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At 3/18/03 11:43 PM, My-anus-is-BLEEDING wrote:

And Tofu is tasty..

i have to agree with you there...

Weither you like tofu and all that other stuff or not is a matter of taste. Personally i quite like it.

Carnivorian animals, they don't know any better.
And their digestion system needs meat. Ours don't. Just look at us: no claws, no sharp teeth, very weak compared to carnivorian animals. We are not meant to eat meat.

Further more, you don't say it's murder? Than please give me your defenition of murder. Mine is: killing someone when it's not self defence or anything like that. And killing an animal just because you're spoiled and want to have some food that you don't really need, that's murder!

And if we let our livestock loose in nature right now, of course, that won't work. We just have to stop overbreeding them and keep a few as pets. Easy as kissing an elephant's butt.

If you eat meat, you are selfish. And that's the final word. (I wish)

At 3/19/03 09:16 AM, Veggiemeal wrote: Weither you like tofu and all that other stuff or not is a matter of taste. Personally i quite like it.

that'll be the only time i concure with you here.

Carnivorian animals, they don't know any better.

so they eat meat because they're stupid. try feeding a tiger salad, it'll die.

And their digestion system needs meat. Ours don't.

while it may not NEED meat, it is designed to function at best with a meat-encompassing diet.

Just look at us: ...no sharp teeth,

canines, moron. have you ever bitten your lip with those before? i you had, you'd agree that they're quite sharp.

Further more, you don't say it's murder? Than please give me your defenition of murder. Mine is: killing someone when it's not self defence or anything like that.

murder is the impractical killing of another human.

And killing an animal just because you're spoiled and want to have some food that you don't really need, that's murder!

so i eat meat because i lack dicipline?

And if we let our livestock loose in nature right now, of course, that won't work. We just have to stop overbreeding them and keep a few as pets. Easy as kissing an elephant's butt.

that would be completely impractical. who do you think would be responsible for doing that? if you want to, go ahead. just don't use taxdollars to do it.

If you eat meat, you are selfish. And that's the final word. (I wish)

denied. so i suppose all carnivores are stupid AND selfish...

Veggiemeal, if you're so behind the statement that "Meat is Murder" then you wouldn't be wearing or using leather, eating eggs, using glue, driving a car, using money (It's paper, which comes from trees, which are being cut down, destroying an animals habitat).

If you were really serious about your statement, "Meat is Murder" then you would go Vegan. I eat meat, and I like it a lot, I can't be perfect like you, and live in a little hut where I sit in a corner curled up into a ball, eating only tofu for the rest of my life and living in harmony with fellow creatures.

Go away.

Everyone eats meat, even if its shoved down your throat as a little baby. Even the Turkish who are going to be eating the bodies of the dead Iraqis. Ew.

At 3/19/03 10:44 PM, JudgeMeHarshX wrote: Everyone eats meat, even if its shoved down your throat as a little baby. Even the Turkish who are going to be eating the bodies of the dead Iraqis. Ew.

that's just uncalled for...but true

At 3/19/03 10:44 PM, JudgeMeHarshX wrote: Everyone eats meat, even if its shoved down your throat as a little baby. Even the Turkish who are going to be eating the bodies of the dead Iraqis. Ew.

"Who wants this leg?! Any takers?"

From PleaseEatTastyAnimals?

At 2/25/03 01:49 AM, jazz_mazter wrote: Might as well get used to it, unless you want to buy expensive imported foreign meats. If you were given two 'medium rare strip steak,' one from an animal given hormone boosters or any other genetic 'enhancement' and another that was all natural, you wouldn't be able to tell any difference, nor would you feel any different. Same goes with wheat or rice, too. Embrace the future, it's going to save lives.

I agree. Forget what you hear about how this or that is raised and/or slaughtered. A simple fact of life: Humans are the dominant force in today's world. What does that mean? Due to our very nature we will change our environment to suit us.

2000 years ago, it was called selective breeding. It was used to produce animals with characteristics we found suitable. See also: Dog.

Today we use hormone therapy. We use genetic manipulation. We also still force animals who may not like each other to fuck because we want a faster racehorse, a smaller chihuahua, and a beefier cow.

GET OVER IT

I personally don't care what living conditions animals go through to become my hamburger. Really. Unless they deliver some superstrain of Ebola or something nasty like that, I really don't care. Why? Because animals have feelings. They do think. They are capable of caring and hating. But they aren't human. There is this thing... it's called the food chain. And just because our species has the unique ability to choose their position on the food chain doesn't mean we should all go straight to the bottom. I like meat. I LOOOOOOOVE a big, juicy steak. Shark tastes good, too. Fish is nice, especially with a good wine, and bacon, bacon, sweet jesus BACON!!! I mean really... BACON!!! I also love eggs. I once broke open an egg with a half-developed chik inside. it was disgusting. So I ate a hot dog.

Food is food. I think that animals should be treated with respect (no sticking fire-crackers in a cat's ass for me [ although it is tempting....] ). But if the animal in question is my next meal-
Pet, stroke, pet, stroke, 'calm down... it's ok...' CHOP!

Humans are omnivores. We weren't designed to be strictly vegan or strictly carnivorous. So get real, already.

The people who piss me off the most are the ones who drink organic (or soy) milk, and take hormone replacement therapy for their own good. So I hate the hypocrites. And all furry-huggin vegans are hypocrites because it's true- harvest kills animals, too.
-
On a side note, ths cartoon doesn't fit what I said, but I think it should go in with this topic. Long Live Larson.

Just though I'd let the Veggie-heads know what they are up for...

PleaseEatTastyAnimals?

This topic is obviously just a spoof off my anti-vegan topic made a couple weeks ago (it was so cleaverly titled PleaseEatTastyAnimals). Nice try, pal... but if you wanna know people's opinions, why don't you back track a bit and chest out all 3 pages (or was it 4) on this exact same idea, under the topic I started? Just a hint... Maybe you should try to be more original...

i don't see what the big fuss is about.I mean i am a vegetarian and i like being a vegitarian becouse it is healthy and i don't like to eat dead animals!

We are indeed dominant and powerfull. We have the power to control other speeches. But we are abusing that power. That is not good. It is never good to kill someone else. Animals have feelings too. They're not human. SO WHAT?!!! If i say: "I think it's OK to kill a negro, cause he's not white", you will all call me a racist, and you're fucking right. But the same goes for animals. Just because they have different genotypes doesn't mean we are allowed to torture them!

The unique thing about us humans is that we can choose what we eat! Than choose wise! Show that you have a heart and don't kill animals for meat wich you can replace with other food. That's just not right, no matter what stupid argument you use to defend it!

At 3/20/03 09:05 AM, Veggiemeal wrote: We are indeed dominant and powerfull. We have the power to control other speeches.

Well, make sure Bush doesn't go 'mispronounciating' words, then. Nah, I'm just playing with you, I got the point of your post, and we do tend to abuse the power we have over other animals. I mean, do you think that little dog looking at you hasn't plotted your death a thousand times over?

If I told you I was going to go on a mass murder spree and kill hundreds of people and you were the only one who could stop me, wouldn't you? Even if it meant you had to kill me? I would hope so. I would if I was in that situation.

Well, if you would, then by your logic you should kill me and anyone else who refuses to eat vegetarian. If you consider that killing an animal for food is no different from killing a negro because they're black, then what's the difference? I have killed and will continue to kill animals for food and clothing. The police will not, the animals cannot stop me. You could though, but only by killing me. If you have the courage of your convitions, shouldn't you take up arms in the name of your animal brothers? If I'm a mass murderer, stop me before I have dinner again. Or should you, perhaps, examine those convictions to see how much sense they really make.

I don't care what you eat. Meat? Vegetables? Shit? Doesn't matter to me. I don't like being told I'm a murderer though.

From a more scientific direction, why do we have canine teeth? They are only used in nature for ripping meat. Why is our digestive system so short? While it is proportionally slightly longer than the average carnivore, it is much shorter than the average herbivore. This indicates, as does our dentition, that humans are by nature omnivores, meant for a balanced diet of plants and meat.

Oh, and the argument that eating vegetarian is healthier doesn't hold water. It is healthier than guzzling red meat by the truckload, but a balanced diet that includes small amounts of red meat, larger amounts of leaner meats like chicken, and especially fish, mixed with plenty of fruits and vegetables is healthier than just fruits and vegetables alone. The key is balance. Both extremes are harmful, it's best to stick to the middle.

Now, if you'll excuse me, my fish dinner is ready.

At 3/20/03 08:24 AM, aligindahouse wrote: i don't see what the big fuss is about.I mean i am a vegetarian and i like being a vegitarian becouse it is healthy and i don't like to eat dead animals!

i don't see what the big fuss is about.I mean i am an omnivore and i like being a omnivore because it is healthy and i don't like to eat just veggetables!

that reminds me, i turned a vegitarian into a normal human being. meaning i turned her on to meat. heh heh.

to the vegans - are you people serious?

i am very biased on this subject because i was not raised in a city, but on a farm. so i guess this makes me a mass murderer, doesnt it? i grew up eating meat with every meal, now im in college and all they serve is imitation meat (tofu). i assure you that even though i did eat all those delicious farm animals, i am in great health.

many have pointed out to you that humans have canines, but some also have extremely sharp bicuspids (those are the teeth behind the canines), like myself. Does this make me lower than you weed eaters on the evolutionary scale? of course not, and if you say it does, then why are you defending your furry friends? and to the guy who says that when he gets to Heaven he will be able to say he never killed, theres something you should know...

God created the animals for man to do with as he pleased

im no Biblical scholar, but this is from the Bible (not an exact quote, but all well), and that would include eating animals.

i just cant wait to go home, have 6 eggs, tons of bacon, 3 glasses of milk, and toast with LOTS of butter for breakfast........a couple of bacon cheeseburers for lunch.........and a huge steak for dinner.

thats a real menu, city soy boy

At 3/21/03 10:51 AM, fourdaddy wrote:

God created the animals for man to do with as he pleased

actually, if you're trying to get a Biblical stametment, here it is.

God gave humans "dominion" over all other creatures of the earth.

I was a vegaterian for a month, it was hell. Then I went to a BBQ and they had ribs Mmmmmmm sweet rib meat.

As a strength sports and general fitness enthusiast (Ok, a jock) diet is a very important factor in general health, for athlete, and everyone else. Extended vegetarianism is known to cause health issues such as thin hair, stomach problems, anemia, hyperglycemia, migraines and weak bones/joints. Most of your body is made up of proteins. You don’t get enough of the essential Amino Acids in vegetables.

When preparing for shows and contests, I go on a simi-vegetarianism diet. Eggs, milk yogurt, and cheese make excellent sources of proper protein, and are very health. But this is only for the last few weeks, and I still get he proper about of animal protein. Show me ONE Professional Athlete who is good, and is a true vegetarian. You will not find one, they all at least get animal by-products, like milk. These are people who make a living by being health.

So, how can something so “moral” be so unhealthy for you?

At 3/21/03 07:51 PM, MuscleHed wrote: ...diet is a very important factor in general health, for athlete, and everyone else. Extended vegetarianism is known to cause health issues such as thin hair, stomach problems, anemia, hyperglycemia, migraines and weak bones/joints. Most of your body is made up of proteins. You don’t get enough of the essential Amino Acids in vegetables.

well said. this makes my point. eating only veggetables isn't healthier and can cause health problems.

I have been a vegetarian for 1 1/2 years for health and will probably continue for the rest of my life. To those who say vegetarianism in unhealthy, you are wrong. Here are several facts showing how beign a vegetarian is good for you.

FACT: Animal proteins, especially those found in red meat are not heathy. They are processed very inefficiently and generate excess amino acids which the body can't absorb. These excess amino acids weaken bone structure. Hense vegetable proteins found in lentils and nuts are better for you.

FACT: It has been shown through many studys that vegetarianism increases longegivity

FACT: Red meat is notiorious for having bad cholesterol that clog up arteries and cause heart attacks.

FACT: One does not need to eat meat in order to be strong. Several Olympic athletes have been vegetarians. Moreover, look at gorillas.

Just to set the record straight...

what REALLY gets me is "veggetarians" who eat fish. how can that be right??

Actually, I think the whole thing with vegetarians vs omnivores is getting kinda silly. It's not like either side is arguing with someone who is listening.

Question: If we weren't meant to eat the animals, then why are they made of meat? And... how many vegitables had to die for your stupid salad? I mean, c'mon man! At least the animals can fight back (by that, I mean wild animals... i.e. hunting; the real way meat should be harvested!)! Remember, plants ar eliving creatures too... they grow and reproduce, and have feelings and can communicate! Don't believe me? Turn Pagan and go talk to a damn tree! They don't like being cut down, but hey, we need them, don't we?

...once again, just my stupid, unwanted opinion... v_v

At 3/23/03 12:44 AM, kittie_cross wrote: Question: If we weren't meant to eat the animals, then why are they made of meat? And... how many vegitables had to die for your stupid salad? I mean, c'mon man! At least the animals can fight back (by that, I mean wild animals... i.e. hunting; the real way meat should be harvested!)! Remember, plants ar eliving creatures too... they grow and reproduce, and have feelings and can communicate! Don't believe me? Turn Pagan and go talk to a damn tree! They don't like being cut down, but hey, we need them, don't we?

...once again, just my stupid, unwanted opinion... v_v

Don't be hard on yourself, I thought it was a great opinion to a certain extent. Plants do go into a state of shock when hurt, anyone who says they are less of a life then an animals, they have some serious issues.

At 3/22/03 11:37 PM, Disguy_youknow wrote: I have been a vegetarian for 1 1/2 years for health and will probably continue for the rest of my life. To those who say vegetarianism in unhealthy, you are wrong. Here are several facts showing how beign a vegetarian is good for you.

FACT: Animal proteins, especially those found in red meat are not heathy. They are processed very inefficiently and generate excess amino acids which the body can't absorb. These excess amino acids weaken bone structure. Hense vegetable proteins found in lentils and nuts are better for you.

Animal protein IS healthy. You have been lied to if you think it is not. Yes, EXCESS animal protein will make Animal protein excess in your body. For a time. Don’t buy into the garbage that is stays in your system. It is crapped out. Lentils and nuts don’t have all the proper Amino Acids. See, out of the tons of Amino Acids, there are 13 essential, and the only way to get all 13 in the right amount is though animal protein! Lentils and nuts don’t have all 13. They all have bits and pieces. On top of that, do you realize how little protein is in them? Do you realize how much your would have to eat to get proper protein?

FACT: It has been shown through many studys that vegetarianism increases longegivity

What studies? I can find studies staying the Adkins diet is healthier, doesn’t mean it is true. I can find studies that say being a vegetarians is unhealthy, even! Studies don’t mean anything, studies are just a stepping stone on the scientific method. They have a study that proves everything under the sun.

FACT: Red meat is notiorious for having bad cholesterol that clog up arteries and cause heart attacks.

So, what is wrong with Fish, poultry, and dairy protein? You can also by Lean Beef, that is health for you. Even pork has been lowered in fat now!

FACT: One does not need to eat meat in order to be strong. Several Olympic athletes have been vegetarians. Moreover, look at gorillas.

Tell me the name of one? The only Professional Athlete who is close to being a vegetarianism I know of is a Body Builder in the Golden Age named Bill Pearl. And he did eat Dairy and eggs. However, there where at least 20 other guys better then him at the time, and they ALL eat red and white meat. GORILLAS? WHAT!? You are basing your knowledge on that of another animal!? DO you realize how unique and specific human philology is? Clearing not. And this is based on fact! If you want to talk about animals, what about Tigers? What about loins? What about Bears? What about wolves? You apes friends have a longer digestive tracked and a large colon, so that the plants stay in their longer, and digest more. They have evolved to a fully vegetarians diet for Millions of years of only eating Plants. We human, like lions, tigers, and bears, never evolved to the level where we can eat all vegetables and fruits and get the full benefit like apes and other animals do.

Just to set the record straight...

Well, try again. And please, be more careful next time when you label things as facts.

i'm glad i eat kosher food....

At 3/23/03 01:19 AM, MuscleHed wrote:

At 3/22/03 11:37 PM, Disguy_youknow wrote: I have been a vegetarian for 1 1/2 years for health and will probably continue for the rest of my life. To those who say vegetarianism in unhealthy, you are wrong. Here are several facts showing how beign a vegetarian is good for you.

FACT: Animal proteins, especially those found in red meat are not heathy. They are processed very inefficiently and generate excess amino acids which the body can't absorb. These excess amino acids weaken bone structure. Hense vegetable proteins found in lentils and nuts are better for you.

Animal protein IS healthy. You have been lied to if you think it is not. Yes, EXCESS animal protein will make Animal protein excess in your body. For a time. Don’t buy into the garbage that is stays in your system. It is crapped out. Lentils and nuts don’t have all the proper Amino Acids. See, out of the tons of Amino Acids, there are 13 essential, and the only way to get all 13 in the right amount is though animal protein! Lentils and nuts don’t have all 13. They all have bits and pieces. On top of that, do you realize how little protein is in them? Do you realize how much your would have to eat to get proper protein?

I never said excess animal proteins stay in the system. I said they were not absorbed, which is true. They are broken down after they linger on the bone structure, and then are finally crapped out. Furthmore, the amount of protein the human body needs has been seriously miscalculated by "experts" who work for meat companies. "Proper protein" isn't that much say experts which are unalligned to meat companies, and the 2 or 3 amino acids that meat has which vegetables largly don't aren't needed to be comsumed as they are the type which are easily manufactured by the body.

FACT: It has been shown through many studys that vegetarianism increases longegivity

What studies? I can find studies staying the Adkins diet is healthier, doesn’t mean it is true. I can find studies that say being a vegetarians is unhealthy, even! Studies don’t mean anything, studies are just a stepping stone on the scientific method. They have a study that proves everything under the sun.

Okay, here you are pretty much attacking the scientific method as a whole. Proper studies use the scientific method, they are not a "stepping stone" as you say. The studies about the Atkins diet focus largly on wieght loss and not longegivity. As for the studies which say vegetarianism is bad, almost all of them use surveys, which are extremely unreliable. Since vegetarianism has been around for a while, accurate demographic data has been compiles and shown that vegetarians live, on average 7.4 years longer then omnivores.

FACT: Red meat is notiorious for having bad cholesterol that clog up arteries and cause heart attacks.

So, what is wrong with Fish, poultry, and dairy protein? You can also by Lean Beef, that is health for you. Even pork has been lowered in fat now!

My comment about red meat was largly to rebut a earlier statement about how red meat is good. Fish, poultry, beef, and pork are damaging to the heart as well, just not as much as red meat.

FACT: One does not need to eat meat in order to be strong. Several Olympic athletes have been vegetarians. Moreover, look at gorillas.

Tell me the name of one? The only Professional Athlete who is close to being a vegetarianism I know of is a Body Builder in the Golden Age named Bill Pearl. And he did eat Dairy and eggs. However, there where at least 20 other guys better then him at the time, and they ALL eat red and white meat. GORILLAS? WHAT!? You are basing your knowledge on that of another animal!? DO you realize how unique and specific human philology is? Clearing not. And this is based on fact! If you want to talk about animals, what about Tigers? What about loins? What about Bears? What about wolves? You apes friends have a longer digestive tracked and a large colon, so that the plants stay in their longer, and digest more. They have evolved to a fully vegetarians diet for Millions of years of only eating Plants. We human, like lions, tigers, and bears, never evolved to the level where we can eat all vegetables and fruits and get the full benefit like apes and other animals do.

Tell you the name of one other than Bill Peral? Sure. How about Carl Lewis? He set the world record for the 100-meter dash, won two gold medals, and had the best long jump series of his career wqhen he went on a vegetarian diet. I am not making the point that being a vegetarian makes you strong. I'm saying that you don't need meat to be strong; you just need exercise. As for your speal about gorrilas, consider this. We share 99% of our DNA with monkeys. The type on monkey we evolved from ate plants whenever possible and only turned to meat as a last resort when other food stuffs were not availible. We don't get as much as pure vegetarians from vegetables, but we get guite enough. Your comment on lions, tigers and, bears simply are not applicible, as those animals have digestive processes much different from ours, and can deal with the negative parts of animal protein.

Just to set the record straight...

Well, try again. And please, be more careful next time when you label things as facts.

You agreed with the my lkast three facts; you just differed in your interpretation. Moreover, my first point is backed by science, the methodology to determine facts.

At 3/23/03 06:12 PM, Disguy_youknow wrote:

I never said excess animal proteins stay in the system. I said they were not absorbed, which is true.

Your right, I said that, I was correcting you.

They are broken down after they linger on the bone structure, and then are finally crapped out. Furthmore, the amount of protein the human body needs has been seriously miscalculated by "experts" who work for meat companies. "Proper protein" isn't that much say experts which are unalligned to meat companies, and the 2 or 3 amino acids that meat has which vegetables largly don't aren't needed to be comsumed as they are the type which are easily manufactured by the body.

Say what? What? The Bones? What? Are you joking? Medical Text books document the importance of eating animal meat! I have never read anything ever saying Protein is stored in the bones!

Okay, here you are pretty much attacking the scientific method as a whole. Proper studies use the scientific method, they are not a "stepping stone" as you say. The studies about the Atkins diet focus largly on wieght loss and not longegivity. As for the studies which say vegetarianism is bad, almost all of them use surveys, which are extremely unreliable. Since vegetarianism has been around for a while, accurate demographic data has been compiles and shown that vegetarians live, on average 7.4 years longer then omnivores.

No, I am informing you as to what the Scientific Method is. It is a process by which we prove or disprove theories. Studies are only one of the steps. Studies are a part of the Method, please tell me your not trying to argue with of all things! Vegetarianism, yes, we can argue that intelligibly, but every 5th grade science student learns the Scientific method! Again, I ask you to show me these studies! We can quote scientific finds all day, but I want to see some documented proof! Besides, there is just as many studies saying Vegetarianism is unhealthy, so it’s a 2 edged sword.

My comment about red meat was largly to rebut a earlier statement about how red meat is good. Fish, poultry, beef, and pork are damaging to the heart as well, just not as much as red meat.

Never heard of that. That is the first time I have ever heard someone say Chicken, when prepared properly, is unhealthy!

Tell you the name of one other than Bill Peral? Sure. How about Carl Lewis? He set the world record for the 100-meter dash, won two gold medals, and had the best long jump series of his career wqhen he went on a vegetarian diet. I am not making the point that being a vegetarian makes you strong. I'm saying that you don't need meat to be strong; you just need exercise. As for your speal about gorrilas, consider this. We share 99% of our DNA with monkeys. The type on monkey we evolved from ate plants whenever possible and only turned to meat as a last resort when other food stuffs were not availible. We don't get as much as pure vegetarians from vegetables, but we get guite enough. Your comment on lions, tigers and, bears simply are not applicible, as those animals have digestive processes much different from ours, and can deal with the negative parts of animal protein.

As for Carl Lewis, let me ask you with, when did he win his Gold Medals? In the 1984 Olympics he own four gold medals, the first from the100. With a burst that was clocked at 28 mph at the finish, Lewis won by eight feet, a record. He had a 10-year unbeaten streak in all events, till the 1991 World Championships, he got owned by Mike Powell. He started his vagen diet in 1990. The point is, in the 1980’s, when he was still an omnivore, he won more races, and by a much widen margin. He is still a great athlete, but he got progressive worst as he started eating his new diet. He made the hall of fame in 1984, and not 1990 or any time later.

Bro, look up “gorilla diet” on a search engine, and look for a Zoology or otherwise scientific site, not a vegan site, and they will confirm what I have said. Gorilla’s diet are different because their philology is different. Call me when you have black hair growing all over your body and you can climb trees with your toes!

You agreed with the my lkast three facts; you just differed in your interpretation. Moreover, my first point is backed by science, the methodology to determine facts.

Is it? Really? Show me, and NOT in a Vegetarian site, either. Show me in a Scientific site! I just finished looking though “the Textbook of Medical Physiology” by Arthur C. Guyton, M.D., and it said nothing about Protein being stored in the bones. Are you telling me the foremost textbook for medical knowledge is wrong and you are right? Product some proof, buddy, or don’t quote science!