Ok, Game Over America

[FightingForFreedom]

The end of World War II left America a world superpower. The end of the Cold War left America as the ONLY superpower. A position we have filled for almost 15 years.

When is our time up? India and China both have vastly booming economies. Japan, Brazil, Russia, and the European Union all have huge GDP growth rates. We are over our heads in national debt, under billions in our trade deficet, and continue to shill out trillions in military spending.

When do you thing we will no longer be a superpower? Has it already started? If so, when?

(Personally I believe we are gradually losing our position as sole superpower and it started at 8:46 AM on September 11th, 2001)

[Rigormort1s]

Probably not for a while.... maybe in 2092, I don't really know.

[Imperator]

China and India are following in our economic steps, ie, towards oil dependant societies. Since we already kinda fucked them on that end, China and India will either have to advance 30 years in 2 months, or take a back seat as the head honcho.

As a country, we have just as many problems as we had before 9/11. I don't see that as the start date of the Fall of the Empire. If anything, I see it as the start.

Respective to the Roman timeline, George Bush may be Caesar or Augustus, hiding the Empire behind the facade of Republic.

There are a ton of other correlations too, like the disappearing middle class, decline of civil liberties in favor of Imperial rule (From before Clinton to now things have been getting worse, y'all just didn't know it until big things like the Patriot act and NSA spying came into the picture.......but it's been silently happening for a while......), period of strife followed by relative peace and calm (might be the reverse, need more time to see this one fully), and the list goes on........

Basically, I see us going nowhere but HIGHER up the food chain, 9/11 being the catalyst for America to start active and aggressive Imperialism........

Think about it. In 10 years we may have stakes in Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, Syria, Cuba, Venezuela, and numerous other places under whatever realm of cause you wanna believe........

[sdhonda]

The US has the capacity to be a super power for a good while. Although it wont be the only super power for long. China, India, a revived Russia, Brazil, Japan and possibly the EU are catching up quickly, paticularly the first 2.

[fahrenheit]

It will end like rome. We will eventually collapse on ourselves, riots will break in every major city (kind of like dominoes, when one goes down the others fall) and news will spread and an invasion will follow.

The riots themselves will start over something trivial, possibly a violation of rights or increase in taxes, or a death/murder of someone important. I cant say exactly how, I can only guess.
But once the invasion follows we will push the invaders away (most likely china/russia/or possibly a middle eastern country) but our defence will be greatly hindered and a lot of our citizens will have fled to canada or mexico. In which borders will be closed off after the first 100,000 citizens cross, and the rest will be sent away possibly injured.

After that our country will no longer remain any sort of threat, major amounts of american all over the world will revolt or get slaughtered and embassies will fall.
The US will call for help from all the allies, but our dept will get in the way. And a few nuclear bombs are bound to be launched, at us/from us or possibly both.

Once the bombs drop, some countries will be outraged and order the death of americans, and most will have people who do that with our without the countries support. Then China/Japan/Russia/Europe will have a clash of empires to decide the super power, but it wont be on army might. It could be upon space technology (colonies on the moon), resources, or a computer simulation fight. Or maybe they will all come together to form one empire and give rights to the UN in hopes to stop the formation of another US.

But unfortunatly the greed will spread and a country will become a traitor, most likely one that wont be suspected and stopped, they will get power by getting most of the powerfull position in the UN filled with their citizens. Then they will gain allies from other countries (possibly by setting up their own heirs and killing the people in command and have their heirs become leaders) and slowly but swiftly turn the UN into a socialistic empire. Naturally the traitor country will run the show, but they wont be hated. In fact they will be loved mainly due to propoganda and purposely setting up hinders and faults on theirs and others sides.

Some people will suspect, and they will be killed and blammed for other crimes. I cant say how they will end, but like history has taught us.

The more power a side has, the quicker it shifts.

[Demosthenez]

Velocitom, I like your fiction. Write books. Cause that is about all your post boils down to. Political fiction and prediction.

At 3/20/06 11:50 PM, Imperator wrote: Respective to the Roman timeline, George Bush may be Caesar or Augustus, hiding the Empire behind the facade of Republic.

I understand you are a classics guy but just because America has a bad President for 8 years doesnt mean we are reverting to an Empire with a ruling class. Hes gone in 2 years and nothing more will come of this trash. Anything anyone else says is as good as a prediction from Ms. Cleo. Its all voodoo.

y'all just didn't know it until big things like the Patriot act and NSA spying came into the picture.......but it's been silently happening for a while......),

The effect of the Patriot Act is largely overblown.

Among the more controversial provisions are the "roving wiretap" portion and the "sneak and peek" section. The first allows the government to get a wiretap on every phone a suspect uses, while the second allows federal investigators to get access to library, business and medical records without a court order.
Link

They have never seemed wildly invasive to me. If you notice, for the most part, all you will hear fools say is, "OH, the Patriot Act is so damned bad." Reason? I have yet to met anyone in real life that can supply one. And the Democrats fighting the reinstatement only ever gave these stupid little quotes that mean nothing. Examples.

"While we have made some progress, much is left to be done," said Sen. Patrick Leahy, a Vermont Democrat, who voted for the Sununu bill.

Feingold, a possible Democratic presidential candidate, said: "I am disappointed in this result. But I believe this fight has been worth making."

The bests is Kucinich's though. That little fuck is such a shifty little shit. I wouldnt trust him to lead a platoon of Gerbils to a cage.

"I rise in strong opposition to this legislation because it offers only a superficial reform that will have little if any impact on safeguarding our civil liberties," Kucinich said in House debate, according to his Web site.

"Congress has failed to do its job as a coequal branch of government," he said. "The administration's attack on our democracy has to be reigned in."

I am neither for nor against the Patriot Act. I dont know enough about it to have an opinion like that. I just would like some rationality restored to the Patriot Act debate. Everyone has these platitudes they echo and I dont think anyone really has any clue what the hell they are talking about.

period of strife followed by relative peace and calm (might be the reverse, need more time to see this one fully), and the list goes on........

I suppose you would reason during Vietnam that America was turning into an Empire also? That would have turned out well, wouldnt it?

Basically, I see us going nowhere but HIGHER up the food chain, 9/11 being the catalyst for America to start active and aggressive Imperialism........

I dont see how America gaining more power is something great. I like the status quo. And what is the point of more power at the expense of the people? I hope that is not what you are arguing.

[RedSkunk]

With the US strangehold in the Middle East on all things oil, I think our position as sole superpower will continue for quite some time. I think the real question is whether or not this unipolar set-up is a good thing; for Americans, for the second tier, for those in abject poverty – for the entire world. Of course, the conversation there would be equally lame-ass.

Shorter answer – America will likely remain dominant for as long as any of us live.

[Lawndeer]

ever played the game fallout?

[Imperator]

I understand you are a classics guy but just because America has a bad President for 8 years doesnt mean we are reverting to an Empire with a ruling class

I know. That's why I said, "may be". But there ARE similarities, and they are rather striking ones at that........

The effect of the Patriot Act is largely overblown.

Wholeheartedly agree.

They have never seemed wildly invasive to me.

Me neither.

I suppose you would reason during Vietnam that America was turning into an Empire also? That would have turned out well, wouldnt it?

I COULD argue that, but I won't. And it probably would have turned out well, it certainly had elements of an imperialistic move, it wouldn't be too hard to argue. Doesn't make it true though, just a theory.......

I dont see how America gaining more power is something great. I like the status quo.

So do I. Not too much I gotta worry about in this day and age, cept failin out of school. Plus, I never said it was a "good" thing. Re-read my statement.

And what is the point of more power at the expense of the people? I hope that is not what you are arguing.

The point is for the government to gain more control over the masses. It IS what I'm arguing has been slowly happening over the past decades. There are some emerging monopolies in the country that aren't being addressed by the government, simply because they've given up on this road. Phone, internet, medicines are a few rising monopolies, why do you think we pay so much more than everyone else for the same services?

Again, I never said this was a "good" thing. Far from it, I would prefer a "use it or lose it" rule for copyright, lower internet connection prices thanks to multiple providers (students at U of M are pigeonholed into choosing Comcast, and they jack up their price knowing this), and a real gutting of all the government bills and programs going on. But it ain't exactly happening that way.......

[Tantalus]

All civilizations are bound to end at some time. The painful truth is that America will end. It may be in ten years, it may be in 100 years, maybe even 1000 years. Do you think people in Rome or the great dynasties of China ever believed it would end? No. None of us will probably see it in our lifetime, but it's bound to happen.

I like your story, Velocitom. :)

[BritZombie]

America will always be a powerful country but it's power will start to detiriate. Like all empires have over thousands of years.

[ClickToPlay]

Well, you cant really be sure, remember America has a very strong economy, so when the war or Iraq offically ends, America without a doubt will pay it's debt. These days, superpowers are meaning the armys strength, not really economy in my opinion. So if there is a country with an army as strong or stronger then America, that country would be the next Superpower.

[sdhonda]

I doubt america will collapse violently like rome. It will just wane, kinda like the british empire.

With the US strangehold in the Middle East on all things oil, I think our position as sole superpower will continue for quite some time. I think the real question is whether or not this unipolar set-up is a good thing; for Americans, for the second tier, for those in abject poverty – for the entire world. Of course, the conversation there would be equally lame-ass.

Shorter answer – America will likely remain dominant for as long as any of us live.

1. There is growing contempt of the US in the middle east.

2. It will remain superpower, but not sole super power.

[sdhonda]

Oops, forgot to make the second bit a quote.

[HighlyIllogical]

At 3/21/06 02:35 AM, red_skunk wrote:

Shorter answer – America will likely remain dominant for as long as any of us live.

Quite assuredly longer. I doubt that American hegemony will deteriorate significantly until China or another large nation has a world-class military, health care system, educational system and economy.

[airraid81]

We will always be among the top 3 if you include China and India, but in the case of India, they are kind of reliant on us. Recently, we overrode one of our own treaties to give them some nucleur weapons, so if they go against us, they would be losing some power.

[RedSkunk]

At 3/21/06 05:45 PM, GSgt_Liberal wrote:

At 3/21/06 02:35 AM, red_skunk wrote:

Shorter answer – America will likely remain dominant for as long as any of us live.

Quite assuredly longer. I doubt that American hegemony will deteriorate significantly until China or another large nation has a world-class military, health care system, educational system and economy.

What makes you say that? I think health care and education have nothing to do with this. It's all economics – and by extension, military.

[SolInvictus]

its not like America has to collapse for it to lose its place as a super power, it can just shrink background of worldly-stuffness... ....yup

[Wakraw]

America has become complacent and lost much of its work ethic which is what made the country great. Other countries have a stronger work ethic and are slowly catching up to us in terms of innovation and technology.

[sdhonda]

If I were to go to the 1920s and tell people that in 20 years that the british empire would collapse, the soviet union would be the dominant power in most of eurasia, that the US would also be a super power, and that for a breif period, germany and japan would become huge powers in a war more deadly than the last one, I'd be laughted at.

[Dash-Underscore-Dash]

I would love to see the president go, "Game over, man! GAME OVER!!"

[sdhonda]

At 3/21/06 06:14 PM, lollerskaters wrote: I would love to see the president go, "Game over, man! GAME OVER!!"

Heh, aliens. "17 days, we wont last 17 hours!"

[HighlyIllogical]

At 3/21/06 05:51 PM, red_skunk wrote: What makes you say that? I think health care and education have nothing to do with this. It's all economics – and by extension, military.

Ah. But I think that you're ignoring why people ALWAYS want to come here (Education , health care, freedom!). Immigrants make america what it is.

However, the economic and military aspects are probably more important.

Relax all we need to due is remove some uneeded freedoms and were all set.

[RedSkunk]

At 3/21/06 08:13 PM, GSgt_Liberal wrote: Ah. But I think that you're ignoring why people ALWAYS want to come here (Education , health care, freedom!). Immigrants make america what it is.

Ja, but that doesn't have a whole lot with why we're the head honcho.

[Markface]

I dont think america will ever be a threat in power. Economic, well yea. China has got you there!

[Nylo]

At 3/21/06 08:13 PM, GSgt_Liberal wrote: Ah. But I think that you're ignoring why people ALWAYS want to come here (Education , health care, freedom!). Immigrants make america what it is.

Europe was seen as the fountain of enlightenment for a very long time. You can still be a brilliant country with all the right stuff, but that won't glue your spot down as a super power.

America has way too many financial interests abroad and vice versa to lose their power too quickly. With that much power the only way it would come down, at least within a reasonable, forseeable future is through a steep, blow-out depression in the market or if the Americans turned on eachother sharply enough to use that power against themselves.

[fahrenheit]

At 3/21/06 02:23 AM, FAB0L0US wrote: Velocitom, I like your fiction. Write books. Cause that is about all your post boils down to. Political fiction and prediction.

Some people say I have a very creative imagination, and I guess they are right considering most of that was thought of on the spot.