At 9/8/12 03:41 PM, I-smel wrote:
I'm stressing about that n I'm not even Tom Fulp!
But you're still Tom, and that's all that matters!
On a more serious note:
At 9/9/12 01:42 AM, Glaiel-Gamer wrote:
At 9/8/12 03:41 PM, I-smel wrote:
Sweet, I asked how he feels about people who grow so much in what they're doing that they dissapear from Newgrounds,I still enjoy newgrounds, its just I can't really make a living off of flash games anymore since I actually have bills to pay now, and sponsors don't pay enough and ads don't make enough.
That's the thing. I've always seen Newgrounds as a community, not just a flash/movie/game/art portal. I mean I'd probably still visit it everyday if they removed the game and movie portals. It's like the epicenter of creativity of the internet. It's the place that has nurtured and encouraged talents and innovation. The amount of lives Newgrounds has influenced, or even completely altered is astounding.
I mean just recently, after like 2 years, the writing forum has put together and published in a real, hard-copy book, a collection of short stories and poetry whose quality is jaw-breakingly amazing (in my amateur opinion). I mean the fact that this push, this collection, this work would not have happened without Newgrounds is interesting to think about. To think about how many things wouldn't be without Newgrounds, it's bigger than I ever imagined. But it makes me sad to see it not be regarded as such. I mean, NG frikking pioneered the whole user-submission system (if I'm not mistaken) that tons of sites do now. And I could be wrong, but as far as I know, Tom was one of the first, if not the first, to try making games with flash. Back when it didn't even have variables apparently.
But what makes me even more sad:
At 9/8/12 06:12 PM, Archawn wrote:
Everyone in this thread should go and support Newgrounds.
It's the least you could do for the website that's likely shaped your lives and careers.
..is seeing this. I started feeling something was weird back when Tom said he stopped sponsoring games because they didn't have the budget. And when Tom made that newspost about whether they should take "Venture Capital" or stay independent, and they chose the latter, I started getting worried.
Now I'm not saying Newgrounds is going to go bankrupt or anything, but just think about how much better Newgrounds could be if they had more staff and more money. If they could offer more contests, if they could get involved in more events, if they could pioneer and innovate with more features.
I see Newgrounds as having the potential to be the creative pool of the internet. To influence so many more and in much greater ways. To create history even. And I think chasing a vision like that is hard to do when you're worried about how you're going to pay next month's bills.
My vote went to taking investors into NG. Sure, you'd have investors who may have certain opinions about your content or whatever, and I don't know that much about how these economics work, but I don't think they'd really assert that much control or would want to ruin Newgrounds.
Kongregate got sold and it's doing fine. And I think large capitals with these sort of things are crucial. I read that Youtube was beginning to lose money before they were sold to Google.
Tom wrote once that he had a vision for Newgrounds' future, and he hoped this redesign would take them closer to this vision. They're still going through the bugs of the redesign. And having a bigger staff is one thing, but again, I think having to not worry about financial issues is a pretty big other thing.
I'd really like to get people's opinions on the state of things.
At 9/9/12 09:52 AM, 14hourlunchbreak wrote:
SPEAKING OF SPONSORS.
As I'm wrapping up my first sponsor-worthy game, I was thinking about the process, which I've never been involved in.
If I go directly to sponsors would they want me to name a price?
Negotiating is a game. It's basically "He who names the price first, loses". Because if the sponsor names the price first, it may be higher than what you were expecting, so he's lost some money, and if you name the price, the sponsor may have been willing to pay more.
You have two options really. Either tell them you're inexperienced, and can't really judge the monetary value of your game, and ask them to make you an offer. They'll most likely start off with a low offer, and from there you try to raise it.
Or you give them an offer higher than what you're looking for. So they drop down to around your target price.
Also, for anyone that's had a game sold, can you link to the game and how much money you got from the sponsor? I tried looking at some post-mortems for some popular flash games, but hardly anyone mentions how much they got. Are you not allowed to, or is it just taboo?
People just don't like talking about how much money they make, but there are a lot of post mortems out there that mention prices. Here's a nice collection:
At 9/9/12 11:22 AM, ProfessorFlash wrote:
they got so many games offered to them they can just pick the cheapest quality games they get offered. The sponsorship scene used to be much better like 5 years ago, probably cuz there wasn't so many developers back then. Today if you make a good game (good, not great) you will be fighting for scraps (talking like 200-400$ price range). It's sad :(.
It's not necessarily sad. It's true that there are a lot more developers now, and it's true that the bar of quality has risen, but that's an overall good thing. It means people are making better games.
What that means for the individual is that you need to raise your own bar of quality and try to make better games. A "good" game by iOS standards could flop at $500 or something, but that same game may earn $3k or more in flash, just because the bar of quality of mobile is much higher.
What I can say for sure is that there's still a lot of money in flash games. The money is now being shifted towards the top tier of games. A friend of mine just told his game some time ago for $20k, and there are still deals on FGL every other month that go upwards of that. A ton more money is also being made from micro-transactions, that being much more lucrative than the ad/sponsorship model. (Although riskier, as you need to develop a game keeping in mind that you expect people to pay for it)
And I leave you with this article about microtransactions: