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I-smel
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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-18 02:13:30 Reply

At 9/18/12 12:45 AM, Toast wrote:
At 9/17/12 05:10 PM, I-smel wrote: I got COMPLETELY LOST reading that
That's because he's probably using techno-babble and buzzwords to cover the fact that he's having to hack through his convoluted waypoint pathfinding system instead of building an efficient representation of the walkable spaces in his world :P Either that or he built his nodes in the correctly efficient way but didn't use them right yet.

Yea it did seem like he was fancying up words here n there, tbh.
Folk don't "displace vertices" much here on Newgrounds.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-18 02:49:55 Reply

At 9/18/12 02:13 AM, I-smel wrote:
At 9/18/12 12:45 AM, Toast wrote:
At 9/17/12 05:10 PM, I-smel wrote: I got COMPLETELY LOST reading that
That's because he's probably using techno-babble and buzzwords to cover the fact that he's having to hack through his convoluted waypoint pathfinding system instead of building an efficient representation of the walkable spaces in his world :P Either that or he built his nodes in the correctly efficient way but didn't use them right yet.
Yea it did seem like he was fancying up words here n there, tbh.
Folk don't "displace vertices" much here on Newgrounds.

Sorry, I really didn't mean to fancy words up...

I will do a structured right up, I just use words like displace rather than...move? Nevermind.

Toast: I am using a mesh, aka a representation of the walkable spaces in the world. How would you do pathfinding on that? (I figured that pathfinding still boils down to using the vertices (fine, POINTS) of the mesh (shape/area))

And I quickly wrote that after I had just solved it, so yeah, when I just write a quick blurb, it's hard to understand without background knowledge of my whole engine/whatever I'm doing at the time.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-18 18:00:47 Reply

I played around with zombie pathfinding a while ago too (2009 wow)
http://www.newgrounds.com/dump/item/d56e5640470d8a1376c209c7 6ac61018

Click to place 2 'targets' then clicking again places walls

space+click to spawn shitloads of zombies where you click

It uses something called diffusion pathfinding, where the pathfinding data is stored in the map instead of running A* every frame on each zombie. What you do is you put a "scent" on the target, then diffuse the scent throughout the map every frame (have the scent spread to nearby tiles while having the targets place more scent), the zombie pathfinding now just needs to "follow the scent" to find the player. As in, check all the tiles around him, and go to the one with the highest scent. As an added thing, the zombies themselves generate 'negative' scent, and the walls generate negative scent too (which means zombies will avoid each other, and avoid walls), so if one pathway gets flooded with zombies, they'll start filling in the other pathways too.

Its actually fairly simple, all the complicated stuff is just emergent bonuses you get from the simple system underneath

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-18 18:06:52 Reply

At 9/18/12 06:00 PM, Glaiel-Gamer wrote: It uses something called diffusion pathfinding

I remember discussing that a looonnngg while ago, when I made a pathfinder and everyone copied >=(

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-18 18:11:10 Reply

At 9/18/12 06:00 PM, Glaiel-Gamer wrote: I played around with zombie pathfinding a while ago too (2009 wow)
http://www.newgrounds.com/dump/item/d56e5640470d8a1376c209c7 6ac61018

Click to place 2 'targets' then clicking again places walls

space+click to spawn shitloads of zombies where you click

Spent way to much time screwing around with this. Add a title screen and you've got yourself your next Steam title.

Feels like it would work well with slow zombies considering all the zig zagging they do. Would look strange for fast zombies that tend to run in straight lines for the most part. Maybe that's just a matter of changing the negative scent values for walls and zombies? Either way, fun stuff.


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I-smel
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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-18 19:05:45 Reply

At 9/18/12 06:00 PM, Glaiel-Gamer wrote: I played around with zombie pathfinding a while ago too (2009 wow)
http://www.newgrounds.com/dump/item/d56e5640470d8a1376c209c7 6ac61018

Wow that's amazing! I first looked into pathfinding a couple years ago, and it took me like a few days to actually get my head around A*. Once I did it I was like "Oh thank god, I have now worked out pathfinding." (my game Solid Sneak is what I made with it)

Then found out that that's a coding technique they came up with decades ago.

So this is cool, I totally wanna try this.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-18 19:50:05 Reply

At 9/17/12 08:45 PM, MSGhero wrote: And write.

writing something somewhat-decent is actually pretty easy.
You just have to have no idea what the hell you're writing.
And use metaphors.


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MSGhero
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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-18 22:01:45 Reply

At 9/18/12 07:50 PM, egg82 wrote: writing something somewhat-decent is actually pretty easy.
You just have to have no idea what the hell you're writing.
And use metaphors.

...I mean for storylines and stuff lol. I wrote enough bs in my english classes throughout high school and the uni one last year. I want to write a story I actually care about and make it good...plus like designing skills and dialogue and all the stuff my RPG is currently missing.

Writing on my userpage was kinda therapeutic actually, getting ideas off my chest instead of writing about the crap my teacher likes. My engineering graphics class is so time-consuming, though (and I don't have that much to write about) that I can't just sit down whenever I want and write.

Also, Game Jam 8. Can we use pre-existing classes or is that not fair? By pre-existing, I mean like if I made a blitting or basic physics engine, could I use that?

Not the pre-existing classes of an entire game, lol
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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-18 22:15:28 Reply

At 9/18/12 10:01 PM, MSGhero wrote: Also, Game Jam 8. Can we use pre-existing classes or is that not fair? By pre-existing, I mean like if I made a blitting or basic

so soon? :o

i'll see what my weekend's like and if i'm up for another or not. I still remember the last one. 15 Monster energy drinks in 72 hours.
They were on sale.


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-18 22:23:13 Reply

At 9/18/12 06:11 PM, 23450 wrote: Spent way to much time screwing around with this. Add a title screen and you've got yourself your next Steam title.

I actually am working on a zombie game right now, lol. I even made a backstory generator for it today
http://www.newgrounds.com/dump/item/e825b2b7dd58d59b65e0fd73 7c83518f

I won't go into too much other detail for what the same is about though

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-18 22:33:43 Reply

At 9/18/12 10:23 PM, Glaiel-Gamer wrote: I actually am working on a zombie game right now, lol. I even made a backstory generator for it today

"This is Jim. He is a single father with two daughters. They have a dog and a cat."
"Jim has trouble being a full time father."

I wonder why?


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-18 22:44:11 Reply

At 9/18/12 10:23 PM, Glaiel-Gamer wrote: I even made a backstory generator for it today

here's an idea: add ages to the generator as well.

more ideas:
add body types
add personalities

the personalities would be the most difficult, but would be brilliant if you could pull it off successfully (by that I mean integrate it into the game somehow)


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-19 00:08:43 Reply

At 9/18/12 10:15 PM, egg82 wrote: so soon? :o

i'll see what my weekend's like and if i'm up for another or not. I still remember the last one. 15 Monster energy drinks in 72 hours.
They were on sale.

I remember the one I did...back when I kinda knew what was I was doing. Flash decided that a variable would always go to infinity despite it working fine the previous compile (with no changes). Plus some other crap with the art. Hopefully I don't have anything going on cuz I wanna try again. Aka, I'll do hw and studying early since I will guaranteed have something going on.

And wow, dude. Caffeine makes me perform worse at everything, so I've cut it out of my diet. Plus I'm crazy when I'm tired, especially when playing video games, so maybe something interesting and creative would happen :3

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-19 02:22:00 Reply

At 9/18/12 06:00 PM, Glaiel-Gamer wrote: It uses something called diffusion pathfinding, where the pathfinding data is stored in the map instead of running A* every frame on each zombie. What you do is you put a "scent" on the target, then diffuse the scent throughout the map every frame (have the scent spread to nearby tiles while having the targets place more scent), the zombie pathfinding now just needs to "follow the scent" to find the player. As in, check all the tiles around him, and go to the one with the highest scent. As an added thing, the zombies themselves generate 'negative' scent, and the walls generate negative scent too (which means zombies will avoid each other, and avoid walls), so if one pathway gets flooded with zombies, they'll start filling in the other pathways too.

Love that!

I checked that method out, and it might be something I'm up for implementing. Just my focus on this game will be a bit less zombies, but hopefully smarter zombies. More horror oriented than action.
So with A* I can find the 3 shortest paths to the player, and then check what direction the player is facing, where to send the zombie, etc. etc. (To optimize for big crowds, I can divide them into groups of 5 zombies where only 1 does the A*, and the rest follow him)
Though damn...now that I'm thinking about it, that diffusion thing is still definitely crazy useful...if I want to launch hordes at the player.

REALLY cool to hear you're working on a zombie game too! :D But now there's someone else making something similar but better than me :(

P.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-19 09:22:21 Reply

This comic is fucking mindblowing:

http://xkcd.com/1110/

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-19 09:48:56 Reply

At 9/19/12 12:08 AM, MSGhero wrote: I remember the one I did...back when I kinda knew what was I was doing. Flash decided that a variable would always go to infinity despite it working fine the previous compile (with no changes). Plus some other crap with the art. Hopefully I don't have anything going on cuz I wanna try again. Aka, I'll do hw and studying early since I will guaranteed have something going on.

last one I did was with AS2 and the Flash IDE, despite having just leaned AS3 and how to use FD.
I didn't expect it to be anything amazing, and the fact that we scrapped everything and changed tactics in the middle of it didn't help.

So basically I want to correct my mistakes and clear that whole mess from being the last flash i've submitted, but at the same time i'm not sure I want to do this again so soon.

And wow, dude. Caffeine makes me perform worse at everything, so I've cut it out of my diet. Plus I'm crazy when I'm tired, especially when playing video games, so maybe something interesting and creative would happen :3

usually it does. I cheated a little and took a six-hour nap and a four-hour nap, though.


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-19 09:52:26 Reply

At 9/18/12 10:15 PM, egg82 wrote: i'll see what my weekend's like and if i'm up for another or not. I still remember the last one. 15 Monster energy drinks in 72 hours.
They were on sale.

Those things will give you kidney stones and liver damage, y'know.
Might want to cut back. :)

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-19 10:15:54 Reply

At 9/19/12 09:52 AM, Diki wrote: Those things will give you kidney stones and liver damage, y'know.
Might want to cut back. :)

so I heard. First time in a long time i've even touched an energy drink, and I haven't looked at once since, so I think i'm okay :P


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-19 19:24:11 Reply

At 9/19/12 02:22 AM, PSvils wrote: REALLY cool to hear you're working on a zombie game too! :D But now there's someone else making something similar but better than me :(

P.

Rule of thumb: There is ALWAYS someone making your game but better.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-19 20:50:43 Reply

At 9/19/12 07:24 PM, I-smel wrote: Rule of thumb: There is ALWAYS someone making your game but better.

I like that way of thinking.
It's kinda like sneaking in a large memory buffer to your game and then removing it after it's polished. (neat little tip I picked up not too long ago)

The overall effect is the same: A game that's a hell of a lot better than you would have done otherwise.


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-19 21:40:24 Reply

At 9/19/12 07:24 PM, I-smel wrote: Rule of thumb: There is ALWAYS someone making your game but better.

Do you have time to explain that?

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-19 23:38:40 Reply

At 9/19/12 09:40 PM, NeNe wrote: Do you have time to explain that?

If you constantly think that there's someone making something better, then you're constantly pushing yourself to make something better. There's no point in making something if there's already something better out there, so either you quit or you wind up making the best game you possibly can.

It somewhat the same with putting in a memory buffer or a CPU-eater before you start making something. If you design everything to not take too much memory or CPU while that buffer is in, once you take it out it'll use almost nothing at all and be lightning-fast.

Half the battle is the mindset you put yourself in.


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-20 03:03:56 Reply

At 9/19/12 09:40 PM, NeNe wrote:
At 9/19/12 07:24 PM, I-smel wrote: Rule of thumb: There is ALWAYS someone making your game but better.
Do you have time to explain that?

Not only do I have time to explain it; I have Crunchdown, Duck Sim, Robot Dinosaurs, April & Booster and Legend of JOHNNY to explain it.

If you're spending 6 months on a game, rest assured that a team of 20 people somewhere is in like their 2nd year on it.
Actually that'll be a good thread for when Newgrounds has it's game development forum: What Game Is The Better Version of Games You've Made.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-20 09:29:54 Reply

At 9/20/12 03:03 AM, I-smel wrote: If you're spending 6 months on a game, rest assured that a team of 20 people somewhere is in like their 2nd year on it.

That's the more depressing side of that coin :P


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-20 10:53:35 Reply

At 9/20/12 09:29 AM, egg82 wrote:
At 9/20/12 03:03 AM, I-smel wrote: If you're spending 6 months on a game, rest assured that a team of 20 people somewhere is in like their 2nd year on it.
That's the more depressing side of that coin :P

But my idea is original! Nobody else has ever thought of it, and I can definitely make this game rock the hell out of any other game ever made!

Sonic tribute...
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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-20 11:02:45 Reply

^ you can say all that but many games that are considered 'original' are just a mix of old game mechanics. This isn't even a bad thing at all really, but the game you make has to deliver an experience that is pure. Thats why many games that leave a strong impression build around this one idea.
Looking at Closure, this game has a unique element of dark / light mixed with collision detection, and many used mechanics like a 2d platformer and puzzle mechanics and linear level design. It does the dark / light thing so well the entire game can be build around it and be successful!

My point is that its easy to say that everything has been done before, but it takes some deeper thinking to come up with an element or combination of elements that is unique.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-20 11:34:48 Reply

I very much disagree with all of this. Given the astounding amount of game releases nowadays, there are surprisingly few good games out there. What I find most lacking in games that I play or hear about is combat mechanics and cinematics / atmospheric tension.


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-20 11:54:01 Reply

At 9/20/12 11:34 AM, Toast wrote: I very much disagree with all of this. Given the astounding amount of game releases nowadays, there are surprisingly few good games out there. What I find most lacking in games that I play or hear about is combat mechanics and cinematics / atmospheric tension.

True say!

A lot of attention and game theory in the last few years has been around games being fun, which may not be the best thing for all games.

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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-20 12:29:34 Reply

At 9/20/12 11:54 AM, PSvils wrote: A lot of attention and game theory in the last few years has been around games being fun, which may not be the best thing for all games.

I'm not quite sure I understand. Care to elaborate?


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Response to The Flash 'Reg' Lounge 2012-09-20 12:37:04 Reply

At 9/20/12 12:29 PM, egg82 wrote:
At 9/20/12 11:54 AM, PSvils wrote: A lot of attention and game theory in the last few years has been around games being fun, which may not be the best thing for all games.
I'm not quite sure I understand. Care to elaborate?

To explain in short, I'll steal something what one of the creators of Amnesia and Penumbra said in one of his blogposts:

"Schindler's List" might not be a movie that people refer to as "fun", but it's still an exceptional movie in so many ways.

In that same way, games don't have to be fun to be good games. And what I mean by that even further, is that a lot of the time people recycle old ideas, but add on features features features, and try to make them more fun, usually missing the whole point of the original game, and hence making a shitty one.
Of course there are lots of games that are meant to be fun, and work well like that, but...there's so much more than fun to explore! :D

That's why I'm going to try and focus my game not on having a lot of action, but really try and making every second count/being meaty in a storyline/atmosphere kind of sense.