*The US have already lost the war*

[bumcheekcity]

This war has already been lost. I do not mean militarily, but diplomatically. The world knows that America could win the fight in under 24 hours, their military far outnumbers and outpowers the Iraqui military.

The way they have lost is that most of the world has turned against them. Not openly, and not majorly, but the other countries of the world are slowly turning against the way they act.
The fact that they will ignore the France veto (although it doesn't look as if they will give them the chance to even use it) will mean that other countries will start ignoring their vetos.

Do people think I'm right? Or am I missing things here?

[NEMESiSZ]

Seriously, you're taking very vague general statements and making specific conclusions from them. In no way is "most of the world" against the war, if anything, most of the world is indifferent. The UN isn't a fourth grade classroom, but the French would treat it as one, they have refused to negotiate, and turned the UN into a little game. This doesn't mean the security council will turn into "omg u vetod now i veto 2, ur gay," as you predict. There was no diplomatic road to victory, there almost never is.

[TheEvilOne]

From what I understand, we had the votes to get the new resolution passed, but there was no way France was going to just let it go. The way I see it, the country that will come out of this with egg on their face will be not the US, but France.

[JudgeDredd]

anypne who was at all reticent to suggest that the US were burgeoning as Neo-Millenium-World-Police (NMWP) will no-longer be under any illusions of the truth of the matter - UN law is whatever the US cares to make of it from this day forward..

UN-constitutional
UN-cooperative
UN-necessary
UN-dermined!
_

[Taors]

So Spain, Britian, Belgium, and 38 other countries backing the United States aren't enough?

[Ted-Easton]

Not by a long shot! The anti war movement is STRONGLY supported in Albania, Sri Lanka, and dozens of other countries that could fit in your bathroom.

[MrSomeone]

As a palestinian leader said, they can have bombs, they can have missles, they can have tanks, but they do not have souls.

[NEMESiSZ]

Yeah...thanks anarchy dude...your wisdom is so....appreciated...yeah, that's the ticket...

[Zio-Shirai]

well, yeah, ive always thought like this, even before this iraqui thing, i was hoping that one day the whole world was gonna realize about the fascist imperialist methods of the US, and now it seems that that day is really gonna come soon, really, i think even a war against the US is possible if he continues like this, and US's military isnt SO powerful as it seems, theyve got really bad budget problems

[NJDeadzone]

At 3/17/03 06:27 PM, Ted_Easton wrote: Not by a long shot! The anti war movement is STRONGLY supported in Albania, Sri Lanka, and dozens of other countries that could fit in your bathroom.

lol nice one! Yeah we don't answer to anyone. We don't need the French permission to let terrorist nations persist. Do not make me cite my german shepard. And we certainly don't need these small toilet nations either. We're so caught up in trying to please everyone that we're holding our own balls as the searing sand blows up our skirts...

[Zio-Shirai]

At 3/17/03 06:36 PM, Pirates wrote: As a palestinian leader said, they can have bombs, they can have missles, they can have tanks, but they do not have souls.

i liked that one honestly

[NJDeadzone]

forgive me Ted for twisting your words, lol...

[Zio-Shirai]

At 3/17/03 05:56 PM, TheEvilOne wrote: From what I understand, we had the votes to get the new resolution passed, but there was no way France was going to just let it go. The way I see it, the country that will come out of this with egg on their face will be not the US, but France.

the US has never had enough votes, almost noone supported the resolution, but France was the one that was most firmly against it cuz it has enough power to overcome any economic harm caused by the US, i mean, lets take the examples of Mexico and Chile, what would they do if the Us gets angry at them?? their economy would collapse, thats y they cant oppose the US that easily

[Taxman2A]

At 3/17/03 07:34 PM, NEMESiSZ wrote: Yeah...thanks anarchy dude...your wisdom is so....appreciated...yeah, that's the ticket...

lol, yeah. Personally, I've always been impressed by 14 year olds who go around marking the anarchy sign on everything without even really understanding what it means politically. Their political views are always so well thought out and refreshing.

10 bucks says he has a little Anarchy symbol sewed onto his bookbag.

[JudgeDredd]

At 3/17/03 06:36 PM, Pirates wrote: As a palestinian leader said, "they can have bombs, they can have missles, they can have tanks, but they do not have souls."

aye, fair credit thou, ..it's a very good quote for 1st evar NG post ;O)

(free advice for Pirates: in NG you can talk about WAR all u want, but best be careful mentioning software piracy - lol : )

[JMHX]

At 3/17/03 07:47 PM, Taxman2A wrote:

At 3/17/03 07:34 PM, NEMESiSZ wrote: Yeah...thanks anarchy dude...your wisdom is so....appreciated...yeah, that's the ticket...

lol, yeah. Personally, I've always been impressed by 14 year olds who go around marking the anarchy sign on everything without even really understanding what it means politically. Their political views are always so well thought out and refreshing.

10 bucks says he has a little Anarchy symbol sewed onto his bookbag.

I'll take your bet. But anyway, yeah, we've upset a few countries, but they're nations who never really liked us in the first place. China was always against us and has done things in the UN just out of spite. Russia's always been a bit "Uhhn...um...no...um...damnit!" and France is just so....French. Oh well, we've got bigger problems to deal with on the homefront, like possible terrorism coming from the Iraq War. Make that definite terrorism.

[JudgeDredd]

At 3/17/03 08:55 PM, JudgeMeHarshX wrote:
China was always against us and has done things in the UN just out of spite.

..but China only used Veto twice in how many years? whereas i think US is well over 30 Vetos already (mostly in support of Israel)

> like possible terrorism coming from the Iraq War. Make that definite terrorism.

hmmm, i wonder if the definition changes now; "war is war, not terrorism" ..or the US droping MOABs is a planned terror tatic...

[TheShrike]

I honestly believe we have lost the war on the diplomatic front. I don't even support it.
And I'm not alone. The amount of americans who oppose this war, this way, this time is not insignificant. The idea of a pre-emptive war is foolish.
But someone had to take care of Saddam, and it might as well be the easiest president to absolutely hate that we've ever had.
I say let the war happen, let Bush enjoy his moment of fun, then call for the impeachment of Bush.

[NEMESiSZ]

No more posting for you.

[TheShrike]

Saddam is an evil mother fucker. I have no illusions about his intent in my mind. He has tested weapons on his own people and shut out any possibility for free speach in Iraq. He takes money from the oil he sells and lines his pockets with it. All while Iraq goes down the shitter.

But the idea of a pre-emptive war is still foolish

At 3/17/03 09:47 PM, NEMESiSZ wrote: No more posting for you.

You are a fucking moron. Please come to terms with that.

[NEMESiSZ]

At 3/17/03 09:58 PM, FlattusMaximus wrote: You are a fucking moron. Please come to terms with that.

I don't remember inviting you back here. Begone.

[TheShrike]

FlattusMaximus, I would just like to say that while NEMESiSZ is not my favorite person, you are much, much, much much lower on the list. Please go die somewhere, or at least use your mind when posting.

[karasz]

At 3/17/03 07:41 PM, NJDeadzone wrote: lol nice one! Yeah we don't answer to anyone. We don't need the French permission to let terrorist nations persist. Do not make me cite my german shepard. And we certainly don't need these small toilet nations either. We're so caught up in trying to please everyone that we're holding our own balls as the searing sand blows up our skirts...

but by attacking iraq it makes us in violation of the UN... the very THING that we are attacking IRAQ for doing... im not the only one that sees the irony behind this right???

personally i think the UN should be re-worked and re-made to suit the post cold war world...

[HighWing]

At 3/17/03 06:01 PM, Taors wrote: So Spain, Britian, Belgium, and 38 other countries backing the United States aren't enough?

Nope. Maybe you should take a look at some world news. People in some of those other countries are protesting the war just as the US public is. Britin's parliment in perticular is under heavy fire from the public protesting the war just as the US public is. This war has no point, it's a Bush revenge and he just happens to have a few governments to back him up reguardless of the people's voice. I mean come on look at the Korean war, and Kent state?

[karasz]

At 3/17/03 11:16 PM, HighWing wrote: Nope. Maybe you should take a look at some world news. People in some of those other countries are protesting the war just as the US public is. Britin's parliment in perticular is under heavy fire from the public protesting the war just as the US public is. This war has no point, it's a Bush revenge and he just happens to have a few governments to back him up reguardless of the people's voice. I mean come on look at the Korean war, and Kent state?

yeah but the public opinion in other countries are more against teh war then the US... the protesters are doing shit, 15 million people protested last month and nothing changed... if you want to change something then get a bunch of people and vote for someone else in the upcoming elections... thats the only way to change things...

i dont understand teh korean war and kent state reference... kent state happened during teh vietnam war, and it was an accident that those 4 people got shot, at least thats how i learned it anyway...

[MarijuanaClock]

Yah, I mean most of the world hates America as it is anyway.

Shoe399-BananaClock
JuanaClock-MarijuanaClock

Shoe399: you wathcing this?
JuanaClock: whats that?
Shoe399: bush
JuanaClock: nah It's st. patricks day
JuanaClock: I don't give a fuck
JuanaClock: time to drink
Shoe399: oh
JuanaClock: fuck bush
Shoe399: cause hes annoucning war
Shoe399: fun fun
JuanaClock: I knew he would
JuanaClock: big surprise
JuanaClock: fucking fascist
Shoe399: sadam and his sons have 48 hours to leave iraq or iraq go boom
Shoe399: its fun though
Shoe399: i love war
JuanaClock: feck, stupid yank
Shoe399: no
JuanaClock: another reason for me to get drunk

*drinks another shot*

[bumcheekcity]

At 3/17/03 11:37 PM, Doomhammr wrote: this is slightly off topic but here's how much of a joke the media is, has anybody noticed that there have been almost just as many pro war protests as there are anitwar protests? didn't think so, because the media hasn't covered them.

if there have been pro-war protests i wouldn't have heard of them, and besides, don't you think that the government (especially here in britain, they're under terrible fire) would have told us about them in order to boost support?

also why does the dixie chicks get so much backlash from fans when they say one comment about george bush and his whole war while eminem gets little fan (not media or parental watchdog group) backlash (i'm sure its because he already has a bad boy image so its no big deal) when he sings songs about how america sucks and the bush administration is fucked up (not that i have a problem with eminem, he's pretty decent).

[JMHX]

Marijuana Clock, that says so much about the interest of the American people in decisions that might drastically effect the way they live. Or die. Sometimes it seems like we're the only ones paying attention to anything! Mwaha!

[David-Green]

shit i dont think we lost the war by diplomacy or otherwise. by polotics and brute strength we'll beat their asses back to hell