What is punk?

[StatiK]

yeah...me and my friends (they're real...i swear) have been debating recently about what it means to be punk...and now you, yes you have an opportunity to post your pothead ideas bout what it is...woo hoo!

[alexsmolik]

A musical moovement. (?spelling?)
Punks are people (most of the time) who likes alcohol, drinking, smoking and doing nothing.
But they are kewl and ... kewl.
I had my punk period too... lol.

[TomFlump]

Well its hard to say since a lot of "facts" about punk are derived from opinions. Supposedly it's being anti-conformity, but now it seems as if more people are CONFORMING to the punk trend. Then theres the punk-rock, which is really hard to define. There were the punk rock bands back in the day that were fast paced and often times political and anti-government. It's kinda hard to give a definition, because a definition would mean a label, which is also anti-punk philosophy... CONTRADICTIONS GODDAMIT!

[sirevil]

punk
n.

1. Slang.
a. A young person, especially a member of a rebellious counterculture group.
b. An inexperienced young man.

[MarijuanaLock]

it's not a style of clothing, i don't think. not in my opinion. it's more of a musical movement, yeah.

everyone i talk to about it seems to think that punk's sold out. but i don't think so. it was a mostly underground thing. but just like with lots of other underground music, it got popular, and that, for some people, automatically means sell-out.

eh. i dunno. punk is whatever you think it is. individuality.

[TomFlump]

At 6/28/03 07:06 PM, MarijuanaLock wrote: eh. i dunno. punk is whatever you think it is. individuality.

yea thats the problem these days though. its not about individuality. its about going out and putting saftey pins all over your clothes and dying your hair, and wearing metal spikes. thats not idividuality, as far as im concerned, that is a fashion trend. good charlotte and sum 41 aren't punk bands, theyre mediocre pop/rock bands who dress up in "punk" clothes. "Clothing should not define a musician's style. Rather (and here's a real challenging idea for you), their MUSIC should."

[MarijuanaLock]

At 6/28/03 07:11 PM, FrankTheTank wrote:

At 6/28/03 07:06 PM, MarijuanaLock wrote: eh. i dunno. punk is whatever you think it is. individuality.

yea thats the problem these days though. its not about individuality. its about going out and putting saftey pins all over your clothes and dying your hair, and wearing metal spikes. thats not idividuality, as far as im concerned, that is a fashion trend. good charlotte and sum 41 aren't punk bands, theyre mediocre pop/rock bands who dress up in "punk" clothes. "Clothing should not define a musician's style. Rather (and here's a real challenging idea for you), their MUSIC should."

hahah, that's a great quote. i totally agree with you. i don't call any of the new "punk" bands punk. i won't bash them, because they're popular for a reason. but they're totally riding on an image that wasn't supposed to be an image in the first place.

[all-thats-unstopable]

i agree with frank punk isn't about the "clothes" or the "styles" its about the music if you just care about styles and clothes then yor a MTV punk at the most.

[Dagodevas]

Being "punk" (much like being a "goth", "gangsta", or "preppy") is a lifestyle. You could try and define it ostensively or persuasively, but there is no solid theoretical definition for it.

[cryogenics]

sup stereotypes?

[EZ3]

To me Punk has always simply been a state of mind in which one disregards society's wishes, expectations, and needs of the said person. Generally punks sacrfice society's material rewards for natural freedoms.

..................

Ya... I guess everyone comes off as a moron when they try to define anything.

[Lagro]

whats punk? NOT avril lavigne (sp?)

[SubNoctem]

Punk, like every other style, has been swallowed up by mtv with shitty bands like blink and good charlotte. These are nothing but bands that go for an image and want money. Real punk, like every other style, is how you live your life, and your state of mind. It is very rare to find a real "punk" or a real any other styled human anymore.

[cylon]

Diverting from the desired image of the term punk: isn't it also used as prison slang for, well, someone's bitch?

[House-Of-Leaves]

Sadly...

Punk is dead.

[Jordanog]

I'd have to say someone who disobeys authority. Sum41 represents this very well. Not punk= Good Charlotte. Good Charlotte < Poser= suck. My math formula thing= gay.

[aeQea]

MEDIA2017 is punk

[Dagodevas]

At 6/28/03 09:59 PM, jordanog wrote: I'd have to say someone who disobeys authority. Sum41 represents this very well. Not punk= Good Charlotte. Good Charlotte < Poser= suck. My math formula thing= gay.

I can't totally agree with your view on the definition of "punk". Wouldn't disobeying authority make us all punks since we've most likely have disobeyed authority of some sort once in our lives?

By the way, I don't think Sum 41's music is very punk-like. But I don't listen to a lot of punk so what do I know.

[StatiK]

in the movie SLC punk...a great movie...they were pretty much defining being punk as being anarchistic and anti-umm...basically everything...later in the movie stevo said that there was this 1 guy(cant remember his name but we'll call him johnny for the sake of clarity) who dressed like a dork but stevo says he was the most hardcore guy of any of them. to demonstrate this sean turns some schmucks head towards johnny so hes looking at him and johnny decks him...throughout the movie stevo has conversations that question who he is like whether he truly believes in anarchy and why people dress like punks cuz really thats just conforming...

[StatiK]

also...i was conversing with my good friend scott about anarchism (closely related to being punk in many cases) and how nobody could be completely anarchistic no matter how hardcore they were because to be totally anarchistic one would basically have to cease all use of systems...examples being money, government, education (at least the way we think of education)...all this shit often contradicts itself and is pretty confusing...i think i agree that there is no solid definition to what punk is...its much easier to identify what is not punk i.e. good charlotte avril lavigne...and 1 more thing theres a fine line between punk and pop rock...

P.S. this is not an end to the forum...more people should share their opinions (however retarted they may be)

[Ted-Easton]

Punk is, (or at least it seems to be) a counterculture based upon a hatred of conformity, as well as an expression of individualism, and a questioning of authority.
Unfortunately, a group of people who hate conformity inevitable change by reflection of the other members of said group, and there is conformity to this new "punk" culture, which violates the very punk ideals, making one of them defunct.
An expression of individualism can be accepted to a certain point, until this "individualism" suffers the same fate as the "conformity" argument.
Finally, a society based upon questioning authority can be of noble ideals, simply excercising their rights and not following blindly, but this is often misinterpreted. Rather than "questioning authority", punks defy it.
Regardless of whether or not you like the authority, they are the authority, and are there for you to obey, when under their jurisdiction.
That being said, punk is a society based upon altogether noble and somewhat intelligent ideals, all of which are unfortunately inherantly faulty. Simple logic brings one to the conclusion of such, and it really is remarkably simple.

[OpIvy420]

Punk is supposed to be all about non-conformity and rebelling against society. However, a punk fashion has been created (leather, spikes, boots, etc.) that you are expected to conform to, or else you aren't considered punk. This goes against everything punk is supposed to stand for. Anyone who conforms to the punk standard fashion is not a punk, but anyone who says they are punk conforms to this standard. Therefore, no one is actually a punk.

Punk music, however, is a different topic entirely. It stems from rock, metal, ska, country, and any other influence bands feel like throwing down. In most cases, it takes an extreme political stance (either left-wing revolutionary or right-wing racist), with harsh, angry lyrics.

If you consider yourself to be a punk, then you are not a punk. Being punk means not giving a fuck what you are, since much of the punk ideology is founded on nihilism, the belief that nothing exists and therefore nothing matters.

[OpIvy420]

At 6/28/03 07:19 PM, MarijuanaLock wrote:

you. i don't call any of the new "punk" bands punk. i won't bash them, because they're popular for a reason. but they're totally riding on an image that wasn't supposed to be an image in the first place.

It seems like the new generation of popular punk will always be considered to be sell-outs and not punk at all. Before Good Charlotte and Sum 41, the "hardcore" punk community was ranting and raving about Blink 182, and before that The Offspring, and before that Rancid, and before that Green Day, and before that...

The musicians themselves may not be punk, but the style of music they are playing is. I think that's why the classify them to be punk bands. However, from a lyrical standpoint, their music is not punk at all. Save for Rancid, all of the punk bands that busted out onto the MTV pop culture scene didn't feature any political stance at all. Green Day was just a few stoners talking about how bored they are (not that there's anything wrong with that, I do it all the time), and Blink 182 was a few dumb-ass Los Angeles fartsmiths who bragged about their immaturity.

But their music is influenced by actual punks like The Clash and The Ramones, and if you took out the lyrics, the music itself would probably be considered punk.

[Stinko-Man]

Many say that "punk is dead". This is not true. Being punk means that you cannot be labeled or categorized; it means that you go against the norm. True punk will never die. It will always be in the hearts of those that strive to be different in a world of conformity. Punk is dead, you say? Maybe the "punk" that you know. But I doubt that what you speak of is truly punk, rather it is more likely a cheap imitation or something labeled, or perhaps it might have once been punk, but has been watered down, digested, and spewn back upon us by record companies, the media, and the so-called "fashion industry". Punk shouldn't be limited to a music genre; it can't be duplicated in a shop or boutique. I agree with Kazuo here...punk is simply a way of life.

Sorry if that didn't make sense...just sharing my thoughts.

[allpro]

At 6/28/03 06:48 PM, liamgre wrote: yeah...me and my friends (they're real...i swear) have been debating recently about what it means to be punk...and now you, yes you have an opportunity to post your pothead ideas bout what it is...woo hoo!

well dragqueens rockingout singing wiht a 3 peace band is punk

kid wiht a mohawk and denium sleveless jacket over a leather jacket well...

just aint...

[Stinko-Man]

Many say that "punk is dead". This is not true. Being punk means that you cannot be labeled or categorized; it means that you go against the norm. True punk will never die. It will always be in the hearts of those that strive to be different in a world of conformity. Punk is dead, you say? Maybe the "punk" that you know. But I doubt that what you speak of is truly punk, rather it is more likely a cheap imitation or something labeled, or perhaps it might have once been punk, but has been watered down, digested, and spewn back upon us by record companies, the media, and the so-called "fashion industry". Punk shouldn't be limited to a music genre; it can't be duplicated in a shop or boutique. I agree with Kazuo here...punk is simply a way of life.

Sorry if that didn't make sense...just sharing my thoughts.

[StatiK]

you forgot that the offspring also has not necisarily (sp?) a political view but views about society, illustrated in songs like Americana and The Kids Aren't Alright...and actually Blink 182 does have some small amount of comments on society...actually not so much about society but just other social groups..."hate the jocks and preps the hippy fuckin scumbags, heavy metalers with their awful pussy hair bands"..yeah that isnt political but at least it expresses an opinion...unlike most Green Day songs

[therazorsedge555]

punk for me is a state of mind. anti-conformist, anti-corporate, anti-fashion, anti-consumer. problem is, like some other things, it is defined not by what it is, but what it is not.

musically speaking, punk died in the early eighties. there are people copying those styles ( it is not one musical style ) but they lack the cutting edge that punk was in the late seventies. you can dress up all you want and spit at cops, but you're just going through the motions.

[Th1RT33n]

Punk is dead

EDN

[House-Of-Leaves]

OMG! Okay, I'll give in to the 'dragqueens jamming to a three piece band' thing. That's punk.

Everything else? Nah. ;)

Actually...I can't remember who wrote this. But it was about the style of music, and not the members. I sorta agreed with that. Copying the speedy beat or heavy powerchords of a punk band might make a band sound like a punk band. Agreed. But what punk was in the late 70's, and around there...nah. That's dead. It can't be the same.

Just like doo-wop wouldn't be the same now.

Just like blues has changed.

And jazz. It's not necessarily a bad thing. Just...change happens. That's all.