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I-smel
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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-08 15:41:45 Reply

At 9/7/12 03:59 PM, The-Great-One wrote: Interview with Tom Fulp

Wanna ask the creator of Newgrounds, Tom Fulp a question? Well you can! The Interviewer is putting the power in your hands to ask the questions. Just click above!

Also yes, Tom Fulp has given permission to do this thread.

Sweet, I asked how he feels about people who grow so much in what they're doing that they dissapear from Newgrounds, like Ed McMillen or Egoraptor, Hotdiggedydemon, and all the other people who haven't made a noise for a year. They're on Youtube and twitter n facebook, they're still making stuff and talking about it every day, but even Dan Paladin doesn't share those videos of him working on BattleBlock on Newgrounds. I see em on Twitter every week.

Figure I'd mention it on here considering Closure's on Steam now, and this is the thread for people who've been here for years. Like if you're the person who owns Newgrounds do you... try and fix that? Or do you focus on newcomers? Are you totally not worried about it? I'm stressing about that n I'm not even Tom Fulp!

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-08 18:12:41 Reply

Everyone in this thread should go and support Newgrounds.

It's the least you could do for the website that's likely shaped your lives and careers.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-08 18:25:59 Reply

Where'd ya hear about that?

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-08 21:32:10 Reply

At 9/8/12 06:25 PM, I-smel wrote: Where'd ya hear about that?

http://www.newgrounds.com/bbs/topic/1317780/

Apparently it wasn't supposed to go public just yet, but someone leaked it somehow. Liljim said on page 8:

At 9/8/12 07:31 PM, liljim wrote: I might be missing something here, but I don't think that feature was ready to launch - so there will be problems with it. It's really encouraging to see that so many people have already donated and I'll speak on behalf of everyone on the staff and thank those of you who have already contributed!

Please be patient though - like I said, I think someone may have stumbled across the URL and it's gone public without any of us intending it to be, so expect whatever problems there are with it to be worked out over time.
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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-08 22:33:32 Reply

At 9/8/12 06:12 PM, Archawn wrote: Everyone in this thread should go and support Newgrounds.

It's the least you could do for the website that's likely shaped your lives and careers.

I haven't been here THAT long, but yeah we should do that. For Luis.

Meanwhile, I've confirmed that my artist and writer for my RPG are both still alive, so I'll hopefully have something to show soon :S

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-09 01:42:05 Reply

At 9/8/12 03:41 PM, I-smel wrote: Sweet, I asked how he feels about people who grow so much in what they're doing that they dissapear from Newgrounds,

I still enjoy newgrounds, its just I can't really make a living off of flash games anymore since I actually have bills to pay now, and sponsors don't pay enough and ads don't make enough.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-09 09:52:29 Reply

At 9/9/12 01:42 AM, Glaiel-Gamer wrote:
At 9/8/12 03:41 PM, I-smel wrote: Sweet, I asked how he feels about people who grow so much in what they're doing that they dissapear from Newgrounds,
I still enjoy newgrounds, its just I can't really make a living off of flash games anymore since I actually have bills to pay now, and sponsors don't pay enough and ads don't make enough.

SPEAKING OF SPONSORS.

As I'm wrapping up my first sponsor-worthy game, I was thinking about the process, which I've never been involved in.
If I go directly to sponsors would they want me to name a price?

Also, for anyone that's had a game sold, can you link to the game and how much money you got from the sponsor? I tried looking at some post-mortems for some popular flash games, but hardly anyone mentions how much they got. Are you not allowed to, or is it just taboo?


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-09 11:22:25 Reply

At 9/9/12 09:52 AM, 14hourlunchbreak wrote: If I go directly to sponsors would they want me to name a price?

Yes. From my experience every sponsor (that is interested ofc, that's 2%) will reply to you something like "nice game, how much you want for it?". And if you give them the 'im not sure' kind of answer, they most likely will not reply back to you. Ofc it will be the same case if you price it too high for them. So pretty much you can never win with the sponsors, they got so many games offered to them they can just pick the cheapest quality games they get offered. The sponsorship scene used to be much better like 5 years ago, probably cuz there wasn't so many developers back then. Today if you make a good game (good, not great) you will be fighting for scraps (talking like 200-400$ price range). It's sad :(.


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-09 14:40:45 Reply

At 9/8/12 03:41 PM, I-smel wrote: I'm stressing about that n I'm not even Tom Fulp!

But you're still Tom, and that's all that matters!

what what

On a more serious note:

At 9/9/12 01:42 AM, Glaiel-Gamer wrote:
At 9/8/12 03:41 PM, I-smel wrote: Sweet, I asked how he feels about people who grow so much in what they're doing that they dissapear from Newgrounds,
I still enjoy newgrounds, its just I can't really make a living off of flash games anymore since I actually have bills to pay now, and sponsors don't pay enough and ads don't make enough.

That's the thing. I've always seen Newgrounds as a community, not just a flash/movie/game/art portal. I mean I'd probably still visit it everyday if they removed the game and movie portals. It's like the epicenter of creativity of the internet. It's the place that has nurtured and encouraged talents and innovation. The amount of lives Newgrounds has influenced, or even completely altered is astounding.

I mean just recently, after like 2 years, the writing forum has put together and published in a real, hard-copy book, a collection of short stories and poetry whose quality is jaw-breakingly amazing (in my amateur opinion). I mean the fact that this push, this collection, this work would not have happened without Newgrounds is interesting to think about. To think about how many things wouldn't be without Newgrounds, it's bigger than I ever imagined. But it makes me sad to see it not be regarded as such. I mean, NG frikking pioneered the whole user-submission system (if I'm not mistaken) that tons of sites do now. And I could be wrong, but as far as I know, Tom was one of the first, if not the first, to try making games with flash. Back when it didn't even have variables apparently.

But what makes me even more sad:

At 9/8/12 06:12 PM, Archawn wrote: Everyone in this thread should go and support Newgrounds.

It's the least you could do for the website that's likely shaped your lives and careers.

..is seeing this. I started feeling something was weird back when Tom said he stopped sponsoring games because they didn't have the budget. And when Tom made that newspost about whether they should take "Venture Capital" or stay independent, and they chose the latter, I started getting worried.

Now I'm not saying Newgrounds is going to go bankrupt or anything, but just think about how much better Newgrounds could be if they had more staff and more money. If they could offer more contests, if they could get involved in more events, if they could pioneer and innovate with more features.

I see Newgrounds as having the potential to be the creative pool of the internet. To influence so many more and in much greater ways. To create history even. And I think chasing a vision like that is hard to do when you're worried about how you're going to pay next month's bills.

My vote went to taking investors into NG. Sure, you'd have investors who may have certain opinions about your content or whatever, and I don't know that much about how these economics work, but I don't think they'd really assert that much control or would want to ruin Newgrounds.

Kongregate got sold and it's doing fine. And I think large capitals with these sort of things are crucial. I read that Youtube was beginning to lose money before they were sold to Google.

Tom wrote once that he had a vision for Newgrounds' future, and he hoped this redesign would take them closer to this vision. They're still going through the bugs of the redesign. And having a bigger staff is one thing, but again, I think having to not worry about financial issues is a pretty big other thing.

I'd really like to get people's opinions on the state of things.

At 9/9/12 09:52 AM, 14hourlunchbreak wrote: SPEAKING OF SPONSORS.

As I'm wrapping up my first sponsor-worthy game, I was thinking about the process, which I've never been involved in.
If I go directly to sponsors would they want me to name a price?

Negotiating is a game. It's basically "He who names the price first, loses". Because if the sponsor names the price first, it may be higher than what you were expecting, so he's lost some money, and if you name the price, the sponsor may have been willing to pay more.

You have two options really. Either tell them you're inexperienced, and can't really judge the monetary value of your game, and ask them to make you an offer. They'll most likely start off with a low offer, and from there you try to raise it.

Or you give them an offer higher than what you're looking for. So they drop down to around your target price.

Also, for anyone that's had a game sold, can you link to the game and how much money you got from the sponsor? I tried looking at some post-mortems for some popular flash games, but hardly anyone mentions how much they got. Are you not allowed to, or is it just taboo?

People just don't like talking about how much money they make, but there are a lot of post mortems out there that mention prices. Here's a nice collection:

http://www.radicaldog.com/blog/?p=94

At 9/9/12 11:22 AM, ProfessorFlash wrote: they got so many games offered to them they can just pick the cheapest quality games they get offered. The sponsorship scene used to be much better like 5 years ago, probably cuz there wasn't so many developers back then. Today if you make a good game (good, not great) you will be fighting for scraps (talking like 200-400$ price range). It's sad :(.

It's not necessarily sad. It's true that there are a lot more developers now, and it's true that the bar of quality has risen, but that's an overall good thing. It means people are making better games.

What that means for the individual is that you need to raise your own bar of quality and try to make better games. A "good" game by iOS standards could flop at $500 or something, but that same game may earn $3k or more in flash, just because the bar of quality of mobile is much higher.

What I can say for sure is that there's still a lot of money in flash games. The money is now being shifted towards the top tier of games. A friend of mine just told his game some time ago for $20k, and there are still deals on FGL every other month that go upwards of that. A ton more money is also being made from micro-transactions, that being much more lucrative than the ad/sponsorship model. (Although riskier, as you need to develop a game keeping in mind that you expect people to pay for it)

And I leave you with this article about microtransactions:

http://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/ColmLarkin/20091008/3257/You_
Should_Be_Making_A_Premium_Flash_Game.php

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-09 15:58:00 Reply

Oh there's plenty of stuff Newgrounds could change if they're ever under the thumb from investors.
They could introduce buying credits to spend on games, replace half the Featured Games and Movies with sponsored links for free-to-play MMOs, post what medals you get to Facebook, take Artist News off the front page, ban people for swearing-... Audio and Art only get like 1% of the hits that games get, so from an investment standpoint, why are you spending time and money on that, right? I'm basically naming what every site similar to Newgrounds has already done.
Seeing Kongregate and how much it basically looks like the Flash Game Licensing website, that's personally the best example for why Newgrounds SHOULD stay independant.

But yea, on the other hand looking up Newgrounds on Alexa is fucking depressing.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-09 16:15:35 Reply

Ugguuuuhhhh I just hopped in chat and asked if anyone bought the Supporter thing, and one guy said "Newgrounds, more like Fewgrounds"

SO sad after looking up Newgrounds' traffic history over the passed few years :(

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-09 16:23:29 Reply

At 9/9/12 04:15 PM, I-smel wrote: Ugguuuuhhhh I just hopped in chat and asked if anyone bought the Supporter thing, and one guy said "Newgrounds, more like Fewgrounds"

SO sad after looking up Newgrounds' traffic history over the passed few years :(

Especially in those periodic interviews, it seems like a lot of people just randomly found this site. I think I StumbleUpon-ed some game that just happened to be on this site. Too bad marketing costs money too

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-09 17:11:40 Reply

At 9/9/12 03:58 PM, I-smel wrote: But yea, on the other hand looking up Newgrounds on Alexa is fucking depressing.

I'm not 100% sure how it works, but from my understanding they only count a website's traffic based on how many people with an Alexa toolbar visit it. So in reality Newgrounds traffic is much higher than the estimate Alexa provides. You can ask liljim about it, he's always in threads where Alexa pops up.


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-09 18:19:31 Reply

Oh you're right, I remember hearing that was a thing.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-10 01:36:25 Reply

At 9/9/12 05:11 PM, 14hourlunchbreak wrote: I'm not 100% sure how it works, but from my understanding they only count a website's traffic based on how many people with an Alexa toolbar visit it. So in reality Newgrounds traffic is much higher than the estimate Alexa provides. You can ask liljim about it, he's always in threads where Alexa pops up.

Why have I always heard of this as an accurate reading for traffic if that's the case? It can't cater for all audiences, surely.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-10 03:28:11 Reply

Just this past week I was wondering how Newgrounds was doing, with the rise of apps and the decline of Flash and whatnot, I come here and I see the 'Support Newgrounds' thing. Kinda depressing.


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-11 12:38:49 Reply

DAMNIT!!!

It happened again...

Working on my zombie engine, I realize that there's a whole new, better way to structure the whole thing than I currently am, and now I need to resist the urge to restart the whole engine...
I just need to implement a shooting system, and a way to use items (So far, I'm thinking just ID cards for doors (a crowbar could be an "ID card" for a grate somewhere of course, to make it seem different to the player), and then I'll start making some fancy AI, and try getting a whole game done...

I'm really happy with the engine so far though, and how smooth the level editing process is (All Flash IDE, AI mesh drawing is now working really well, and the background graphic gets rendered to bitmapData's during level loading, which means I can slap on HQ blur fx or bevel etc. etc., and then have the levels look nice in game. Way better than using a .jpg or .png for the whole background, since the filesize is way smaller like this too...)

The screenshot doesn't show a lot, you just see a mess of drawing, but I thought I'd at least show something to give me a bigger incentive to continue. I still gotta put in my dynamic lighting stuff too...
(The .swf is currently .5 MB, which I guess isn't too small for it's current state...)
The red box is the player, the green dot is a zombie (currently it just runs at the player if he's in sight), and the red dot in the top left is an item...

The Flash 'Reg' Lounge

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-13 14:48:47 Reply

WOAH!

Workers in Flash are now available with the latest Flex SDK download! :O

Threading, heeere we cooome! (Perfect for AI Pathfinding running in the background or something...hell yeah!)

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-14 04:22:17 Reply

At 9/13/12 02:48 PM, PSvils wrote: WOAH!

Workers in Flash are now available with the latest Flex SDK download! :O

Threading, heeere we cooome! (Perfect for AI Pathfinding running in the background or something...hell yeah!)

Though from my reading about it, they're BS. In the sense that the Flash VM itself isn't multithreaded, they just load in another VM instance and then run the code on that = BULKY AS FUCK.
And Thibault Imbert keeps saying they didn't want to expose new Thread() style functionality because it is tooo complex or something, though I think it's easier to understand that than their new system.

In my opinion, they should have simple new Thread() functionality, and then someone can make a library to have it behave like their current implementation.

Whatever, I'm just a bit disappointed I guess...

P.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-14 09:40:26 Reply

Hey sorry if you guys have already discussed this sort of thing...

I think about how the forum that would personally interest me would be discussion about straight up game development and design. It doesn't matter what programming language or platform, game design is game design. The closest thing to it is conversations that take place here in the Flash Reg Lounge.

So it makes me wonder, what if we closed down the Mobile forum (because it's a flop), changed the entire "Developers & Programmers" category into just "Programming", then added a "Game Design" or "Game Development" forum under "Artists & Creators", officially representing game makers among the Animation, Art and Music categories we have now.

If we did this, I feel like I would need to walk the walk and put myself out there on the forum more. I would try posting about failed projects, including playable demos. I would post about games in-progress, which is something that always makes me nervous because I've become ultra paranoid and protective over the years when it comes to stuff I'm doing. I really need to get over that and just start talking again.

We could also have AMAs with developers. I (hopefully we) would want to make an effort to pull in guys from the scene and get them to have AMAs, post-mortems, etc...

I was always excited to have post-mortems on NG, as a category in the Writing Portal. The thought was, you could append it to your game project - so when you play the game it links to the article with the post-mortem, and if you read the post-mortem is has a link to the game, all cross-connected between portals.

Some guys like I-Smel and Hyptosis have made posts like these on their user blogs. They are always my favorite thing to read in the Artist News section, I would love to see more posts like that. So that begs the question, is it better to do it on user pages where it gets all fragmented, or would it be best in a centralized forum where everyone shares the same interests? It could be a mix of both, like making a big post in the forum, then using the front page Artist News to give the public a brief synopsis and link to your post - thus promoting the forum and bringing in more activity to the benefit for everyone who hangs out there.

The forum would only succeed if a good number of interesting game developers actually like hanging out there and talking. Do you guys think it has potential?


This is the game JohnnyUtah and I have been working on.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-14 11:06:10 Reply

At 9/14/12 09:40 AM, TomFulp wrote: So it makes me wonder, what if we closed down the Mobile forum (because it's a flop), changed the entire "Developers & Programmers" category into just "Programming", then added a "Game Design" or "Game Development" forum under "Artists & Creators", officially representing game makers among the Animation, Art and Music categories we have now.

In my personal opinion, the less boards we have the better when it comes to game design. Game Design includes programming, animation, art, and music, and having all these boards just spreads out the conversation and appears to slow down activity. But, I'm all for whatever solutions you can consider.

I was always excited to have post-mortems on NG, as a category in the Writing Portal. The thought was, you could append it to your game project - so when you play the game it links to the article with the post-mortem, and if you read the post-mortem is has a link to the game, all cross-connected between portals.

Sounds like a sound plan to me. I would love to see post-mortems from the games I play, getting a little deeper conversation than the comment system provides.

The forum would only succeed if a good number of interesting game developers actually like hanging out there and talking. Do you guys think it has potential?

I say go for it.

Good luck.


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-14 11:32:06 Reply

At 9/14/12 09:40 AM, TomFulp wrote: I think about how the forum that would personally interest me would be discussion about straight up game development and design.

I was seriously thinking of PMing you about this. What would the ground rules for discussion be, though? I can already see the "I'm developing a game and I need help with this code" posts. Should it be limited to things that go in a game design doc? Or what?

We could also have AMAs with developers. I (hopefully we) would want to make an effort to pull in guys from the scene and get them to have AMAs, post-mortems, etc...
Some guys like I-Smel and Hyptosis have made posts like these on their user blogs.

I didn't even know they had written anything...so yeah, a forum would be good. Or maybe a subscribe-able list of all user page posts about dev-related stuff?

The forum would only succeed if a good number of interesting game developers actually like hanging out there and talking. Do you guys think it has potential?

Yes, but you'd have to promote writing posts. Like maybe a few days after someone releases a game, prompt them to write a post-mortem for it. Or in the project system, have a spot for a (substantive) "how's the game coming along?" post. Maybe some devs have never thought to do a post-mortem, and that prompt may generate some good ideas.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-14 14:01:34 Reply

I was definitely one of the supporters of dividing the forum into more specific sub forums. I still do think that collabs should have their own section, but apart from that I've come to think the segregation got too out of hand.

It also seems the forum as a whole has been less active during the last year or two. Maybe the forum changes played their part in that, but either way the low user count probably should result in fewer and more broad forums.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-14 15:18:18 Reply

At 9/14/12 09:40 AM, TomFulp wrote: I was always excited to have post-mortems on NG, as a category in the Writing Portal. The thought was, you could append it to your game project - so when you play the game it links to the article with the post-mortem, and if you read the post-mortem is has a link to the game, all cross-connected between portals.

That sounds like a really really good idea.

Not only would it get more people involved in seeing how the game was developed and monetized, because right now post-mortems are pretty few and hard to find, and you'd only stumble upon them if you hang around development forums and developer blogs. Players have no idea they exist and perhaps seeing it might spark someone's interest into creating something.

But not only that, I think having that option to append a post mortem to the game submission would also encourage more post mortems to be written. Which I think is an awesome thing.

About a Game Design forum, I do agree that the forums that aren't very active should be grouped (like anything related to mobile can be asked in the Flash forum) however the existence of a game design forum will get people to talk more about game design, and get people to understand what game design actually is. It may not be very populated at first but I think its existence alone will entice a lot more discussion about it, and I think that's a good thing with game design being a pretty crucial thing and all.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-14 16:17:53 Reply

At 9/14/12 09:40 AM, TomFulp wrote: I would try posting about failed projects, including playable demos.

My speciality.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-14 17:09:28 Reply

At 9/14/12 09:40 AM, TomFulp wrote: The forum would only succeed if a good number of interesting game developers actually like hanging out there and talking. Do you guys think it has potential?

Absolutely! I think a forum such as that would have a lot of potential. Sometimes a simple forum post is all someone needs to be inspired to continue, or even start developing.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-14 17:21:47 Reply

At 9/14/12 09:40 AM, TomFulp wrote: Hey sorry if you guys have already discussed this sort of thing...

I think about how the forum that would personally interest me would be discussion about straight up game development and design. It doesn't matter what programming language or platform, game design is game design. The closest thing to it is conversations that take place here in the Flash Reg Lounge.

So it makes me wonder, what if we closed down the Mobile forum (because it's a flop), changed the entire "Developers & Programmers" category into just "Programming", then added a "Game Design" or "Game Development" forum under "Artists & Creators", officially representing game makers among the Animation, Art and Music categories we have now.

It would feel a lot more like the old Flash forum was before Animation was split off, but more wide spread in terms of languages. It'd be great because personally I love seeing games as they get developed and the posts that people make would give us a glimpse into what they're working on.

We could also have AMAs with developers. I (hopefully we) would want to make an effort to pull in guys from the scene and get them to have AMAs, post-mortems, etc...

Also a brilliant idea. It'd be cool to have a AMA thread that gets stickied for a fortnight and then rolls onto the next one, although, with that frequency, we might run out of developers fairly fast.

:So that begs the question, is it better to do it on user pages where it gets all fragmented, or would it be best in a centralized forum where everyone shares the same interests? It could be a mix of both, like making a big post in the forum, then using the front page Artist News to give the public a brief synopsis and link to your post - thus promoting the forum and bringing in more activity to the benefit for everyone who hangs out there.

Having it on user pages would mean that people who are already fans of that developer would be able to read about them, but finding new developers just based on the AMA would be hard as there's no central location for it. I think having one big post would be too cumbersome to find a specific developers AMA.

The forum would only succeed if a good number of interesting game developers actually like hanging out there and talking. Do you guys think it has potential?

I'm not much of a developer but I'd visit it often.

TomFulp
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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-15 06:34:48 Reply

More on the topic of being language agnostic... When making a game, if you need some math to make an enemy shoot towards the player, or lob a bomb that lands on the player, it really doesn't matter what language you're programming in or what platform you're building for - you just need the math.

I want to get on the ball with more regular game jams but I want a place where we post the discussion thread for each jam. Where is that? If I post in the Flash forum it doesn't make sense when future jams will include HTML5 and Unity submissions.

I could see closing down Mobile and those guys just having an iPhone lounge, Android lounge, etc. in the Game Development forum. Games Factory guys could likely do the same... Could be GF2 lounge, Flixel lounge, etc. for those specific things.

Also I need to make a big post about all the economics of NG but I'll save that for later. When you see stuff like the Supporter system, don't think NG is gonna go BANKRUPT... NG doesn't carry any debt and my paycheck comes from the Behemoth. What IS depressing is that the staff has been shrinking these past two years and can't afford to shrink any more. If the staff shrinks more, all progress will slow down and it will just be a huge downward spiral, as it already has been with a tightening budget.


This is the game JohnnyUtah and I have been working on.

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PSvils
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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-15 07:10:33 Reply

At 9/15/12 06:34 AM, TomFulp wrote: More on the topic of being language agnostic... When making a game, if you need some math to make an enemy shoot towards the player, or lob a bomb that lands on the player, it really doesn't matter what language you're programming in or what platform you're building for - you just need the math.

Definitely, same with anything related to game architecture/design...the language doesn't matter. I would love a Game Development forum, since if someone's developing a game in C++, I still love to hear about it, see screenshots, etc. etc.

I want to get on the ball with more regular game jams but I want a place where we post the discussion thread for each jam.

More game jams...always a good thing! :)

P.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-15 07:13:27 Reply

At 8/17/12 02:16 PM, 4urentertainment wrote: In fact, the flash framework is so efficient at making games that a lot of people are using it in non-flash games. A lot of iPhone or just generally games made with C++ and such use Flash for animation. I believe that's how Castle Crashers handled their art and animation. Everything is vector, and the vector data is taken from SWF's and converted to raster data during loading.

Apparently Bioshock also has SWF files in their source, but I'm not 100% sure about that.

Castle Crashers is a Flash 6, AS2 game that is parsed to C++ and rasterized at run-time when files are loaded into ram.

Groundcats for iPhone wasn't programmed with actionscript but the art was all made in Flash and dumped to sprite sheets. The cinemas were made in Flash and converted to MP4 with Mike's upcoming Swivel software.

I do want to modernize with AS3 but JohnnyUtah and I are working on another console game using AS2... But Flash 8 this time. :P


This is the game JohnnyUtah and I have been working on.

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