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Big News for Reviews!

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liljim
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 05:45 PM Reply

As usual, some people don't seem to get the point to this, so I'll try and explain why this should be a good thing:

Some users repeatedly curse out authors they don't like who upload sunmissions, or just waste their life writing "lkjsabdflkajvbv !!!" in their reviews. This has a negative affect on most authors, who're interested in hearing what people have to say about their submissions - they shouldn't have to cut through crap like this to get to something of legibility.

Along with flagging these "bad" reviews, this feature serves another purpose - imagine coming across a fictitious submission, "Xiao Xiao 99999". You've seen the other Xiao Xiao movies, and you're on a 56K modem. Someone writes in a review:

"This was really great, but I'm on a 56Kb connection and there wasn't enough new stuff in there to justify the 5Mb download."

99/100 people found this fictitious review helpful. If you were on a 56Kb connection, would you bother loading something like that up (unless you are a die-hard Xiao Xiao fan, of course :)), or would you think, "Hrm, I'll come back to this when I have DSL."?

I know what I'd do.

As for the Multi-Author stuff - I have been working on this, but it is a big project, so don't expect things to happen overnight. :)

TheMDude
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 05:52 PM Reply

The only people who hate this new law are afraid of anybody messing with their 'reviewer power trips.' The lights were off, and slowly they're turning on. Watch the rats run for cover!!!

There's an old saying...... "If you don't have anything decent to say in a review......SHUT THE FUCK UP!!!"

SteveGuzzi
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 05:52 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 04:40 PM, Lomaxxx wrote: yay im first! :)

what a knucklehead.

anyway, it sounds like a good thing to me. liljim just keeps HOOK-HOOK-HOOKIN IT UP! all of the new and improved features continue to make NG more and more of a community. just like other communities, everyone deserves some way to protect themselves from "the village idiots", and this review system upgrade is only going to help.


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Idiot-Finder
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 05:59 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 04:36 PM, TomFulp wrote:

Thanks Tom, that's exactly what I have been waiting for a long time!

I've known many great flash movies that have received bad reviews for no reason.


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69anytime
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:02 PM Reply

PHEAR!!! Well... no....actually this could work....somehow....someway....maybe...probably...doubtfully...probably not...its lunacy...its dumb...it might work....DEAR GOD!! My mind is at war, leave me alone!!! Go away, evil voice in my head!!

Logixp13
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:02 PM Reply

Ok, I'll admit I know nothing about flash so how can I give advice? I write reviews to tell the creater of the flash what I thought of the movie. I have never been abusive in a review, but I have also never asked a flash maker to change his movie in anyway as i don't think i have a right to. I don't make flash movie's I enjoy them, where do I get off telling someone that there animation is to sticky. But maybe I am naive, I just assume people put all their effort into a flash movie, so me telling them the animation is sticky won't make a whole lot of difference as this is the full scale of their talents.

EarthCrisis
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:06 PM Reply

I have nothing to say ut mean things about movies. Fuck you, Fuck you all. This piece of crap thread must be mother-fucking destroyed. I hate this thread and will delete it somehow at any cost. Except live.

poxpower
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:08 PM Reply

Good, very good. Now, it seems some people are getting annoyed by the abundance of rules on NG and the severity of the repercussions on assholes. Well...

First off, NG has had to make more rules over the years because of its ever-growing user base. As more people came in, more (negative term of your choice, might I suggest buttpeople)have come also. At one point, so many came that it actually made an impact, a very negative impact, so, now there are rules to deal with their abuse. Nice people should not be afraid of them (the rules) because they only punish those who are nasty ( insert negative term again). BTW, you DO fall in that category if you have hired your little sister to vote 0 on every NG entry for you when you're at school, or when you write stupid and nasty reviews to authors just for the sake of doing so and because you think you're funny/clever.
Don't forget that NG gives you rights, but with rights also come responsability. You have the right to vote on any movies, but you have the responsability of using this power responsably. You do have the right to review movies, or wright a BBS post, but please, be smart enough to not litter Newgrounds with your crap.
Example:For all those of you who don't know what happened in France during the elections, here's a recap:
During the elections, former president Chirac was the leading candidate by far. In the campaign for presidency, ran another guy, Jean-Marie LePen, who was almost a Nazi.It seemed he didn't have much of a chance. No one knows what happenned then, but LePen actually came 2nd! People freaked out! On the second vote ( it works like that in France) Chirac won by far, indicating that perhaps people had not been voting responsably on their first vote, thinking Chirac would win anyways.
You see kids, that'a what happens when you don't use your power to vote responsably. They almost had a Nazi for president!
( By the way, I know LePen was not that bad and that it might have been the people's actual choice, but c'mon, work with me on this one!)

The repercussions are very severe, not because the people cause a lot of damage ( they do cause some, but not that much...) but because we are all tired of bastards now. There are enough all around the world or in the streets, so, NG fans should not have to endure those people.

As for the new system, I think its perfect. Some people might think the author should be able to delete reviews, but that wouldn't work because some people would delete all the bad reviews and keep only the ones who gave them 10. The new system alows everyone to see all the reviews and enables the author to report excessive cases, just like the whistle. I don't see this as a voting system, I see it as a new whistle. Don't be afraid to write reviews, because if the author constantly reports minor cases, he'll be ignored. ( I hope)

Good Job Computer-Zombie-Liljim


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poxpower
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:12 PM Reply

wtf? my post was posted twice? I think it's because I press "Post it" but then, realized I didn't review it,so I immediately pressed the "Stop" button. I guesse it still posted it. Sorry for this.


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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:13 PM Reply

you want people to review, right?
Do you believe that the majority of the users who watch movies on this site wants to to like write a 10 page review for every damn movie he/she thinks worthy of a (good or bad) comment? i don't think so.

so if i post something like "this is crap" - that will suffice for a movie that consists of a two sec. loop with a stickman kicking another one. any other lengty review would be a waste of time.
and a review like "this is crap" can very well spare some users the time and pain of watching a shit movie.
but this is only my opinion and it's your site after all.

and what happens to "bad reviewers"? any ideas about that already?

ryu12
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:20 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 04:40 PM, Lomaxxx wrote: yay im first! :)

you are not first! lol

Big News for Reviews!

ryu12
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:22 PM Reply

I like this idea, I hope it will find those abusive people out there.

Big News for Reviews!

Idiot-Finder
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:50 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 05:06 PM, JuanManda wrote: What the hell is going on with all this new rules at NG, can we just go back to the orginal one?

No, you lamer!


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TheSphincter
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:53 PM Reply

This a pretty good idea, people who vote unfairly, get treated unfairly!

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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:55 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 04:36 PM, TomFulp wrote: For a while now, one of our big issues has been abusive reviewers. You know who I'm talking about - those jerks who discourage Flash artists by having nothing but mean things to say about Portal submissions.

LilJim has just finished a new feature to address this! You can now rate individual reviews as you read them. There are only three choices - you either find it helpful, not helpful, or you find it downright abusive.

Remember, just because a review is negative does not mean that it is not helpful or that it is abusive. A review is only abusive if it fails to address anything at all that could be of use to the author, and merely slanders him for no good reason. A negative review is still able to be helpful, by bringing flaws to an authors attention. There is a difference between a negative (helpful or not) review and an evil, nasty (abusive) review.

Nice, but...

PLZ let them be editable, though!

I mean, really.

You actually expect us to think before we write reviews? Some of us really don't think right and sometimes make typos.

IstvanOrosi
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:56 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 06:13 PM, b-lame wrote: Do you believe that the majority of the users who watch movies on this site wants to to like write a 10 page review for every damn movie he/she thinks worthy of a (good or bad) comment? i don't think so.

10 pages? If you think something needs improvement, it only takes 1 sentence per point.

so if i post something like "this is crap" - that will suffice for a movie that consists of a two sec. loop with a stickman kicking another one. any other lengty review would be a waste of time.

Why do you even bother reviewing it in the first place? If you have that free 30 seconds then you can spare another 30 to put down a useful comment.

Good job guys! Special thanks so liljim for transforming NG. It just keeps getting better and better.
liljim, any approximate date on the multi-author system? 1mo, 6mo, 1year?


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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 06:56 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 05:43 PM, Katanaman wrote:
At 2/11/03 04:36 PM, TomFulp wrote:

I agree.

Big News for Reviews!


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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:03 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 06:56 PM, TutiTV wrote: liljim, any approximate date on the multi-author system? 1mo, 6mo, 1year?

Yeah, when's the multi-author system coming?

You really should use sizzler's idea for that!

BooDestroyer
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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:05 PM Reply

BTW, we could've kicked KTKore's ass with this if he were still here today!

And who's Xito? A guy who wrote bad reviews?

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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:06 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 04:45 PM, apotheosis wrote: hmm... dont you think that maybe there's too much rules on newgrounds? ....i believe that everyone has the right to say "fuck you" to whoever they want to say it to. if a dude thinks the flash is crap, then he's entitled to rant and rave on how bad it is..... i prefer to cuss and rave and maim and do whatever the fuck my mind and instincts want me to say or do.

I don't think Tom mentioned that you CAN'T say "fuck you" review message. You are right, everybody IS entitled to say what they want, Freedom of Speech, right? The thing is, just be prepared to deal with the consequences for "fuck you" reviews.

I believe Tom is trying to even out things on both sides. If you think about it, doesn't flash artists have rights too, just as much as the viewers do?

Granted there are always going to be fuck offs who ruin things whether they be flash artists or viewers, it's still no excuse for abusive talks. Even I have felt that I have may been too hard on reviews myself (either that or I always drank beer while on the computer) and much of the rage has died down overtime.


Only I can make blue whales cry.

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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:13 PM Reply

it's not the fact it's "fuck you", it's the fact it's JUST "fuck you" and nothing else, the review feature is to provide USEFUL feedback!!!

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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:24 PM Reply

Again, we have the owners of this site telling people how to think about stuff that we see. Sure there are jerks that write reviews just for the sake of doing them, but they just have to accept that that is a flaw for rewarding people for doing so. Stop limiting everyone else's voice Tom, and just get rid of the system all together. This place has really gone down hill... :(

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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:26 PM Reply

Well, this seems fine to me so long as there is no retribution against abusive reviewers. I mean, what do you say to someone who makes a movie called "Cuonter Strike Stikz Woo1337 Fite"?

"Gee, I really felt you should have animated the stick figures arms, legs, faces, guns, bodies, movements, and background. Oh, and I liked how you interspersed frames of goatse.cx in the film. That was disgusting."

I mean, sometimes the best advice for someone is to "Fucking quit, you stupid noob."

P.S. If I tell someone to "Start over", is that constructive or negative?

Big News for Reviews!

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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:29 PM Reply

Exelent Idea!

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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:33 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 04:48 PM, SPiNDLE_XL wrote: In my opinion, This might be a useless feature. We arent making a purchase, just watching a 1 or 2 minute video or playing a small game for free. Usually review systems like that are only implemented at emcommerce stores, so people can find an honest review of a product before making a purchase. I dont think ive ever read 200 reviews before I decided to watch a movie, that takes more time than watching the movie and seeing for myself.

haha, and sometimes peoples abuse comments are funny to read.

RIP Curtis Henning =(

I agree with this, I don't see how it will be usefull. I do find much humor in the bad reviews. People simply show how stupid they are. I also belive that was the whole point behind strawberry clock's B. The movie had no value, but the reviews for that movie are funny as hell.

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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:36 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 04:52 PM, BestZest wrote: Great idea!
Now I was wondering if you could put the 1-5 voting panel (or just text) in the window with the movie.

How about at the end of all movies, so u have to watch the whole movie to vote.

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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:39 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 04:55 PM, lil_Ginny wrote: WOW.

Now we are rating reviews....
whats next Blam points for reviews?
I can see it now.

(Review of movie)
the Movie lacked something.
-the reviewer.

will result in this:

(Review of Review)
While stating the obvious you were quite vage in what the movie was lacking, Therefore I will have to
blam this review.
-the View reviewer reviewer.

Thanks NG, Now I have some more stuff to look forward while i watch crap, and read about the crap, and then a review of the review of crap...

And the cycle continues =)

I am like you I can see that happening. Then Tom, and wade will come out, and say "if you go around, and leave abusive review's you will be banned!" then no one will review because people will worried that they will be banned.

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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:41 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 05:43 PM, Katanaman wrote:
At 2/11/03 04:36 PM, TomFulp wrote: For a while now, one of our big issues has been abusive reviewers. You know who I'm talking about - those jerks who discourage Flash artists by having nothing but mean things to say about Portal submissions.
Man, I hate those. There are also some who say pointless things. Just look at what this fool said about a submission of mine:

o ho you didn't January 29, 2003
Reviewed by: blackmidgitpenis Overall rating: 0
chockmunk monkey don't like to pooooop 302-934-8781 ask for shelly andgary gonna give you a fist job
Graphics: 0 Sound: 0 Interactivity: 0 Style: 0 Violence: 0 Humor: 0

And the guy reviewed all the other submissions he decided to review the same way. Guys like those should be blammed!!!!!!!!!!!!

Um. No they shouldn't. Not if that's the worst thing they've done on NG. That wasn't hateful or abusive, it was, as you said: pointless. And thus should be voted NOT HELPFUL but not ABUSIVE. This review voting system is apparently going to result in a lot of sensitive artists blasting review authors for no good reason.

Not only that but politically controversial flashes are going to turn into a hotbed of review wars (I can just see the Palestinian and Israeli supporting NG users giving opposite reviews to tons of flashes and opposite reviews of those reviews).

When will the madness end?


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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:44 PM Reply

heh. that's pretty cool. i don't make flash animations but there are a lot of jackasses out there who make crappy reviews for even the greatest games and movies that have NOTHING to do with the actual submission (example: people who say rockman neo or johnny rocketfingers for example suck without giving actual reason or without even viewing the submission.)
It also helps take care of fools who say a submission sucks just because their crappy 56k dial up modem cant load a submission!

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Response to Big News for Reviews! Feb. 11th, 2003 @ 07:47 PM Reply

At 2/11/03 06:13 PM, b-lame wrote: you want people to review, right?
Do you believe that the majority of the users who watch movies on this site wants to to like write a 10 page review for every damn movie he/she thinks worthy of a (good or bad) comment? i don't think so.

so if i post something like "this is crap" - that will suffice for a movie that consists of a two sec. loop with a stickman kicking another one. any other lengty review would be a waste of time.
and a review like "this is crap" can very well spare some users the time and pain of watching a shit movie.
but this is only my opinion and it's your site after all.

The problem with a "this is crap" review is that even though it nicely matches the length of the crappy movie, it A) is just as useless as the movie was, so why did you sink to the artist's level? B) there's doubtless 10 other people who said something about the same as you. If you write longer reviews (as I tend to do), you're also going to naturally choose fewer things to review (as I do). And seeing as how there are flashes with 500 reviews that no one will ever wade completely through, are fewer and more thought-out reviews such a bad idea?

this is why (in combination with my post above) I am conflicted on this new feature. It's both good and bad. We'll see how the populace uses it. For now, I won't be rating any reviews, but if I was a flash artist, I'm sure I would rate all of mine, so it's good for them at least.


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