Controversy makes Newgrounds great. No controversy = no Newgrounds.

I think that what makes newgrounds great is the ability to express your feelings (limited) or your flash skills.

yes, I agree with what Ross said. the site should stand as freedom of speech.

if we have issues with a flash, take it to the creator, he's the one that should remove it (or not if he feels like suffering).

Two threads and an "eloquent speech in newgrounds defense" goes to show how blown up Newgrounds can make controversial BULLSHIT just so they can look like they'd been mauled or hounded by some "moral group", be it media, individual or religious.

Get ahead of the game and stop caring.

At 5/21/07 12:51 PM, Nightmaric wrote: And you STILL haven't refferenced to the fact that his donation scam was to prove noone would attempt to do something when presented the chance.

Bullshit on that as well.

His donation "scam" was saying he would FORFEIT his art and his message, making his Vtech flash void: It would never see the light of day again.

Whether or not he starts another flash for money is up to him, just kind of funny that he will be "controversial" until paid well enough.

I wish this flash never happened so I didn't have to hear so many varied idiotic comments

the game is terrible due to gameplay. screw the tradegy,gameplay/graphics suck.

At 5/21/07 12:47 PM, Ross wrote:

As the saying goes, I may disagree with what PiGPEN's doing, but I'll forever defend his right to do it.

First of all, that was my comment that I posted in the original thread, second of all, you didn't say it right. It's okay if you steal it, but atleast say it right please.

Haha, I just came back from a long exercise, and this exact headline struck me when I was in the middle of the running :O

However, I had a different angle on my thoughts and was more thinking of what newgrounds is today, and what actually makes newgrounds today.
The community is quite steady it seem, and even though some go, and some come, alot of fans remain and help taking NG to the next level.

One thing haven't changed, NG still profits from controversy, always have, like Ross talk about, and most likley always will.
However, the quality of the site as it is today offers a totally different side of NG, with big cash flash contests, art and audio contests, and in my opinion alot more serious face outwards than just two-three years ago.

I guess the fact that controversy is the quick way of attention still will rush through both NG and the community, it was built of it, and new and old artists hope to find quick attention through these simple, and many times tasteless means.

What NG holds in the future noone knows, maybe there are plans. I assume the redesign will reveal alot of the thoughts and goals NG have.
Personally I hope that NG won't be afraid of expanding, and I'm talking mainly about the audio and the art section of the site. Underdogs very much worthy of putting some effort into, perhaps especially the art-part, seing most flash artists are good drawing artists in the beginning.

I'm definitley happy to be part of this community, even though it sometimes tend to steal a little too much of my time... as is probably the case for most regulars. :)

So to sum it up, the community makes newgrounds great, and the llarge amount number of users who don't have an account or maybe doesnt even regularly visit NG provide the basic source of income, so NG staff can maintain and serve the community. That's the way I see it.

At 5/21/07 03:45 PM, Nopidam wrote:

At 5/21/07 12:47 PM, Ross wrote:

As the saying goes, I may disagree with what PiGPEN's doing, but I'll forever defend his right to do it.

First of all, that was my comment that I posted in the original thread, second of all, you didn't say it right. It's okay if you steal it, but atleast say it right please.

Yeah, well, what are you gonna do about it you whiny little bitch?

-- Keep it on the site, there are far more offensive things already on Newgrounds.

At 5/21/07 12:52 PM, DarkZrobe wrote: I agree for the whole freedom of speech thing, I just dont like how he wants money to take it down (as stated above).

IT was a joke you idiots, he said he was just doing it to see if anybody was dumb enough to donate.

God damn.

Anyway I think it should stay on NG.

At 5/21/07 03:23 PM, Mr-Money wrote: Well, Ross, I guess you're just using some clever excuse which links somewhat to freedom of speech, and which will let Newgrounds continue to get more money from the media exposure.

I don't blame you, really. It's not like Newgrounds is full of family-friendly material. There's nothing too sick for Newgrounds.

Unless it's child porn, in which case they call the FBI ;)

I guess we're damned if we do and damned if we don't. Keep it up and we get accused of cashing in on tragedy, take it down and thousands lose their mind and hope our website goes up in flames for censoring. well, thats the internet for you.

At 5/21/07 03:30 PM, Erkie wrote: Two threads and an "eloquent speech in newgrounds defense" goes to show how blown up Newgrounds can make controversial BULLSHIT just so they can look like they'd been mauled or hounded by some "moral group", be it media, individual or religious.

Actually, it was more of a "here's an opportunity to take something that's generating negative attention, and use it to illustrate what makes NG great". Infuse that with as much imagination and/or cynicism as you wish.

Side note - I find it especially funny when people talk about Newgrounds as if we're this faceless corporate monster. If only you could watch the day-to-day operations of the site. We are, beyond a shadow a doubt, one of the least corporate "big sites" on the Internet.

Without Flash, Newgrounds couldn't be Newgrounds

so hence why Newgrounds was called what it is "To Break New Grounds"

If people want to make a Flash game about some wacko that went beserk and killed a couple people, I say let him

And if your one of those victims(including emotionally hurt family members and friends) from the V-tech shooting, I have one thing to say to you, "LIFE SUCKS" we all have our ups and downs in life and this is no different than 9/11 these things happen so get over it and move o with your life!!!!!!!

At 5/21/07 12:47 PM, Ross wrote:

Speaking only for myself, I think V-Tech Rampage is in poor taste. In terms of gameplay, it's : decent, but tying it to this recent tragedy is a bad idea, in my opinion.

yeah...i agree with you there

but once we take away his right to put it here on NG, we lose track of what makes Newgrounds great.

is it such a great thing that makes newgrounds great, then? don't get me wrong i worship this place....but is letting it stay on right? clearly it's not moral....but is keeping it on the web necessary to uphold the idea of free speech and therefore the greater good? i'm honestly not sure....

i see your point ross, and it's a good one. however, i'm not sure if the NG staff is thinking more towards their own image or the best thing to do....

but it's ur site, so i'll stop being an arrogant prick ^^

wait i think more people than just you make it great

People did let it stay in the portal at one point, so too bad that you people couldn't help blam it away...

Anyway, he is a dick for trying to bribe his way out!

WAY TO GO ROSS!!! This has benn what I have been trying to say all along, but everyone kept calling me a stupid insensitive bastard.

Also, I hope PigPen makes a sequel.

Ross I agree with you 100% I don't agree with what pig pen says but newgrounds has always been about freedom of speech and that will never get taken away from anyone who puts flashj in the portal

At 5/21/07 01:35 PM, ArmyAnt wrote: I still think the game where you loot the corpses after the Tsunami hit is worse.

Agreed.

Anyways, its that time again and Tom isn't around to shut all of you up. It's going to stay and that IS final. Freedom of speech has been around longer than the USA itself and that's a fact. I have always believed that anyone can say whatever they want. HOWEVER, their are limits as to what the they way in which, if I were physically present, I'd say "STFU you asshole" or "Kick his ass". This is one of those cases. Sometimes, I wish the admins or mods would just, though not removing priviledges, give them a slap on the wrist per say. To be so purposefully malicious, thats a choice to be slanderous. Slander is in essence the crime here but it isn't in a form that can be punished since he himself didn't say such things as "the shooter is dead so i'm going to reinvent a false pretense against him". This is a loophole that is abused very often so it is often brushed aside as a legal action.
Sorry for the long winded speech but we must become more aware that this is both a legal choice of action AND at the same time a poor response to a tragedy. We just need our priorities straight now, the shooting is done and over. Now we gotta such up stupid kids that are writing "V-tech will happen here tomarrow" in bathroom walls.
Move on, shut up media, you have had you're say.

a.k.a
Ross, dont bother drawing attention to it if you yourself don't find it tasteful. I would have been more convinced of you're arguement should you had been REALLY defending the principle of his work.

p.s.
It's true, Pico's School is the same thing. Don't freak out people.

I <3 this game, and I <3 mocking tragedy. It's like a hobby, only it's more fun to see people ge angry and offended.

At 5/21/07 04:52 PM, JohnnyUtah wrote:

At 5/21/07 04:48 PM, Inferno42 wrote: I <3 this game, and I <3 mocking tragedy. It's like a hobby, only it's more fun to see people ge angry and offended.

kid, you're not a badass. lets just be clear about that.

Yeah, I know.

are people still talking about that game? i mean really there is stuff just as bad on newgrounds. nobody got into a stink when the 9/11 games were submitted. well maybe people did but there weren't new's articles and topics about them.

He's still a bastard for trying to make money off of it.

At 5/21/07 04:10 PM, Striker028 wrote: is it such a great thing that makes newgrounds great, then? don't get me wrong i worship this place....but is letting it stay on right? clearly it's not moral....

Clearly it's not moral... to you. The point I was trying to make is that what's "right" or "moral" to you may not be the same as what's "right" or "moral" to someone else. Newgrounds is a testament to the fact that one person's "immoral" is another's "art".

i see your point ross, and it's a good one. however, i'm not sure if the NG staff is thinking more towards their own image or the best thing to do....

I don't know what you're getting at here, but what I wrote had nothing to do with anyone other than myself. So any scenario you've concocted in your mind about the NG staff conspiring is likely to be more interesting than the reality.

At 5/21/07 04:52 PM, JohnnyUtah wrote:

At 5/21/07 04:48 PM, Inferno42 wrote: I <3 this game, and I <3 mocking tragedy. It's like a hobby, only it's more fun to see people ge angry and offended.

kid, you're not a badass. lets just be clear about that.

I thought you were cool, Utah.

I shed a tear. I almost certainly heard the triumphant war music in the background as I read that remarkable and memorable post.

Agreed in it's entirity.

100th post in the topic?

At 5/21/07 02:30 PM, Jessii wrote: .... I'm working on a Clinical Psychology degree, so if someone's perception is so distorted that they needed to create a game out of a tragedy, it's poor taste.

:... and I would have to question why that person is glorifying it as if the person who did the killings was some kind of hero.

YOU GOT BE JOKING ahahahahahaha LOOOOOOOOOOLLLZZZZZZZz

'i might not agree with what you're saying [making] but ill damn well fight for your right to do so'