France & Russia's real agenda?

[Commander-K25]

They say that the war is about oil. Perhaps it is....

Kurd PM: French, Russians to lose Iraq oil

[JMHX]

We already knew that this was a business venture war for France and Russia. After all, Chirac and Saddam were buddies back in the day..

I dislike the French.

[bumcheekcity]

At 3/18/03 04:48 PM, JudgeMeHarshX wrote: We already knew that this was a business venture war for France and Russia. After all, Chirac and Saddam were buddies back in the day..

Wow. Bush Senior and Saddam were buddies. He helped Saddam into power, so they must be pretty close.

[shamROCK678]

Hey, the last time the French disagreed with a war they were marching under a German flag...

[RoboTripper]

France, Russia, and Germany don't want the war because the U.S. is greedily jumping the gun in the colonialization of the Middle East. They watch the U.S. put a puppet government in Afghanistan and be about to do the same in Iraq, and they are upset as their piece of the pie slips away.

[TheEvilOne]

At 3/18/03 06:14 PM, DenkSmoker wrote: France, Russia, and Germany don't want the war because the U.S. is greedily jumping the gun in the colonialization of the Middle East. They watch the U.S. put a puppet government in Afghanistan and be about to do the same in Iraq, and they are upset as their piece of the pie slips away.

First of all, let me say that is a reason that some are opposed to war (and in my opinion, it is not a valid reason). You are right about France being worried about losing their piece of the pie, but is the US really trying to greedily grab influence in the Middle East? Or maybe France is the one being greedy, opposing the removal of a brutal and dangerous dictator for their own personal interests. France is not being the "defender of morality" by opposing an "unjust" war. France has its own agenda, and they seek to retain their contracts with the present regime, and embarrass the United States on the world stage. It's not going to work--we will be at war in less than 24 hours. Saddam's weapons will be found, and it would not surprise me at all if one of the nations he was obtaining weapons from was none other than France.

Pro-war, anti-war... it doesn't matter--anyone can see through France's bullshit. Bill O'Reilly is calling for a boycott of French goods, and I tend to agree.

[Der-Ubermensch]

At 3/18/03 04:48 PM, JudgeMeHarshX wrote: We already knew that this was a business venture war for France and Russia. After all, Chirac and Saddam were buddies back in the day..

Those countries may be defending their interests, but at least they aren't STARTING wars to do so.

I dislike the French.

That's a rather red-neckish attitude to adopt...

[NoNameProphet]

At 3/18/03 06:14 PM, DenkSmoker wrote: France, Russia, and Germany don't want the war because the U.S. is greedily jumping the gun in the colonialization of the Middle East. They watch the U.S. put a puppet government in Afghanistan and be about to do the same in Iraq, and they are upset as their piece of the pie slips away.

Heh. Yeah, we've seen alot of problems with US attacking countries in the past for their own benefit. Saddam needs to be removed yes, but it's hard to let anyone do it, because whoever does is probably going to try and nab some power and oil while they're there anyway.

If only Saddam could just be shot by one of his people RIGHT NOW, or get hit by lightning, or spontaneusly combust, or tornado, or earthquake... C'mon God, if you're out there, do something now you lazy bizatch!... Oh that's right, you gave us the free will to f*** ourselves up the a** and turn this world into a total sh*thole ^_^....

[RoboTripper]

At 3/18/03 10:20 PM, NoNameProphet wrote:
If only Saddam could just be shot by one of his people RIGHT NOW, or get hit by lightning, or spontaneusly combust, or tornado, or earthquake... C'mon God, if you're out there, do something now you lazy bizatch!... Oh that's right, you gave us the free will to f*** ourselves up the a** and turn this world into a total sh*thole ^_^....

Seriously, it would save everybody a lot of trouble if this were handled internally. There would be no need for a war and Iraq would hold onto its soveriegnty. You see these people who have come from Iraq to the U.S. and they are all about having us go in there and solve their problem for them - I say they deal with it themselves. If the situation is really so shitty, the people should have nothing to lose. I know I haven't walked in their shoes, but it's just not the U.S.'s responsibility to rescue people from bad leadership - otherwise we'd be at war with half the countries in the world.

[JMHX]

At 3/18/03 10:00 PM, Ruination wrote:

At 3/18/03 04:48 PM, JudgeMeHarshX wrote: We already knew that this was a business venture war for France and Russia. After all, Chirac and Saddam were buddies back in the day..

Those countries may be defending their interests, but at least they aren't STARTING wars to do so.

That's true, but it's also wrong in my book to stay out of something for less than moral reasons. Saving a few bucks is never reason to stay out of something like this, especially since we've helped them out.

I dislike the French.

That's a rather red-neckish attitude to adopt...

I apologize.

[NoNameProphet]

At 3/18/03 10:29 PM, DenkSmoker wrote: Seriously, it would save everybody a lot of trouble if this were handled internally. There would be no need for a war and Iraq would hold onto its soveriegnty.

.....
I know I haven't walked in their shoes, but it's just not the U.S.'s responsibility to rescue people from bad leadership - otherwise we'd be at war with half the countries in the world.

EXACTLY!... That's how I live my life. I ignore the problems of the world around me and just play my music, mess around with my video games, and occasionaly spout out some ideas and ideals =P

I lay myself down and become a tool of the system. To hell if they're corrupt, there's no way anyone can change the way the world works and its revolution around greed.

I preach this! Procrastinate! Do nothing! Lets all just enjoy ourselves before death comes around and takes its toll.

I've said this before, you'll go insane if you worry about everyone's problems and the world as a whole. We're just too messed up!

[NJDeadzone]

France's Muslim population, since times of 18th Century connection with the Ottoman Empire, has been the greatest in all of Europe(excluding certain Balkan regions). Russia does not have a military that could defend all of itself due to the breakdown a decade ago. They could not defeat Afghanistan yet the US defeated in speedy time. Therefore i see two issues why France and Russia are so adamant in their position.
Of course, number one is oil. When i was visiting France 2 years ago, the gas prices were $5 a gallon.
::moment of silence::
They don't need that price higher, and unless there's been some under the table wheeling and dealing, that price could only have risen. Russia too is in need of oil, and this winter has not been the kindest for them.
These nations are reliant on oil from Iraq. But you all knew that.

To another point. France's Muslim population leads to a potential of suicide bombings similiar to Israel if France swung the other way. On my visit to France, the Muslim women, of course dressed as they are, weren't searched by the police as thoroughly as the white females.
In Russia, its economic position cannot afford any terrorist attacks, not to mention its supply of oil. Russia doesn't want to freeze over.

Therefore, these nations really don't have a choice when it comes to whether or not to support US involvement. There's nothing in it for them other than disaster.

[NoNameProphet]

At 3/18/03 11:38 PM, NJDeadzone wrote:

Makes sense. It's not like their help really would matter would it? Iraq was swiftly defeated before, and I am assuming this attack will either work really "well" easily (look at last time), or go horribly wrong (nukes, chem weapons).

I don't hate them for it. Do what they want. *shrug* It IS in their best interest not to help, and you can't blame ANYONE for looking out for themselves, because that's what everyone does. The common good is so hard to achieve, and so hard to feel immediate in-this-life-time effects from unless everyone does it, which is too much to ask.

If war was horribly out of favor for US like it is Russia, would this war still be happening?

[Der-Ubermensch]

At 3/18/03 10:31 PM, JudgeMeHarshX wrote:

At 3/18/03 10:00 PM, Ruination wrote:

At 3/18/03 04:48 PM, JudgeMeHarshX wrote: We already knew that this was a business venture war for France and Russia. After all, Chirac and Saddam were buddies back in the day..

Those countries may be defending their interests, but at least they aren't STARTING wars to do so.

That's true, but it's also wrong in my book to stay out of something for less than moral reasons. Saving a few bucks is never reason to stay out of something like this, especially since we've helped them out.

I dislike the French.

That's a rather red-neckish attitude to adopt...

I apologize.

I really agree with you that its no better of them to stay out of this situation to suit their monetary needs...but I just want to point out that George W is no saint himself.
By the way it's really big of you to apologize, really respectable. I'm sorry too for sounding a little crass.

[Commander-K25]

At 3/19/03 12:18 AM, Ruination wrote:
By the way it's really big of you to apologize, really respectable. I'm sorry too for sounding a little crass.

Group hug, everyone!

[NoNameProphet]

At 3/19/03 12:18 AM, Ruination wrote:

Group hug, everyone!

Woo! *hug*