South Dakota

[ReiperX]

http://www.cnn.com/2..ortion.ap/index.html

A bill making almost all abortions in South Dakota illegal looks like its going to be signed into law. This bill even prevents abortions from rape and incest giving rapist the same parental rights as the mother.

As I've stated before, I am pro-choice and I do hope that the supreme court decides that this law is bogus.

[BeFell]

At 2/24/06 10:09 PM, ReiperX wrote: As I've stated before, I am pro-choice and I do hope that the supreme court decides that this law is bogus.

I'm pro life and I agree with you.

[MoralLibertarian]

At 2/24/06 10:14 PM, BeFell wrote:

I'm pro life and I agree with you.

why?

[BeFell]

At 2/24/06 10:16 PM, MoralLibertarian wrote:

At 2/24/06 10:14 PM, BeFell wrote:

I'm pro life and I agree with you.

why?

I think there should be an exception for rape. I have no problem forcing a woman to carry a baby to term if she had cosential sex and got pregnant because she did get a choice. In the case of rape a woman is physically violated, forcing her to carry the child prolongs the violation. Honestly, I think all abortion is wrong but in the case of rape I'm willing to compromise.

[Jerkapotamus]

At 2/24/06 10:14 PM, BeFell wrote

I'm pro life and I agree with you.

Well, the "baby" isn't breathing so it's not technically alive. So you aren't really pro life.

[ReiperX]

At 2/24/06 10:28 PM, Jerkapotomus wrote: At 2/24/06 10:14 PM, BeFell wrote

I'm pro life and I agree with you.

Well, the "baby" isn't breathing so it's not technically alive. So you aren't really pro life.

Technically the baby isn't breathing until the ambilical cord is cut, so does that mean we can just put a bullet in its head before the cord is cut?

[BeFell]

At 2/24/06 10:28 PM, Jerkapotomus wrote: At 2/24/06 10:14 PM, BeFell wrote

I'm pro life and I agree with you.

Well, the "baby" isn't breathing so it's not technically alive. So you aren't really pro life.

You failed biology class didn't you?

[IllustriousPotentate]

At 2/24/06 10:20 PM, BeFell wrote: I think there should be an exception for rape. I have no problem forcing a woman to carry a baby to term if she had cosential sex and got pregnant because she did get a choice. In the case of rape a woman is physically violated, forcing her to carry the child prolongs the violation. Honestly, I think all abortion is wrong but in the case of rape I'm willing to compromise.

Couldn't that lead to false claims of rape though? If abortion is only allowed if one is raped, wouldn't that lead many mothers-to-be-that-don't-want-to-be claiming rape against the father, in order to be able to get a legal abortion?

[BigBlueBalls]

Great, now South Dakota can go back to the dark ages of coathanger abortions. Although, in this day in the age, we have the internet. There are sites out there that give you dozens of ways to perform your own abortion, although it's more risky.

Call it murder all you want, but hey if a woman never tells anyone she's pregnant, then she could flush it down the toilet without anyone ever knowing that the fetus even existed. Murder? Murder who? There is no record that a victim even existed.

If there was somehow found out that a fetus was missing from a woman, she could claim it was a miscarriage. Should a forensics team investigate every miscarriage? My cousin had a miscarriage and she was devestated. Imagine now if she had to be investigated for potential murder.

That's how ridiculous abortion bans are. It'll never stop them, it'll just drive it underground and cause a lot of desperate woman to go through desperate measures to take back control over their own body.

[SEXY-FETUS]

At 2/24/06 10:28 PM, Jerkapotomus wrote: At 2/24/06 10:14 PM, BeFell wrote

I'm pro life and I agree with you.

Well, the "baby" isn't breathing so it's not technically alive. So you aren't really pro life.

Hold your breath for a bit I'll be right over.

[crossxoutxthexeyes]

This kinda shit really pisses me off. Jesus you notice that the only people who are Pro-Life are Christian? There is a seperation of church and state.

This world is slowly turning into a prison planet.

[Altarus]

Still in the first trimester, an unborn child has a regular heartbeat, fully formed feet, toes, hands, and fingers, a functional liver that creates its blood, and has a unique bloodtype. It is a human, period.

Revolutionary War - 4,435 deaths.

Civil War (both sides) - 498,332 deaths.

World War I - 116,708 deaths.

World War II - 407,316 deaths.

Korea - 25,604 deaths.

Vietnam - 58,168 deaths.

Total killed due to abortion since 1973
44,670,812 (44 MILLION) deaths
as of April 22, 2004
Source: National Right To Life

The Nazis probably knew, deep down, that the Jews were really human beings. Liberals have probably convinced themselves that unborn children are not. Which is worse?

At 2/24/06 11:44 PM, BigBlueBalls wrote: That's how ridiculous abortion bans are. It'll never stop them, it'll just drive it underground and cause a lot of desperate woman to go through desperate measures to take back control over their own body.

So what you are basically saying is that people commit crimes out of desperation...

[jmaster306]

First of all this is the second topic on this matter already on this forum

and second, purely as a political matter, I love how I hear christian groups complaining about how liberals use the supreme court to get their views turned into law (like gay marriage) yet given the chance they spring at the same opportunity. C'mon people, lets drop this fasade, we all know the supreme court is an effective way to get unpopular legilation passed and will use it to our advantage whenever possible. Admit it! both sides are greedy bastards willing to do most anything to get their way.

[Altarus]

At 2/25/06 01:00 AM, jmaster306 wrote: and second, purely as a political matter, I love how I hear christian groups complaining about how liberals use the supreme court to get their views turned into law (like gay marriage) yet given the chance they spring at the same opportunity. C'mon people, lets drop this fasade, we all know the supreme court is an effective way to get unpopular legilation passed and will use it to our advantage whenever possible. Admit it!

If I recall, abortion was legalized through an act of judicial activism, against the peoples' will. South Dakota is taking back their rights, not infringing the rights of others.

[SEXY-FETUS]

At 2/25/06 12:42 AM, crossxoutxthexeyes wrote: This kinda shit really pisses me off. Jesus you notice that the only people who are Pro-Life are Christian? There is a seperation of church and state.

This world is slowly turning into a prison planet.

Then how do you explain me? Or say http://www.godlessprolifers.org or one of the many other non-christian pro life groups. You see it's with science that we say a fetus is human and has a right to live. So fuck you you stereotyping hypocrit.

[jmaster306]

At 2/25/06 01:04 AM, Wyrlum wrote: If I recall, abortion was legalized through an act of judicial activism, against the peoples' will. South Dakota is taking back their rights, not infringing the rights of others.

Expect for those that, you know, are seeking an abortion. But they are amoral so it doesn't matter.

[BeFell]

At 2/24/06 11:07 PM, IllustriousPotentate wrote: Couldn't that lead to false claims of rape though? If abortion is only allowed if one is raped, wouldn't that lead many mothers-to-be-that-don't-want-to-be claiming rape against the father, in order to be able to get a legal abortion?

Granted there are bound to be false claims but putting your boyfriend in jail seems a little fucked up when you could just use adoption. I hope for a world when people will be as revolted by abortion as we are to human sacrifice or slavery so there would be careful scrutination of such claims. However, the world is not perfect and it never will be so sometimes shits just going to happen. I know that we will never be able to stop the use of abortion as birth control but I would like to slow it down.

At 2/24/06 11:44 PM, BigBlueBalls wrote: Great, now South Dakota can go back to the dark ages of coathanger abortions. Although, in this day in the age, we have the internet. There are sites out there that give you dozens of ways to perform your own abortion, although it's more risky.

You could always just not get knocked up in the first place.

Call it murder all you want, but hey if a woman never tells anyone she's pregnant, then she could flush it down the toilet without anyone ever knowing that the fetus even existed. Murder? Murder who? There is no record that a victim even existed.

Yeah so? That's hardly a reason to support the act.

If there was somehow found out that a fetus was missing from a woman, she could claim it was a miscarriage. Should a forensics team investigate every miscarriage? My cousin had a miscarriage and she was devestated. Imagine now if she had to be investigated for potential murder.

My understanding of the law indicated that it went after doctors who performed abortions, not the mothers.

That's how ridiculous abortion bans are. It'll never stop them, it'll just drive it underground and cause a lot of desperate woman to go through desperate measures to take back control over their own body.

Where was her control of her body when she was being impregnated? As for you other argument, some people are going to stab other people wether it's legal or not, does that mean we should just make it legal to stab people?

[Altarus]

At 2/24/06 10:20 PM, BeFell wrote: I think there should be an exception for rape.

Does rape change the fact that the unborn child is a human being? Of course not. You are basically justifying the murder of a human being.

[darkfiretime1]

Im not Christian you dumbass, and im pro-life. Exception of course on rape.

[BeFell]

At 2/25/06 03:03 AM, Wyrlum wrote:

At 2/24/06 10:20 PM, BeFell wrote: I think there should be an exception for rape.

Does rape change the fact that the unborn child is a human being? Of course not. You are basically justifying the murder of a human being.

Basically but if we don't compromise on this issue than an abortion ban has no chance. I would rather save as many lives as possible than complete blow the opportunity because I can't face the reality of the situation.

[BigBlueBalls]

At 2/25/06 02:38 AM, BeFell wrote: You could always just not get knocked up in the first place.

...or not get raped apparently. "Too bad, you shouldn't have dressed so provacatively at that party miss. Oh and BTW the rapist has full parental rights over that baby too."

Call it murder all you want, but hey if a woman never tells anyone she's pregnant, then she could flush it down the toilet without anyone ever knowing that the fetus even existed. Murder? Murder who? There is no record that a victim even existed.

Yeah so? That's hardly a reason to support the act.

No but it's a good reason to support a woman's choice over her own body. Otherwise, you'll have just as many abortions, but this time without any way of tracking how many actually occured. One here estimated there were 44 million abortions. It'll still be around that number, you just won't know about it. Seems to be the solution of much of what the religious right does. Just sweep it under the rug and pretend it doesn't exist.

Where was her control of her body when she was being impregnated?

The same control she has in deciding to terminate the pregancy. Otherwise, the fetus has more rights to a woman's body, than she has to her own.

As for you other argument, some people are going to stab other people wether it's legal or not, does that mean we should just make it legal to stab people?

No that wasn't my argument. I was actually making a point that unlike murder, this cannot be investigated without infringing on people's privacy. So all this will do is drive it underground and it will be just as bad as before, except swept under the rug so all the religious folk can pretend it's not happening. Try catching someone who committed an abortion crime and you'll end up with thousands of cases where people just claim it was a miscarriage. Want to prove them wrong? Well then send forensic teams to investigate every miscarriage and see how well that goes.

That's what makes abortion bans ridiculously stupid. It can't even be enforced, unless someone out there is openly stating that's what they're doing or again if you want to investigate every miscarriage case.

[MortifiedPenguins]

At 2/25/06 03:03 AM, Wyrlum wrote:

At 2/24/06 10:20 PM, BeFell wrote: I think there should be an exception for rape.

Does rape change the fact that the unborn child is a human being? Of course not. You are basically justifying the murder of a human being.

No thats the aspect but if that Child is born, that rapist gets all rights as a parent over that child, no matter what.

That's what some mothers are afraid of.

[darkfiretime1]

So you consider that a reason to have an abortion?