Should We Keep IRAQ for ourselfs???

[EvDog]

Hey

Tell me this...

Should we really give Iraq Back to the People of IRAQ or keep it for Ourselfs.

You tell me what you think

[mysecondstar]

At 6/17/03 12:03 AM, EvDog wrote: Hey

Tell me this...

Should we really give Iraq Back to the People of IRAQ or keep it for Ourselfs.

You tell me what you think

ok.... you really want to know what i think? i think you're a moron. gah, i remember saying this more than a couple times. CLEARLY you can't think further than the front of your nose. i'll let you try and think it out for yourself why what you just said was not only impossible but meat-headed at the same time. it is something i would expect a 10 year old to say. and that may just be the case. funny how it's like that sometimes.

[Alejandro1]

No. People would start calling us Yankee imperialists if we did.

[Commander-K25]

At 6/17/03 12:41 AM, alejandro1 wrote: No. People would start calling us Yankee imperialists if we did.

Well, they're going to do that no matter what, so we might as well....

Nah, that never works out. We know not to do a 'Great Britain'.

[D2Kvirus]

No, divide it up so everyone who pays the desired sum can have their own piece of Iraq for their empires, say $250,000 per square foot. That might decrease the National Debt a bit.

However, if the US conveniently have all the parts over the oilfields, just admit there's a reason the price of petrol conveniently went down a couple of weeks ago...

[karasz]

No, but all the iraqi oilfields will be under US companies control... but then the US will try the 'democratic iraq' thing, that will fail, as did afghanistan, but bush will play the 'war on terror'-arabians are the boogeyman card and win close...

[Commander-K25]

At 6/17/03 07:03 PM, mwazzap wrote: I blame gullible christians...

No seriously. WTF was the topic started smokin. Here's what I think, we already fucked up their country, their environment (or what they had of it), their social structure, and their government (what they had of it)... lets leave em with their dignity. Lets not be terrorists, playing command and conquer. And lets not use their pollutent oil fields for ourselves.
We ARE NOT TO AMERICANIZE OTHER COUNTRIES.

What the hell was that UN thing about?
I dunno I forget, I was to busy bullying them and pillaging other countries in the name of stupidity and gullibility.

Leave them alone. BAD! BAD! America. Stop that. NOT your country! Land of the free my ass. You stupid shit. Id like to knock your brain in. Damn right I'm beligerent, what kinda of <republican> diea was this.

*growl*

Calm down and you might make a coherent argument.

I'm not even going to respond to the rest of this drivel because all you seem to know how to do is blame Christians and Republicans and then have the audacity, the sheer hypocrisy, the ABSOLUTE ARROGANCE to call other people brainwashed when what you spout makes you nothing more than a member of the Blame America/Blame Religion cult.

Please come back when you have something meaningful to say.

[TheTio]

At 6/18/03 01:20 AM, Commander-K25 wrote:

Calm down and you might make a coherent argument.

I'm not even going to respond to the rest of this drivel because all you seem to know how to do is blame Christians and Republicans and then have the audacity, the sheer hypocrisy, the ABSOLUTE ARROGANCE to call other people brainwashed when what you spout makes you nothing more than a member of the Blame America/Blame Religion cult.

Please come back when you have something meaningful to say.

What the hell was that?
The Blame America/Blame Religion Cult

Cmon, firtly, its fun to blame america, and your government is just a big circle of impotent greedy men these days, no way to get past it
& Blame religion cult? cmon, how many people suffer because of religion, im not singling out any one religion, but fuck me with a rotten icon, no doubt theres anti religion feelings about

You cant just flush everything anti american and anti religion down the toilet as baseless because you are trying to defend a position that is totally devoid of a strong place to stand

[D2Kvirus]

At 6/18/03 01:20 AM, Commander-K25 wrote:
Calm down and you might make a coherent argument.

I'm not even going to respond to the rest of this drivel because all you seem to know how to do is blame Christians and Republicans and then have the audacity, the sheer hypocrisy, the ABSOLUTE ARROGANCE to call other people brainwashed when what you spout makes you nothing more than a member of the Blame America/Blame Religion cult.

"The world is like a ride in an amusement park. And when you choose to go on it, you think it's real because that's how powerful our minds are. And the ride goes up and down and round and round. It has thrills and chills and it's very brightly coloured and it's very loud and it's fun, for a while.

Some people have been on the ride for a long time and they begin to question, is this real, or is this just a ride? And other people have remembered, and they come back to us, they say, "hey - don't worry, don't be afraid, ever, because, this is just a ride..."

...It's just a ride. And we can change it anytime we want. It's only a choice. No effort, no work, no job, no savings and money. A choice, right now, between fear and love. The eyes of fear want you to put bigger locks on your doors, buy guns, close yourself off. The eyes of love, instead, see all of us as one. Here's what we can do to change the world, right now, to a better ride.

And we kill these people, afraid of believing it's just a ride, as we have too much invested in it - 'Shut him up, this HAS to be real...'"

Bill Hicks, summing up your "act" perfectly.

[Commander-K25]

At 6/18/03 10:56 AM, D2KVirus wrote: Bill Hicks, summing up your "act" perfectly.

I forgot: Your opinion is the only one that matters, right?

Nice argument anyway, a unrelated passage from a second-rate comedian.

Why does this bug me? Is it because I don't agree? No, I will disagree with you and you can disagree with me, but what I hate is hypocrisy.

You denounce me for even using the words "anti-american" or "anti-christian", no matter what the context, yet you say nothing when some idiot makes a whining, unsupported rant that blames everything on Christians and the right for no particular reason other than that he hates them. Do you denounce him for his bigotry or blindness to any sort of other side? No, you continue to attack me for any little thing.

[D2Kvirus]

No, Commander, if anyone is blind and bigoted, it has to be you. After all, you're always diving in to stifle debate with unnecessary crap (especially if it gives you the opportunity to take potshots at Michael Moore et al), and as soon as someone disagrees with you, the clockwork starts ticking, and it comes down to about three digfferent responses:

1.) "You're Anti-American."
2.) "You're Anti-Christian."
3.) "So YOU'RE right, are you?"

Stop shutting your mind off to outside influence, re-enforcng your walls at the expense of others, and damning those that you deem "wrong", because it's boring, pathetic, and generally irritating. Alas, it's a widespreadthing, and you're just a demographic, not an individual.

Still, you did prove my point. You operate from fear, which dictates everything you see as being against you as plain old wrong, from Bill Hicks onwards. Don't fuck with people with Psychology qualifications, they know shit you don't admit to.

[Commander-K25]

At 6/19/03 09:24 AM, D2KVirus wrote: usual stuff

Thanks for listening....

[D2Kvirus]

"The books that the world calls immoral are books that show the world its shame" - Oscar Wilde (who you'll dismiss as a second-rate poet, right?)

Fine, call me stupid, wrong, or the usual catchphrases, dismiss all you don't agree with, stifle debate and be a bitch, I don't really care.

After all, the person that gets the most resistance is due to the opposition harbouring fear, unable to admit that, oh dear, their view of the world is being disintigrated with the harsh light of reality, so they must defend the last bastion of their world that remains. The problem is that, with the advent of the internet, they can't be shown physical examples, while simultaniously never sourcing, giving proof, or experiencing other ideas face to face.

It's called "character assassination."

[Nirvana13666]

We should give Iraq back to its people and not to any political parties. Haven't these people been through enough? Iraqi kids witness all of this crap and then we expect them not to grow up and hate Americans. We liberated them from the freakin' tyrant now let them live in some type of peace.

[TheTio]

Bah, this isnt going to be a big hand Iraq back with a bow-tie wrapped around it and everythings gonna be happy

My stance is that there was no need for the war in the first place, so youve taken out saddam (yeah hes a fuck, but so what, fucks always land on top), the only things that can happen after war being declared were
A. america wins, then somehow deciding they have to stay in iraq to set up a stable government, thus leading to some pretty martial fuckin law
B. america wins, leave iraq after the war & the tyrant vacuum being filled with one of the new seedy nice guys you can see on tv, who are about 5 steps away from being a new saddam
C. america wakes the fuck up, actually listening to the U.N. and admitting it was jumping the gun....yeah, that
D. america losing this war, what was it called, "the greatest military achievement in recent history", the quotes vague

Yeah, very america bashing of me, its easier to write that than england, plus australia, plus america every time

[D2Kvirus]

At 6/20/03 01:24 PM, TheTio wrote:
Yeah, very america bashing of me, its easier to write that than england, plus australia, plus america every time

Although the whole notion of a coalition was a joke. It was all 50 states, plus the one that's being dragged that way by a grinning megalomaniac, plus whoever wanted to be in on the ride for their own ends, none of which financial. By the way, you are aware Spain is about the poorest member of the EU, right?

I'll save the ass-shredding for Blair's "dossier" for later.

[bumcheekcity]

At 6/20/03 09:52 AM, Nirvana13666 wrote: We should give Iraq back to its people and not to any political parties. Haven't these people been through enough? Iraqi kids witness all of this crap and then we expect them not to grow up and hate Americans. We liberated them from the freakin' tyrant now let them live in some type of peace.

We can't. We have to set up some political parties, otherwise it would just be left in anarchy, which doesn't work.

At 6/18/03 01:20 AM, Commander-K25 wrote:

Calm down and you might make a coherent argument.

I'm not even going to respond to the rest of this drivel because all you seem to know how to do is blame Christians and Republicans and then have the audacity, the sheer hypocrisy, the ABSOLUTE ARROGANCE to call other people brainwashed when what you spout makes you nothing more than a member of the Blame America/Blame Religion cult.

Please come back when you have something meaningful to say.

Bush=Christian and Republican, no? Isn't he the fellow that started this Iraq thingie? When did this marvelous cult start? I WANT TO BE A PREMIUM MEMBER! and a pony.

[SpEeDFiReSrFr]

At 6/17/03 12:03 AM, EvDog wrote: Hey

Tell me this...

Should we really give Iraq Back to the People of IRAQ or keep it for Ourselfs.

You tell me what you think

Is this sarcasm? OR were you drunk?

[D2Kvirus]

At 6/20/03 07:09 PM, bumcheekycity wrote:
We can't. We have to set up some political parties, otherwise it would just be left in anarchy, which doesn't work.

"Have to"? taking the dystopian route, how will these people truly be free if they're having "Democracy" dumped upon them?

As I stated in an older post, the US not allowing the Ba'ath Party, or any Fundamentalist parties at all, to take to the polls isn't Democratic - after all, what would be better, being told who you can and can't vote for, or the sybol of removing the Ba'ath from power at the polls, which is more powerful than any number of tanks running over any number of statues?

The people need to work the situation out for themselves, not have it handed to them, willingly or not, as that damns them to an existence of failure: You couldn't rise up against Saddam, and now you can't run your country, but the US will do these for you? It's an insult.

For all you know, anarchy could work - let them have tribal law, if it works best for them. After all, installing Democracy in Afghanistan did fuck all for the people, apart from the heroin traffikers, who recently reclaimed their spot as Number One Heroin Exporter of the World. One system may work for the US (and that's debatable), but the same map won't work for every other nation on the planet, and nor should it. Dictating a set of codes to a nation you were only too happy to blow large chunks of to smithereens is hardly going to smooth over the relationship, so just let them get on with their lives, their generations, their Government, and their economy - all of which are up shit creek without a paddle at the moment, so having the US there to, in effect, rule them for the time being is rubbing salt in the wound.

After all, the US stayed behind in Germany and Japan post WWII (as did the Brits and the Russians), helping rebuild the countries to the economic superpowers they are now, and they thrive on their own. A world apart from the spit & polish job on Afghanistan, and what's to say the same won't happen to Iraq?

[bumcheekcity]

At 6/25/03 11:57 AM, D2KVirus wrote: "Have to"? taking the dystopian route, how will these people truly be free if they're having "Democracy" dumped upon them?

Yes, they will, but only if we allow anybody to run.

As I stated in an older post, the US not allowing the Ba'ath Party, or any Fundamentalist parties at all, to take to the polls isn't Democratic - after all, what would be better, being told who you can and can't vote for, or the sybol of removing the Ba'ath from power at the polls, which is more powerful than any number of tanks running over any number of statues?

Completely. We need to allow the fundamentalist parties to run for the presidency. If the Iraquis like them then they will vote for them.

The people need to work the situation out for themselves, not have it handed to them, willingly or not, as that damns them to an existence of failure: You couldn't rise up against Saddam, and now you can't run your country, but the US will do these for you? It's an insult.

No, i disagree with you. They need a first election set up, but after that we need just to fuck off and leave them alone.

For all you know, anarchy could work - let them have tribal law, if it works best for them. After all, installing Democracy in Afghanistan did fuck all for the people, apart from the heroin traffikers, who recently reclaimed their spot as Number One Heroin Exporter of the World. One system may work for the US (and that's debatable), but the same map won't work for every other nation on the planet, and nor should it. Dictating a set of codes to a nation you were only too happy to blow large chunks of to smithereens is hardly going to smooth over the relationship, so just let them get on with their lives, their generations, their Government, and their economy - all of which are up shit creek without a paddle at the moment, so having the US there to, in effect, rule them for the time being is rubbing salt in the wound.

You forget one thing, we didn't do a job at all in Afghanistan. They (the Iraquis) should have the complete right to vote for anyone, eenb somone who says he will take away all their rights, and will never hold an electiona again.

[PsychoDoughboy]

WE have to take care of it at first then give it back, of course.

[leperchaun81]

We should put someone in charge that we trust and leave it, iraq is worthless anyway, the camels are worth more than the people

[TheTio]

At 6/28/03 06:53 AM, leperchaun81 wrote: We should put someone in charge that we trust and leave it, iraq is worthless anyway, the camels are worth more than the people

Leperchaun, i know your a n00b, and you havent even hit 20 posts yet, but when your first fledgling little steps are as stupid as this, im thinking you should go back to the general forum

We should put someone in charge, have you any idea of the history of iraq, america supported saddams claim to power as they thought he could be manipulated into helping them with their current problem next door, iran, which had just overthrown and humiliated the good old US of A

saddam was provided all the guns, bombs and funds he needed, then he turned on you

how the fuck would you feel if someone came to your country, picked someone they liked and your whole country despised, stuck him in power and told you "obey"

[OpIvy420]

Dude. You can't spell "ourselves" and you think you deserve to take over an entire country?

Americans.

[hippomania]

At 6/29/03 12:23 AM, OpIvy420 wrote: Dude. You can't spell "ourselves" and you think you deserve to take over an entire country?

Americans.

Ok, this is what pisses me off. Everybody judges the American citizens because of what our President does. Do you think we always agree with our President? Hell no!

[hippomania]

Once I think about it, We, Americans, are evil. Well, some of us are anyways. Not ALLL Americans are bad except all the countries hate us. I don't blame them. We consume more resources then we should and consume more food then we should :) But some of us are in shape and still like other countries even is they hate America itself. Because I really do not give a damn. EVERYBODY HAS DIFFERENT OPPINIONS! Damn. You people make it sound like you speak for your country and ALL of your people. Ill admit that we are evil and the world would do better without us. BUT! I don't know why the British would hate us since Americans are British, too. You British wanted to expand, same with the french and Spanish. So you killed the Native Americans to settle here. So Americans are French, Spanish, and british and you cannot deny that. So, that means you are hating your own people.

[TheTio]

At 6/29/03 01:19 AM, hippomania wrote: I don't know why the British would hate us since Americans are British, too. You British wanted to expand, same with the french and Spanish. So you killed the Native Americans to settle here. So Americans are French, Spanish, and british and you cannot deny that. So, that means you are hating your own people.

Yeah, but America had the revolution against empire building and the colonizing of the entire world, you people have failed in your duty as citizens of your country to uphold the essence of the Bill of Rights and the Constitution, america has in itself become an empire, sending out its little military spores all over the globe, maniupulating everything for its own gain, and the rights set up by your founding fathers have been watered down by new legislation so much that it is but a drop of liberty in an ocean of corruption

And I highly doubt that anyone will bother to do anything, your all to content with your cable t.v on a 29 inch plus screen, high speed internet connections streaming porn into your homes, and your precious consumer shit to give a damn

[Jimsween]

At 6/29/03 02:20 AM, TheTio wrote:

At 6/29/03 01:19 AM, hippomania wrote: I don't know why the British would hate us since Americans are British, too. You British wanted to expand, same with the french and Spanish. So you killed the Native Americans to settle here. So Americans are French, Spanish, and british and you cannot deny that. So, that means you are hating your own people.

Yeah, but America had the revolution against empire building and the colonizing of the entire world, you people have failed in your duty as citizens of your country to uphold the essence of the Bill of Rights and the Constitution, america has in itself become an empire, sending out its little military spores all over the globe, maniupulating everything for its own gain, and the rights set up by your founding fathers have been watered down by new legislation so much that it is but a drop of liberty in an ocean of corruption

You just described every single superpower in the world. America is just the most visual of them all. And you do an awful lot of talking about corruption when I bet you yourself couldnt name 5 America senators without looking it up.

And I highly doubt that anyone will bother to do anything, your all to content with your cable t.v on a 29 inch plus screen, high speed internet connections streaming porn into your homes, and your precious consumer shit to give a damn

Quite the ethnocentric you are, just because the people in America happen to disagree with the way you think they should run their government does not mean they are wrong, and it certainly doesnt mean that the government is corrupt.

[mikehrt]

At 6/29/03 02:20 AM, TheTio wrote:

At 6/29/03 01:19 AM, hippomania wrote:

you people have failed in your duty as citizens of your country to uphold the essence of the Bill of Rights and the Constitution, america has in itself become an empire, sending out its little military spores all over the globe, maniupulating everything for its own gain, and the rights set up by your founding fathers have been watered down by new legislation so much that it is but a drop of liberty in an ocean of corruption

Where did we fail? We kicked Iraq out of Kuwait a decade ago and could have taken over Iraq then if we wanted it's resources. We are just trying to make the world a better and safer plus. Oh and BTW, do you actually think GWB made any decisions about the war? No. Colon Powell is running this show, and he has done a good job. I'm sure the reason we are attacking them now is that this is the first time we've had an administration that is willing to act against tyrants. This is something Clinton should have done the first time we saw pictures of Saddam gassing his own people in the mid 90's, but that worthless bastard was to busy getting it on with the interns.