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At 9/6/07 08:14 PM, kahncccp wrote: Need I say More?

no, in fact it would be appreciated if you never say a thing again.

At 9/5/07 06:59 PM, kahncccp wrote: I'd like to know your opinions on Joseph Stalin. I personally think he was the greatest leader of all time, since he destroyed Nazi Germany

He helped to destroy Nazi Germany. His nations vast size and defensive abilities, Britains constant hinderance since day one, American firepower, and Subjugated nations various resistence cells broke Hitler.

and turned the U.S.S.R. into the most powerful country in the world.
Discuss.

Anyone can create a superpower if they don't let that pesky morality stand int their way.

At 9/5/07 07:58 PM, cellardoor6 wrote: Would they have stormed Berlin naked, starving, armed with pitchforks and rocks?

God, how much pot have you been smoking. This is STALIN we're talking about here. Of course he would send his own countrymen naked, starving, and armed with pitchforks. That's a bit like asking "Would Hitler run over a puppy out of spite"?

Hell, the fact that Stalin never DID send unarmed militias on mass to Berlin just to deplete their ammo caches is a bit amazing to be honest.

At 9/6/07 08:14 PM, kahncccp wrote: Need I say More?

Alright, this is the kicker; this one absolutely has to be a troll. No one can honestly be this fucking dumb.

Anyway, I'm very Pro-Stalin. Why? He killed tens of millions of his fellow communists. Anyone who kills commies has to be a good guy in my book.

At 9/6/07 09:22 PM, Cuppa-LettuceNog wrote: That's a bit like asking "Would Hitler run over a puppy out of spite"?

Hitler loved animals, especially dogs, so i doubt he would. now a Jewish baby, thats a different story.

At 9/5/07 08:43 PM, cellardoor6 wrote:

You still haven't proven any of this shit.

At 9/7/07 06:11 PM, kahncccp wrote:

At 9/5/07 08:43 PM, cellardoor6 wrote:

You still haven't proven any of this shit.

its common knowledge but anyways.

At 9/7/07 06:11 PM, kahncccp wrote:

At 9/5/07 08:43 PM, cellardoor6 wrote:

You still haven't proven any of this shit.

And you probably can't disproove it.

Here's a wikipedia article paragraph on the soviet army of wwII

"Soviet forces suffered heavy damage in the field as a result of poor levels of preparedness, whose primary causes were inadequate officers, as a result of the purges, disorganisation as a result of a partially completed mobilization, and the reorganisation the Army was undergoing.[12] The hasty pre-war growth and over-promotion of inexperienced Red Army officers as well as the removal of experienced officers caused by the Purges offset the balance favourably for the Germans"

"In the first part of the war, the Red Army fielded weaponry of mixed quality. It had excellent artillery, but it did not have enough trucks to maneuver and supply it; as a result the Wehrmacht (which rated it highly) captured much of it. Red Army T-34 tanks generally outclassed other tanks until 1943, yet most of the Soviet armored units were less advanced models; likewise, the same supply problem handicapped even the formations equipped with the most modern tanks. The Soviet Air Force initially performed poorly against the Germans. The quick advance of the Germans into the Soviet territory made reinforcement and replacements much more difficult since much of the Soviet Union's military industry lay in the west of the country. Until the Soviet authorities re-established the industry east of the Urals, much improvisation was necessary, and Soviet units were routinely far below their weapons establishment levels.[21"

At 9/6/07 04:30 PM, kahncccp wrote: Hitler made lampshades out of people, burned them alive, made them into soap, and made them EAT their own dead. So never never compare this fuck to Stalin.

Okay here I actually need some proof. You'll find that most of that is untrue. Not that it matters, but you can't make ridiculous, unsubstantiated claims and demand proof when people cite historical fact. Again, not that it matters, but most of the individual cruelties toward Jews were because of Himmler, whose job it was to oversee it all, and those who hope to advance their careers but appealing to him.

Let's move on because communism is getting old.

Old? It will soon be the new world order when the People's armies invade. LONG LIVE COMMUNISM!

You do realize that it's Capitalism that's allowing you to speak your little opinion, and that under Communism you'd be in prison if you were of an even remotely opposing view, don't you? You realize that your ability to use a computer, have lots of food, water, heat and no everpresent fear for your life is a result of NOT living under Communism...right? If Communism is so great, why do people with a choice always decide against it?

At 9/7/07 10:28 PM, Jerconjake wrote: Okay here I actually need some proof.

to be fair, everything he described happened in Nazi Germany, the vast majority of those things were never ordered or commited by Hitler himself (he just wanted the Jews gone, and to get some cheap labour out of it). most of the attrocities (things other than the forceful relocation and exterminations) were thought up and committed by those running the death camps, some of these people were actually tried by the Nazis themselves for attrocities.

but its still a ridiculous point. both Hitler and Stalin killed millions of people. though one difference, where i think Stalin should be considered a worst leader, is that Hitler had the intention of eliminating a specific group from his country while those killed by Stalin were simply victims of his paranoia and horrible economic plans. (though to be fair, he did purposely starve the Ukraine)

The ukraine is weak!!!!!!!

At 9/5/07 06:59 PM, kahncccp wrote:

lololol

At 9/5/07 06:59 PM, kahncccp wrote: I'd like to know your opinions on Joseph Stalin. I personally think he was the greatest leader of all time, since he destroyed Nazi Germany and turned the U.S.S.R. into the most powerful country in the world.
Discuss.

The only reason Stalin won the war was because Hitler made even worse mistakes: Stalin refused to believe and ridiculed officers that warned him of an attack on Moscow, long after it was too late. On average there was one gun for every ten Soviet soldiers. If Hitler hadn't been dumb enough to make an attack on Moscow in winter without supplying his troops with adequate clothing, Moscow quite possibly would have fallen. In fact, during the assault on Moscow, propaganda leaflets about the evacuation of the city were already being made. STALIN != GREAT LEADER

Stalin betrayed Marx, and Lenin. He was NOT A GOOD LEADER. Despite the damge down to Nazi Germany, he sent waves of soldiers, often without weapons. He lived in luxury, while Russia lived in poverty. He created such a huge class division, which is supposed to be absent in socialist society. I suggest you actually read the Communist Manifesto before you talk about how great of a "communist" leader Stalin was.

I dont care that he industrialised USSR. He killed many millions of people including innocents socialists and communists. He destroyed the image of socialism and becausoe of his existence.

He is no better than a capitalist pig, because just like a capitalist, he exploited the people to achieve huge economic growth. Killing of innocents can be never justified.

It is the duty of every socialist and communist to prevent people like Stalin to stay in power. Even if the own life has to be sacrificed to stop people like him. Those who opress others are criminals and belong into jail.

There are plenty of communist leaders who you should respect. Stalin isn't one of them.

Why not express your support for Ho Chi Minh?

At 9/6/07 08:14 PM, kahncccp wrote: Need I say More?

Need I say more?

Karl Marx was a misanthrope.

At 9/9/07 04:48 PM, Ursine wrote: Karl Marx was a misanthrope.

So is Dr. House. Are you implying that Karl Marx was super awesome and always discovered that it wasn't lupus?

I smell me a commie.

Joseph's pro's:
He pwned Nazi Germany.
He made USSR a cool and powerful country.

Joseph's con's:
He killed lots of people or took them to GULAG.
He used shitty strategies in WWII so lots of people has kiled by Nazis.

At 9/9/07 05:09 PM, Empanado wrote: So is Dr. House. Are you implying that Karl Marx was super awesome and always discovered that it wasn't lupus?

damnit! why does everything end up coming back to how theres no lupus? we need more lupus!

Lol, Stalin? Killed the most people? Are we forgetting Mao and the Great Leap Forward, the Cultural Revolution and the Red Guard?

Also, Stalin is sort of an iffy subject. Although he did kill millions of his own people for no reason, he did transform a struggling Soviet union into the industrial powerhouse of Asia and Eastern Europe.

Nice to see 99.9% of Ng hate Stalin.

At 9/6/07 12:10 AM, Gunter45 wrote: The only thinking keeping the Soviet Union together by the end were strong-arm tactics by the KGB and the like. The reason why the workers fought for it was because they thought "hey, free money, I'm in." Once people realized that it royally screws your economy and that their lives still sucked, it didn't matter who was in power.

True but all I'm saying is that in true communism no one is really in power because everyone is equal. But no, I'm not a communist.

It's really the very definition of why an absolute direct democracy that is at the whims of the people is a BAD idea. One of the purest cases was in colonial America where they even wanted to print money and the government let them because there was a majority in favor. What ended up happening was the economy went right into the shitter and the money wasn't even worth the paper it was printed on. Just because people fight for something doesn't mean it's in their best interests and it's sustainable.

Once again, good point, there's some stuff that shouldn't be left to the voters but to those who actually know what they're doing and just what will happen with something. I know that communism screws up your economies and makes everyone's life crappy instead of just the ones who are at the bottom, I wasn't saying it didn't. I was just saying that TRUE Communism wasn't a dictatorship.

At 9/9/07 04:47 PM, GaiusIuliusTaberna wrote:

"In December 1934, the popular Leningrad party leader, Sergei Kirov, was assassinated, allegedly on Stalin's orders. This provided the spark for the escalating series of purges that Stalin launched almost immediately, under emergency "security" legislation "stating that in cases involving people accused of terrorist acts, investing authorities were to speed up their work, judicial authorities were not to allow appeals for clemency or other delays in which the sentence was death, and the NKVD was to execute those sentenced to death immediately."

It's a good thing none of that happens here, and that everybody condemns anything of the sort..

At 9/10/07 09:16 PM, animehater wrote: Nice to see 99.9% of Ng hate Stalin.

not everyone hates him, per say, but most people hate stupid people who say ridiculous things about him.

how can you hate such an awesome moustache?

Stalin had ballz, but he had never won WWII if you americans didn't came to save the fucking day! Unfortunately Stalin is one of the worst examples of how comunism should work, as he was an DICTATOR! Do remember that every type of goverment has to be sustained under the working class and Stalin was none other than Hitler and nowadays Bush or Putin.

As a remark, Does Usa still has those commie witch hunts? I can only see 2 Parties in every election...

At 9/9/07 03:38 PM, Kenzu wrote: Why not express your support for Ho Chi Minh?

He was a good leader as well.

I dont believe someone who was a priest and religious and then sent other priests into gulags
I dont believe someone who called himself a communist and sent other communists into gulags.

Stalin is even worse than a child-molesting slave trader.

He also killed a lot of his own people, was deeply paranoid, and caused the tension that is the Cold War because he wanted power.