The base building block

[poxpower]

Well ok, let's get philosophical here.

As time goes by, we decompose the atom into smaller and smaller parts, but what if there is actually a kind of starting block that creates everything.
And I mean everything. Time, space, matter, joy, hapiness -- everything.

Like a giant beach made of sand, it shifts constantly to create shapes, places, people, feelings...

I'm gay, but I need to talk about things right now.. sorry.

[reviewer-general]

At 2/10/07 03:37 PM, poxpower wrote: Well ok, let's get philosophical here.

As time goes by, we decompose the atom into smaller and smaller parts, but what if there is actually a kind of starting block that creates everything.
And I mean everything. Time, space, matter, joy, hapiness -- everything.

Like a giant beach made of sand, it shifts constantly to create shapes, places, people, feelings...

I'm gay, but I need to talk about things right now.. sorry.

I suppose that would be spirit or soul or something of that sort. Possibly even just the force of good in the world.

Wow, a semi-spiritual moment, get some fireworks and a video camera QUICK!

[Peter-II]

Arguably fundamental particles are all pretty much the same thing, but are characterised by different spins. Fermions, for instance, have a half-integer spin and bosons have an integer spin. It depends whether or not you consider particles to be different if their spins differ. However, fundamental particles, to the best of my understanding, don't form time - so I dunno.

[Kidiri]

When this happens, science will have unraveled the very fabric of our existence, every single part of our being. When this happens, our existence will have no more meaning, everything we know will just be the shifting of those particles. In the eyes of the scientists people won't have anything that makes them human left, all of those abstract terms -like love, soul, sorrow, hate and even time- will just be the shifting of particles.

It will be more 'depressing' -What's a depression more than the shifting of some subatomic particle?- than the Wall Street Crash of 1929. When the people commonly accept this theory -and that will probably take a long, long time, they won't have any belief anymore. It would mean the collapse of all religions. All of them would most likely declare war onto scientists.

[Gunter45]

That is very philosphical and pretty much all I can say is that it isn't time. I've thought about time a lot and, seeing as how it's not even a universal constant, it's not possible that it's really a fundament of anything. Since time can be manipulated relatively easily (even normal velocities affect it slightly), it seems like it would be possible for something to exist even outside of time.

I digress. Based on just about nothing but supposition, I'd think that the fundamental building block is energy. The close relationship that matter and energy have seems like it might bind them on a universally basic level. Not to mention the fact that there must be incredible amounts of kinetic energy at the core of matter and, if Einstein really is right, then it's possible that the core of matter is just mass that has become energy. It also seems possible, since when we start breaking apart things like quarks and leptons, we get gluons which are kind of like attractive forces. I'm not too sure exactly what gluons are but I think they might still be classified as matter even though they seem very much like energy at the same time.

But hell, I don't know.

[Draconias]

At 2/10/07 07:44 PM, Gunter45 wrote: That is very philosphical and pretty much all I can say is that it isn't time. I've thought about time a lot and, seeing as how it's not even a universal constant, it's not possible that it's really a fundament of anything. Since time can be manipulated relatively easily (even normal velocities affect it slightly), it seems like it would be possible for something to exist even outside of time.

The most reasonable proposition about the basic nature of time that I've heard so far suggested that time is actually created through an interaction between the matter of the universe-- it's a collective property created by the basic attributes of matter. Yeah, it's a bit odd.

[StCyril]

At 2/10/07 03:37 PM, poxpower wrote: Well ok, let's get philosophical here.

As time goes by, we decompose the atom into smaller and smaller parts, but what if there is actually a kind of starting block that creates everything.
And I mean everything. Time, space, matter, joy, hapiness -- everything.

Dude, just go with the Gaia theory, you'll sleep a lot better.

[Alphabit]

There is string theory that leans towards the idea that we are made out of static sound waves. It'll be interesting to see how this turns out.

[SteveGuzzi]

At 2/11/07 07:11 AM, LolOutLoud wrote: There is string theory that leans towards the idea that we are made out of static sound waves. It'll be interesting to see how this turns out.

Doesn't string theory say we have 10 (or 11) dimensions?

Interesting.

The Kabbalah says there are 10 (or 11) emanations of God in each world.

They also place huge importance on sound and number.

Hmm.

Harmonics.
Cymatics.
Aum.

Life is one big "lol".

[goozebump]

At 2/10/07 06:06 PM, Peter-II wrote:

:However, fundamental particles, to the best of my understanding, don't form time - so I dunno.

Time is a product of motion so when they spin its sort of creating time

[Gunter45]

At 2/12/07 01:10 PM, goozebump wrote:

At 2/10/07 06:06 PM, Peter-II wrote: However, fundamental particles, to the best of my understanding, don't form time - so I dunno.

Time is a product of motion so when they spin its sort of creating time

Exactly. And all matter is moving. Since absolute 0 is theoretically impossible, there isn't a particle around that isn't subject to the theory of relativity.

However, in this perspective. Time is a result rather than a building block. Time is simply another natural force that is perpetuated by physics. If this is the case, it's fascinating that time is something that is about on the level of gravity. It's definately far more powerful, but it's not something insurmountable.

[Peter-II]

At 2/12/07 01:14 PM, Gunter45 wrote: However, in this perspective. Time is a result rather than a building block. Time is simply another natural force that is perpetuated by physics.

Which leads to the next question: is time simply an invention made by humans to give a name to the various motions and events that we see, or is time something completely seperate which works as an arena which allows these events to occur?

Man, I'm going to have to think about this some more.

[Gunter45]

At 2/12/07 02:35 PM, Peter-II wrote: Which leads to the next question: is time simply an invention made by humans to give a name to the various motions and events that we see, or is time something completely seperate which works as an arena which allows these events to occur?

Man, I'm going to have to think about this some more.

Well, time is very real. It has a visible effect, just like, to use the same analogy, gravity. We can't see it, but, just like any force, we can measure it based on the effect it has on matter. Additionally, just like any force, it's effect varies based on certain criterion. Here's where it muddies the waters. Our entire perception of physics is based on dividing stuff by time. If we eliminate time, we basically have no perception of the world. Newtonian force is fucked, distance is fucked, velocity is fucked, all measurement becomes invalid. Seeing as how I've never put much stock in the infallibility of human calculation and reason, I'd imagine that it's entirely possible that things can exist nontemporally, but they would follow a completely different set of physics than we have knowledge of. Not to mention the fact that since we are completely and utterly bound by time in so many ways, the thought of something not following that set of rules is completely incomprehensible to us.

[Sir-S-Of-TURBO]

It's called the wraithbone.

^_^