who truly won the election?

[caseyizzle]

i thinkthat gore won and that flordia was with bush and also that the ballots were too confusing.

[ZenGaijin]

Confusing my ass those ballots were punch type how can you screw that up other than lose the ballots.

[Ted-Easton]

Some people can't understand the puch ballots :P

[swayside]

At 1/17/03 03:44 PM, Ted_Easton wrote: Some people can't understand the puch ballots :P

some people are smart as asphalt, too.

[House-Of-Leaves]

Simple fact. Gore won by popular vote. Bush won because of the fucking electoral college.

[RandomFreak]

In the end ultimately it was Bush, Gore won the popular vote but that's not how our system works.

[House-Of-Leaves]

At 1/18/03 05:54 PM, RandomFreak wrote: In the end ultimately it was Bush, Gore won the popular vote but that's not how our system works.

Exactly. That's not how it works, but it should.

And if we don't like the 'system'...don't we have the power to change it?

"Any people whatsoever have the right to abolish the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better. This is a most valuable, a most sacred right -- a right which we hope and believe is to liberate the world."

- Abraham Lincoln, 1848

How sad that our own government has made that impossible.

[usagisailor]

Gore Gore Gore! The whole reason that the electoral college was ever created was because there was no way that the general public of America could see everything going on in the elections, and so the higher-ups would vote for them. (Which, although understandable because we didn't have the media technology we have today is still unfair.) Today, we have the media that we need to go ahead and tell everyone in America what is going on with certain candidates, and therefore the electoral college should be abolished. Another thing.... if anyone saw the debates between Bush and Gore... Bush never answered a question straight. If you asked about education, you got an answer about social security. Ask about the army, you get an answer about the lottery. BLAH! I say that everyone at Newgrounds gets together and BLAMS BUSH!!! PS: Another thing here, it's funny that Bush wants violence and Gore's a tree hugger... Think about it. (Gotta love those names.)

[SashaTheCatClock]

The reason the electoral college exists is because, as we saw in Florida, a lot of people are too stupid to vote properly. It's also the reason those party levers exist. Most people don't know who or what they are voting for, they just pull a level out of stupidity.

Bush legitimately won, and it's better that way when you look at most of the people who voted left.

[TheEvilOne]

Ahh... the ever-present "abolish the electoral college" argument. Some people fail to realize that without the electoral college, a candidate would only have to win in the country's major population centers (New York and California) to win the election (and I probably don't have to get into how different California's political views are from those of the rest of the nation). Thus, the voice of the smaller states is silenced. With the electoral college, in order to win, a candidate has to win both large and small states, and thus has to have broader appeal. That way, the smaller states don't fall under the iron boot of the larger ones.

[Slizor]

At 1/19/03 05:37 AM, TheEvilOne wrote: Ahh... the ever-present "abolish the electoral college" argument. Some people fail to realize that without the electoral college, a candidate would only have to win in the country's major population centers (New York and California) to win the election

Shock horror, they would have to win the majority of the population?! Holy mother of Jesus!

(and I probably don't have to get into how different California's political views are from those of the rest of the nation). Thus, the voice of the smaller states is silenced.

They still have the senate(or is it the House, no I think it's the Senate) and they have their own State lawmaking bodies.

With the electoral college, in order to win, a candidate has to win both large and small states, and thus has to have broader appeal. That way, the smaller states don't fall under the iron boot of the larger ones.

That's bullshit, if anything it's the will of the majority being imposed on the minority, if you are going to talk about it in that sense. But I think people would prefer that to the will of the minority being imposed on the majority. The bigger states would have no control over the smaller states, but a representative control of the Federal Government.

[BigSexyHair]

Well, I can always complain because I didn't vote for him :P but then again, I voted libertarian so I coulda complained about gore as well :D :D

[D2Kvirus]

Read the first chapter of Stupid White Men - Gore won the damn election, and Bush stole it from him. It's quite deep how much cheating went on in that corrupt little corner of the globe known as the Bush Compound.

[TomFlump]

who knows. alls i know is al gore is weird and bush is a moron. deep down, i think we all wish clinton could have run again...

[Zio-Shirai]

I THINK GORE WON, NOT THAT I CARE MUCH, BUT I THINK SO CUZ US' ELECTORAL SYSTEM IS JUST FUCKED UP

[TheEvilOne]

At 1/19/03 06:17 AM, Slizor wrote: That's bullshit, if anything it's the will of the majority being imposed on the minority, if you are going to talk about it in that sense. But I think people would prefer that to the will of the minority being imposed on the majority. The bigger states would have no control over the smaller states, but a representative control of the Federal Government.

Yes, the smaller states would still have control over their own governments, but, in my opinion, the larger states shouldn't have COMPLETE control over the federal government. For the most part, the majority should rule, but the interests of the minority should be heard as well. That is what the electoral college does. It is rare for the candidate who wins the popular vote to lose the electoral college, but, since it can happen, that reminds presidential hopefuls to keep the interests of both large and small in mind.

[A-Carrot-By-Dr-Riot]

I think that we all need to grow up a little. Bush won, there was cheating on both sides, there has always been cheating on both sides. It might not have been totally fair, but it's too late now. There's another election coming up in about a year.

[D2Kvirus]

I repeat, go to a bookstore (a good one, preferably) and pick up a copy of Michael Moore's Stupid White men. Chapter One covers it, and should save dumb responses such as this.

[A-Carrot-By-Dr-Riot]

Got the book, I liked the chapter on education, but I disagree on most of his information. I don't think his sources are very accurate as I have conflicting information.

[Slizor]

Got the book, I liked the chapter on education, but I disagree on most of his information. I don't think his sources are very accurate as I have conflicting information.

Is it possible that your sources are not very accurate?

[DarknessIncarnate]

At 1/21/03 03:06 PM, Dr_Arbitrary wrote:

Bush won

i totally disagree here. if bush get an x-ray you can still see the reminants of gore ballots rotting in his system...

[IamjustSci]

I could've sworn that 2000 ended three years ago...

[TheEvilOne]

At 1/23/03 05:15 PM, Scaletail wrote: I could've sworn that 2000 ended three years ago...

It did.

You would think that, given Bush's high approval rating and the GOP victories in the 2002 midterm elections, what happened in 2000 wouldn't really matter anymore. I guess there are some people who, sadly, can't let it go.

[House-Of-Leaves]

You're right. It DID end three years ago.

Are you honestly going to sit here and tell us that it's not reasonable for us to be talking about it now? It's affecting us today, so we can talk about it today. For fuck's sake, Reagan's economics were affecting us twenty YEARS after his presidency, and people talked about it.

So...WWII ended over half a century ago. Should we stop talking about it? Or...any history?

Get with it. This is a bigger issue than a lot of people think. No, we can't change what happened, but if we talk about what DID happen, we can possibly prevent it from happening again.

As for the rest of this conversation. I sincerely want to know how many people who bitch about Bush, or Gore, or ANY other politician....I want to know how many of you are old enough to vote, or how many of you are registered if you ARE old enough...or how many of you excersized your voting rights. This isn't a knock on anyone, really...I'm just hoping I'm not debating with a bunch of precocioius kids.