At 6/20/07 04:15 PM, HighlyIllogical wrote:
At 6/20/07 01:42 PM, Proteas wrote:
So am I to understand that you HONESTLY BELIEVE that a firearm is a living weapon and actually causes crime on it's own?Now, now, he's not saying that.
Guns are inanimate objects that ENABLE crimes.
In 1993 (a year before the AWB) the Dept of Justice (under Clinton) released a report that had the following to say about violent crime in America:
Use of weapons
*Offenders used or possessed a weapon in an estimated 27% of
overall violent incidents, 8% of rapes/sexual assaults, 52% of
robberies, and 25% of assaults.
*Offenders were armed with a firearm in 10% of all violent
crimes; a knife in 6% and some other object used as a weapon in
Funny thing about this is that a weapon other than a gun is used in more crimes than in crimes where the perp is armed with a firearm...
Furthermore, when you talk about effectiveness I came across another statistic (I'll try to find later) that the worst massmurders in this country were done via bomb or arson. There goes the theory that a firearms restriction would've stopped Cho. Like I've said before, if he didn't have guns he would've most likely figured out how to build a bomb.
*Violent crimes by strangers were more likely than crimes by
nonstrangers to involve a weapon.
Also, here's something interesting on Self-Defense:
*In about 71% of all violent crimes, 81% of rapes and sexual
assaults, 61% of robberies, and 71% of assaults, victims took
some type of measure to protect themselves.
*Victims of violent crimes were more likely to report that . The most common
way that victims reported their actions helped was by allowing
them to avoid injury altogether or to prevent greater injury.
Guess what this means? The individual's efforts were better at dealing with the situation than the police! Why? Often times the police are notified after the violent crime has been committed, or if notified during the incident it is more likely than not that they will be unable to respond until after the attack is over. And so my friends who think guns are for pussies or that not having a gun makes you safer, try dealing with an intruder when your wife is four months pregnant.
That happened to me. 9-1-1 said that they could not respond while he was breaking in; only after he was in the house. Had I not been armed and been a potential threat to the perp, the police would not have responded until he was in the house. At that point if the guy had been armed or violent my ex-wife, my unborn child and I could have been dead.
And this leads me into my next problem with the gun control argument over self-defense and the use of guns. Under the stats you like to throw around (I'm talking to you Illogical, my friend) what I described above would not have been counted as using a firearm in self-defense. See you do not have to draw down on or shoot a criminal to use a firearm in self-defense. In fact you are most effective when you and your family are barricaded in a room where a locked door is between you and the guy.
The reason is when he enters the room he does not know where you're at. However, he is in the "kill box"...you know where he is coming from. And you have an opportunity to keep the situation from escalating. When he tries the door you charge your gun (even if a round is already chambered) this lets him know you actually have a gun, this works well with a voice warning. 9 times out of 10, the perp will flee because he is not there to do violence and even if he is he is not so dedicated to hurting you that he will take that loosing risk.
However, if he keeps coming you know he's not there to give you flowers. If the door is not that heavy then you can effectively fire through it. If it is heavier wait until he kicks it down and open fire from a concealed position. You will be behind cover, and they will be nicely framed in your room's doorway. Easy shot.
And now you know the tactics of effective home defense: don't confront but play effective defense. And yet people who use these tactics are not figured into most studies of firearms used in self-defense.