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Take it down!

At 5/15/07 05:44 PM, Maus wrote:

At 5/15/07 05:42 PM, MattTheParanoidKat wrote: a masterpiece such as V-Tech Rampage

Okay, I'm all for lofty speech in the defense of ideals, but c'mooonnnn.

Lol, well, I only think it's a masterpiece for the choice of music. I was laughing hysterically when I heard Shine. Damn killers, c'moooooooonnnnnnn it's METAL not alt-rock.

How come games like this and that columbine one get so much attention when they out right suck and not to mention sprites???

I think you should take it down because as a lot of people said this kid is basically extorting money based on peoples emotions towards the incident. Newgrounds shouldn't be the platform he used to try to get people who are emotionally effected by the game to pay him money.

Also, the NBC reference is stupid. Yeah, NBC profited off the video. But first of all, just because NBC does it, it in no way makes it right. NBC is in the toilet. If Newgrounds starts doing business like NBC (however that is), maybe Newgrounds will end up in the toilet with NBC.

Anyway, it's no longer about freedom of speech or any of that with this game. It's a stupid kid playing off peoples vulnerable emotions to gain money. And now he's getting some more publicly which translates to more money. That's why I think you should take it down.

i say we keep it on.

but move it and all other school shooting games, all terrorist attack games etc (911, col,umbine etc.) to the mature section.

that game is ok, but i do agree it could be seen inappropriot in some peoples eyes (possibly people whose friends/syblings died in the v-tech massacre), but i think it shouldnt be torn down, there are worse things out there than this game, take those down before you start critizizing this

I don't like the game.
however.....newgrounds startred off with contraversy and shit...why are you guys so........ Family friendly now? Protect the freeom of art/expression (etc.)

I enjoyed it.

Hey wait-a-minute, isn't newgrounds all about school shooting games anyway?

One more thing.

I'll tell you how this will play out. If Newgrounds doesn't remove it, in a matter of days or weeks, you'll see an "account suspended" message when you click donate on his site.

When that happens, Paypal will look like the good guys who put a stop to the scheme, and Newgrounds will probably look careless. And don't give me the "it's not illegal" crap for why Paypal wont suspend his account. They suspended Save Toby, and that wasn't illegal either. If too many people complain to Paypal and they feel the concept is wrong they aren't afraid to step on a little freedom of speech.

It would be awesome if NG could look like the good guys on this one instead of Paypal doing it because I get the feeling they will.

i dont mind the nature of the game.. i saw a mockery of it a mile away... its been done before and its usually a cheap way to get attention and for some kids thats the prime of their careers so whatever all power to him...

i think the fact that he is attempting to peddle dimes and nickels off of the event is in poor taste. while i understand that the media is already profitting from their hard core coverage of the event i think that newgrounds is smarter than to be a monkey see monkey doo point of view about it.... i dont think newgrounds should back him up on it ... i know we're all about letting kids do whatever they want but is it necessary to stoop that low for the sake of being the cool site where everything goes?

Do not remove it. Ever. To do so would go against eh very principles upon which the sit eis founded.

At 5/15/07 04:58 PM, Net-terrorist wrote: If it ain't fun to play...
Then fuck for all I care, take it the fuck down.

Yes it is, and supporting its takedown is true net-terrorism.

Its not terrorism unless the person who posted that is threatening to harm the author in some way you silly cunt.

At 5/15/07 06:15 PM, Bolo wrote: Do not remove it. Ever. To do so would go against eh very principles upon which the sit eis founded.

I respect you.

At 5/15/07 06:18 PM, Afro-Ninja wrote:

At 5/15/07 06:15 PM, Bolo wrote: Do not remove it. Ever. To do so would go against eh very principles upon which the sit eis founded.

I didn't know blackmailing was an NG principal

Is everyone completely ignoring the paypal aspect of this?

AFRO NINJA IS COOL

I recently advised a friend not to make a game similar to this one. Same idea based on the same event, but different in every other aspect. I think that it was a disturbing event and I don't believe people should make games or movies about it, but unless the artist displays the psychopath as a hero or god of some sort, there's nothing that can or should be done to stop these artists from expressing their point.
If you don't like the idea of the game, then don't play it. There is no reason to subject yourself to it if you don't like it. That would be like watching the news coverage of Anna Nicole Smith's death for the entire period of time that it was on, then complaining that it is all that is on. If you open your eyes there are plenty of other flashes on here that are equally or more insulting then this one.
I do appreciate you bringing to our attention that he is trying to make a profit over this. I think that he is making something that wasn't a big deal (in my opinion) into something that is wrong and that is disgusting. I only hope no one is actually contributing to his paypal account, in hope that he'll take the flash off.

If you know someone who is sitting inside, playing the game over and over again, have him/her committed.

Wade makes some good points to be sure, but I have to agree with Afro Ninja on this one. I highly doubt that Pigpen made this game to make people think about the ethical questions it raises about freedom of speech; he did it to be an attention whore and a prick, and he proved that since he'll accept money to remove it from NG. That is literally capitalizing off of a tragedy, and I believe we should stop him from doing that. Sure, the media is doing the same thing in its own way, but I say we shouldn't tolerate that either. In fact, we can begin to say "fuck you" to the media by removing this game, as a means of demanding that people show the proper respect to those affected by this event.

This wouldn't be drawing a line that limited our future freedom of speech. This would be making an exception to the rule, based on extenuating circumstances. Moreover, as website whose members have the power to vote on which submissions stay and which go, it wouldn't be at all unreasonable to remove this game based on user disapproval. In fact, there's already a function where we can blow the whistle on submissions under judgement whose content we think is inappropriate. The precedent has already been set; invoking constitutional rights is unnecessary.

Here's an idea: set up a poll, and NG users can vote on whether they want V-Tech Rampage on the site or not. Make it so it's only open to people who created an account before today's date to prevent vote stuffing. Think of it as expanding the judgement process to allow more than the normal amount of votes. That way, we as a community who have a vested interest in the content on the site can decide for ourselves whether this is inappropriate or not.

...Man, Tom picked a bad week for a honeymoon, huh?

It would be meaningless to remove it. Another one would pop up sooner or later.

At 5/15/07 05:52 PM, Crue wrote: In short, I believe highly in my countries freedoms, and I think that anyone pushing to have it removed should be rounded up, kneeled in front of a large hole, and shot in the face, like in Casino. You people make me sick.

Freedom of expression doesn't mean freedom to be an asshole. Take a crisis, take advantage of it's shock value, and package it for views and response. It's like selling off 9/11 building dust on Ebay.

Fact of the matter is that the intention of this game was not to do something for the sake of a position or opinion, or does it make any sort of statement about anything. It's critical value is severely limited. Fighting to keep it up for the sake of "liberty and freedom" seems to be a bit overblown. I'm not saying take it down, but really, there's no reason to have this argument. If the piece was trying to send a message, it would have more bearing.

Sure, its freedom of expression, but its not saying anything.

I'll be getting immature responses now, feel free to rain down with name calling, violence, and accusations of sodomy... it's what I would expect given half of these opinions and rants.

IF ANYTHING happens to that game I will personally make all of you unfunny BBS faggot statwhores pay

At 5/15/07 06:18 PM, Afro-Ninja wrote:

At 5/15/07 06:15 PM, Bolo wrote: Do not remove it. Ever. To do so would go against eh very principles upon which the sit eis founded.

I didn't know blackmailing was an NG principal

Is everyone completely ignoring the paypal aspect of this?

I don't think it's as relevent because he's not using NG as a base for it, just his own site. If it wasn't for this thread I wouldn't have been aware of his plan.

Although him putting a link to his website doesn't exactly help that argument.

At 5/15/07 06:19 PM, exaggeration17a wrote: Here's an idea: set up a poll, and NG users can vote on whether they want V-Tech Rampage on the site or not. Make it so it's only open to people who created an account before today's date to prevent vote stuffing. Think of it as expanding the judgement process to allow more than the normal amount of votes. That way, we as a community who have a vested interest in the content on the site can decide for ourselves whether this is inappropriate or not.

I liked everything you said except that paragraph. It's clear what would happen with a vote. Most people here are the "FREEDOM OF SPEECH LEAVE IT YEAH!!!!" type because they aren't seeing the real problem of extorting money by playing off peoples emotions. Being that most people aren't seeing the whole money issue, it's clear how the vote would go because once you take it to the general Newgrounds population, it'll swing towards the "freedom of speech" people, although it doesn't even make sense.

I really don't think it matters though. I STRONGLY feel it it's not Newgrounds, it'll definitely be Paypal.

...Man, Tom picked a bad week for a honeymoon, huh?

That's why he has a great group of people working for him :)

Funny thing is, half the people complaining that it should be taken down probably love playing Pico's School.

At 5/15/07 06:27 PM, TheAbominableMatt wrote: Although him putting a link to his website doesn't exactly help that argument.

Putting a link to his website IN THE AUTHORS COMMENTS ***

HEY GUYSSS LETS DISCUSS ABOUT POLITICS morals and CONSPIRACY THEORIES AND STUFF IN THE WORLDS SHITTIEST BBS

ya know THE SAME BBS THATS FILLED WITH CONSOLE V.S CONSOLE THREADS, the same bbs where we discuss the kitty krew AND PHOTOSHOP BEDN ALLDAY

sounds a great idea

its a great shame Toms away

At 5/15/07 06:24 PM, jmtb02 wrote: Freedom of expression doesn't mean freedom to be an asshole. Take a crisis, take advantage of it's shock value, and package it for views and response. It's like selling off 9/11 building dust on Ebay.

I'd buy it!

Fact of the matter is that the intention of this game was not to do something for the sake of a position or opinion, or does it make any sort of statement about anything. It's critical value is severely limited. Fighting to keep it up for the sake of "liberty and freedom" seems to be a bit overblown. I'm not saying take it down, but really, there's no reason to have this argument. If the piece was trying to send a message, it would have more bearing.

The message was unintentional, but it's still there, although I can see your point.

Sure, its freedom of expression, but its not saying anything.

Again, not intentionally.

I'll be getting immature responses now, feel free to rain down with name calling, violence, and accusations of sodomy... it's what I would expect given half of these opinions and rants.

No immature response from me, just heavy belief in freedom.

At 5/15/07 06:27 PM, DFox wrote:

At 5/15/07 06:19 PM, exaggeration17a wrote:

...Man, Tom picked a bad week for a honeymoon, huh?

That's why he has a great group of people working for him :)

Here's a napkin, you can wipe some of that brown stuff off your nose.

At 5/15/07 06:33 PM, Crue wrote: The message was unintentional, but it's still there, although I can see your point.

What is the message?