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Hey Skunk, how are you liking your Mini? Hopefully will be getting mine early next year depending on how much college is gonna cost my wife and I since we are starting it.

Anyways, I'll believe the $2.00 a gallon when I see it. With the Iran situation right now, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if it ended up staying where it is now, or going higher depending on what happens there.

in the uk oil is about £1 per liter (thats $1.90 case you don't know)

You are all worng. The only reason its going so low is the upcoming elections in November. As soon as its over, bet money it skyrockets up to $3+ again. make that $5 if the deomocrats win as the republicans will get thieir oil company associates to jack it up sothey can blame the dems.

Get that tinfoil hat out, it's Goosebump.

At 8/31/06 03:29 PM, JMHX wrote: Get that tinfoil hat out, it's Goosebump.

Haven't you heard? It's all the rage in Paris.

At 8/31/06 03:29 PM, JMHX wrote: Get that tinfoil hat out, it's Goosebump.

OHHH mr. politican is running scared. Its funny how you and discredit my opinion even though it is valid as everyone elses. OF course you felt the need to repsond to mine becuase you know it makes the most sense. Oh yes, reality and its liberal bias......

You're right, it's ALL an elaborate election-year scheme, an evil plot by Republicans to keep their hands in the international pie, trilateral commission, Skull and Bones, vast right wing conspiracy etc. etc.

Can't just be economics. Impossible. It's the shadow agency that gives George Bush his marching orders.

At 8/31/06 03:52 PM, JMHX wrote: You're right, it's ALL an elaborate election-year scheme, an evil plot by Republicans to keep their hands in the international pie, trilateral commission, Skull and Bones, vast right wing conspiracy etc. etc.

Can't just be economics. Impossible. It's the shadow agency that gives George Bush his marching orders.

Oh im not saying it cant be economics. Just rememebr its all based on a nubmer in a computer that can be easily changed. Something to think about.

At 8/31/06 03:57 PM, gooze_bump wrote:

At 8/31/06 03:52 PM, JMHX wrote:

Oh im not saying it cant be economics. Just rememebr its all based on a nubmer in a computer that can be easily changed. Something to think about.

You really have no goddamned idea what you're talking about.

At 8/31/06 12:00 PM, red_skunk wrote:

At 8/31/06 11:50 AM, Tomsan wrote: it doesnt matter what kinda car I drive. because thats a choice you can make.

Is it? What about the fact that the automakers market / sell larger cars to the American market? My car is about the smallest you can buy new in the US, yet it's a midsize in Europe. You could argue that the market has decided this, but myself as an individual consumer, is still limited.

Maybe you cant buy cars as small as the ford -k or the smart, but you can buy normal size cars and efficient car. So the argument Proteas gave is invalid. The point is that americans dont know how good they have it, and still whine alot about oil prices.

At 8/31/06 12:30 PM, Proteas wrote: At 8/31/06 11:50 AM, Tomsan wrote: lol, no! whats your point?

My point was that you don't have to buy as much gas to fill up your car, so 6.83 a gallon for gas wouldn't put near as big a ding in your budget as it would mine. Or perhaps it works out about the same, w/e.

?? how so? I dont understand you? you say that, because your car has a bigger tank you pay more then I??? are you retarded? I already said the effiency of the car is an option so that doesnt count. I assume you didnt mean that anyway because you left it out of your quote!

its your own choice to buy a benzine slurping jeep

Besides, you have more access to public transportation in your country. In simple terms, fewer people driving = higher gas costs for those who do, that way the oil company can make a profit doing business there.

lol, dont you have it upside down? fewer people driving=lower gas costs. its a matter of "vraag en aanbod" (I dont know how to translate). if fewer people want to buy bread and buy crackers instead, the price of the bread goes down and the price of the crackers go up.

but I dont really believe your statement anyway: we have more acces to public transportation??? could be, but gimme proof!

anyway I hope your done now?

At 8/31/06 03:59 PM, JMHX wrote:

At 8/31/06 03:57 PM, gooze_bump wrote:

At 8/31/06 03:52 PM, JMHX wrote:

Oh im not saying it cant be economics. Just rememebr its all based on a nubmer in a computer that can be easily changed. Something to think about.

You really have no goddamned idea what you're talking about.

REally now? Dont the feds release the numbers daily? Where do u think all that info. is stored? Its not like they have accounting checking for every peace of item sold trade or bartered in the US.

That would be wonderfull.

At 8/31/06 01:00 PM, ReiperX wrote: Hey Skunk, how are you liking your Mini? Hopefully will be getting mine early next year depending on how much college is gonna cost my wife and I since we are starting it.

It's so friggin sweet. But you'll be getting a re-designed turbo model, waiting till next year. Slight exterior / interior redesign, completely new engine. Suppose to be a lot more economical. Should be interesting seeing how the redesign comes out!

At 8/31/06 04:20 PM, Tomsan wrote: Maybe you cant buy cars as small as the ford -k or the smart, but you can buy normal size cars and efficient car. So the argument Proteas gave is invalid. The point is that americans dont know how good they have it, and still whine alot about oil prices.

Normal and efficient are relative. I just said that what's normal and efficient in Europe differs from what's in America. I forget Proteas' argument, but you're wrong regardless. Strictly comparing gas prices between the US and Europe doesn't tell us anything about the relative strains / PITA that high prices have on the two respective places.

REally now? Dont the feds release the numbers daily? Where do u think all that info. is stored? Its not like they have accounting checking for every peace of item sold trade or bartered in the US.

The market price of gas in the United States is governed, like everything else, by supply and demand (obviously the cost of taxes, marketing transportation, etc., also have to be taken into account). The price of gas cannot be arbitrarily changed to suit a politician's taste.

http://www.eia.doe.g..ces/html/petbro.html

At 8/31/06 03:18 PM, gooze_bump wrote: You are all worng. The only reason its going so low is the upcoming elections in November. As soon as its over, bet money it skyrockets up to $3+ again. make that $5 if the deomocrats win as the republicans will get thieir oil company associates to jack it up sothey can blame the dems.

He's right you know... republicans are assholes, there is nothing more I can say about that. No truly there isn't, because soon some assholes will prove my point on that.

We wouldn't be in this situation by the way, if we had done what George Washington had said, "God DAMN IT! Didn't I told you no political parties?"

We would or at least should be voting for people base on their character and not by their political affiliation. But this is what happens when you have Commonfolk (Dems) vs. Aristocrats (Rep).

But it isn't America's fault other than being founded by Roman principles, including the continual struggle between patricians and pebleians.

The market price of gas in the United States is governed, like everything else, by supply and demand (obviously the cost of taxes, marketing transportation, etc., also have to be taken into account). The price of gas cannot be arbitrarily changed to suit a politician's taste.

That does'nt eman jack *hit if you have a big Influence with OPEC, and those big multi-NAtionals whoa ctually set the price for unrefined crude.

we don't have help from "mommy" -Express-.. we have houses to and other finances to take care of plus we have P13 (our currency)/liter of gas..

freaking hell they need to think of better solutions to run stuff on. its a joke

At 8/31/06 04:20 PM, Tomsan wrote:

At 8/31/06 12:00 PM, red_skunk wrote:

At 8/31/06 11:50 AM, Tomsan wrote:

Maybe you cant buy cars as small as the ford -k or the smart, but you can buy normal size cars and efficient car. So the argument Proteas gave is invalid. The point is that americans dont know how good they have it, and still whine alot about oil prices.

Public transportation is relatively limited here compared to Europe. Not only that, but our population is much more spread out. For example, most white collar work for corporations is concentrated in northern New Jersey. In my state, there are only three train lines. In order to get to a train that leads north, I'd have to take at least one bus a good twent miles north, which would be local and take an hour to arrive at the train station. Then, I'd have to catch that train, and then another bus or a cab to get north. It would take too long.

Now, if we took my old car, a 95 neon with a manual transmission (which had more gears and hence more efficient power and fuel usage), it would take about two gallons of gas to traverse the same distance, or about $6.00, and that would be one way. Thus, $12 a day to go to work. Mind you, the only cars that get better gas mileage that that new are the civic, insight, and the prius. The two hybrids themselves usually only max out in practical driving at most 45 mpg. Now, all of the above takes place in a state that has one of the highest population densities in the country. Imagine how much worse it is in the midwest, where miles per person is a more convenient means of measuring population density than people per mile.

At 8/31/06 12:30 PM, Proteas wrote: At 8/31/06 11:50 AM, Tomsan wrote: lol, no! whats your point?

its your own choice to buy a benzine slurping jeep

True, and I'm against that when it's unnecessary (exception being pickups and vans for delivery and construction). The problem is that even with hybrids, the average person commuting to work is still going to be spending at least $6.00 a day on gas.

lol, dont you have it upside down? fewer people driving=lower gas costs. its a matter of "vraag en aanbod" (I dont know how to translate). if fewer people want to buy bread and buy crackers instead, the price of the bread goes down and the price of the crackers go up.

but I dont really believe your statement anyway: we have more acces to public transportation??? could be, but gimme proof!

\Again, check the size and population of your country vs ours. Not all areas of our country have enough people in them to support public transportation. Also, given how spread out things our, even if our public transportation were widely available, the time taken to travel the distance needed to get to work would make it prohibitive for many people.

anyway I hope your done now?

At 8/31/06 07:16 PM, red_skunk wrote: At 9/1/06 05:14 AM, VigilanteNighthawk wrote:

ok I am gonna give in on the fact that the netherlands is a higly dense populated area, and you cannot compare it with the US. however, France and germany as well as large parts of italy and spain, are not as densly populated, and are a good comparison of the US. They Also pay alot more for gas as you do.

Strictly comparing gas prices between the US and Europe doesn't tell us anything about the relative strains / PITA that high prices have on the two respective places.

yes it does because I converted the the value to the dollar. and that already includes the "purchasing power" (I dont know how to translate koopkracht, I mean the average income compared to the prices of goods/products within a nation)
So you can compare those two values.
and I dont know what PITA is

the only real argument is that the US is less dense populated, but I already gave a good counter example.
even if you HAVE to drive a certain percentage more, it does not life up to the amount of money europeans spent more on gas.
btw even though holland is small, people tend to move when they work further then 50-70 km away. this is also due to traffic jams, which also cost alot of gas. and moving is a choice to

So I am still not convinced

At 8/31/06 04:20 PM, Tomsan wrote: its your own choice to buy a benzine slurping jeep

Yeah, I'll just call up my rich Uncle Pennybags for a loan right quick and go buy myself a Toyota Prius. He won the lottery last year you know.

lol, dont you have it upside down? fewer people driving=lower gas costs. its a matter of "vraag en aanbod" (I dont know how to translate). if fewer people want to buy bread and buy crackers instead, the price of the bread goes down and the price of the crackers go up.

And yet you still get screwed on the price of gas, don't you?

could be, but gimme proof!

Amazing what you can find on the internet.

At 9/1/06 07:39 AM, Tomsan wrote: (I dont know how to translate koopkracht, I mean the average income compared to the prices of goods/products within a nation)

I believe the term you're looking for is Cost of Living.

even if you HAVE to drive a certain percentage more, it does not life up to the amount of money europeans spent more on gas.

$3 a gallon for gas X 16 gallon tank = $48 for a full tank of gas.

Now try doing something like that 2 or 3 times a week because you've got a long commute to work, then get back to me.

btw even though holland is small, people tend to move when they work further then 50-70 km away. this is also due to traffic jams, which also cost alot of gas. and moving is a choice to

If it were cheaper to live closer to where you work, do you really think that we would be as spread out as we are here in the U.S.?

For fucks sake, will you wankers stop whinging.

Just do what I do, get a small deisel car (get a turbo deisel is performence means that much to you) run it on old (filtered!) cooking oil and don't declare the fuel tax.

You get almost free fuel and the gouvernment gets fuck all, all is right in the world.

At 9/1/06 12:21 PM, Proteas wrote:

At 8/31/06 04:20 PM, Tomsan wrote: its your own choice to buy a benzine slurping jeep

Yeah, I'll just call up my rich Uncle Pennybags for a loan right quick and go buy myself a Toyota Prius. He won the lottery last year you know.

non-argument # 1
prius is a hybrid, good choice, but you can buy 'normal' cars with high efficiency. I dont know who you are trying to fool, just buy a normal car! I could rent like 10 different, what I call, normal cars when I was in the US

lol, dont you have it upside down? fewer people driving=lower gas costs. its a matter of "vraag en aanbod" (I dont know how to translate). if fewer people want to buy bread and buy crackers instead, the price of the bread goes down and the price of the crackers go up.

And yet you still get screwed on the price of gas, don't you?

non-argument #2
yes its called taxes, our goverment is more left, so they tax alot on enviromental and health declining issues. it has nothing to do with the profit the oil companies want to make, like you stated!

could be, but gimme proof!

Amazing what you can find on the internet.

not an argument at all but lets call it non-argument #3
you just gave me a link to amsterdam, where it talk about, in some parts, public transport! So you didnt really proof anything! btw it also says that we ride the bike alot (choice!) it says nothing about comparing american public transport with dutch. it doesnt matter tho 'cause when you read my earlier post, you will see I partually agree with this, just read my earlier post.

At 9/1/06 07:39 AM, Tomsan wrote: (I dont know how to translate koopkracht, I mean the average income compared to the prices of goods/products within a nation)

I believe the term you're looking for is Cost of Living.

ok thanx, no argument of your side here

even if you HAVE to drive a certain percentage more, it does not life up to the amount of money europeans spent more on gas.

$3 a gallon for gas X 16 gallon tank = $48 for a full tank of gas.

good you can count! large tank you have, what kinda car do you drive?

Now try doing something like that 2 or 3 times a week because you've got a long commute to work, then get back to me.

non-argument # 4
move closer, if you have to buy a 16 gallon tank 3 times a week your a moron, really! its your choice to do it. start looking for homes nearer to work, or work nearer to home!
btw I can drive almost 1600 miles on that! you drive 1600 miles a week??? assuming you drive to work 6 days a week that means you drive 267 miles a day meaning you work 133 miles away from home! or 215 km! that my dear friend is insane! lol I live in amsterdam, I just calculated I can drive to france then. omg everyday to france!!

btw even though holland is small, people tend to move when they work further then 50-70 km away. this is also due to traffic jams, which also cost alot of gas. and moving is a choice to

If it were cheaper to live closer to where you work, do you really think that we would be as spread out as we are here in the U.S.?

non-argument #5

assuming its not(cheaper), so being further away from the city you work means that your house is cheaper (I assume this is your point) then whats the problem? the whole issue was gasprices! the prices in the US and europe. if the house prices are in relation of the distance to work this doesnt change much does it? in this case you pay less for your house and more for gas, obviously.
So this doesnt change ANYTHING about my statements, that you dont know how good you have it, concerning gas prices!

did I convince you now?

its so funny, everytime someone I know that visited the states they are all like: "wow we didnt spent shit on gas and we still saw whole america"
and know you all are still trying to proof that you have it worse then in europe, its insane

i agree wanting them to back down will probably raise them.we should all just stop caring,then maybe things will return to normal ie:1:75 range.

At 9/1/06 02:00 PM, Tomsan wrote: his arguments

Sir i salute you, that was a well thought out and meaningful post.

The comment about the size of the pertol tank made me think of another point, what is the adverage MPG of you r standrd american made car?

I rember that even my old 1992 nissan sunny ( the chariot of rust) could do something like 30-35 MPG on the moterway, and that was before the oil change, that added a few more on.

wow ur lucky not even 2$ & we're pushing 3$

Locally, gas is $2.62 a gallon, with it being 15 cents cheaper just across the state line... and here I thought I was just hallucinating.

Im Modern.
I dont use imperial mesurements (apart from Miles)

It is 95p per LITRE in the UK. BTW, approx $1.8 = £1, but i cant convert your irritating imperial mesurements into Metric, and Vise-Versa.

At 9/1/06 02:00 PM, Tomsan wrote: did I convince you now?

Of what? That you have successfully perpetuated the stereotype of an ethno-centric European asshole that has been handed down through the generations here in America?

You want a flame war, YOU'VE GOT ONE.

At 9/1/06 02:17 PM, Archkronos wrote: Im Modern.

Well aren't we just self important?

It is 95p per LITRE in the UK. BTW, approx $1.8 = £1, but i cant convert your irritating imperial mesurements into Metric, and Vise-Versa.

It's not that difficult to do, you just go to google and let one of their handy-dandy conversion tables do the work for you. Wouldn't want to overwork that one last brain cell you've got left, it's doing overtime just figuring out how to type on the keyboard properly.

Not to mention that gasoline is bad for the environment in the sense that the carbon dioxide from burning it contributes to climate change.

But yeah they have been going down. YippyKyeh mother fucker!

I hope those electric cars come in faster. I have a whole life ahead of me and i don't want to pay a risk of 600$ per year of gas And polute earth. ( Yes. I am dyslexic for those who don't know *cough* )
As i meant of electric cars in canada. I can't wait to see how it looks like