Newgrounds.com — Everything, By Everyone.

At 10/15/06 12:56 AM, troubles1 wrote:

plus most of us AMERICANS feel it is our GOD given right to bear arms. and the fact that Hunting is a very popular sport here. So WE WILL BE KEEPING OUR GUN BOYS.

That’s what pisses me off with people today. hunting for sport. If you aren’t starving don’t hunt. And besides you aren’t getting anything for it except a dead body. If you want to feel like a man try wrestling it bare handed.

At 10/14/06 11:31 AM, neoptolemus wrote: What your schools should have is not teachers armed but security guards.

The following was in the "readers comments" section of this week's "Up Yours!" newsletter, regarding this....

What an insane idea..... teachers carrying guns to protect
themselves and other students. The liberal Teachers' Union,
and the Politically Correct powers that be, will NEVER let
something like this happen. Something as drastic as this
will affect the self esteem of teens and hurt their
feelings!!! I think instead of wasting education funds on
stupid things like teaching kids English and History, they
should spend the money and effort on courses like "Target
Shooting and Gun Safety For Social Misfits." Now I need a
drink. --Dave

At 10/15/06 12:21 PM, the-man-who-knew wrote: If you aren’t starving don’t hunt. And besides you aren’t getting anything for it except a dead body.

*cough*

At 10/15/06 12:21 PM, the-man-who-knew wrote:

At 10/15/06 12:56 AM, troubles1 wrote:

plus most of us AMERICANS feel it is our GOD given right to bear arms. and the fact that Hunting is a very popular sport here. So WE WILL BE KEEPING OUR GUN BOYS.

That’s what pisses me off with people today. hunting for sport. If you aren’t starving don’t hunt. And besides you aren’t getting anything for it except a dead body. If you want to feel like a man try wrestling it bare handed.

What? did I tell you that you must hunt? lots of us grew up hunting ,and we do eat the meat, and sometimes make a trophy out of it and just recently I had a rabbit hat and mittens made 4 my daughter, witch she loves and it is sooo soft. if you don't like it don't do it, but if you have never went hunting you can't judge people who do.

At 10/15/06 09:12 AM, Viper-010 wrote: I think that some of you americans take things like this a bit to far.

Yeah, that is a trait of America. But the act of us going a bit too far is what created our country. Colonists got pissed off when they were getting taxed so they threw tea into the ocean and that started the chain of events that led to America being the first indepedently formed true Republic in history. This overreaction caused a chain of events that eventually led to Europe being saved by Americans who "took things a bit too far".

For instance i'll start with your bill of rights, yeah fair enough it was made by your forefathers and has been well know in american history for some time now, but things change, time and advancements force thigns to change, nothing last forever and this includes the bill of rights.

Times do change, but not in this regard. The founding principle of the 2nd amendment is that American civilians are more powerful than their government. You can't have a dictatorship when your citizenry is freedom-loving and armed to the teeth!

The Soviet Bolsheviks and the Nazis quickly banned or heavily restricted ownership of firearms among their citizens, they did this cunningly to disarm their people. This is true in many other civilizations throughout history. When a dictator or opressive regime takes hold, they usually disarm their people first and foremost.

In England it is illegal for a civilian to posess a firearm without a licence and reason for the licence to posess that specific firearm. On a percentage basis there are alot less armed assaults/robberys in England than in America.

England also doesn't have 20 million illegal immigrants. England also doesn't have 20 million blacks. This may sound racist to you, but it is a fact that Illegal immigrants and African Americans cause the majority of crime in the US even though they make up only a fraction of the population. So don't accuse me of racism its just a statistical fact. (I am not racist, I am just not sensitive or adherant to political correctness which disallows people from telling the truth)

If England had a similar composition of minorities, was bordering a country like mexico, and was so large and populated like the US, they'd have just as much crime.

I strongly believe that there is no need for an American citizen to feel the need that they must carry a firearm with them, you say "land of the free", how can you label america as the land of the free if the majority of citizens feel the constant threat of danger to a high enough degree that they feel that they must carry a firearm.

America IS the land of the free! Partly because Americans aren't prevented from owning weapons by their government. America was founded on the idea of individual responsibility. The American citizen is equal to the politician or the government official. If you obey the law in the US, then you are entitled to be on equal ground within reason with all other Americans, even authority figures. When an American breaks the law or proves that they aren't worthy of having these full rights, then they are barred from possessing firearms, and are prevented from enjoying other rights that responsible Americans are granted. But if an American obeys the law, then he is granted the freedom to self-defend with deadly force with a firearm.

The debate should not be whether or not the American government should make the posession of firearms illegal, in my mind this should deffinately happen, but the question that should instead be being asked is what is the American government doing to stop the illegal smuggling of firearms into the country and what it is doing to protect it's own citizens.

You're not judging the situation objectively. The US is large and heavily populated, it is impossible for a government to completely protect all Americans and to completely prevent smuggling of weapons into the US. The US is bordering a corrupt and essentially lawless nation and has a gigantic open border with that country. There are also many Americans who live far from police stations and far from a source of outside help, these Americans NEED firearms to assure their safety and the safety of their families and to protect their property.

The whole point behind a government it that it can make decisions and actions that will both help it's nation aswell as protect its citizens, the American government needs to sort itself out and sort its country out, actions like this will not solve problems but just start revolt.

The government cannot be in all places at at once within its borders. The US government is not omnipotent. Americans are given greater rights to accompany the greater degree of individual responsibility they have. Americans own guns because the US government is INTENTIONALLY a small government with limited power and limited capability to influence or dictate the daily lives of its citizens. This is how it was intended to be and how it SHOULD as long as our country exists.

The government should protect our country as a whole, but they simply cannot protect every man, woman and child in every part of our country. That is where legal civilian gun ownership comes in! American citizens that obey the law are trusted to use their firearms responsibly and 99% of them DO! I am one of them!

If the American government continues to act the way it has done during the recent years it will not just undermine the bill of rights and it's own laws as a shortcut to a dire problem but will bring the entire nation into anarchy.

I have no problem with the way the Government is acting. I don't feel my rights are being trampled upon, I don't think that the government is acting against my will. The only people who feel like anarchy are the ones who dislike our country to begin with IMO.

At 10/16/06 12:33 AM, troubles1 wrote:

At 10/15/06 12:21 PM, the-man-who-knew wrote:

At 10/15/06 12:56 AM, troubles1 wrote:

plus most of us AMERICANS feel it is our GOD given right to bear arms. and the fact that Hunting is a very popular sport here. So WE WILL BE KEEPING OUR GUN BOYS.

That’s what pisses me off with people today. hunting for sport. If you aren’t starving don’t hunt. And besides you aren’t getting anything for it except a dead body. If you want to feel like a man try wrestling it bare handed.

What? did I tell you that you must hunt? lots of us grew up hunting ,and we do eat the meat, and sometimes make a trophy out of it and just recently I had a rabbit hat and mittens made 4 my daughter, witch she loves and it is sooo soft. if you don't like it don't do it, but if you have never went hunting you can't judge people who do.

How about I hunt you.

And I have been hunting and when that animal falls to the floor try imaging it was a family member. I sware it'le put persective on what your doing. And besides what the fuck do you need to hunt for anyway. Your country is full of supermarkets. My pall went to the US in the summer and couldnt believe the size of them.

At 10/16/06 07:03 AM, the-man-who-knew wrote:

How about I hunt you.

And I have been hunting and when that animal falls to the floor try imaging it was a family member. I sware it'le put persective on what your doing. And besides what the fuck do you need to hunt for anyway. Your country is full of supermarkets. My pall went to the US in the summer and couldnt believe the size of them.

People hunt for food because it is a very primal, natural thing to do. Providing for yourself and eating what you killed yourself is a very satisfying feeling. Its the "fruits of your own labor" type thing .

I'm sure you eat meat! The cow is going to die anyway so why would it cause more harm if you killed it yourself? Do you not realize that animals are killed everday for food, what harm does it cause when people do it their self?

You know that the money that hunters pay every year to hunt goes to the preservation of the animals they hunt? Hunters are the largest contributors to wildlife preservation in our country. The amount of deer, bear, and other animals that are hunted and killed each year is miniscule to the amount that are repopulating our land due to conservation efforts by hunters!

Besides, if a deer isn't shot, then the way it will eventually die is usually from wolves or bears that get them when the deer gets old or sick and can't run away. Personally, I'd rather get shot in my heart/lungs and bleed to death in 30 seconds than the alternative of getting clawed to shreds and finally have my throat ripped out by a hungry predator. Wouldn't you?

At 10/16/06 07:22 AM, cellardoor6 wrote:

At 10/16/06 07:03 AM, the-man-who-knew wrote:

How about I hunt you.

And I have been hunting and when that animal falls to the floor try imaging it was a family member. I sware it'le put persective on what your doing. And besides what the fuck do you need to hunt for anyway. Your country is full of supermarkets. My pall went to the US in the summer and couldnt believe the size of them.

Fruits? Satisfying? Your hunting with a gun, how satisfying can it be that you have a huge advantage over an animal. And its attitude like this that causes hundreds of species going extinct.

Shit I deleted too much quote

At 10/16/06 07:22 AM, cellardoor6 wrote:

Besides, if a deer isn't shot, then the way it will eventually die is usually from wolves or bears that get them when the deer gets old or sick and can't run away. Personally, I'd rather get shot in my heart/lungs and bleed to death in 30 seconds than the alternative of getting clawed to shreds and finally have my throat ripped out by a hungry predator. Wouldn't you?

Theres nothing wrong with hunting, and no way should americans have that taken away, But You don't need to go hunting deer with an AK47 or a Tactical sniper rifle or anyother army based gun. It's stupid

At 10/15/06 09:12 AM, Viper-010 wrote: I think that some of you americans take things like this a bit to far.
For instance i'll start with your bill of rights, yeah fair enough it was made by your forefathers and has been well know in american history for some time now, but things change, time and advancements force thigns to change, nothing last forever and this includes the bill of rights.

If you look at the history and the reason behind the Bill of Rights, the second amendment was there to ensure that Americans will always have a military power that counters that by the government as well as provide a citizen army reserve so we did not have to rely on a standing army with all of its Imperial/aristocratic aires...(But that went out the window when we inherited the world that European colonial imperialists left following WWI and WWII...) Thus while technology changes, that does not mean that the basic reasoning has gone away.

In England it is illegal for a civilian to posess a firearm without a licence and reason for the licence to posess that specific firearm. On a percentage basis there are alot less armed assaults/robberys in England than in America.

The problem with this is one of legal rationality. Many of the pro-gun control crowd over here pushes legislation that is rational. They push legislation on an emotional basis. The assault rifle ban for instance looks good on paper and the argument goes that they are only designed for killing. This is wrong on so many levels:

Rifles in general are only used in 1% of firearms crimes (not all of which are violent). Assault rifles like the AK-47 are only used in 0.8% of firearms crimes (again, not all of which are violent).

Secondly it is not the design of the gun that has the most impact on lethality it is the design of the bullet. Full metal jacket and armor piercing rounds have a linear trajetory in the body. They are too fast to bounce around inside the body tearing up internal organs. Hunting ammo, which the anti-gunners would protect, however is designed to kill game by mushrooming and causing massive trauma to internal organs. This is to provide a quick death for humane killing and not having to track blood through the woods.

So my point is the anti-gunners do not pursue legislation that makes sense or is rational when one looks at the subjetive, technical reality of the situation.

I strongly believe that there is no need for an American citizen to feel the need that they must carry a firearm with them, you say "land of the free", how can you label america as the land of the free if the majority of citizens feel the constant threat of danger to a high enough degree that they feel that they must carry a firearm.

I agree that there is a definite problem here. People here get carried away with fear mongering on the Left and the Right. This presents a distorted picture of this country to ourselves and the world. While I have had to pull a gun in self defense, I do not feel constant fear walking the streets and it is irrational that anyone else should.

The debate should not be whether or not the American government should make the posession of firearms illegal, in my mind this should deffinately happen, ...

Watch V for Vendetta and Schindler's List for why you are wrong...

The whole point behind a government it that it can make decisions and actions that will both help it's nation aswell as protect its citizens, ...

There are limits to this and there are places in a country with the US' size and population dispersion that the government cannot provide protection to its citizens. Furthermore, as I talked about rationality in legislation above, the government must make rational laws in order to be legitimate or in a practical sense be able to provide the services you suggest.

If the American government continues to act the way it has done during the recent years it will not just undermine the bill of rights and it's own laws as a shortcut to a dire problem but will bring the entire nation into anarchy.

Again, that is the point. The second amendment is part of the highest law of the land, congress and the government cannot interprut it on emotional or irrational basis. If you do away with it because it is fashionable or out of fear; the law becomes lawless.

But as i say, this is merely my opinion,
Viper

AAK

At 10/16/06 11:12 AM, zzzzd wrote:

At 10/16/06 07:22 AM, cellardoor6 wrote:

But You don't need to go hunting deer with an AK47 or a Tactical sniper rifle or anyother army based gun. It's stupid

Going last to first:

1) The USMC tactical sniper rifle is a modified hunting rifle that is marketed in civilian gun stores across the country. The modifications include new triggers that makes the rifle more responsive to the shooter and a barrel that increases accuracy. Both of which make the rifle more likely to hit the target and not more lethal. This is a function of the bullet and not the modifications made by the Marine Corps. The military modifications are prized by some hunters in that it increases accuracy, and anything that increases hitting what you mean to shoot makes hunting MORE safe.

As for large calibre sniper rifles (ie: .50 cal), these would be useful in hunting big game (a pastime for the wealthy).

2) Many State hunting laws limit using an AK-47 only in regards to magazine capacity; you can only carry five round hunting magazines. Furthermore, full auto is prohibited by law and feasibility. What makes these guns suitable/unsuitable is the type of bullet it is shooting. There are bullets made for the AK that are designed for hunting (military rounds lack the lethality that hunting rounds do). These bullets do not have the range that traditional hunting rounds do and are lesse powerful than traditional hunting rifles that are of a higher power. Thus in some settings the AK-47 or M-16 can actually be more desirable in a hunting setting...

In conclusion it is not stupid to go hunting with the rifles you described. What you present (briefly) is an emotional argument that is not based in an understanding of what these guns are and what there capabilities are relative to "hunting rifles". So while your argument sounds good...it betrays a larger ignorance of the subject.

(NOTE: Ignorance means a lack of knowledge; contrasted with stupidity which means a lack of capacity for knowledge. Being ignorant is not an insult in that we are all ignorant to some degreee...)

AAK

At 10/16/06 07:03 AM, the-man-who-knew wrote:

At 10/16/06 12:33 AM, troubles1 wrote:

At 10/15/06 12:21 PM, the-man-who-knew wrote:

:: And besides what the fuck do you need to hunt for anyway. Your country is full of supermarkets. My pall went to the US in the summer and couldnt believe the size of them.

1) Supermarkets do not provide game animals such as deer, squirell or rabbit in most places in the US. So there is an availability aspect.

2) Hunting is a useful skill that must be maintained. Thus people need practice for times when supermarkets are not available. I'm not talking survivalist/wack-o end of the world people here, but events that are likely to happen. The people who depend on supermarkets and did not posses the skill went hungry when Hurricane Kathrina blew through (and other natural disasters that can knock out power and supermarkets). The people who knew how to hunt in the rural areas fed themselves. Money was useless; guns were not.

3) I have known people in this country who rely upon growing and hunting their own food. So while you said you support hunting in this case, I just wanted you to know there are people in the land of the big supermarket that must hunt to live...

4) Besides, how is farm raised animals any better? There is still slaughter and killing involved. Besides I'm sure only the first cow in line is the only one who doesn't know what's coming...

AAK

At 10/16/06 07:30 AM, the-man-who-knew wrote:

At 10/16/06 07:22 AM, cellardoor6 wrote:

At 10/16/06 07:03 AM, the-man-who-knew wrote:

Fruits? Satisfying? Your hunting with a gun, how satisfying can it be that you have a huge advantage over an animal. And its attitude like this that causes hundreds of species going extinct.

Hunting is not the leading cause of extinction, definitely not in the US. Hunting is a very regulated activity. There are seasons and limits. In fact it also serves as population control in some areas that actually improves the health of the game animal's population as a whole. This has been proven time and time again. There are places where predators have moved out (for reasons other than hunting) and so deer populations explode leading to starvation and disease (more animals; more chance of communicable disease). Other places people feed the deer thinking they are nice, wonderful people; only to see a population explosion and the deer hurt as a result.

Managed hunting helps keep a thriving population of game animals. You my friend, are just displaying your ignorance time and again on this subject.

At 10/16/06 11:12 AM, zzzzd wrote:

At 10/16/06 07:22 AM, cellardoor6 wrote:

Besides, if a deer isn't shot, then the way it will eventually die is usually from wolves or bears that get them when the deer gets old or sick and can't run away. Personally, I'd rather get shot in my heart/lungs and bleed to death in 30 seconds than the alternative of getting clawed to shreds and finally have my throat ripped out by a hungry predator. Wouldn't you?

Theres nothing wrong with hunting, and no way should americans have that taken away, But You don't need to go hunting deer with an AK47 or a Tactical sniper rifle or anyother army based gun. It's stupid

Actually the AK-47 is used by alot of people (me included) as a defensive rifle when hunting that can also be used as the main hunting rifle. Where I hunt there are cougar and black bear attacks almost every year. The reason I bought my AK-47 is because with proper bullets it can reliably kill medium-to large game yet is semi-auto with minimal recoil which allows follow-up shots alot easier for defense against predators than a bolt-action hunting rifle. It is also much more light-weight for carrying long distances through the woods/mountains.

An AK-47 is probably one of the least used weapons in crimes in the US, there is no reason for it to be banned.

I actually plan on using mine for whitetail deer hunting this weekend. I have a 5-round clip to meet regulations for hunting, and a 30-round clip for killing hordes communist invaders, zombies, crab-people, or just paper targets and soda-cans and jars and other random objects (he he).

I had this Romanian WASR-10 AK-47 custom made to my specifications with synthetic stocks and deep woods camoflauge:

At 10/16/06 09:33 PM, cellardoor6 wrote:

I actually plan on using mine for whitetail deer hunting this weekend. I have a 5-round clip to meet regulations for hunting, and a 30-round clip for killing hordes communist invaders, zombies, crab-people, or just paper targets and soda-cans and jars and other random objects (he he).

I had this Romanian WASR-10 AK-47 custom made to my specifications with synthetic stocks and deep woods camoflauge:

Theres somthing about you gun obsessed weirdos which make me fucking cringe. sort your fuckin life out.

We all know men which love guns have lil willys

Gun-control is bullshit, and it'll never happen with the consent of Americans. An interesting factoid is that everytime the government starts talking about it, sales in weapons and ammunition sky-rocket.

Could be that people just want more of something that might be illegal soon, but the federal government sees it as people arming themselves; and that's usually enough to make the shut up about it for a while.

Gun control = dictatorship.

At 10/17/06 02:01 AM, tawb wrote:

At 10/16/06 09:33 PM, cellardoor6 wrote:

I actually plan on using mine for whitetail deer hunting this weekend. I have a 5-round clip to meet regulations for hunting, and a 30-round clip for killing hordes communist invaders, zombies, crab-people, or just paper targets and soda-cans and jars and other random objects (he he).

I had this Romanian WASR-10 AK-47 custom made to my specifications with synthetic stocks and deep woods camoflauge:

Theres somthing about you gun obsessed weirdos which make me fucking cringe. sort your fuckin life out.

There is nothing wrong with having a hobby that involves guns. People take pictures and discuss their motorcycles, paintball guns, computers, and so forth. Whats the difference?

Stupid people like you have been raised with a sense of stigma surrounding guns. Why isn't there a stigma around cars and motorcycles? They kill more humans every year than guns do. Why hasn't society made cars and motorcycles the taboo?

We all know men which love guns have lil willys

We all know that men that fear guns are either brainwashed, homosexual, or just dumb. Which are you? Or are you a combination of all of them?

Besides, my willy is just fine with me, and the ladies.

At 10/17/06 02:09 AM, cellardoor6 wrote:

At 10/17/06 02:01 AM, tawb wrote:

At 10/16/06 09:33 PM, cellardoor6 wrote:

I actually plan on using mine for whitetail deer hunting this weekend. I have a 5-round clip to meet regulations for hunting, and a 30-round clip for killing hordes communist invaders, zombies, crab-people, or just paper targets and soda-cans and jars and other random objects (he he).

I had this Romanian WASR-10 AK-47 custom made to my specifications with synthetic stocks and deep woods camoflauge:

Theres somthing about you gun obsessed weirdos which make me fucking cringe. sort your fuckin life out.

There is nothing wrong with having a hobby that involves guns. People take pictures and discuss their motorcycles, paintball guns, computers, and so forth. Whats the difference?

I dunno... There not designed to kill other human beings.

Stupid people like you have been raised with a sense of stigma surrounding guns. Why isn't there a stigma around cars and motorcycles? They kill more humans every year than guns do. Why hasn't society made cars and motorcycles the taboo?

My dad used to go shootin alot, So i haven't been raised to be against guns or brainwashed. and people don't mean to kill people in cars, And cars are essential in todays society. Guns are not. Plently of Countrys which don't have guns have much lower crime rates than the US.

We all know men which love guns have lil willys

We all know that men that fear guns are either brainwashed, homosexual, or just dumb. Which are you? Or are you a combination of all of them?

I don't fear guns, unless of course someone came at me with a gun. And people who don't like guns aren't gay or stupid, lol, there just against something which has been ultimitly been designed to kill a human.
Personaly i havn't got anything much against hunting rifles an hunting shotguns. But Pistols, Assault rifles an such, have been designed to kill other humans, therefore they shouldn't be accesable to your average joe.

Besides, my willy is just fine with me, and the ladies.

lol cause it is,

wanker

At 10/17/06 02:18 AM, tawb wrote:

At 10/17/06 02:09 AM, cellardoor6 wrote:

At 10/17/06 02:01 AM, tawb wrote:

At 10/16/06 09:33 PM, cellardoor6 wrote:

I actually plan on using mine for whitetail deer hunting this weekend. I have a 5-round clip to meet regulations for hunting, and a 30-round clip for killing hordes communist invaders, zombies, crab-people, or just paper targets and soda-cans and jars and other random objects (he he).

I had this Romanian WASR-10 AK-47 custom made to my specifications with synthetic stocks and deep woods camoflauge:

Theres somthing about you gun obsessed weirdos which make me fucking cringe. sort your fuckin life out.

There is nothing wrong with having a hobby that involves guns. People take pictures and discuss their motorcycles, paintball guns, computers, and so forth. Whats the difference?

I dunno... There not designed to kill other human beings.

Guns are also designed to hunt, not kill humans. They are also designed to shoot paper and steel targets, but are capable of killing people. Just how cars and motorcycles are meant to transport people, yet they kill the people the transport or act as a big projectile and kill bystanders.

Stupid people like you have been raised with a sense of stigma surrounding guns. Why isn't there a stigma around cars and motorcycles? They kill more humans every year than guns do. Why hasn't society made cars and motorcycles the taboo?

My dad used to go shootin alot, So i haven't been raised to be against guns or brainwashed. and people don't mean to kill people in cars, And cars are essential in todays society. Guns are not. Plently of Countrys which don't have guns have much lower crime rates than the US.

Yes those plently countries where they don't have MILLIONS of illegal immigrants and MILLIONS of other minorities who commit crime. The crime among white Americans is the same as it is among whites among other nations. I'm not racist, its just a fact that the minorities in our country commit the VAST majority of crime and murder even though they only make up a fraction of the country. If any other country had the same make-up that the US has, they would have a similar amount of crime. This isn't a politically-correct thing to say but its true.

We all know men which love guns have lil willys

We all know that men that fear guns are either brainwashed, homosexual, or just dumb. Which are you? Or are you a combination of all of them?

I don't fear guns, unless of course someone came at me with a gun. And people who don't like guns aren't gay or stupid, lol, there just against something which has been ultimitly been designed to kill a human.

Knives were ultimately designed to kill humans when they originated, and more stabbings are just as common as shootings. Why aren't knives tabooo?

Personaly i havn't got anything much against hunting rifles an hunting shotguns. But Pistols, Assault rifles an such, have been designed to kill other humans, therefore they shouldn't be accesable to your average joe.

Except for the fact that the average Joe American citizen who obeys the law is considered responsible enough to own a weapon that is designed for killing humans. Why? Because in the US you are ALLOWED to kill assailants to protect yourself if it is justified. There is also the principle that Americans are armed sufficiently to protect theirself against the GOVERNMENT if the government decides to revert to dictatorship. Like I said before, a dictator ship CANNOT exist when its people freedom-loving and armed to the teeth. But people will still get shot in the US even if assault rifles and pistols are illegal. Guns would still get smuggled into the US.

And assault rifles are almost NEVER used for crimes anyway! So wheres the logic in that?

At 10/17/06 02:18 AM, tawb wrote:

At 10/17/06 02:09 AM, cellardoor6 wrote:

At 10/17/06 02:01 AM, tawb wrote:

At 10/16/06 09:33 PM, cellardoor6 wrote:

I dunno... There not designed to kill other human beings.

:: I don't fear guns, unless of course someone came at me with a gun. And people who don't like guns aren't gay or stupid, lol, there just against something which has been ultimitly been designed to kill a human.

Personaly i havn't got anything much against hunting rifles an hunting shotguns. But Pistols, Assault rifles an such, have been designed to kill other humans, therefore they shouldn't be accesable to your average joe.

Tawb, your argument that assault weapons are designed to kill other humans is just not true. The rounds designed to be fired through those weapons are actually less lethal than the ammunition developed for hunting rifles and hunting shotguns (a shotgun is a shotgun). A military round is by and large designed to maim rather than kill; the logic is a dead soldier only takes out one enemy while by wounding a soldier one takes out three enemy combatants because they have to take that person to the rear.

On the other hand, hunting rifles and shotguns are designed to kill and kill effeicently with one shot (while it takes multiple hits with an assault rifle shooting military ammunition).

So this is what I do not like about anti-gun people is not that they are morally deficient or gay or anything like that; but that their arguments rarely make sense or are rooted in emotion rather than logic, rationality or reality. You would outlaw assault/military rifles because they are "designed to kill human beings" (which is simply not true), yet defend hunting as if the bullets are smart enough to be less lethal when hitting a human rather than a deer. And furthermore, assault rifles are used in less than 1% of firearms crime in this country and not all of those crimes are violent.

AAK

gun control is just outright idiocy,

statistics clearly show that areas with little to no gun control have a far-lesser occurence of violent crime.

Contrast this to a city with extremely stringent regulations surrounding gun-ownership like washington DC. Highest murder per capita rate in the nation.

The logic is flawed from the start. If guns are illegal then criminals wont have them<<
Right because someone is willing to commit murder, but they wont cross that line and own a weapon illegally.

The argument is always that fender-benders will turn into shootouts if everyone is armed. This is just completely false. I live in minnesota and we passed a law allowing citizens to carry a concealed weapon in public. Before the passing of this law the gun-control airheads were crying that every minor disagreement would become a murder. Guess what, that was several years ago and this doesn't happen.....EVER. There is not one incidence of this ever happening anywhere in the state.

The simple fact is that people who use guns for criminal purposes aquire them illegally.

But if the government were to make all firearm ownership there would be less guns on the market right? Yeah, because the government has done such a bonny job of keeping drugs out of people's hands, because they're completely illegal.

You gun control nuts need to go to your respective rooms and think about what you did :p

Prohibition has never worked you fools, if a product is in demand a black market will form and society at large will just become that-much-more unsafe.

At 10/18/06 11:47 AM, vicjperry wrote: What? They want to take away guns from every grade three educated redneck-animal disrespecting-classmate hating-store robbing-neighbor hating-grand theft auto addicted-critter poaching-federal building blowing-columbine bored-meth smoking-crack addicted-Bush dictated-road raged American? What a Goddamen shame! I just heard that they reached 300,000,000 million weapon toting citizens. Oops! I mean Americans. Yeah, let's fight that bill!

Again another emotionally based argument that is not rooted in reality and adds nothing to the discussion!

At 10/18/06 08:36 PM, TheMason wrote: Again another emotionally based argument that is not rooted in reality and adds nothing to the discussion!

The U.S. seeks to take away weapons from those who are not likely to use them wisely is what he's saying. However, it doesn't really add much to the discussion.

http://www.guardian...y/0,,1736424,00.html

32.6% of adults keep guns in or around their home , according to a 2002 survey. An estimated 40% own a gun

30,136 people were killed by firearms in the US in 2003; 730 of these were accidental

1.3m rifles were manufactured in the US in 2004; as well as an estimated 294,000 revolvers; 728,500 pistols; and 732,000 shotguns. Only 132,50o of these weapons were exported

And to Cellardoors statement saying You all need guns because your
Get so much Crime from illegal immigrants. Therfore need guns.
The UK Has a much higher Assault, Burgalry, Robbery an car theft rate. But AMerica has a much higher Murder rate. So that proves your little statement wrong.

Ok in America, someone robs your house, your allowed to kill him. Fair enough, bit savage but yea, at least he won't be robbin any one else of there stuff. lol

But 730!!! Accidental Shootings. FUCKIN HELLL! 730 people killed by accident.
ok you get more of that by cars but you can take away guns and you save 730 people a year.

I think it's stupid for the most advanced nation with a medium Crime rate to have to keep guns to protect them selves from other people and the goverment.
How is that free

At 10/18/06 11:47 AM, vicjperry wrote: What? They want to take away guns from every grade three educated redneck-animal disrespecting-classmate hating-store robbing-neighbor hating-grand theft auto addicted-critter poaching-federal building blowing-columbine bored-meth smoking-crack addicted-Bush dictated-road raged American? What a Goddamen shame! I just heard that they reached 300,000,000 million weapon toting citizens. Oops! I mean Americans. Yeah, let's fight that bill!

Another fine post to justify my hatred for our neighbors to the North. Oh well, I suppose being an idiot such as the quoted author can't be helped.

At 10/18/06 08:40 PM, EnragedSephiroth wrote:

At 10/18/06 08:36 PM, TheMason wrote: Again another emotionally based argument that is not rooted in reality and adds nothing to the discussion!

The U.S. seeks to take away weapons from those who are not likely to use them wisely is what he's saying. However, it doesn't really add much to the discussion.

Somehow when he mentions the 300,000,000 Americans (calling them gun owners first) he obviously shows that he is making a statement about all Americans, not just gun owners, gun nuts, gun control advocates or criminals. Furthermore, the US already has laws designed to do just that.

AAK

At 10/14/06 05:20 AM, MortalWound wrote: Recently I was talking to one of my friends about guns and he said that apparently, the US gov is trying to get the right to bear arms taken out of the bill of rights and constitution. Is this really true? If so, how would this help any? In the end, only the lawless wil have guns.

It's retarted how people take things RIGHT out of the basis of America. Also, thanks for using my sigmaker.

At 10/18/06 09:15 PM, zzzzd wrote: http://www.guardian...y/0,,1736424,00.html


32.6% of adults keep guns in or around their home , according to a 2002 survey. An estimated 40% own a gun

Go find out how much crime is committed by the 40% who own guns. Very little compared to people who dont OWN guns. Law abiding citizens are very unlikely to shoot people or commit crime of any sort.

30,136 people were killed by firearms in the US in 2003; 730 of these were accidental

Divide those figures by 5.5, THEN compare it to the rates in your country in your country. We have 5.5 times the population. I know it won't be equal but just saying "30,136" doesn't accurately depict the facts in restrospect.

1.3m rifles were manufactured in the US in 2004; as well as an estimated 294,000 revolvers; 728,500 pistols; and 732,000 shotguns. Only 132,50o of these weapons were exported

And to Cellardoors statement saying You all need guns because your
Get so much Crime from illegal immigrants. Therfore need guns.
The UK Has a much higher Assault, Burgalry, Robbery an car theft rate. But AMerica has a much higher Murder rate. So that proves your little statement wrong.

British citizens commit alot of crime. American citizens are unlikely to commit crime compared to illegal immigrants who populate the US.

You didn't prove my statement wrong because Illegal immigrants in the US contribute disproportionately to MURDER in the US as well. If we took all the illegal immigrants in our country and brought them to the UK, lets see how well you managed.

Ok in America, someone robs your house, your allowed to kill him. Fair enough, bit savage but yea, at least he won't be robbin any one else of there stuff. lol

Fine by me.

But 730!!! Accidental Shootings. FUCKIN HELLL! 730 people killed by accident.
ok you get more of that by cars but you can take away guns and you save 730 people a year.

there are 300,000,000 citizens in the US plus somewhere between 11-30 million illegal immigrants. That means that the US has about 5 times as many people as the UK, lets say 5.25 as many people to account for the illegal immigrants in the middle of the range of estimates. Divide 730 by 5.25 and you get 139. Now compare 139 to the amount in your country.

I think it's stupid for the most advanced nation with a medium Crime rate to have to keep guns to protect them selves from other people and the goverment.
How is that free

How is being prohibited by your government to defend yourself freedom? Its more of a testament to the freedom of citizens of a country when they the law-abiding citizens are allowed to own firearms. It's a founding principle of this country because private ownership of firearms is a large factor in the fact that we defeated the British and became free and independent in the first place!

Lets see how well your country does if you have 11-30 illegal immigrants in your country, if you bordered a country like mexico, and had the same racial make-up that the US has. Regardless of your gun laws you'd still have a shit load of guns coming from your neighbors.

You refuse to consider the context of the situation. Our countries are very different. If our country had gun control similar to how it is in the UK it wouldn't lower gun death rates to any significant degree, and it would just cause alot of other causes of murder and death. And in the process it would limit the ability of the LAW-ABIDING citizens to defend themselves, all while criminals who dont obey the law are given free reign. Then you'd see as much robbery as there is in your country because criminals would be fearless.