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the only difference I see between liberal christians and conservative christians is the conservative christian want every one else to follow their beliefs while liberal ones dont really care what other people do.

At 6/19/06 10:02 PM, afliXion wrote: O yea... they also like to think that Jesus was liberal.

You're wrong I'm afraid. Even if Jesus didn't claim to be a LIberal (which I agree, he didn't) his actions have come to be synonymous with Liberalism. Hence Jesus was a Liberal. Simple as that.

At 6/20/06 06:45 AM, x_Toadenalin_x wrote:

At 6/19/06 10:02 PM, afliXion wrote: O yea... they also like to think that Jesus was liberal.

You're wrong I'm afraid. Even if Jesus didn't claim to be a LIberal (which I agree, he didn't) his actions have come to be synonymous with Liberalism. Hence Jesus was a Liberal. Simple as that.

Next time try responding the part where I actually made my argument eh?
Since when do you get to decide what Jesus did is synonomous with Liberalism? The truth is, the Bible has already revealed why Jesus acted the way he did. Hence, any explaination as to why Jesus did what he did given by liberals or conservative or socialists or communists is completely irrelevant. Its discusting that liberals think they can ignore scripture and label Jesus however the want just to fit there cause.

At 6/20/06 03:48 PM, afliXion wrote: Next time try responding the part where I actually made my argument eh?

You said "He wasn't affiliated with any particular political party". I agreed. I then pointed out that you were wrong to draw the conclusion you did from this

Since when do you get to decide what Jesus did is synonomous with Liberalism?

Step 1) Look at what Jesus did
Step 2) Look at what Liberals believe
Step 3) If there is a correlation, say 'Jesus would probably have identified with Liberalism as a political philosophy, had He known about it'
Step 4) Defend this irrefutable logic from morons.

The truth is, the Bible has already revealed why Jesus acted the way he did. Hence, any explaination as to why Jesus did what he did given by liberals or conservative or socialists or communists is completely irrelevant.

I agree. I've already agreed with this. My point is that a Liberal, alive today, has more in common with Jesus' teachings than a Conservative. I don't care how Jesus would have voted, I'm looking soley at His actions.

There is no doubt in his mind that Jesus was aliberal of his time. Jesus had ideas that the conservative Pharisees did not enjoy. What? We can't stone adulterers to death? What a liberal!! Of course we might not consider Jesus a liberal by today's standards, with abortion and same-sex marriage and all, but you get the point.

At 6/20/06 04:00 PM, x_Toadenalin_x wrote:

:: I agree. I've already agreed with this. My point is that a Liberal, alive today, has more in common with Jesus' teachings than a Conservative. I don't care how Jesus would have voted, I'm looking soley at His actions.

Since the Bible is the inspired word of God and Jesus is God i'll say these.

Even tho God told his people to go to battle against wicked people (Saddam was evil, needed to be out a long time ago, killed his own people, yet liberals object to taking him out). The bible teaches eye for an eye (liberals object to the death penalty). The bible teaches that if a man hits a pregnant woman, he shall be punished according to how much damage he caused (hm...abortion, yep liberals are for it). The bible says that Homosexuality shall not Inhearit the earth (Liberals are for it).

Liberals dont have ANYTHING in common with Jesus other than helping the poor...altho liberals today help the poor by giving them all the money taken from the middle class...yay!

At 6/20/06 04:09 PM, AccessCode wrote: Since the Bible is the inspired word of God and Jesus is God i'll say these.

Even tho God told his people to go to battle against wicked people.

"nation will not take up sword against nation, nor will they train for war any more" Micha 4:3-4

:The bible teaches eye for an eye.
"You have heard that it was said, 'Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.' But I tell you, Do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also." Matthew 5:38-48

Also

"Let those who are without sin cast the first stone" (John 8:7)

The bible says that Homosexuality shall not Inhearit the earth (Liberals are for it).

The Bible says "The rich shall not enter the kingdom of heaven". I take it from your holier-than-thou attitude that you have given all of your money to the poor?

Liberals dont have ANYTHING in common with Jesus other than helping the poor

And opposing unjust authority... and ensuring social justice... and opposing the death penalty... and opposing the war on Iraq (Thomas Aquinas certainly would have done, on the basis of his 'Jus ad bellum', although might have been for it in other ways)

At 6/20/06 04:18 PM, x_Toadenalin_x wrote:

"You have heard that it was said, 'Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.' But I tell you, Do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also." Matthew 5:38-48

So the bible is contradicting itself? That doesn't make any sence...

I wouldn't rely on the bible to help me out of a nasty situation.
Unless it consist of titanium alloy, is easy to handle and can render a man unconscious with a single blow...

At 6/20/06 04:00 PM, x_Toadenalin_x wrote: You said "He wasn't affiliated with any particular political party". I agreed. I then pointed out that you were wrong to draw the conclusion you did from this

That was not my argument. That was merely a statement.

Since when do you get to decide what Jesus did is synonomous with Liberalism?

Step 1) Look at what Jesus did
Step 2) Look at what Liberals believe

Well theres your problem. You are comparing what Jesus did, 2000 years ago, with what liberals here 2000 years later believe. You have no historicity at all, which means you make obsolete the cultural norms of Jesus day.
As ridiculous as it is, lets make a few comparisons of Jesus to modern liberals.
1. Liberals believe in Gay marriage. Jesus affirmed marriage is for one man and one woman in Matthew 19:5. Notice Jesus used the scripture here, not his own ideas.
2. Liberals (generally speaking of course) do not support the war, and promote peace.
Matthew 10:34 "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." Sounds llike the Old Testament to me, not a new or radical idea. (though it might seem like it to someone who only know what liberals teach about Jesus)
3. Liberals, and other new-age christians, say if you are a good person you can go to heaven. Jesus said Matthew 7:22-23 "Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." Note also in Mat 7:21 Jesus you can't enter heaven unless you do the will of the Father. God is unchanging, so if we are to do His will, how can we be wanting to break away from tradition?
If you can give me one thing from the New Testament that Jesus did that is in accordance with liberals of today, I will admit you are right. In order for you to prove Jesus was liberal, you must be ready to show what ideas he was breaking away from. So far you have not, and I have shown that Jesus did not try to change anything, but rather fulfill the tradition.

-note-
I won't respond to you again if you don't refute atleast one of my three comparisons in detail, or if you can provide no scripture of Jesus acting the way a modern liberal does.

Well since Jesus was God, I'm going to say that he didn't care about politics.

Just my though seeing as how he is the creator and all.

At 6/15/06 09:42 AM, -Fudge- wrote:

At 6/15/06 12:57 AM, maxamas64 wrote: does the Bible say its ok to be gay

It doesn't say anything against being gay, just gay sex.

What does being gay lead to? Sodomy is a sin, and being gay encourages it. What do you hope to achieve out of being gay anyway? It's like saying 2+5 = 7, but its ok to be 8

If you lean more to the "just because we were born that way", doesn't mean that it is the designed function. the desire for homosexuality is completely a free will choice... there usually is an abuse somewhere to contribute along the lines, whether physically or emotionally.. but yes it is sinful.

Being libereral doesn't mean you have to be for homosexuality, abortion, tax hikes ect...
the terms liberal and conservative only relate to how you think the law should be interperated. Not how you feel on any issue in specific. You can be a liberal and be against abortion or you can be a conservitave and be for welfare. I want to know at what point the terms liberal and conservative became synonamis with any political belief. Did I miss that memmo? Conservatives think that the law should be upheld as it was written, with no interperatation. A conservative interperatation. Liberals think that there is room for interperitation in the laws due to circumstances that didn't exist, weren't thought of, or weren't as big of an issue at the time of the law being written. A liberal interperitation. Did you think these words were just made up? Where does any specific political stance fit into that? And where in the hell does religeous belief fit into that? Nowhere, get off it. I am a liberal, and I am against abortion, against gun control (to a dgree) and for stem cell reserch; pluss I'm a christian. See how that works.