what he does best with a team of professionals doing what they do best with professional equipment doing what it does best.

Considering the free market of supply and demand, I'd say Hip-Hop is quite fairly represented here and what unappreciation you're talking about is probably toward the 'dregs' who don't put much effort into their amateur productions. It happens in all the genres, please quit crying about Hip-Hop.

There, I said it.

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Chronamut

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Posted at: 12/19/07 02:51 PM

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hey erkie - without using technicslities - explain to everyone your thoughts on the topic :P

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DofS

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Posted at: 12/19/07 07:36 PM

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At 11/29/07 01:32 AM, Rig wrote:
At 11/29/07 01:14 AM, New-Milkman wrote: Mostly, it's a matter of preference.
I'm not usually a fan of hip-hop, but I'd really like to see some GOOD hip-hop on here, ya know.
Hip-hoppers - invest in a good mic. PLEASE.

Check out Cajete he's the hip hop king around here.


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Erkie

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Posted at: 12/19/07 07:54 PM

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At 12/19/07 02:51 PM, Chronamut wrote: hey erkie - without using technicslities - explain to everyone your thoughts on the topic :P

I did.

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Poetic-Reven

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Posted at: 12/23/07 10:36 PM

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At 12/19/07 12:40 AM, Adam-Beilgard wrote:
At 11/29/07 01:16 AM, Stamper wrote: I like hip-hop.

::

Considering the free market of supply and demand, I'd say Hip-Hop is quite fairly represented here and what unappreciation you're talking about is probably toward the 'dregs' who don't put much effort into their amateur productions. It happens in all the genres, please quit crying about Hip-Hop.
There, I said it.

first of all you don't get a reveiw, like HIP HOP SUCKZ GO TO HELL....come on bro

don't hate me because i make hip hop i ain't gonna say nothing i let my music speak for itself

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Poetic-Reven

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Posted at: 12/23/07 10:40 PM

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and another thing i feel like many ppl i collaberate with are not amatures as you say i use FL 7 Vst's Soundfonts and Samples...with a midi keyboard so is that mediocre equipment because most of us ain't born with a silver spoon in our mouths. That's just how I feel about that comment I've been doing music for over 3 years and i take up to a few hours to a few dayz or weeks to finish a hip hop beat.

don't hate me because i make hip hop i ain't gonna say nothing i let my music speak for itself

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endlessnumber

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Posted at: 12/24/07 01:05 AM

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http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?titl e=Soulja_Boy&oldid=177530394#Early_life

SB made his entire album using the demo version of FL... it's a musical masterpiece. Personally the best thing I've ever listened to. Just goes to show you that the whole is more than the sum of its parts.

*eyeroll*

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TheEyeOfMusiK

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Posted at: 12/24/07 05:38 AM

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Hip Hop > Techno

(I did this only to watch this topic go in circles again.. its quite amusing ^_^)


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InGenius

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Posted at: 12/24/07 11:32 AM

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I think most people still confuse "rap" with "hip-hop". The apples to fruit comment above, in fact, fits that as an analogy far better than fitting that Hip-Hop isn't music. Rap is something you do over a beat. Hip-hop is the entire culture associated with the musical genre of the same name. As for the genre of Hip-Hop music, it can incorporate Ambient Hip-Hop tracks like Fatboy Slim or DJ Shadow's work, all the way to Glam/Bling rap, which is what most of the detractors see as such a devastatingly bad image to Hip-Hop. But you need to look at Hip-Hop like every other genre and culture from a musical standpoint to understand the subtleties.

Rock music began as an offshoot of Blues which was an offshoot of something else, ad infinitum. All music has it's roots someplace else. And, strangely enough, the newer the music, generally, the less it is "accepted" by those of older or different genres. Hip-hop has only been recognized since the early 80's as being it's own genre, though one could argue that it's roots could stretch all the way to some spoken word tracks from the 20's, so it is fairly new in the scheme of things. And it has been loathed by critics since it's inception, but this is no different than other "experimental" or socially unacceptable musics.

When Elvis first began his trek to stardom he along with other classic rock and roll stars, such as Buddy Holly, were seen as socially and morally unacceptable, as little more than racy lyrical content and horrific musicianship at best, but at worst Rock and Roll was described as not even being music. Rock morphed into Metal, which also was first described as not being music. Techno, first described as not being music. Worse than that, musicians who played "analog' instruments saw the digital underpinning of techno as unnatural and nonmusical, simple even. Every genre can accuse another genre of being "simple".

To usurp the earlier statement about using samples being simple, "How hard can it be to spin two records and mix together a song?" Which is exactly what DJ's in many techno genres do...but I dare you to claim it's easy to do. Also, "How hard can it be to program a computer to produce saw tones and create techno music?" Which is the other aspect of techno musicianship and also not easily accomplished. "How hard can it be to play the same 3 power chords and growl into a stage mic about demons and angels?" Heavy metal music. Also not easy or simple. "How hard can it be to write a song about a ford pickup truck and a hound dog on the Texas plains?" Country music. The point is that if you don't have experience in the genre, you might think it's simple but if you take the time to try and reproduce the music, you'd note how hard it really is to create a quality track.

The problem is that, yes, all genres have their one-hit wonders and their bad apples who make the genre look like trash. I, personally, don't like bling rap at all. Lil Flip and Mike Jones made Texas look like trash, in my opinion. But they also make money and that's what their goal was, so I won't begrudge them that. But judging all of hip-hop on that? It's like judging all of techno based on Sandstorm by Darude, the most overplayed POS song I ever heard come from any genre of Techno. Or all of Heavy Metal based on Marilyn Manson, which had some of the simplest lyrics and musical numbers ever, but everyone loved him because he was outrageous.

The list can go on and on. The fact remains, if you don't like hip-hop, then that's great for you. I don't like country. But I am NOT searching out country songs online and sending messages to their singers saying "COUNTRY SUXX0RS P3n1S an so do u!!!!" But some music on NG gets that type of review, alot of it in the Hip-Hop genre which is sad really. But that's how it will be until some new musical form reaches the same status as Hip-Hop and everyone can hate on it for awhile. So the circle has gone since music began. I guarantee someone listening to ragtime in the 20's was busy saying "That devilish swing music, making people dance!!! How apalling!"


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KF-mwh-BK-toas

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Posted at: 12/24/07 02:03 PM

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At 11/29/07 01:16 AM, Stamper wrote: I like hip-hop.

With Dicks innit.


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Khuskan

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Posted at: 12/24/07 03:27 PM

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Because the majority of people on NG don't [i]like[/i] hip-hop, and since most of them arn't musicaly skilled enought to be able to seporate personal opinion on a track from the musical ability demonstrated in it, they can't appreciate it for what it is either.

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TechnoReaper666

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Posted at: 12/24/07 04:43 PM

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hip hop is gay and i dont even consider it music becuase the artists know absolutely nothing about music and making music and plus they cant even come up with good lyrics so if ur a fan of hip-hop and (c)Rap go fuck urself


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Rig

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Posted at: 12/24/07 04:47 PM

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At 12/24/07 04:43 PM, TechnoReaper666 wrote: hip hop is gay and i dont even consider it music becuase the artists know absolutely nothing about music and making music and plus they cant even come up with good lyrics so if ur a fan of hip-hop and (c)Rap go fuck urself

How old are you? 9? Maybe you should work on your grammar and spelling before you post.
I'm sorry...I just can't take you seriously.


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chucktownbluv

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Posted at: 12/24/07 08:21 PM

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lol, i'm amazed by this community's grasp of the english language.


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Greeksta-69

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Posted at: 12/25/07 12:31 AM

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At 12/24/07 04:43 PM, TechnoReaper666 wrote: hip hop is gay and i dont even consider it music becuase the artists know absolutely nothing about music and making music and plus they cant even come up with good lyrics so if ur a fan of hip-hop and (c)Rap go fuck urself

See, your only invisioning yourself as a hip-hp artist...

You have to think about others too silly.

Check out my newest song HERE!

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Poetic-Reven

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Posted at: 12/25/07 05:42 PM

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At 12/24/07 04:43 PM, TechnoReaper666 wrote: hip hop is gay and i dont even consider it music becuase the artists know absolutely nothing about music and making music and plus they cant even come up with good lyrics so if ur a fan of hip-hop and (c)Rap go fuck urself

well your gay

don't hate me because i make hip hop i ain't gonna say nothing i let my music speak for itself

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endlessnumber

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Posted at: 12/25/07 05:58 PM

endlessnumber EVIL LEVEL 14

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His gay what?

What did his gay do?

-.-

Look. Love it or hate it, hip hop is music and it takes a modicum of skill to pull it off right. And by a modicum, I mean a VERY small amount (see: Soulja Boy). But there are good artists and then there are bad artists. If people come into the portal screaming "HIP HOP SUCKS" on all your reviews, report them as abusive and they'll get deleted, it's no big deal. Plenty of people post stupid shit on my songs about how they would have made my song, but differently (i.e. wrong) but I deal.

And I don't think you'd like people worshipping you anyways, then you never get any criticism.

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Chronamut

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Posted at: 12/25/07 06:12 PM

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At 12/25/07 05:42 PM, Poetic-Reven wrote:
well your gay

do you HONESTLY think that's an insult that built its foundations on homosexuality? Lol

I mean.. half the mods are even gay :P

and ive got the pics and cam time to prove it :P

oh and once again

goldencat loves plaid tees lol :P

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DSMagnum

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Posted at: 12/25/07 06:25 PM

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At 12/25/07 05:42 PM, Poetic-Reven wrote:
At 12/24/07 04:43 PM, TechnoReaper666 wrote: hip hop is gay and i dont even consider it music becuase the artists know absolutely nothing about music and making music and plus they cant even come up with good lyrics so if ur a fan of hip-hop and (c)Rap go fuck urself
well your gay

Do NOT feed the trolls.


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preffertobedead

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Posted at: 12/25/07 07:20 PM

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