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At 12/26/12 07:37 PM, DickBuns wrote: Yeah pretty much. Im not a redneck. I own a semi automatic firearm and a large caliber rifle. Im not white trash and I dont hunt.

Lucky you. I'm thinking of picking up an M1 once more flow comes my way to have something in a larger caliber then 5.56 that isn't a handgun.

At 12/27/12 04:16 PM, Tony-DarkGrave wrote: Senator Dianne Feinstein has announced that on the first day of the new Congress - January 3rd - she will introduce a bill to ban commonly owned semi-automatic firearms, register gun owners, and require fingerprinting, among other things. This gun ban plan would treat law-abiding gun owners like common criminals!

Link

Simple proof that some people like Senator Dianne Feinstein just don't understand why this is the Land of the Free, people like Senator Dianne Feinstein just simply DON'T understand why this nation is meant to be the Land of the Free & Home of the Brave.

Why is this? Because Senator Dianne Feinsteine just doesn't support the way how Freedom is meant to be, further more also doesn't realize why people need to learn The Creed of Weapon Responsibility.

That said, people like that don't even know why people in America are meant to have the right to bear arms, in fact it should include not only just guns but all forms of weapons, including our own body itself.

Gun Control is simply like Weapon Control, and no matter how hard some people try such individuals like Senator Dianne Feinsteine can't get rid of weapons, because weapons are apart of us, down to our own body itself.

Again I will say, it's The Creed of Weapon Responsibility people need to learn about, not the idea of actual Gun Control.

Pistol grip on an item that has a detachable magazine. I wonder if this makes all non-revolver handguns technically an assault weapon over this dumb bitches new bill.

Although it is cool knowing that by these sweeping generalization of things I have numerous assault weapons in my house now whereas before there was none with 2 on the way.

lol @ americans getting pissy because they cant shoot eachother anymore

At 12/28/12 03:39 PM, BumFodder wrote: lol @ americans getting pissy because they cant shoot eachother anymore

Why do you hate freedom?

At 12/28/12 03:39 PM, BumFodder wrote: lol @ americans getting pissy because they cant shoot eachother anymore

Nah, there will always be people shooting each other. The only difference is we can shoot back against the aggressors.

At 12/28/12 03:39 PM, BumFodder wrote: lol @ americans getting pissy because they cant shoot eachother anymore

lol @ shitty troll who says we cant shoot at eachother anymore when we definitely 100% still can.

At 12/27/12 06:47 PM, RacistBassist wrote: Pistol grip on an item that has a detachable magazine. I wonder if this makes all non-revolver handguns technically an assault weapon over this dumb bitches new bill.

I would not put it past some activist judge to rule in this way. In fact, I wouldn't put it past some politician to pass something that includes revolvers too, or swap the "and" to "and/or" to make all non pump action, break barrel, revolver, or bolt action guns with a rifle stock to be illegal.

the left knows if they want to take away guns they're gonna have to wait until the supreme court is loaded with leftist judges who could care less about the constitution and then pass a weapons ban that somehow through vague wording includes all guns, then have the activist judges uphold the law

guns can be banned in America, the problem for those who want a federal gun ban is that pesky 2nd amendment, along with previous rulings against them, and judges unwilling to snub the constitution when it's inconvenient to them. so, you either wait and hope or figure out a way to.... persuade some conservative judges to "retire", then let Barry O find some liberal activists to put on the bench, then bam, all you gotta do is send in a lawsuit. hell, you could probably have the constitution declared unconstitutional if you can get enough judges to agree that it is.

At 12/26/12 05:13 AM, Ceratisa wrote: So tell me how to handle the coyote who has dug the sunk his teeth into the throat of a goat? I'm sure you've had to deal with plenty of them.

A coyote who has already sunk it's teeth into one of your goats? You make sure it is a coyote and not a Red Wolf then shoot it. Obviously to avoid this you either lay out traps, snares, cages, scent repellent, etc. These methods are far more effective in PREVENTING your livestock from being preyed upon in the first place. You also reduce the risk of killing a critically endangered species like the Red Wolf and receiving a massive fine or jail time.

Oh and good job jumping the REAL point I was making. Killing happens monster killed many people without a gun.

What weapon is used most to commit murder? The gun. It has the most desirable cost to killing effectiveness ratio of any weapon a citizen can buy today.

You refuse to answer the questions or actually address some of the real points I have brought up. I can only come to the conclusion that your ignorance on the subject has led to an irrational fear of guns. Your lack of knowledge regarding automatic weapons supports this theory.

Do I have a fear of guns or does a gun nut have a fear of leaving his house without a gun? I don't have a fear of guns nor do I have a fear of getting shot/attacked while doing my daily activities or sitting in my apartment.

Do I think possessing a semiautomatic rifle/automatics with 30+ round clips is required to "protect" yourself? Absolutely not, that is ridiculous and ridiculously expensive.

What is deadlier "Armor Piercing" or "Hollow Point" ? Now which one is often found in what kind of weapon?
I'll give you a hint I'd rather be shot with AP then HP.

Hollow points are only suppose to be used for hunting. I'd rather not get shot period, but my chances of survival would be higher with "armor piercing bullets", however the term is pretty silly. Either way, you'd load your guns with hollow points to "best protect yourself". As long as those bullets are required to have serial numbers on them and you go to prison for shooting anyone with a hollow point, thats fine with me.

Saen just used every argument used in the past 46 pages of this thread.

Do you really need?

I might who knows

Serial numbers on a bullet would be retarded as that is the projectile and especially a hollowpoint. it'd break up and be unreadable.

Microstamping is probably what you are thinking of and it's for handguns. It won't work on revolvers btw as the shelling casings stay in the cylinder and if the gun is not used by it's original owner then it's pointless. It can also be removed with a file in seconds.

Well as far as having farm animals you probably already have a fence and would only shoot an animal that has never attacked before. Why would you place traps if your animals may be already safe behind a fence? If it somehow does get past that then go ahead a kill it. It's pretty unlikely that somebody will see an endangered animal.

At 12/28/12 10:22 PM, thegarbear14 wrote: Saen just used every argument used in the past 46 pages of this thread.

Do you really need?

I might who knows

The truth is you don't. Our species has proliferated for ten of thousands of years without semi-automatic rifles and machine guns, neither our standard of living as a species or yours as an individual increases with the presence of semi-automatics. If fact, the more weapons you buy the further you increase your debt, fuel your addiction of gun-buying, and in fact LOWER your standard of living.

Serial numbers on a bullet would be retarded as that is the projectile and especially a hollowpoint. it'd break up and be unreadable.

Detectives has recovered evidence from much more damaged items. This is assuming that the bullet even shatters entirely.

Microstamping is probably what you are thinking of and it's for handguns. It won't work on revolvers btw as the shelling casings stay in the cylinder and if the gun is not used by it's original owner then it's pointless. It can also be removed with a file in seconds.

If a person is convicted of a crime and used a filed bullet or a bullet with the serial number removed, X-amount extra years in prison should obviously be added.

Well as far as having farm animals you probably already have a fence and would only shoot an animal that has never attacked before. Why would you place traps if your animals may be already safe behind a fence? If it somehow does get past that then go ahead a kill it. It's pretty unlikely that somebody will see an endangered animal.

Fences are some of the most ineffective methods of biocontrol. If you're having problems with your livestock getting killed, you will have to take more effective preventative measures other than a fence.

Really, clip and magazine definition and hollow points is all yall got?

I understand a clip is loaded and concealed inside a gun while a magazine attaches exposed. Yes a magazine holds more, who is going to cry if I interchange the term clip with magazine at x-am in the morning?

As for hollow points, they should be illegal across all states to fire at a human. If you think that detectives will have any difficulty in finding a simple stamped serial number on a shattered hollow point, serial numbers can be applied in different ways. Electronically or on a small or microscopic scale for example.

1) It would be nice if all those in favor for gun control looked up what the existing laws already are before spouting a bunch of crap that may or may not already be in existence

2) There are 300+ million guns or so in the united states. Good lucky getting them all

I'm kinda of ppl advocating for "stricter" laws for any activity without having any understanding of the laws that are already on the books. Theres like some 20,000 laws for everything imaginable on federal state and local levels and theres no way anybody could know them all but please try to educate yourself so you don't sound retarded. For your own sake please

3) It always make me wonder why foreigners that dont actually live in the US are so interested in gun control for a country they don't live in

At 12/30/12 05:00 AM, Kellz5460 wrote: 1) It would be nice if all those in favor for gun control looked up what the existing laws already are before spouting a bunch of crap that may or may not already be in existence

You expect people to read the drastically varying laws of each and every state. Not to forget that reading legal bills is not easy as they are written in 'fucking' legalize.

2) There are 300+ million guns or so in the united states. Good lucky getting them all

Gun buyback, volunteer gun retrievable programs, and possibly fines would do quite a bit to dent that despite your pessimism.

3) It always make me wonder why foreigners that dont actually live in the US are so interested in gun control for a country they don't live in

Why does the US concern itself in Israel, Iran, Egypt, Yemen, Mexico, Columbia, Russia, Germany, Canada, Japan, China, North Korea, South Korea, Turkey, Syria, Libya.....getting the picture yet?

The reason we foreigners concern are selves in the US is because we all share the same bloody planet and I assure you if it were possible i'm sure every country on the planet would vote to launch the US in its entirety into space toward the sun. So be thankful.

Oh, and specifically on the note of gun control. The reason why South American countries and Mexico are as violent as they are is because the US's drug war and complete lack of gun control.

At 12/30/12 08:13 AM, CaveStoryGrounds wrote:

You expect people to read the drastically varying laws of each and every state. Not to forget that reading legal bills is not easy as they are written in 'fucking' legalize.

So ignorance and apathy are excused- My point is many of the things people are calling for - ALREADY EXIST

Gun buyback, volunteer gun retrievable programs, and possibly fines would do quite a bit to dent that despite your pessimism.

You can try those schemes realistically ppl are not going to sell a $400 gun for a $100 walmart gift card. There was an article I read the other day about a gun buy back in san francisco and most of the guns bought back, were old useless, and missing parts. People are not stupid, If they're gonna sell a pricey item they paid out of pocket for they're going to demand something close to an equitable trade. If you forced people to sell their weapons you'd create a black market- Why do you think people are buying out AR-15s left and right now that they will try to impliment a ban? So they can resell those $700 guns at $1500 or higher because you won't be able to get them anywhere from dealers. Also gun buy backs are voluntary, it does nothing to curb straw purchases and private sales that happen inbetween individuals

3) It always make me wonder why foreigners that dont actually live in the US are so interested in gun control for a country they don't live in

Why does the US concern itself in Israel, Iran, Egypt, Yemen, Mexico, Columbia, Russia, Germany, Canada, Japan, China, North Korea, South Korea, Turkey, Syria, Libya.....getting the picture yet?

The reason we foreigners concern are selves in the US is because we all share the same bloody planet and I assure you if it were possible i'm sure every country on the planet would vote to launch the US in its entirety into space toward the sun. So be thankful.

Oh, and specifically on the note of gun control. The reason why South American countries and Mexico are as violent as they are is because the US's drug war and complete lack of gun control.

Right because the US gov't under Obama and Atty Gen. Eric Holder (who the world loves so much and gave a nobel prize to) created an illegal gun running scheme called Fast and Furious that ended up putting guns in the hands of known cartel members. In addition Eric Holder came out saying the idea behind this was to demonize the 2nd amendment. In addition the drug war has been financed by US banks HSBC and Barclays

http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/news/regions/americas/mex ico/120921/drug-war-cartels-money-laundering-banks

Yup. Gun control would solve that.... Right....The very gov'tt aiding and arming the drug cartels is going to suddenly stop? Right... The very gov't that is turning a blind eye to money laundering for drug cartels is going to suddenly become virtous and go after them.... right? and the left hand doesnt know what the right is doing.

Fact is the 2nd amendment like the 1st amendment and the bill of rights as a whole are the constitutional foundation of the country. If we (americans) want eradicate them then we have a process for that, the states must vote to redact the bill of rights and scrap the constitution. For foreigners to attack our countries laws and founding documents is essentially an attack on american soverignty as much the US attacking other nations is an attack on their soverignty

fact is we dont have control over what the gov't does. Its a beauracratic entity with agendas of its own and the populace of any country is not essentially it's gov't. Other countries should be aware of that more than the US.

At 12/30/12 02:47 AM, Saen wrote: Really, clip and magazine definition and hollow points is all yall got?

I understand a clip is loaded and concealed inside a gun while a magazine attaches exposed. Yes a magazine holds more, who is going to cry if I interchange the term clip with magazine at x-am in the morning?

wrong. Magazines load ammunition into a firearm, directly into the chamber. the m1 garand, sks, m16, etc all have magazines but only the m16 has a detachable mag. Clips are devices used to load bullets into magazines.

As for hollow points, they should be illegal across all states to fire at a human. If you think that detectives will have any difficulty in finding a simple stamped serial number on a shattered hollow point, serial numbers can be applied in different ways. Electronically or on a small or microscopic scale for example.

The way you keep saying this makes your point come out very poorly. a bullet is the projectile part of any pistol or rifle round. the shell casing is what you want the serial number on or it will be unreadable later. Microstamping is where the firearms firing pin leaves what you want on a shell casing from a handgun. This idea is retarded as 1. you can pick up shell casings at a murder scene 2. if a revolver is used then the shell casings stay in the cylinder, meaning they won't be left at the scene unless the idiot dumps em on the floor. 3. a file can remove it in less than 10 seconds. 4. this is only useful in tracking the firearm to the last legal purchaser, if it is stolen or illegally sold you cannot find where it went and cannot trace it through paper anymore. 4. a mass shooter would not be affected by microstamping as by the time they are committing the crime they're have already probably been identified.

It's illegal to shoot at people unless they are attacking you. If you're a ccw holder you will want hollow points for 2 reasons.
1. It will probably do a better job of stopping an attacker. 2. It is less likely to fly through an attacker and hit somebody innocent.

At 12/30/12 10:08 AM, thegarbear14 wrote:
The way you keep saying this makes your point come out very poorly. a bullet is the projectile part of any pistol or rifle round. the shell casing is what you want the serial number on or it will be unreadable later. Microstamping is where the firearms firing pin leaves what you want on a shell casing from a handgun. This idea is retarded as 1. you can pick up shell casings at a murder scene 2. if a revolver is used then the shell casings stay in the cylinder, meaning they won't be left at the scene unless the idiot dumps em on the floor. 3. a file can remove it in less than 10 seconds. 4. this is only useful in tracking the firearm to the last legal purchaser, if it is stolen or illegally sold you cannot find where it went and cannot trace it through paper anymore. 4. a mass shooter would not be affected by microstamping as by the time they are committing the crime they're have already probably been identified.

Seeing as the bullet will shatter inside the murder victim's body, as long as enough pieces (or one piece in the case of microstamping") then it can be traced. Obviously serial numbers should be placed onto the casing as well, not every murderer is going to pick up all of their shells. As for filing off the numbers, that's easier said than done if they ares tampe don a microscopic scale. Not only should you serve jail time for merely possessing bullets with filed-off serial numbers, if you are convicted of a crime involving your filed bullets, then you spend 10+ extra years in prison.

It's illegal to shoot at people unless they are attacking you. If you're a ccw holder you will want hollow points for 2 reasons.
1. It will probably do a better job of stopping an attacker. 2. It is less likely to fly through an attacker and hit somebody innocent.

It will do a better job of multilating an attacker or anyone you shoot, a regular bullet will do just fine. Hmm wouldn't it make sense then to ban these ridiculously powerful and high caliber handguns and rifles? If that is a problem it doesn't make sense switch to a deadlier bullet that can cause irreversible damage to the human body rather than banning deadlier weapons.

That's what happens when you choose to defend yourself with high-caliber weapons. A burglar breaks into your house, you shoot him with your manly magnum, the bullet goes through his shoulder and right through your daughter's eye.

Saen you make no sense.

the microstamping is for the firearm. It puts the guns serial # on the shell casing. Filing can remove microstamping, it takes second and that firearm will no longer place the serial # on the cartridge.

You'd have to register ammo or get custom made ammo to your serial #

a 9mm can go through someone too.

It would probably be a felony to remove microstamping although shooting someone is already a very serious crime. Regular bullets are copper jacket typical. They will also break apart but they will penetrate deeper.

Wait, why are gun control advocates against hollow points? It minimizes collateral damage because over penetration stops happening as frequently.

At 12/30/12 09:02 AM, Kellz5460 wrote: So ignorance and apathy are excused- My point is many of the things people are calling for - ALREADY EXIST

In some states versus others, you might be correct. What needs to happen however is a federal across the board kind of change. Every state should share the same freedom as in which the constitution protects.

You can try those schemes [...]

I read a recent story that in an annual buyback in L.A. they received 2 military grade RPG's, alongside numerous assault rifles. People waited in 2 hour lines to give their guns to the police and the police ran out of giftcards a couple times. So I wouldn't bash the idea of a gun buyback because you buy into the stereotype that America is entirely made up of gun nuts.

Yup. Gun control would solve that [...]

Most guns that have made there way into the South American countries did not come from the "Fast and Furious" program. Most of the damage done in the drug war (though Obama has been no help) has been done in previous administrations like Nixon who started it, Kennedy, and Clinton.

Fact is the 2nd amendment like the 1st amendment and the bill of rights as a whole are the constitutional foundation of the country. If we (americans) want eradicate them then we have a process for that, the states must vote to redact the bill of rights and scrap the constitution. For foreigners to attack our countries laws and founding documents is essentially an attack on american soverignty as much the US attacking other nations is an attack on their soverignty

No one is attacking the constitution aside from the government themselves. The 1st amendment and 4th have been brutally torn to shreds while the American people stand around like a deer in the headlights....and you're worrying about foreigners trying to tear it apart? The American public's lack of knowledge and lack of action will be America's downfall.

At 12/30/12 03:18 PM, RacistBassist wrote: Wait, why are gun control advocates against hollow points? It minimizes collateral damage because over penetration stops happening as frequently.

Probably because it's more brutal for the target of said bullet. still stupid though

At 12/30/12 07:06 PM, CaveStoryGrounds wrote: I read a recent story that in an annual buyback in L.A. they received 2 military grade RPG's, alongside numerous assault rifles. People waited in 2 hour lines to give their guns to the police and the police ran out of giftcards a couple times. So I wouldn't bash the idea of a gun buyback because you buy into the stereotype that America is entirely made up of gun nuts.

Those 2 military grade RPGs were one of the ones that have a one time use and they were already fired weren't they? The gun buy backs seem like a waste of money to me. The more criminal element will not sell their guns, and due to the nature of the no questions asked policy, it seems like people will just end up stealing guns to make a quick buck, and that the buyback to get rid of your "assault" weapon seemed like a huge financial loss.

No one is attacking the constitution aside from the government themselves. The 1st amendment and 4th have been brutally torn to shreds while the American people stand around like a deer in the headlights....and you're worrying about foreigners trying to tear it apart? The American public's lack of knowledge and lack of action will be America's downfall.

The problem is that we have a large domestic and foreign pressure to disarm us, while our politicians are more than happy to go along with it.

At 12/27/12 06:47 PM, RacistBassist wrote: Although it is cool knowing that by these sweeping generalization of things I have numerous assault weapons in my house now whereas before there was none with 2 on the way.

I...um...just want every to know...that I have...um...had a change of heart...and I...uh...no longer have any of these firearms...

tongue firmly in cheek