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aw shit, they say he was a "loner"

Damn those Loners. kill them before they kill you

At 4/18/07 12:26 AM, cellardoor6 wrote:

At 4/17/07 11:05 PM, HeavenDuff wrote: Another loner who may have get bullied or laugh at in high school or even at university started to fire on other kids...

and you guys should really change your constitution... fucking morons with guns... good job...

Oh shush, there have been quite a few school shootings in your country as well, and especially in your Province of Quebec.

Educate yourself:

dont fucking tell me to educate myself, I know about all these events. Why do you tell me something that stupid?

The École Polytechnique Massacre in which 14 people were killed.

Yes, and he didnt bought is guns LEGALY, like the USA.

The Concordia University Massacre in which 4 people were killed.

The Dawson College shooting in which 2 people were killed and a bunch critically wounded.

Only one person died. Educate yourself.

Then theres the school shootings in other western countries such as:

The Erfert Shooting in which 18 people were killed.

The Dunblane Massacre in Scotland in which 17 people were killed.

I could go on...

Some of these shootings were worse than Columbine, but have you ever even heard about any of them? Probably not, because people like you in your hypocritical society just love to focus all of your attention on the US. You like to ignore your own problems, and overemphasize the bad in the US to further your inferiority complex and boost your irrational political bias.

just shut the fuck up, we are not hypocritical, but it's fucking true that 30000 die in you country each year due to guns. I ain't ignoring the whole problem, thats fucking untrue, but we are trying in our country to make our lives better, just knowing that my neighboor doesnt have an M16 in is closet makes me feel good.

And by the way, At Dawson College, the guy used guns that shoot with "air". I dont know how its named in english, but that ain't semi-automatic rifles like you have, its a weapon thats made to hunt little animals, and that the reason why just one girl died.

I dont have any inferioty complexe toward a country thats hated all over the world. I have nothing to envy about you and your constitution or your fucking right to own a semi-automatic weapon. I'm ok in my province, even though I would rather live in the country of Quebec. But hey, you must don't know about whats happening between us quebecers and canadians. Go Educate Yourself.

So maybe you should focus on your own gun problems considering Montreal has been a huge gun violence hotspot, even by American standards. Maybe look inwards at your own society and culture instead of sticking your snooty French Canadian nose in our business.

Maybe your country should start sticking is fucking dirty hypocrital and soooo proud nose in your own business. You guys just like to fight with guns, in your own country... and also in countries that are not your country. So until your constitution change, and until your governement change, shut the fuck up about my country.

And don't ever try to insult me on the fact that I speak french, cause I can speak my langage and yours.

So.... Va te faire foutre criss de tache d'américain borné, tu crois toute savoir dans ton ptit trou de pays quand té entouré de sales traces de mardes comme toi, mais si tu sortais voir le monde un ti peu tu verrais à quel point vous êtes des traces de merdes.

Pis ta constitution jme torche avec.

rant much...

Oh, and btw, I ain't saying that you guys are moron.

I'm just saying that people shouldn't be allowed to have guns like that. Or at least find a way to change the constitution so its not anybody that could enter a shop and buy a semi-automatic rifle...

so don't get me wrong, I ain't saying that any american is stupid....

I have a theory that as a thread progresses it will inevitably end in a flame war about whether America is a good country or about whether or not God exists. So far, so good!

Well, chalk another one up for the violent crime record books. My condolences to anyone who was affected by this tragic event.

I really hope that this guy, and what he did, doesn't become an inspiration to any troubled youth out there. It just seems that some people can't cope with their own emotions and they resort to mega-violence to show people how they feel. It's a shame, really. Also, there really isn't any obvious way to curb these types of things. As far as I know, people who go on killing sprees do not usually go around telling people about it, and if they do, they probably weren't going to do it anyway and just wanted attention. Sure, there are probably warning signs, but if we acted preemptively against every angsty teen in the country we would have detention centers full of pissed off kids all across this country. Maybe the president should apply his logic from the war on terror to this situation. He should draft 'The Loner Act' and hold any kid suspected of being a possible school shooter in Cuba, without habeas corpus. Of course, I jest.

Really though, I wonder if this is just a sign of the times. People in the states are part of a culture that embraces violence in most forms of media. Mind you, I'm not blaming this on movies, TV or video games. But, I do think that there may be a cumulative effect from these things over time. Also, the fact that many media sources tend to constantly focus on the bad in the world doesn't help either. Seriously, how many people know who won the Nobel prize for physics, or peace last year? Yeah, and how many of you know the names of the Columbine shooters? This is my point, two kids that shoot up a school in Colorado a decade ago are more famous than the most brilliant people in the world who have achieved great things. Maybe it is time us, as a society, to rethink what possible psychological impact our media could be having on troubled minds. I'm not talking about outright censorship, I'm talking about personal responsibility on the parts of both parents and media sources alike. If we do come to the conclusion that our media is having an adverse effect on a small percentage of the population, we need to think about how we can remove that effect while minimizing the impact on the other 99.9999% of the population.

Anyways, I'm sure a lot of you will disagree with what I just said. But, if you have a better idea, fire away.

At 4/18/07 01:47 AM, HeavenDuff wrote:

At 4/18/07 12:26 AM, cellardoor6 wrote:

At 4/17/07 11:05 PM, HeavenDuff wrote: Another loner who may have get bullied or laugh at in high school or even at university started to fire on other kids...

and you guys should really change your constitution... fucking morons with guns... good job...

Oh shush, there have been quite a few school shootings in your country as well, and especially in your Province of Quebec.

Educate yourself:

dont fucking tell me to educate myself, I know about all these events. Why do you tell me something that stupid?

The École Polytechnique Massacre in which 14 people were killed.

Yes, and he didnt bought is guns LEGALY, like the USA.

Um yeah he did. Learn to not read selectively. All the guns he used were legally purchased by him.

The Concordia University Massacre in which 4 people were killed.

The Dawson College shooting in which 2 people were killed and a bunch critically wounded.

Only one person died. Educate yourself.

Actually the shooter died as well, so that makes 2.

Then theres the school shootings in other western countries such as:

The Erfert Shooting in which 18 people were killed.

The Dunblane Massacre in Scotland in which 17 people were killed.

I could go on...

Some of these shootings were worse than Columbine, but have you ever even heard about any of them? Probably not, because people like you in your hypocritical society just love to focus all of your attention on the US. You like to ignore your own problems, and overemphasize the bad in the US to further your inferiority complex and boost your irrational political bias.

just shut the fuck up, we are not hypocritical, but it's fucking true that 30000 die in you country each year due to guns.

You do realize that we have 10 times the population that you do right? You do realize that we almost have more illegal immigrants in our country than you have citizens right? You do realize that gun violence is caused by a whole multitude of variables including race, background, geography etc.

Extrapolate the Canadian murder rate if your population was equal to the US, if you had the same racial makeup, and if you had the same influx of smuggled weapons, drugs, and other criminal activity from a country that borders you.

I wonder how well Canada would do if it had our same situation. But luckily for Canada, the US provides a buffer for you, you don't have to worry about drugs and guns being smuggled up from Mexico, and the rest of Central and South America.

I bet that the murder rate in Canada among GUN OWNERS is equal to the murder rate among GUN OWNERS in the US. The higher amount of gun crime in the US has nothing to do with the laws, it has to do with teh law because the US would have many guns on our soil regardless due to our geographic position.

I ain't ignoring the whole problem, thats fucking untrue, but we are trying in our country to make our lives better, just knowing that my neighboor doesnt have an M16 in is closet makes me feel good.

Actually, the M-16 is an AR-15 model and Canadians can own the same AR-15s that people in California can. The only difference is that they don't have a pistol grip (which is meaningless) and only come with 10-round magazines instead of 30 (which is also meaningless because larger magazines can be ordered, made, or smuggled).

And by the way, At Dawson College, the guy used guns that shoot with "air". I dont know how its named in english, but that ain't semi-automatic rifles like you have, its a weapon thats made to hunt little animals, and that the reason why just one girl died.

What are you talking about? He had a
Beretta Storm Carbine heres the article in French for your French Canadian reading pleasure.

Where did you hear that he had an air rifle?

And even if he did (which he didn't). That would only serve my point further, that gun laws don't mean anything.

I dont have any inferioty complexe toward a country thats hated all over the world.

Oh yeah I forgot, you Canadians have so little to be proud of that you judge a country based on how much it is liked by other people that DON'T live in it. I love your logic.

I have nothing to envy about you and your constitution or your fucking right to own a semi-automatic weapon.

Um.. you know nothing do you? Semi-automatic weapons are LEGAL IN CANADA. The weapons that were used in the school shootings in Canada were LEGALLY purchased semi-automatic weapons. The weapons that were used in the VT shooting would be legal in Canada.

And don't ever try to insult me on the fact that I speak french, cause I can speak my langage and yours.

I wasn't insulting you for speaking French. I was criticizing you for being so incredibly delusional that you attack America for things that happen in your country, and that you know NOTHING about as you just proved.

And I speak English, German, and Hebrew fluently so I am trilingual. So don't try to pretend that being bilingual makes you superior to Americans.

Why are guns legal in the US? It's kinda confusing because wouldn't that just encourage gun crime? These kinds of school shootings are unpredictable, but unless your laws over there in the US change, they are pretty inevitable. I mean, someone's gonna get pushed over the edge by bullies and flip. And if they have easy access to guns then, well, there's your tragedy. I am aware that some states like California have decent control over gun use, but other states are too laid back about it.

it from the constitution, it allows all people the right to bear arms (own a gun)

it was first implemented because the US didn't have an army but rather multiple militias made up of farmers. therefore, in order to protect ourselves from the British, farmers needed to be able to own their own gun because they were the army.

it has little use now and i agree that it needs to be controlled, but there is still the sport of hunting, personal defense, and smuggled weapons to worry about.

At 4/18/07 02:19 AM, Yhtomit wrote: Why are guns legal in the US?

To make sure that the people retain the power to overthrow the government if it ever becomes out of control. Also, so we can have militias in case we are invaded.

You know, shit like that.

its all because of the British, it is their fault!

if they didn't want to attack us back then, we wouldn't have needed militias and wouldn't need guns

joke

Ok dude, you gotta understand something.

I dont disrespect the USA, but if you do insult another country for being what they are, I'll do just the same with yours.

I also know that, laws about weapons in Canada are different than in your country, and I also know that our country still have to impove those laws so things like that wont happen again.

There is 350000 individuals in the USA and we are 30000 in Quebec. So according to this, if you guys have 30000 persons dying due to guns each year, we should have 3000.
And thats not the case. And don't blame the illegal immigrants, you can be a legal immigrant and do just the same... just like that Korean guy did. And we do have a fucking lot of immigrants in Canada, especially in Quebec.

I ain't proud of being Canadian, your right... theres nothing to be proud of being from Canada, but I'm proud of being from Quebec.

And I ain't saying I'm in anyway superior to Americans (that are generaly unilingual, your and exception), I am just saying that your constituion should not promote the right to any americans to own a gun.

read my post above

at the time it was necessary to include for the safety of the country

now, it is less important, but if you remove the right to bear arms from the constitution, then would all guns be banned?

people still use guns for hunting,sport,and defense.

its a tricky balance.

i think it should be harder to obtain a gun and maybe some way for cops to be allowed to see if a gun is legally registered or not so illegal guns (which are most likely to be involved in something) can be removed

hay guise what's going on in here?

something about guns?
I love guns!

At 4/18/07 02:31 AM, HeavenDuff wrote: I am just saying that your constituion should not promote the right to any americans to own a gun.

I personally disagree with you there, and I'll tell you why. Also, I'm pretty sure this argument has been made to you before, but whatever.

Gun controll does not keep guns out of the hands of criminals. They will get them anyways, and here is an example. I'm currently living in Japan, where guns are outlawed. But, low and behold, last night the mayor of Nagasaki was shot to death by a member of the Yakuza crime syndicate. By your logic, this would be impossible, but it happened last night.

My point is that having legislation that bans guns only keeps them out of the hands of law abiding citizens. I'll admit that it makes it harder for criminals to get their hands on them, but as history has shown, they get them anyways. I mean, they are criminals, so they don't give a shit about the laws.

There are plenty of legitimate reasons for a law abiding citizen to own a gun. An outright ban on them would just be a silly, emotionally charged, knee jerk reaction. If the US government ever tried to do this, there would probably be a revolt.

At 4/18/07 02:38 AM, Krinkels wrote: hey guys, what's going on in here?

FIXED

People are discussing gun laws following a shooting in Virginia Tech University, where 33 (shooter included) died.

At 4/18/07 02:39 AM, Kolohe wrote:
Gun controll does not keep guns out of the hands of criminals.

if those criminals try too hard to get a gun theyre most likely using those guns on other criminals

considering every murder in vancouver is gang related it all makes cents

At 4/18/07 02:39 AM, Kolohe wrote:

At 4/18/07 02:31 AM, HeavenDuff wrote: I am just saying that your constituion should not promote the right to any americans to own a gun.

I personally disagree with you there, and I'll tell you why. Also, I'm pretty sure this argument has been made to you before, but whatever.

Gun controll does not keep guns out of the hands of criminals. They will get them anyways, and here is an example. I'm currently living in Japan, where guns are outlawed. But, low and behold, last night the mayor of Nagasaki was shot to death by a member of the Yakuza crime syndicate. By your logic, this would be impossible, but it happened last night.

My point is that having legislation that bans guns only keeps them out of the hands of law abiding citizens. I'll admit that it makes it harder for criminals to get their hands on them, but as history has shown, they get them anyways. I mean, they are criminals, so they don't give a shit about the laws.

There are plenty of legitimate reasons for a law abiding citizen to own a gun. An outright ban on them would just be a silly, emotionally charged, knee jerk reaction. If the US government ever tried to do this, there would probably be a revolt.

Yeah I know.

I understand your point. I'll rewrite my statement correctly:
I am just saying that your constituion should not promote the right to all americans to own a gun.

Your right, but I ain't talking about a Yakuza here, I'm talking about the average citizen of a country. That korean kid was probably not in the Mafia or in the Yakuza, he was just a regular guy, just like you and me. And thats the kind of guy who shouldnt be able to get a gun that easily.

At 4/18/07 02:48 AM, HeavenDuff wrote:

just say american citizens are more likely to be "random murder" victims

At 4/18/07 02:48 AM, HeavenDuff wrote: Yeah I know.

I understand your point. I'll rewrite my statement correctly:
I am just saying that your constituion should not promote the right to all americans to own a gun.

I see your point, and it's not without merit, but there are literally hundreds of state and federal laws that limit who can own and purchase a gun. There are also many restrictions on what type of weapons, magazines and ammunition can be purchased and owned. Not to mention background checks to ensure that people with certain criminal records are barred from purchasing guns. Also, we have waiting periods, so you can't get a handgun while you are still freshly pissed off at somebody. I could go on, but we have structured our laws in such a way that I believe that they are reasonable and responsible. So yeah, the constitution says it's our right to own them, but the government has strict guidelines on who can purchase what and how. I don't see anything wrong with that.

Your right, but I ain't talking about a Yakuza here, I'm talking about the average citizen of a country. That korean kid was probably not in the Mafia or in the Yakuza, he was just a regular guy, just like you and me. And thats the kind of guy who shouldnt be able to get a gun that easily.

Just re-read what you just wrote there, please. My interpretation of that is that we should make it hard or impossible for people who are not involved in organized crime or gangs to get handguns. Am I wrong? I don't really need to respond to that, I'll just say see earlier post.

I hope you don't think that I am blatantly trying to argue with you to be an ass (like some people around here), because I'm not. I'm on board with the idea of trying to curb school shootings, and really, any violent crime for that matter. My opinion on how you propose that we go about doing this is that it simply would not work, especially in the US. Much like communism, it looks good on paper, it sounds good when you talk about it, but when you put it into action in real life, the human element fucks it all up. I mean, we live in the real world and things are not ideal. We will never have a perfect utopia, and even if that did happen, it would eventually be fucked up by a bunch of retards. That's life.

I hope that maybe you can understand my point a little. But, if not, I agree to disagree. I just see any point in posting the same thing back and forth.

At 4/18/07 02:31 AM, HeavenDuff wrote: Ok dude, you gotta understand something.

I dont disrespect the USA, but if you do insult another country for being what they are, I'll do just the same with yours.

Dude, I didn't insult another country. I criticized a particular Canadian viewpoint embodied by you that is hypocritical, and irrationally biased.

I also know that, laws about weapons in Canada are different than in your country, and I also know that our country still have to impove those laws so things like that wont happen again.

Canada's laws are not THAT much different. And the VT shootings would still have happened if our laws were different. The Columbine massacre would have happened as well because the guns used were just semi-automatic weapons that fire pistol cartridges, and in the case of Columbine, just simple shotguns (which many Canadians own).

There is 350000 individuals in the USA and we are 30000 in Quebec. So according to this, if you guys have 30000 persons dying due to guns each year, we should have 3000.

What... there are 301 MILLION people in the US, you said 350 thousand.

See... yeah you need to do some research. You're just proving your conclusion is false because everything you base it on is wrong.

And thats not the case. And don't blame the illegal immigrants, you can be a legal immigrant and do just the same... just like that Korean guy did. And we do have a fucking lot of immigrants in Canada, especially in Quebec.

You have alot of LEGAL immigrants from around the world. But the US does as well. However, the US has anywhere from 20-30 million ILLEGAL immigrants that contribute largely to our crime.

If those estimates are correct, we have just under, or possibly a higher amount of illegal immigrants than the entire population of Canada. We also border Mexico, which is a gigantic arms/ammo dump and is the staging point through which guns, drugs, and illegal immigrants are smuggled into our country.

Canada doesn't have this problem. And not to be racist, but Canada doesn't have as many minorities either. In the US, 1/3rd or 33% of our population is comprised of minorities . Only 13% of Canada's population is comprised of minorities

Now don't call me a racist, because I am a minority in the US. But minorities in the US commit a disproportionately large amount of crime. So since Canada has a lower proportion of both illegal immigrants and minorities, and since it doesn't border large smuggling exporters like Mexico, then it doesn't have the same problems and therefore doesn't have the same rate of crime, including gun crime.

I can bet that if Canada had the same situation that the US does, it would have a similar crime and murder rate.

And I ain't saying I'm in anyway superior to Americans (that are generaly unilingual, your and exception), I am just saying that your constituion should not promote the right to any americans to own a gun.

Thats completely stupid. You're saying that no Americans should own guns? Even though the VAST MAJORITY of gun owners in the US are law-abiding and never and will never commit a violent crime of any kind?

See, that is completely ridiculous. It's obvious you're more bent on making a political point to criticize America than you are actually trying to come to a reasonable conclusion. Meanwhile, you say Americans shouldn't have the right to have guns, yet Canadians are allowed to own guns, and Canada has had many school shootings as well.

You also fail to acknowledge the fact that gun control DOES NOT and HAS NOT worked. And if the US had tighter gun control, the VT massacre still could have happened because criminals would still possess and traffic weapons in the US, while ignoring any law. What you are proposing would only make peaceful, law-abiding Americans disarmed, while the only people that WOULD have guns in the US are the criminals, and gun crime wouldn't be affected AT ALL. Gun control doesn't work, the Clinton Assault Weapons ban from 1994-2004 didn't stop crime at all and crime actually went up. Now, this isn't only true for the US either.

The UK banned handguns in 1997 as a result of the Dunblane Massacre in which a Scottish man killed 18 children at a school with a handgun he bought legally.

After the UK passed this irrational law, their handgun violence WENT UP exponentially exponentially.

Handgun crime in the UK
continued to go up by a LARGE margin . In fact, the UK had more TWICE as many gun crimes in 2003 6 years into the ban, than they did in 1997 before the hand gun ban was passed!

So gun control doesn't work. In fact, it actually makes it worse, as was proven during the Clinton AWB ban in the US, and is being proven by the raising gun violence in the UK, even after they banned guns.

So like I said, why don't you educate yourself before you make an uneducated, emotionally-charged attack on the US and our constitution!!!

Because if you were REALLY concerned about gun crime, then based on the statistics you should be PRO-GUN!

Oh man, I'm blatantly breaking a few of my personal rules of conduct here, but sometimes sometimes you read something that is just so...so...yeah.

At 4/18/07 03:21 AM, cellardoor6 wrote: Now don't call me a racist, because I am a minority in the US.

That's fucking ingenious, if I understand it correctly. It's a Swiss fucking watch.

At 4/18/07 03:31 AM, Kolohe wrote: Oh man, I'm blatantly breaking a few of my personal rules of conduct here, but sometimes sometimes you read something that is just so...so...yeah.

At 4/18/07 03:21 AM, cellardoor6 wrote: Now don't call me a racist, because I am a minority in the US.

That's fucking ingenious, if I understand it correctly. It's a Swiss fucking watch.

Oh shush. I made a point that - although entirely true - someone would almost certainly accuse me of being racist for. Therefore I made it known that am I minority myself and therefore my view was based on facts rather than my supposed racial prejudices.

But if you think that's ingenious, then you should commend yourself. Because what better way to give false credit to your anti-war political views than by lying and saying you served in the military right?

Anyone can be racist, even minorities.

Most people are racist, if not just a little bit.

Sorry for going off topic here, but this guy is a fucking douche bag, and it pisses me off that he constantly calls me a liar for talking about my military record. It's really fucking insulting, especially coming from somebody who supposedly supports our troops.

At 4/18/07 03:36 AM, cellardoor6 wrote: Oh shush. I made a point that - although entirely true - someone would almost certainly accuse me of being racist for. Therefore I made it known that am I minority myself and therefore my view was based on facts rather than my supposed racial prejudices.

Damage control, I love it.

But if you think that's ingenious, then you should commend yourself. Because what better way to give false credit to your anti-war political views than by lying and saying you served in the military right?

The only reason I am replying to your post is because you called me a lying sack of shit in response my comment about my military service, and you are trying to be an asshole by referencing that fact that you did that. You are a fucking arrogant asshole who tries to discredit anyone who points out flaws in your logic by calling them liars or idiots. So please, consider this the last time I ever reply to any of your posts. But, before I end this post, allow me to retort.

Assuming that you are not lying in your profile, I joined the military when you were 12 years old. I served six years on active duty and two in the reserves. I got out as an E-6 (petty officer first class) and was warfare qualified in submarines and graduated from Navy dive school. I have two WESTPAC deployments under my belt, one for reconnaissance, one for Iraqi Freedom. Along with that, I have been on countless operations in support of various COMSUBPAC missions.

Here is some good reading material that I obviously planted so that I could one day hope to validate an argument with you:
My post to wwwyyzerd when he went to bootcamp
For reference purposes, he is a picture of me 3 years before I made that post to wwwyyzz,and another
Another 3 year old post that talks about my military service
another picture of me in uniform
and yet another picture of me in uniform

Anyways, you get the point.

Now, SHUT THE FUCK UP you ungrateful piece of shit!

sorry for yelling guys

At 4/18/07 04:14 AM, Kolohe wrote:

At 4/18/07 03:36 AM, cellardoor6 wrote: Oh shush. I made a point that - although entirely true - someone would almost certainly accuse me of being racist for. Therefore I made it known that am I minority myself and therefore my view was based on facts rather than my supposed racial prejudices.

Damage control, I love it.

Ahem...

Take a look. Those are facts, not racism.

Now, SHUT THE FUCK UP you ungrateful piece of shit!

Wow...

Learn to control your anger. See, if you would have tried to repudiate me without turning into a psycho, I would have apologized for questioning your integrity. But now I have no desire to and I'm just scared that people with anger control problems are in the Navy, and not in the Marines. Paradox.

Thanks for your service. But thats the only area that I believe you deserve respect now after your tirade.

Now before you respond with paragraphs of curse words, try to keep it short and civil to some degree if you aren't referring to anything related to the thread. Gun control was the issue, not "swear at cellardoor6 with bold letters".

At 4/18/07 01:28 AM, HAcoreRD wrote: aw shit, they say he was a "loner"

Damn those Loners. kill them before they kill you

There should be a law against loners. People must have at least one friend else they get fined or something.

At 4/16/07 12:48 PM, Sentio wrote:

At 4/16/07 12:43 PM, cellardoor6 wrote:

I wonder what the story with the shooter will be this time. Is it another poor, picked on outcast who listens to too much KMFDM or Marilyn Manson, or is it some delusional twat with an apocalyptic view of the world who thinks hes acting out his destiny? Either way I hope the shoot the motherfucker right now before he does any more harm.

Actually he did it because of his girlfriend left him (or something similar) he shot her first, then killed alot of inicent people, and after all that he shot himself. So its a pretty sad story overall.

GTA series should add in school shootin action

Hello! My name is Cho Seung Hui
and I did it for the lulz