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So much flaming and BIG WORDS I can't figure out what side people are on, or if they are just trolling trying to get people stuck in their arguments!

I guess there are double standards either way you look at it. I think eating meat is natural for a human, we were doing it before we became civilized. But why is it ok to eat and skin some types of animals and not others? That is the question at hand here.

This is one of those issues where you're only safe being either a "vegetarian", or "kill em all i don't care" type. The majority of us are in between, we eat cows, pigs, and chickens, but cringe at the thought of eating our pet cat or dog (although we like to act macho and joke with those "what if you were stranded situations"). Because we have a fondness for "Fluffy" or "Spike", we become hipocrites. That leads to another natural human emotion. Maybe it is ok to be fond of an object, person, or animal, but not others. Just like the way we pick our friends or stare at old photos. We can choose to care about Fluffy, and not the $5.98 package of pork chops at the grocery store.

It all comes down to a bunch of variables, such as preference, knowledge, culture, etc. The way I grew up, and the fact I have a very cuddly cat, I find the stuff featured in that video a horrible act, and think of the people doing it accordingly. But from their point of view, they might think we are the sick people for eating cows and imprisoning Fluffy in our trailor parks. Its a never ending circle with no solution. I don't want to be a hipocrite for eating some types of animals, and having feelings for others, but so be it if thats the only way. All I know is I'm not eating my cat! (Well maybe if I was stranded and I was sure she was exactly what I needed to stay alive long enough for rescue... jk ;)

Its nice to see someone take a balanced approach. I took the schiz out angle to try n counter the sheer amount of fundamentalist, often immature views on animal rights.

People who are for animal rights far too often take the view because of how cute some animals are.

There are more serious issues, such as a populace that is willing to be BRUTAL like the in the kfc videos on peta, whats to stop these same people treating people in the same way?

Then there is my, ahem, learned friend fiddy cent who likes to live in a dream world and likes to think that man can co exist with animals without ever eating them. And also, despite it being entirely natural, that eating meat is wrong.

There is unthinking abuse of animals, and that is battery farming. I say unthinking because it is the general population who support this, by not boycotting its existence. Then there is "thinking", wilful abuse.

But this leads back to the point of 1. battery farming produces A LOT of food. If distributed properly it could feed the world.

Then, we zoom out and go to the big picture. Do we want the entire world to be fed for free, i can see why right wing people believe what they believe, but i also refuse to believe that survival of the fittest is correct, after all most people start with a huge disadvantage which is unfair.

Basically, if we try and support a larger population on the planet, that population will then grow and require more food, which will speed up the stripping of resources on a planet which is starting to show signs of strain.

But then, who are we to decide who should live and who should die?

And for those who are inevitably going to be muppets and say, ISNT THIS ABOUT ANIMAL RIGHTS? YOU SUCK T3H PEN0R, etc

YOU ARE FOOLISH IF YOU CAN BELIEVE ANY ISSUE IS TRULY ISOLATED, THEY ARE ALL LINKED DIRECTLY TO AT LEAST ONE OTHER MAJOR ISSUE.

Dont believe me? name a contraversial issue for me and i will show you.

At 2/27/06 04:25 AM, SpamWarrior wrote: Well whupty fucking do, i get angry and express it on a bbs in the only available fashion. BY SHOUTING... ... both directly and indirectly.

Still doesn't change the fact that it makes you seem like a
moron .

At 2/27/06 05:51 AM, MissKoemiko wrote:

At 2/27/06 04:25 AM, SpamWarrior wrote: Well whupty fucking do, i get angry and express it on a bbs in the only available fashion. BY SHOUTING... ... both directly and indirectly.

Still doesn't change the fact that it makes you seem like a
moron .

well done, you can quote a jpg from the best page in the universe, therefore making you cool. can i lick you? can i touch you so i can have some of your special power?

name calling solves nothing, my special little angel. Learn how to argue properly please or go commit suicide by drugs.

At 2/27/06 06:13 AM, SpamWarrior wrote: all caps.... flaming... etc.

Whoa, dude. You need to chill, or at least turn off the caps lock. Anyways, I couldn't find the .mp3 Tom... please allow me to live.

I am recording it off the link given earlier as I type this, with a program called Acoustica MP3 Audio Mixer. Tom, once it is done, I will convert it to MP3 and e-mail it to you.

BTW this is the first time I have participated in the BBS, although I have been trolling Newgrounds for a while before I even joined. I love the site.

Enjoy the song.

Sorry for the double post, I didn't see and edit button. I uploaded the song to yousendit as everyone else requested, so that those of you that also want a copy can get one. Here it is.

http://s64.yousendit..YQ08BEV2L8HP67624S6R

So.. Spamwarrior.

You say that battery farming will only speed the death of the planet. I ask, what is your suggestion to this?

Humans, by and large, need their chow from somewhere. Plants do not grow fast enough to be meaningful in the long run. Animals, with the short breeding spans are the only option we have left.

Now, I don't personally see fur as desierable simply because 1. I am not living in Mother Russia, where fur is needed on any good, warmth-protecting coat. 2. I don't go outside often to begin with, my work and schooling all happen indoors. and 3. I prefer to take a reasonable stance on consumption.

For example, I see that, fictionally, McDonalds is grinding out Bison Burgers for their menu. Now, my thought is thus "Can I kill the bison on my own, with a axe or not?" Knowing me and the prey in question; the answer is hell no. Therefore, I don't order a Bison Burger becuase it might come down to the event of me, trying to kill the 400 lb steak with a flint axe.

The fact that you proclaim that all things are interconnected is not reasonable with the food supply, save for one example :

The true aim of the 'animal rights' movement is to force every country to grow organic food with no alterations or protections what so ever. By most estimates, the available farm land on Earth can only support 4 billion people if every inch of land was converted for that purpose.

I don't see 2 billion people wanting to die, do you?

Face facts, you acid-dropping hippies! We can't support the world on tofu! I suggest eating meat and liking it!

Heh, I've been having a similar discussion about Animal Testing on another forum. The way I see it, the chances of a petition working is like trying to squeeze milk from a man's bum. I love and respect animals but what people must realise is that we're not gods. I hate it when people say things like, you have a roof over your head, a computer and a pencil but what about all those starving people in Africa, and all the cats and dogs being slaughtered? So wtf does everyone expect us to do? We don't have magical powers to suddenly turn everything to what the West thinks is right. We can't do what others want. And suddenly people are talking like cats and dogs are endangered species. In a lot of countries like China cats and dogs are strays and only end up becoming an inconveniance to humans and other animals. People like Animal Rights Protesters are fanatics and no more than terrorists. Do any Brits remember when that guinea pig farm was closed so scientists couldn't find any new cures etc.? They kept calling the labs up and hanging up like babies would. The girl interviewed on the News acted like a stuck up brat who thought she was a real daddy's girl. These people don't know what's best for the world, if they did they would put more brain cells together. If they have more than three. They're all the same, PETA, Animal Rights, Bob Geldof etc. Fools. Yes, if I could do something in favour of humans and animals I would help but not in a fanatical way. *^_^* \m/

NP: Above the Winter Moonlight - DragonForce: Sonic Firestorm

Trent Reznor on China's fur trade.

Shit, I forgot dogs and cats get special treatment. "I bought this thinking it was made of [animal our culture doesn't accept as a pet] fur! i am outraged that it was actually made of the fur of a [cute animal our culture does accept as a pet]!"

The man has done much for music and I don't blame you (Tom) for posting the link or anything like that. All I'm saying is that Trent Reznor is either a vegan or a hypocrite.

At 2/27/06 12:48 PM, WatcherPrime wrote: The true aim of the 'animal rights' movement is to force every country to grow organic food with no alterations or protections what so ever. By most estimates, the available farm land on Earth can only support 4 billion people if every inch of land was converted for that purpose.

I don't see 2 billion people wanting to die, do you?

That's a straw-man argument.

A = No meat, and it's all organic
B = No meat, but GMOs (non-organic)
C = The current situation.

Animal Rights activists want B. If we had B, some fanatics would probably push for A, no doubt. But they want B. Sliding from C to B would actually be much more efficient than the current system. I think everyone will agree that you can feed more people with grain than with meat, given a section of land. If you can't agree with that concept, I don't know what to say.

Now A is a different story. I would say it's ideal, but we have an overpopulation problem (caused, in part, by religious fanatics who see birth control as a sin), so we can't do it. What we can do, and should do by most accounts (except the account of "meat is tasty"), is move toward B.

Moving toward B is important because C is almost as bad as A efficiency-wise. After all, people are dying of starvation (this has been going on for quite some time, for those unaware). B is the sweet spot in terms of how much food you can grow, although something between B and C is more realistic (and tasty).

But we can't move toward B because that will be a slippery slope towards A which would cause 2 billion people to die, right? Right?

i can't argue with your facts about the anti PETA website, but can you argue with their facts? i understand the source is biased, but do we automatically toss out anything put up on petakillsanimals.com because of that? the fact of the matter is, PETA has enough money to take anyone to court for libel and slander if they are spreading falsifications. they haven't, so what is on this website must be true. if you get the truth from angels or demons, it's still the truth.

A bit of advice to the ranters. I used to do the same thing, but stop. It doesn't work well. Make a single argument per post. It's to your advantage, because then your opponents can't selectively respond and ignore your best points.

I would just like to point out that agriculture and the production of artificial supplements winds up killing far more animals than just raising animals for slaughter.

Seriously, though. Torturing animals? Ice pick to the knees for you.

Why must people always do the, "that's awful however we should ignore this fact completely because people are starving in some remote jungle."

Okay, someone honestly needs too make a video game that involves you feeding every single home in the world. It would be so much multi-tasking your computer or console would probably overheat. Yes people are starving, that is not the only fucking problem in the world stop treating it like we must abandon everything just to save these people. I agree they must be saved but other issues don't just go away whilst we try to achieve this.

Anyways there are three points I'd like to make;
* The Anti-PETA site is a load of shit, if you honestly believe in it you need to exit your gulible life immediatly.
* Meat tastes good.
* Fur is ugly anyone who considers it fashion needs to be face-rushed by Richard Simmons

That is really sad and disgusting... I hope those guys that are beating and killing those animals get assassinated or die.

Sadly nothing will happen to them.
It's just another day in the grind of the job to crush live kittens and puppies into pulp for these people.
The world is a bitch.

I don't give a fu#% why you guys don't like PETA. If they are bringing this to peoples attentions, then I have respect for them. I would like to shoot all of those bitches who are treating those dogs and cats that way. I think they deserve to be thrown in cages and to be skinned alive themselves.. To those stupid people that say ( we eat cows and pigs ) We don't throw them in cages and make them suffer before they die. If anybody treated my dog like that, I would take out a knife and shove it in their neck.

Wow, a brand new low for NG. Posting a peta link.

you should visit limewire.com, it has an mp3 of everything you could ask for.

At 3/1/06 10:16 AM, masked-god wrote: you should visit limewire.com, it has an mp3 of everything you could ask for.

In case you didn't notice, no one cares about the audio file anymore, they are too happy arguing and flaming.

you can try looking for it on morpheus, i'm not sure if i spelled that right, but it's a file sharing program, look for it on google or something, download it and you can get all the free music, vids, ect. ...as long as you have stuff to share with others, plus, whatever you download will be copied so next time someone tries to download what you downloaded, it'll download even faster... not that i actually use this program(cough)
here's the link www.morpheus.com<A>

CAREFUL guys, my paypal was banned because THIS website is considered ADULT AUDIENCE crap and they have closed down my account and i wont get it back that is just SWELL, so all of you before you recieve a donation through this website CAREFUL because its gonna cost you more then you earn

At 2/26/06 07:57 PM, SpamWarrior wrote: QUOTE ME , BITCH OR SHUT THE FUCK UP.

Lol.
Definitly

i have it how do i send it to u add me 2 buddy lit and we will so it or zap it 2 ur i pod

for those who startedwith an opinion and went into a fight
I think both of you are right in some way, i am againsta nimal cruelty but also going vegetarian isnt the way, if we were made to eat meat is because we need to eat meat ypu both have very good ideas but i think this bbs has gone way to extreme.....
fiddycent..we are made to eat meat and also there are lots of people starving when others waste millions on their dogs..democracy doesnt exist its just an idea made to control the majorities...spamwarrior..this doent mean whe should kill animals and destroy the world nor we shouldnt care, even if change is way too near to impossible we dont have to be conformists i know that wasnt what you meant its that PETA seems to have a good reason when it might be another bunch of hipocrites who want to control us with these ideas and make money... even if we are meant to eat meat that doesnt mean we should kill animals just for fashion... money is DEVIL and you cnat say its not

i know this sounds stupid..but if PETA means People for the Equal Treatment of animals or something....and people is being murdered...thats why aniimals are killed too..all of you who have posted are in some way right...but when its my time to write i forget all my ideas i wish to post... i only accept animal killing for the jungle law kill to eat or to avoid being eaten but killing for sports, money, fun, fashion and all, like another guy said.. i dont live in russia to wear a fur coat..

that's great, uhuh

well this has degenerated into a flame war..... and what happened to "news"? this isn't news. this is asking for an mp3... and talking about fur....

why the hell do they make fur coats out of cats and dogs...
who would wanna wear a coat made out of cats or dogs ?
sick world that we live in