Government like mafia

[escudo0]

If you compare the two there is much difference. We pay protection money to them (i.e. taxes) so they don't bring down their enforcers down on us. They have alot of the same heirarchy (not like a few EXTREMELY rich families don't control the goverment Bushes Kennedys ect...) so the only difference I see between them is scale really. that and the mafia doesn't have as big of an R&D department.

[goozebump]

welcome to adulthood.

[SyntheticTacos]

Except the mafia doesn't provide you with an army to defend you from other nations, social welfare programs, regulations on medicine, or many other good things the government does, including.. having police to fight the mafia.

Your points are insightful though; but the government is more useful to us when it's set up properly than the mafia.

[ForkRobotik]

At 6/28/07 05:51 PM, SyntheticTacos wrote: Except the mafia doesn't provide you with an army to defend you from other nations, social welfare programs, regulations on medicine, or many other good things the government does, including.. having police to fight the mafia.

Your points are insightful though; but the government is more useful to us when it's set up properly than the mafia.

Well, actually the mafia will protect you from other businesses(ie competition), and other mafias, so technically you aren't really looking at things straight on. Plus, i know that if shit went down the mafia i was paying would definitely give a shit, whereas the bureaucratic government doesn't.

[JoS]

Someone has watched too many movies. if you don't pay protection the mafia burns your business down, you pay to be proteced from the mafia, not from other people.

[fahrenheit]

Last time I checked the mafia doesnt give you money when you lose your job, or give money to schools and public utilities, or donate any kind of money to anything besides casino's and political campaigns.

[SmilezRoyale]

At 6/27/07 12:48 PM, escudo0 wrote:

"We pay protection money to them (i.e. taxes) so they don't bring down their enforcers down on us"

Your average shmo doesn't need protection money, but he does need some of the things which i'm going to list below here; so please be a dear and read this post; or i will cast a dark spell on you and devour your soul.

There are some things that private buisnesses cant do [and this is coming from a republican ring wing nutt job]

Garbage disposal, Social security [which is not 100 percent evil, sometimes people have terriblly unusual and morbid happenstances, and need a small boost to get themselfs back up to full throttle], police force, military [The military is like an immune system, there ARE bad people that you may or may not know about, shut down the immune system and dozens of varieties of illnesses will flood into your body and easilly create havoc for you; ever heard of a virus called HIV?] , as well as public education and so many more things.

The government cant do this stuff for free, unless you want the government to start using slave labor for government working projects, the things they do will cost alot of money, each individual pays a fraction of they're income to reflectively assist uncle sam and the many other governments that do the same thing but in different respects ; and in turn they are citizens who receive these benifits.

The mafia has protection money to provide gun support for individuals who have themselfs surrounded by enemies, the concept of it is similar to government taxes, but the origins of this are different; and if you dont want to pay taxes to one government.

I sort of get from this first post that you are a fan of anarchy, the purpose of a government is to maintain certain public services [sanitation, roads, occasionally bringing jobs to towns and cities] for they're people, a good government actually uses the tax money to bring wealth and prosperity to the people they get the taxes from, not just themselfs. None of this is possible without tax money.

"They have alot of the same heirarchy (not like a few EXTREMELY rich families don't control the goverment Bushes Kennedys ect...)"

Democracy is partially to blame for this my friend, in order to run for president; or any office for that matter; you need campaign money. [On a local scale, the media rarely endorces you unless you bribe them, which also requires money; and is also far less safe if another news channel catches you in the act] And campaign money isn't just a few thousand dollars, commercials, and Ad's and the other things that provide a backbone for your starting political offices [leading up to the big ones] Require alot of money, sometimes millions of dollars.

Your average joe could run for president but he has no means of telling people who he is, and what his veiws are, and what his background is for running for president. [no money, no strong campaign] So he rarely get's elected.

Also, as i said before, most presidents come from the ranks of individuals who have worked in lower government offices [senate ; hillary / kerry Mayor ; juliani, Governor; Bush] Meaning that these individuals have received they're pay as government officials, and i'm sure you probably already know, but government officials get payed alot of money [infact, senators receive the same pay on duty as they do when they retire] So they are usually rich once they retire, or run for a new office.

Your original campaign people who run for the first time in the lower offices are usually Judges and lawyers, sometimes high ranking buisness people, and sometimes people who work as assistants to low ranking [or high ranking] government officials, so they STILL get payed alot of money.

I also may want to add that some leaders only got rich from BEING leaders [ Abe lincoln was poor; became a senator --> got rich by the time he ran for president]

So your sometimes uninformed about leaders of humble beginings.

the only real case that a person could go from poor straight to being leader [or middle class straight to being top leader] is if they're the leader of some sort of rebellion that overthrows the government and you end up being dictator.

read this post, or as i said before, i will devour your soul.

[ForkRobotik]

You people are all assholes. The mafia is awesome and you all suck and are just jealous.

[SmilezRoyale]

At 6/30/07 11:54 AM, ForkRobotik wrote: You people are all assholes. The mafia is awesome and you all suck and are just jealous.

I prefer the mafia to some other kinds of criminals [Rapists and cereal killers]

But crime is crime; which i am against; as i think that most of the basic laws of killing, blackmail, and so forth are fair.

[escudo0]

At 6/28/07 09:48 PM, SmilezRoyale wrote:

At 6/27/07 12:48 PM, escudo0 wrote:

There are some things that private buisnesses cant do
Garbage disposal,

Who said they can't or wouldn't if the service wasnn't available from the Gov't? Where there is a need unfufilled there is money in fufilling it.

Social security [which is not 100 percent evil, sometimes people have terriblly unusual and morbid happenstances, and need a small boost to get themselfs back up to full throttle],

Are you talking about poor people or old people? Welfare is for poor social security for the elderly. Why couldn't a small boost come from say a PRIVATE bank so that everone doesn't end up paying for the small minority who use welfare to buy alcohol or drugsand cheat the system.

police force, military AKA the govenment enforcers who bring the hammer down when people refuse to play by their rules. The mafia has them too.

public education
A bit of indoctrination is always present in education public or private. They shove patriotism down kids throats and paint our founding fathers as GODS. You rarely hear any mention of the fact that Washington and Jefferson owned slaves and Woodrow Wilson was one of the most rascist presidents in history.

The government cant do this stuff for free, the things they do will cost alot of money, each individual pays a fraction of they're income to reflectively assist uncle sam and the many ; and in turn they are citizens who receive these benifits.

So why not instead have private companies do all this and allow citizens to keep a larger portion of the money they worked for?

The mafia has protection money to provide gun support for individuals who have themselfs surrounded by enemies, the concept of it is similar to government taxes, but the origins of this are different; and if you dont want to pay taxes to one government.

Am I the only one who doesn't understand tis paragraph? Anyone? What does this mean?

I sort of get from this first post that you are a fan of anarchy, the purpose of a government is to maintain certain public services [sanitation, roads, occasionally bringing jobs to towns and cities] for they're people, a good government actually uses the tax money to bring wealth and prosperity to the people they get the taxes from, not just themselfs. None of this is possible without tax money.

I am not an anarchist. I'm just saying a mafia or private corperation could do many of the same jobs much faster and with less expense. The Mafia also brings jobs to towns and cities (bagmen, drivers ect. ect..) and in case you haven't noticedthat also bring prosperity to those who take part in it.

"They have alot of the same heirarchy (not like a few EXTREMELY rich families don't control the goverment Bushes Kennedys ect...)"

Democracy is partially to blame for this my friend, in order to run for president; or any office for that matter; you need campaign money. [On a local scale, the media rarely endorces you unless you bribe them, which also requires money; and is also far less safe if another news channel catches you in the act] And campaign money isn't just a few thousand dollars, commercials, and Ad's and the other things that provide a backbone for your starting political offices [leading up to the big ones] Require alot of money, sometimes millions of dollars.Your average joe could run for president but he has no means of telling people who he is, and what his veiws are, and what his background is for running for president. [no money, no strong campaign] So he rarely get's elected.

So your saying I am right? Thank you

Also, as i said before, most presidents come from the ranks of individuals who have worked in lower government offices [senate ; hillary / kerry Mayor ; juliani, Governor; Bush] Meaning that these individuals have received they're pay as government officials, and i'm sure you probably already know, but government officials get payed alot of money [infact, senators receive the same pay on duty as they do when they retire] So they are usually rich once they retire, or run for a new office.

Same is true of the mafia. Rarely does just random new guy waltz in and takeover. The bosses have do work their way up doing lesser jobs and also like government who you know oftern has much more bearing on your success than what you know.

Your original campaign people who run for the first time in the lower offices are usually Judges and lawyers, sometimes high ranking buisness people, and sometimes people who work as assistants to low ranking [or high ranking] government officials, so they STILL get payed alot of money.

I also may want to add that some leaders only got rich from BEING leaders [ Abe lincoln was poor; became a senator --> got rich by the time he ran for president]
So your sometimes uninformed about leaders of humble beginings.

Oh because the mafia never had any leaers fro humble origins than what about this guy?

the only real case that a person could go from poor straight to being leader [or middle class straight to being top leader] is if they're the leader of some sort of rebellion that overthrows the government and you end up being dictator.

Same in the mafia

read this post, or as i said before, i will devour your soul.

My soul was gone long before you tried to take it. SO HA!

This guy?

[escudo0]

At 6/28/07 05:51 PM, SyntheticTacos wrote: Except the mafia doesn't provide you with an army to defend you from other nations,

If a single mafia controlled all 300 million or so people in the U.S it wouldn't be hard with all the money they could generate to finace a private army...

social welfare programs, regulations on medicine, or many other good things the government does, including.. having police to fight the mafia.

See above post

Your points are insightful though; but the government is more useful to us when it's set up properly than the mafia.

I appricate your comments but eventually when you really come down to it the function in pretty much the same manner.

[Everlasting-Elements]

Meh...the mafia can fuck you over, and so does the US government.
There is a difference yeah, but I guess..you can pick what you want. The Mafia ain't much here anymore. They're pretty much underground! Kinda like AREA 51 XD

[ForkRobotik]

At 7/1/07 07:39 PM, Everlasting-Elements wrote: Meh...the mafia can fuck you over, and so does the US government.
There is a difference yeah, but I guess..you can pick what you want. The Mafia ain't much here anymore. They're pretty much underground! Kinda like AREA 51 XD

Actually here in canada, they have pretty much entangled themselves in local/municipal governments and what not. This legitimizes them to a degree and keeps their business under the radar of the media. I imagine it's the same throughout the usa.

[MERC93]

Who cares what it's like when it works better than several other government systems.

[escudo0]

At 7/2/07 11:59 AM, MERC93 wrote: Who cares what it's like when it works better than several other government systems.

True but I think it's kind of a sad commentary on humanity when the best we can do is a few very rich people with an army of enforcers extorting money from people for the "greater good"

[ForkRobotik]

At 7/2/07 12:39 PM, escudo0 wrote:

At 7/2/07 11:59 AM, MERC93 wrote: Who cares what it's like when it works better than several other government systems.

True but I think it's kind of a sad commentary on humanity when the best we can do is a few very rich people with an army of enforcers extorting money from people for the "greater good"

Greater good according to whom? This is the sham of modern day democracy.

[escudo0]

At 6/28/07 07:15 PM, JoS wrote: Someone has watched too many movies. if you don't pay protection the mafia burns your business down, you pay to be proteced from the mafia, not from other people.

We pay taxes to the government out of fear of them taking our homes and businesses and throwing us in jail.

No big difference.

[KP94]

Except the mafia doesn't provide you with an army to defend you from other nations, social welfare programs, regulations on medicine, or many other good things the government does

Well, actually the mafia will protect you from other businesses(ie competition), and other mafias, so technically you aren't really looking at things straight on.

for a giant cost 'a' $$$

[SmilezRoyale]

At 8/30/07 02:37 PM, escudo0 wrote:

At 6/28/07 07:15 PM, JoS wrote: Someone has watched too many movies. if you don't pay protection the mafia burns your business down, you pay to be proteced from the mafia, not from other people.

We pay taxes to the government out of fear of them taking our homes and businesses and throwing us in jail.

You wouldn't like you're happenstances if no body payed ANY taxes. You need to balance things; taxes are a necessary annoyance. The mafia is an unecessary evil, the government is a necessary one.

People can't individually work out huge construction projects, you have to have somone dirrecting a group of people, and you also need money to pay them, which comes from the populace.

[SuperDeagle]

What are you people talking about?
The mafia doesn't exists.

[TonyTostieno]

At 6/28/07 07:15 PM, JoS wrote: Someone has watched too many movies. if you don't pay protection the mafia burns your business down, you pay to be proteced from the mafia, not from other people.

If you don't pay the government taxes the throw you in jail, sounds familiar to me.

[Empanado]

At 9/1/07 12:34 AM, TonyTostieno wrote:

At 6/28/07 07:15 PM, JoS wrote: Someone has watched too many movies. if you don't pay protection the mafia burns your business down, you pay to be proteced from the mafia, not from other people.

If you don't pay the government taxes the throw you in jail, sounds familiar to me.

Yes, but tax money is used to provide healthcare, education, housing, infrastructure, social services, etc.

Protection money is used to handle dope and beat other people in the head with aluminium baseball bats.