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At 10/4/07 08:32 PM, K-RadPie wrote:

At 10/4/07 06:59 PM, urbn wrote: It's called SARCASM. I think Global Warming exists. Yes. It seems that my Sarcastic comment stirred you up some. lol

Okay. You got me.

:P Better luck next time ;)

North America is more rain but Africa is less rain

At 10/5/07 05:42 AM, Satayu wrote: North America is more rain but Africa is less rain

Wowzers. Genius at work over thar.

At 10/2/07 07:34 PM, SlithVampir wrote: HOLY SHIT A CLIMATE TOPIC!!!!!!!!!1!!!!!!!!!!

By morning we can expect a battle scarred flame war.

Either way, effects will start around 2015, most say.

What do you mean with effects? Here in Sweden, there is already change. The glacier of Helagsfjället is about half the size it was 20 years ago, as an example.

At 10/5/07 07:08 AM, Sajberhippien wrote:

At 10/2/07 07:34 PM, SlithVampir wrote: HOLY SHIT A CLIMATE TOPIC!!!!!!!!!1!!!!!!!!!!

By morning we can expect a battle scarred flame war.

Either way, effects will start around 2015, most say.

What do you mean with effects? Here in Sweden, there is already change. The glacier of Helagsfjället is about half the size it was 20 years ago, as an example.

Perhaps 2015 is when America gets hit? The world outside tends to not count at times :o

At 10/5/07 07:35 AM, Drakim wrote: Perhaps 2015 is when America gets hit? The world outside tends to not count at times :o

I was listening to the radio the other day, coming home from college (I'm not like old people who sit in front of them at home), and they were taking the piss out of some American beauty pagent thing (whatever) and there was a question about how America is helping the Asian and African countries, here rply was something like this:

"Well, erm, I think it's good that America is helping the Iraqi and Asian countries..."

Then there was, "Why do 2/3 of American's not know where other countries are?"

So she replied "I think it's because schools don't have maps"

So, I don't think it's that you don't consider us important, I think that most American's feel like America and the rest of the world are on seperate planets, so anything they do doesn't affect us and vice versa.

/rant

In 2004 have 22 Hurricanes in America
In 2005 have 27 Hurricanes in America
Think In 2010 have >35 Hurricanes in America

At 10/5/07 10:33 AM, Satayu wrote: In 2004 have 22 Hurricanes in America
In 2005 have 27 Hurricanes in America
Think In 2010 have >35 Hurricanes in America

Just taking 2 years isn't enough, you have to look at more, at least 20 but preferably 200 or more years.

At 10/5/07 11:23 AM, Sajberhippien wrote:

At 10/5/07 10:33 AM, Satayu wrote: In 2004 have 22 Hurricanes in America
In 2005 have 27 Hurricanes in America
Think In 2010 have >35 Hurricanes in America

Just taking 2 years isn't enough, you have to look at more, at least 20 but preferably 200 or more years.

Sorry for double posting, but I found a source:
http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/pastdec.shtml

At 10/4/07 12:14 PM, TheMason wrote: A landscape that has been altered by changes in the atmosphere...1000 years ago.

Bringing it back to what I already said. An atmospheric change that has had 1000 years to adjust. I'm not saying GW doesn't happen, I'm saying it should happen so quickly unless there are other factors at work. Hell, it might not even be atmospheric. Erosion, deforestation/afforestation, human activity and changes in land use can all effect a drainage basin.

Really, one of my classmates here is from a Canadian city close to the arctic and a factory was closed down in his hometown because of Kyoto style controls on factory carbon emmissions. 400 people lost their jobs. That is more than a "little" lifestyle change.

I was probably a little strong in my opinion that policy changes wont effect someone somewhere. There's always winners and losers. But changes are having to be made for the future if Climate Change is really down to industry.

But the small lifestyle changes are more preferable, I'm sure you'll agree, as they don't involve anyone losing their jobs.

As a matter of interest, could you tell me more about the factory being closed down? I'd never heard of an entire factory being closed with hundreds becoming jobless just for the sake of carbon emissions. I'm studying Physical Geography at uni and part of it involves the effects of climate change. It'd help me if I could find out more and use it as a negative impact for the Kyoto Agreement. :)

Funny thing there my friend, you don't really address my point here either...

Once Al Gore starts living what he preaches (taking his GW oath and reducing his carbon footprint by conserving energy...and NOT by buying 'offsets'), maybe I'll be able to take people like him seriously.

I understand that. I'm not fully against what you're saying, nor do I fully support it. People are only going to start conserving energy when the politicians themselves make the first steps. Most people are also willing to help, as long as they don't lose out in pocket etc.

I suppose only when the first city gets swallowed up by raising waters or when the last tree in the rainforest gets cut down will the majority feel they need to do something.

And the insect is coming to cool zone.More Seaweed in the ocean.

At 10/5/07 12:35 PM, Satayu wrote: And the insect is coming to cool zone.More Seaweed in the ocean.

THE INSECT OF DOOM!

At 10/5/07 11:23 AM, Sajberhippien wrote: Just taking 2 years isn't enough, you have to look at more, at least 20 but preferably 200 or more years.

;
200 years, that's nothin'
The planet is around 4 & a half BILLION years old.
The oldest rock dated so far is about 3.9 Billion years old, so the earth was a ball of molten material before that 3.9 billion year age.(talk about global warming!)

There is some argument on mankind being around for 2.5 to 3 million years, others say it's 4.5 to 4.6 million years. they seem to be argueing about whether walking upright is enough to be classified as human or did one need erect posture & tool/weapon making skils.

But anyway even if human kind has been on this planet for 5 million years, there has been some other forms of life for 3 Billion years & there's a thousand millions in a billion.
In that time there have been many episodes of global warming & cooling. As well as several incidences of mass extinctions.
Does this planet seem to care ? Not at all it just keeps spinning & turning out new species to evolve as time ticks by.
Global warming may cause a mass extinction, it may take down the human race.
Does it matter in the great scheme of things?
I don't think so, only ones who'll know & or give a fuck are those of us who go through it.
Planet earth will just keep spinning & maybe next species it churns out will be better to itself & the planet.
In the grand ballet that is the universe, I don't believe it will be noticed.

At 10/5/07 12:22 PM, Engelsman wrote:

At 10/4/07 12:14 PM, TheMason wrote: Really, one of my classmates here is from a Canadian city close to the arctic and a factory was closed down in his hometown because of Kyoto style controls on factory carbon emmissions. 400 people lost their jobs. That is more than a "little" lifestyle change.

As a matter of interest, could you tell me more about the factory being closed down? I'd never heard of an entire factory being closed with hundreds becoming jobless just for the sake of carbon emissions. I'm studying Physical Geography at uni and part of it involves the effects of climate change. It'd help me if I could find out more and use it as a negative impact for the Kyoto Agreement. :)

Sure thing, and again I'm going off of something a friend of mine in my grad program told me. Give me a few days and I'll try and get you a link or two.

Also, one of the flaws with Kyoto is that it does nothing to limit the pollution of China and India and I've seen data that indicates that at the present rate those two countries are increasing their industrial capacity using old, dirty technology at such a rate that in 25 years the impact of the US not cutting back on our emissions will be completely offset.

Is geology your major or is it filling your science request?

China and India deserve to rule us [Economically] as they pollute the planet, it's really that simple.

I think America is the most made pollution in the world > South-east Asia + Japan + Australia + Europe

It took me awhile to understand what you meant, but what i said was in reguards to the future. America will [Against it's will or in it's will] reduce it's polution. China and india will not.

1) sum people believe that global warming is not infact effected by humans. wrong. and junk science.com is not a reliable source because the man whom wrote it was trying to save his well paying job.

2) sum people believe global warming is all bad. wrong. global warming allows life to be possible on earth. heres how: the suns rays hit earth , heat that hits earth then shoots out. resulting in a temp of 0 degrees farenhit. with global warming, the ozone traps heat in earth and slowly releases it. this allows for a hospitable climate on earth.

that is my theory

At 10/7/07 04:18 PM, loopyguy0 wrote: 1) sum people believe that global warming is not infact effected by humans. wrong.

Care to back up your little statement?

Well when and if the Apocalypse comes I'll be sure to go out on a New York Highway with a high powered gun and mow down as many people as possible. (Those bloody Evangelists will PAY for dooming the human race).

The thing is Global Warmth Deniers can't accept the fact that we aren't impervious to disaster.

Also my sheep. Children in the stupid flock of god.
Remember and take to heart the following, for it's my word.

1. The Apollo landings were ALL faked. It's impossible to land on the moon.
2. Bush did 9/11.
3. The CIA created HIV/AIDS. Has a vaccine, and refuses to admit it. Google Sue Arrigo.
4. CIA has hid Roswell to further a plan to use Christianity to found a highly fascist and dictatorial New World Order.
5. Global Warming will never happen, if it happens then it means you're among the damned in a futuristic Techno-Thriller hell reminiscent of Blade Runner.

Blessed be the Lord, for he has advised us on the truth of these conspiracies. Amen, Brahma is not God.

At 10/7/07 04:18 PM, loopyguy0 wrote: 1) ...junk science.com is not a reliable source because the man whom wrote it was trying to save his well paying job.

This is a double edged sword in that Al Gore has pecuniary (financial) interests at stake as does the scientist who is publishing proof of GW. There is a lot of money to be made in the "save the planet/world" business...

At 10/7/07 05:32 PM, notld224 wrote: The thing is Global Warmth Deniers can't accept the fact that we aren't impervious to disaster.

I have two objections to this statement.

1) I don't like the term "GW Denier"...it is a loaded term that is more of a personal attack than descriptive of people like me. I prefer "GW Skeptic" since I do not deny that GW is possible, I just have a problem with the methodology and I have questions about it that have yet to be satisfactorially addressed. Until these questions have been answered, then I refuse to submit my reason to shaman, holy man or scientific "consensus".

2) Secondly, I do believe that we can be hit by disaster. The introduction of oxygen to the Earth's atmosphere killed off 95% of the world's species. A meteor took out the dinosaurs. About 10,000 years ago the Black Sea was a lake that got flooded killing a significant number of humans and dislocating survivors (which gave rise to "the Great Flood" myths that can be found in much of the ancient literature from the region). Not only has it happened in the past; it WILL happen again.

As for your post about conspiracy theories...not really sure if you're making fun of us or if you believe that tripe. If you were trying to make a statement that is problematic as well...

I do not believe in conspiracy theories. JFK was killed by a lone nut and al Qaida brought down the towers. I can tell news from fiction...

you realize that the sun has increased its activity, and will continue to do so until around 2040-2050, and then it will get normal. besides multiple other planets have begun to heat up as well, maybe were heating them up too. maybe you drones shouldnt beleive everything Al Gore and David Suzuki says, suzuki was claiming alot of identical things in the 80's about nuclear winter, maybe hes just an attention whore with a title and a TV show, and of course Al Gore just wants to get back at florida.

At 10/7/07 06:08 PM, TheMason wrote: I do not believe in conspiracy theories. JFK was killed by a lone nut and al Qaida brought down the towers. I can tell news from fiction...

;
I might not know the truth behind either of these events... but I do know this.
The only way J.F.K. and that car he traveled in were shot up by one person, is if that person was a magician.
There is no other way to explain the trajectory of the bullets. If there was only 1 shooter in a building shooting at that target. Magic is the only way to explain it, unless there was more than 1 shooter & then it becomes possible to explain .

At 10/8/07 01:15 PM, morefngdbs wrote:

At 10/7/07 06:08 PM, TheMason wrote: I do not believe in conspiracy theories. JFK was killed by a lone nut and al Qaida brought down the towers. I can tell news from fiction...

;
I might not know the truth behind either of these events... but I do know this.
The only way J.F.K. and that car he traveled in were shot up by one person, is if that person was a magician.
There is no other way to explain the trajectory of the bullets. If there was only 1 shooter in a building shooting at that target. Magic is the only way to explain it, unless there was more than 1 shooter & then it becomes possible to explain .

When it comes to the JFK assasination there is more to it than me just being skeptical. I just don't care. I don't attach that much importance to his presidency to pay attention...

I don't care what the effects of Global Warming are and I don't think anybody should. The fact is, there are large groups of people that went to school for a long time to learn about the planet and it's environment and have dedicated their entire lives to understanding these things. And when these people get on TV and say "We're destroying the planet" I think we should listen to them. Ignoring them is like going to the doctor, having him tell you that you have cancer and then just saying "no I don't" and hopeing that if you ignore it, it'll just go away.

Worst case scenario, we do everything in our power to clean up the environment and then wake up one day to a beautiful clean planet and find out that Global Warming was all a bunch of bullshit. So what? We should want to clean up the planet because we live here. I mean, what's the harm in being able to go outside and take a deep breath?

How does cleaning up the environment effect us negativly? Fuck an ice age, I say we clean up the environment under the simple idea that it would be nice to go outside and breath in something other the smog. Am I the only one feels this way?

Seriously, am I the only that sees a problem with this picture of the L.A. skyline?

Who cares the worlds going to end in December of 2012 anyway

"Accordingly, several eclectic authors claim that a major, world-changing event will take place in 2012:
%u2022 The 1995 book The Mayan Prophecies linked the Maya calendar with long-period sunspot cycles.
%u2022 The book claims the Maya may have been instructed in their wisdom by discarnate entities from Orion and the Pleiades. Contact was maintained through shamanic rituals conducted in accordance with the movements of planets and stars.
%u2022 The 1997 book The Bible Code claims that, according to certain algorithms of the Bible code, a meteor, asteroid or comet will collide with the Earth.
%u2022 The book The Nostradamus Code speaks of a series of natural disasters caused by a comet (possibly as above) which will allow the third Antichrist to disperse his troops around the globe under the guise of aid in preparation for a possible nuclear war, although in the strictest sense it is unspecific as to nuclear war or some other natural or man caused destruction.
%u2022 The book The Orion Prophecy claims that the Earth's magnetic field will reverse.
%u2022 The 2005 book Beyond 2012: Catastrophe or Ecstasy by Geoff Stray reviews several theories, prophecies and predictions concerning 2012 and finds where authors have used faulty information or have bent the truth to fit their theories.
%u2022 The 2006 book 2012: The Return of Quetzalcoatl by Daniel Pinchbeck discusses theories of a possible global awakening to psychic connection by the year 2012, creating a noosphere. It also discusses many other aspects of the 2012 phenomenon from a neutral perspective.
Other prophecies and apocalyptic writings and hypotheses for this year include:
%u2022 Terence McKenna's mathematical novelty theory suggests a point of singularity in which a great number of things could happen, including "hyperspatial breakthrough", planetesimal impact, alien contact, historical metamorphosis, metamorphosis of natural law, solar explosion, quasar ignition at the galactic core, or nothing. [10]
%u2022 The Prophecy of the Popes, attributed to Saint Malachy, speculated that Pope Benedict XVI would reign during the beginning of the tribulation of which Jesus spoke, and sometime later a future pope described in the prophecy as "Peter the Roman", the last in this prophetic list, would appear, bringing as a result the destruction of the city of Rome and the Last Judgment.
%u2022 Many new age spiritualists and philosophers ("new-agers") believe humankind will enter an age of enlightenment in 2012. There are a range of varying, generally positive, beliefs shared by a subset of spiritualists from the mundane to exceptional - including a positive social shift and age of peace, mankind becoming psychic and connected by a collective, and/or an evolution of the human race into non-corporeal beings made of "spiritual" energy, or light energy, i.e. 'ascension'.
%u2022 Some alien-enthusiasts, along with some new-agers, believe 2012 to correspond approximately with the return of alien "watchers" or "caretakers" who might have helped the first human civilizations with developing their technology and may have been waiting for us to reach a higher level of technological and/or social advancement. Beliefs range from the extra-terrestrials having benevolent purposes - such as to help human society evolve - to malevolent purposes - such as enslavement of mankind and/or manipulation.[citation needed]
%u2022 The Nepalese ascetic Ram Bahadur Bomjon, the so-called "Buddha boy", reportedly told his followers that he would return around 2012.
%u2022 Some proponents of a peak oil catastrophe place major events in 2012. Richard C. Duncan's book The Peak of World Oil Production and the Road To The Olduvai Gorge claims that the Olduvai cliff will begin and permanent blackouts will occur worldwide. Several studies predict a peak in oil production in or around 2012. [11] [12] [13]"
There's also some doomsday prophesies from the Sybil, oracle at Delphi, Merlin, and web bot surrounding 2012.

I will neither confirm nor deny this material and I have no public opinion.
Enjoy Mahahahahhaha

Global Warming is bullshit. There's no way that suddenly it's all over the news and suddenly respected scientists become concerned. If you think about the things we've accomplished scientifically - and then think about the fact that global warming is simply photosynthesis not being able to occur at a fast enough rate (not enough trees to turn the CO2 into O2) - it becomes obvious this is a scam.

Why anyone would want you to drive less is beyond me. I can't see how it can be beneficial to anyone - especially the big oil companies.

I've heard crazy conspiracies about how every 3600 a planet upsets our polar fields and leads to the natural disasters which are being blamed on "global warming". I find that difficult to verify.

All I can guarantee is that this is not what it appears. The news is reporting this falsely like they do all major political bluffs. And that is an obvious sign that global warming is BS.

At 10/8/07 03:53 PM, iEatFood wrote: I don't care what the effects of Global Warming are and I don't think anybody should. The fact is, there are large groups of people that went to school for a long time to learn about the planet and it's environment and have dedicated their entire lives to understanding these things. And when these people get on TV and say "We're destroying the planet" I think we should listen to them. Ignoring them is like going to the doctor, having him tell you that you have cancer and then just saying "no I don't" and hopeing that if you ignore it, it'll just go away.

Yes let us give up our reason and stop asking questions and challenging authority because a scientist (the modern world's version of a shaman or witch doctor) tells to! I've gone to school for a long time and am currently learning about modeling large phenomenon that involves an unknowable number of variables.

I've also read some of what those guys put out. It is not the samething that Al Gore, Greenpeace or ELF makes it out to be and the margin of error is large.

Worst case scenario, we do everything in our power to clean up the environment and then wake up one day to a beautiful clean planet and find out that Global Warming was all a bunch of bullshit. So what? We should want to clean up the planet because we live here. I mean, what's the harm in being able to go outside and take a deep breath?

And we wake up and our cars are replaced with magical flying unicorns!

How does cleaning up the environment effect us negativly? Fuck an ice age, I say we clean up the environment under the simple idea that it would be nice to go outside and breath in something other the smog. Am I the only one feels this way?

Your point is something that I agree with in principle. We should be good caretakers for the planet. However, we must not be overzealous and make policy that will hurt the lower stratas of society while people like Gore continue living irresponsibily.

Seriously, am I the only that sees a problem with this picture of the L.A. skyline?

That is why I prefer the country...